Hi ST- I see you were separated for 4 months- can you tell us about reconciling? our support court date will be 4 months exactly and that is a few weeks away....

PEACE OUT...and IN!

Hey, Sprezz! Peace of the Lord be with you!

What exactly did you need to know? How he came back? Basically my story? Support court date meaning when you went to court or when you will have court?

<small>[ September 04, 2004, 04:14 PM: Message edited by: StandingTogether ]</small>

hey ST- just noticed I have a typo in your name in the thread title....geez-sorry.

court is coming up the 24th. I rest in the arms of the Lord but do have weary days and reconciling reports DO help!

h said yesterday- as he was taking his clothing that he didn't plan to or mean to leave the day he did. but hes still gone and going more. mad that he has bills to pay- they are his-thats the end of that story-and discovering that fact is what prompted him to come in a huff to get his clothing. h asked several times insistently about my stepfathers memorial service-WHY? said he should be there and wants to be. WHY? very odd 10 minute meeting- sons sat sentry at the door-kicked/rolled his bags down the steps-sat back down-watched him haul them away and never spoke a word when he said hi etc... they are DARK right to his face. its all blatant and ugly-his public adultery- and when he is near me I am so calm and peaceful and civil that he doesn't have a chance to use his usual angry retinue. so feel free to tell me whatever you think!

PEACE OUT...and IN!

Okay, Sprezz. Pull up a chair & read. I think it's real important to know that I didn't fight my H on much of anything. What really helped me learn how to be a good W was reading How God Can & Will Restore Your Marriage by Erin Thiele. She really hit home so many major points for me that I realized that I HAD to change ME in order to have the M I wanted & to work w/God on getting him back home.

While H was gone, I did much soul searching. With the help of this book, I realized that my part in the M dissolving was HUGE. I played such a major role in contributing to the demise of this M that I cried & cried to the Lord to forgive me over & over & over again. The Lord showed me 12 years worth of sins I had committed to drive my H away from me & into the arms of OW. I was like, Wow! That was me?! I knew I had to change - fast! I knew that I wouldn't want to be M'd to me either!

There were several things I had to learn but what sticks out in my mind was the fact that I couldn't point out that what he was doing was wrong like I had been. I had so many things to take care of in mySELF that how on earth could I point this stuff out about HIM to HIM? That would be total self-righteousness. That was a big lesson.

I took Erin's words of Gentle & Quiet Spirit & Winning Him Over W/O a Word concept very deeply. I had to learn (after quite a few setbacks) that when I saw him I needed to listen more than speak, when I did speak, speak w/kindness & gentleness instead of anger, when he did get me angry w/his words, just to listen & nod or grit my teeth. I am a big believer in, If you don't have something nice to say, don't say it at all! This was very hard for me. I'm used to talking so much! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> But eventually, I learned that if I wanted to do things GOD'S way, I HAD to follow these things that He was telling me to do.

H came to me one day & told me that he wanted full custody of at least one of the kids. This hurt me so much. Tore my heart out -- just as much as D-day if not more! We sat the kids down & told them, This is what Daddy wants b/c he loves each of you so much. They seemed to understand this & the only one who really was torn between us was my 11yo (at the time) son. My 11yo D decided right away that she didn't want to leave Mommy (bless her heart <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> ) but my oldest, 12yo S wanted to go live w/his dad. That crushed me! I felt really un-loved then. What I had to realize from this experience was that my kids all loved their father very much & were trying to understand this just as much as I was. They were hurting too b/c they thought Mommy & Daddy would be together 4ever. Normal kid thinking. My H told me if I fought him on this, he would take my behind all the way to the supreme court if he had to. And I believed him. That's how much his kids meant to him - that showed me how much he was hurting by doing this, but I tried to understand that he wasn't making an easy decision for himself, he was just trying to be true to himself. Something that was very important to him I later learned.

