I am the betrayer. I told my H-March 99. My H is a Pastor and I need to know where is God for him in all of this. When I first told him I totally ended it with OM-my decision. I was feeling neglected. H in school full time and a Pastor, everything more important than me, especially church. We have been married 15 yrs. 3 children, he choose ministry late in life and that has been a real struggle. He has been a pastor almost 3 yrs, while going to college full time and me working full time to support us. Small church, not much money.When I first told him he tried to understand how this could have happened but things got worse, he became depressed, got on meds, threatened murder-sucide, was in a psych hosp, didn't seem to help. I moved with 3 kids in Sept, due to fear, he would go off calling me all kinds of names in front of the kids, scaring us all. Now he wants nothing to do with me says he wants divorce and blames me for moving, dosen't understand how the kids couldn't sleep etc. The church wants me to come there even though he dosen't. I even walked the eisle one Sun and prayed with him for us, he didn't even pray. Church is trying to be understanding but he has gotten angry at people when they talk about reconcilation. They have told him he must get back in counseling, hasn't been since 1st of Sept. I told him about a week ago I will leave him alone thats what he wants, no more cards, e-mails, gifts etc. People have said he stands there and preaches about things he is not doing. Don't you all think God has to deal with him in someway?? I pray all the time for God to touch his heart.I am worried about him losing his job, the church knows I want reconcilation and have been very loving to me and supportive. He has been missing meetings etc, dosent see the kids much. Still very depressed. How do I reach him?? Everytime I try he blames me for everything and it gets ugly. The last time we really talked about 2-3 wks ago I told him if he goes to atty I will not sign any papers, he yelled and screamed for me to leave him alone and let him go and finally hung up. Any advice, how to reach him??<BR>

I really don't have much in the way of advice for you - but I want you to know that we are here for you.<P>Your husband seems to be exhibiting very strong symptoms of depression. <B>You CANNOT fix him</B> ... many of us have learned that. And, while your affair may have triggered the depressive episode, you are not to blame for his depression overall.<P>Keep coming here and posting - it can really help!<P>------------------<BR>terri<BR>I believe in miracles...<P>

Terri, Thanks for your reply. I know my affair has triggered his depression, but the counsleor we went to said she feels there is alot more there, maybe from childhood. The sad thing is we only went to counseling a couple of times before things got so out of hand and he went in the hospital and it all went down hill from there. Now he will not consider going to counseling with me. Are you a Christian? And what do you think about a Pastor acting like this?? I know we are all human, but I just have to wonder if he has really reached out to God through this whole thing, he says he has, but I don't see it in his actions. I plan on going