We also discussed support. He did not want to be a dead beat dad at all. He knew I couldn't afford this house by myself, feed the kids, etc. so he offered to pay so many $ to cover these costs & get what the kids needed. He didn't want to go to court, but he understood if that's what I needed to do. I chose not to. Let me tell you why -- I honestly believe that God will provide NO MATTER WHAT. Let me repeat, NO MATTER WHAT. He WILL give us what we need in a form that we aren't expecting (don't you love the power of God & the way He works sometimes?). I felt that no matter if my H paid me or not (most of the times not b/c he couldn't afford it), I KNEW I would be ok. I KNEW that God would take care of me. And when I started to worry about the bills, God reminded me again in a scripture verse, a kind word, my MB friends ( <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> I love all of you!), any form He could, that I would be provided for. He would not let his child fall any more than she could handle! He would not let these innocent children suffer any more. I found out from BELIEVING that God would take care of us, that my bills were ALWAYS taken care of in some way. These kids were ALWAYS provided for in SOME way. Either the bills were lower, we'd get an unexpected check from somewhere or the kindness of strangers & friends & family would help us. BTW, I really believe that people offering $ to help is God's way of sending angels in your path to help you.

I remember over Christmas that I was so depressed over not getting my kids anything for Christmas gifts. What happened was that my mother's employer had gotten the kids & me Christmas presents and I don't just mean a few, they filled the whole tree! That was God working to help us. He used those people to send His love my way & I will 4ever be eternally grateful to them for their kindness & generosity. No, I didn't have $ to get them anything, but GOD did.

This was my experience w/the $ end of the separation. I'm not sure how you feel about attorneys, and I didn't want to go to court, but Erin recommends that you release your attorney & let your fate in God's hands. Let Him do the work. I have heard testimonies that after W's have done this that their H's hearts have softened & they've found their ways back home. I don't know if that would work in your case. Only you can decide if this is an avenue that you'd like to pursue. If you believe that an attorney will take care of you properly, then I would pray very hard for God to work through this attorney to provide for you as God sees fit. When my H saw that I wasn't out for his $ or to get revenge or anything like that, his heart was softened & he started his journey toward home. Eventually, he moved back in & we are continuing both our journeys together.

There is so much more & I have to start another reply on how we managed to keep happy, healthy kids during our separation b/c it sounds like yours are starting to resent & disrespect their father. I would be concerned about this & maybe start to do a little bit of soul searching to find out if you've contributed to that disrespect in any way. Please don't get angry w/me for saying that but I took notice that different things I woud say or my actions indirectly had an affect on what my kids thought of their father & what he was doing. As far as you having peace & being civil -- <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Yeah! Wonderful to hear! Keep doing this. Very important.

Like I said, there is so much more that I could go into, but this is some of it. Although 4 months doesn't seem a long time to some people, it was like a whole year for me & I know the pain you must be going through right now. Trust me when I say, you WILL get through this, your kids WILL get through this w/your help & God WILL soften your H's heart if you let Him.

Hope this helped a little bit.

Blessings to you & love in Christ,
Y

<small>[ September 06, 2004, 12:07 PM: Message edited by: sprezzatura ]</small>

Hi Sprezz - Sons - Unfortunately they're at an age where everything their father does is noticed & everything he says affects them royally. I'm afraid that their R w/their father is going so downhill & when your H wants it back, it's going to take a whole lot on your H's part to win their respect back. I remember when my mother & father both had A's. I was so angry w/both of them & it took a very long time for me to forgive my father for the things that my mother went through when I was a child & how she was treated later when I was an adult. I felt "justified" when my mother started her A b/c all I wanted was her happiness & I just knew my father wasn't giving it to her. I realize now how wrong that was on my part. I should have been opposed to her actions as well but since I was closer to my mom at the time, I forgave her quite easily. My father is deceased now so there was a lot of amends I had to make w/him after he was dead through letters & talking to God and now I feel that my father knows how much I love him & miss him & just wish I could feel him hug me one more time. I pray things work out for your H & your sons sometime soon so they can have the kind of R they should have. Since my kids are younger, I still have an affect on the way they view their father so I'm trying to show him respect so they in turn will show him the respect he deserves as a father so they won't grow up w/resentment in their hearts. Now when they get older & look back on this incident in their lives, I pray that they realize that he's just as human as anyone else & their father did the best he could (in his mind) at the time given the situation he was in.

$ - I believe you're right Sprezz. This is his choosing. You offered to settle it, he refused. This would be his choice so I pray that God will be w/you in the courtroom & he will touch your H in such a way that his heart will be softened & greed will be replaced w/generosity. Please post the date b4 you go so we can all send prayers your way (along with your own <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> ) while you're there. We can all pray for your H to have some kind of Paul moment, recognizing that Jesus is in total control, not him.

Are you letting him attend the service? It sounds to me like he wants to continue his R's w/your family members. I could be wrong? If he's unsure about all of this, it sounds to me like he's very confused & doesn't know which way to turn. That hedge of thorns could be being placed in front of him so maybe pray this a little stronger so his only option would be to turn toward home. I can't tell you how many times I prayed that hedge of thorns around my H & it hurt so much to see all those things go wrong in my H's life and I couldn't help him, couldn't help pick up the pieces. I had to let him fall on his knees. It's so hard to do that when you love someone, but sometimes, I think it's the best thing to do b/c otherwise they wouldn't learn anything. I know my H thought he could still remain good friends w/many members of my family & he never saw the ill affects this all had on them until he moved home & now it's hitting him like a ton of bricks & the guilt for him is overwhelming. He knows a lot of the reason why things are the way they are in every aspect of our lives is b/c of his decision to leave & his choice to have an A & this affects him greatly. Ah, the cost of bad decisions! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> Reap what you sow. How true are those words! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> We are working on rebuilding those R's toward him together now & it's getting a little better but there is such a long road. I pray that the Lord will continue this path of reconciliation w/all of them so we can return to the close-knit family we once were b4.

It's great to hear that God has shown you what you need to be forgiven for & I love the fact that you don't have a lot of anger and/or resentment. Watch out for when he does return though, boy -- that's a whole different ballgame! I don't know if it'll be true in your case for you, but I know this has happened to me & I'm finding that I had a whole lot more anger than what I thought I had. I think I was so busy working on praying that my M be restored & praying for him to turn back to the Lord that I didn't take the time to grieve over this loss & now the phases are hitting me all at once & I'm LB a little bit toward him w/o meaning to. He has been very patient w/that, knowing he deserves a lot of the digs I get in, but I know it frustrates him at the same time b/c he's trying the best he can to make our M beautiful. He's trying to help me deal w/my emotions but he can't find the right words to comfort me in my times of sadness or bitterness. All he can say is how sorry he is. Things are slowly getting better and I know w/time & patience, we'll get there.

I took notice in your post that you said WHEN your H chooses you -- sounds to me like you BELIEVE it & are thanking Him for already doing it. Great attitude to have. God hears you & I believe He is working toward that & I pray that your patience will endure, your strength will endure till that time when your H walks through those doors. How'd your time w/your mother go? Strange how death & A's are so similar in the processes that people go through. The loss of an A or separation is very similar to a death except the chance of return is there, whereas death it's not. You both can help each other through your grieving processes. I pray your mother finds peace -- maybe yours can rub off on her somehow. Blessings to you. My condolensces on your step-father. I know what it's like to lose a parent & the loss is very deep. Prayers to you.

Love in Christ,
Y

Hi ST- thanks for everything you wrote. yes I pray about the reconciliation process too! been there- know it ain't simple but now I am in a veryyyyyyyy different place. I long to see that/share that with my h. sons- very complicated subject. they do not as I do not-approve of D. they stand behind my stand for sure. at the same time they have their OWN stand. in or OUT-CHOOSE. and if you choose in...good for you-good for us-they know it won't be simple-but it will be BETTER. those 2 certainly know alot of up and down in their young lives and alot of work it out no matter what kind of living. at the same time they blame me for no choices I am backed into. they know how carefully I weigh all decisions and how much counsel/mentoring I seek.

Mom is afraid. that will take time. I do my best!
had 3 siblings in those 2 hurricanes and now my father faces a terminal illness and that also effects Mom. big sigh-lots of prayers. Mom is a very independent woman but soft and tender too. arent' we all....

and oh..... I DO BELIEVE. the valley is long-sometimes darker than others but always there is He who sustains me and I won't live in the valley.

alot of contradictions still going on with my h. now WE know where confusion of that magnitude comes from....its unplugging h's ears and opening h's eyes that we need to pray for!

new bookstore opening tonite- going with my kids-braving the anxiety attacks and agoraphobia with a vengence these days...step by step- thru another valley...

looking forward to hearing from you!

PEACE OUT and IN!

cool that you hooked up with chat. next time check out the top of the page-there is a forum index and you can post there too-like this-but no men...we are sure they read but they do not post <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> also if you are registered there is a private message option-you will get an email if one is sent to you. ciao for now!

hey neighbor- that is too cool-meant to be- god sends me gifts. shhhhhhhhh made my day to discover that. thanks so much for your spirit and your h input. I have to be up early for a meeting here = will look for your reply?? going to do my homework now. please send my gold star= like a bad kid- homework at 2:15 a.m.

PEACE OUT...and IN!!

Isn't that wild that we're practically neighbors?! Wow, small world, isn't it? Who'd have thought that I'd meet someone that was so close to me on an anonymous message board? Wow. That blows my mind.

Okay, back on task. How are you feeling today? I really enjoyed our chat the other night. So, did you go back & read the first couple chapters of Erin's book, How God Can... ? I think you need to refocus a little bit on yourself & continue making changes (if you haven't done that a million times already!). Is there anything that might have stuck out for you that you don't think you've done or maybe something that you could do a little differently? It's time to really start putting these things into practice.

Okay, first things first. Contentious woman - angry, argumentative. Is there strife in your home? Do you show your H respect when he IS around or you hear from him? It took a lot for me to find respect for my H. After all, this was hurting so many people, how can a man earn respect when he hasn't given any? A lot of people feel this way. What did my H do to deserve respect? I had to dig deep. And when I found out, I had to TELL HIM. When he stopped for a visit w/the kids one time, I apologized to him for being argumentative w/him all those years, trying to "win the fight" when we had won. You know that old saying, Rule #1 - A woman's always right. Rule #2 - When in doubt, refer to Rule #1. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> So, what did my H do to deserve respect? I told him I admired him for trying to continue his education while he was away; I admired him for being a stand up dad & I respected his decision to continue his life w/o me. I didn't want it, I didn't agree w/it, but I respected it b/c he was being true to HIMSELF. He didn't want to live a lie anymore, pretending he was happy when in fact he wasn't. Notice, I didn't say I respected his decision to have an A, I didn't respect the way he handled things - leaving w/someone on the side & lieing to me about it. I also respected his honesty w/me NOW. These are just some of the things I had to have the courage to face when I asked myself this question - If I was a contentious woman & had anything to apologize to my husband for & in what ways could I show him respect w/o agreeing w/his choice of an A? Remember, we as wives are called to respect our H's. I know this is very hard to do given the fact of how they're living their life right now, but I'm sure if you dig deep you can find SOMETHING to respect your H.

When you find it, make sure you tell him. You say he usually calls you & gets angry & starts screaming at you. How do you think he'd react if, when he paused, you threw in something respectful about him? Think about it. He EXPECTS you to get angry back at the things he says. He EXPECTS you to fight w/him. He EXPECTS a struggle. What happens when you don't give him one and return his anger w/sincerity & respect. He will be <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> . It will probably stump him, make him go quiet & not know what to say.

So, how about it? What respectful thing can you think of that your H has done or said? And do you need to replace some pride w/humbleness & get rid of some anger?

I know, but I'm not the one acting like.....Trust me. There's a reason for the madness. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Remember what I told you. You can't do anything about your H's choices. ONLY YOUR OWN. So do you choose God's way or man's? If you choose God's way (which I know you do) then get ready for the long, narrow road. It's gonna be an uphill climb (with Jesus as the navigator).

Love in Christ,
Y

Desiderata
"Go placidly amid the noise and the haste,

and remember what peace there may be in silence.

As far as possible, without surrender,

be on good terms with all persons.

Speak your truth quietly and clearly;

and listen to others, even the dull and ignorant;

They too have their story.

Avoid loud and aggressive persons;

they are vexatious to the spirit.

If you compare yourself with others,

you may become vain or bitter,

for always there will be greater and lesser persons than yourself.

Enjoy your achievements as well as your plans.

Keep interested in your own career, however humble;

It is a real possession in the changing fortunes of time.

Exercise caution in your business affairs,

for the world is full of trickery.

But let this not blind you to what virtue there is;

Many persons strive for high ideals,

and everywhere life is full of heroism.

Be yourself. Especially do not feign affection.

Neither be cynical about love;

for in the face of all aridity and disenchantment

it is as perennial as the grass.

Take kindly the council of the years,

Gracefully surrendering the things of youth.

Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune.

But do not distress yourself with dark imaginings.

Many fears are born of fatigue and loneliness.

Beyond a healthy discipline,

Be gentle with yourself.

You are a child of the universe no less than the trees and the stars;

you have a right to be here,

and whether or not it is clear to you,

no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore, be at peace with God,

Whatever you conceive Him to be.

And whatever your labors and aspirations,

in the noisy confusion of life,

keep peace in your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams,

it is still a beautiful world.

Be cheerful.

Strive to be happy."

Written by: Max Erhmann

thanks ST- great marathon!! PEACE OUT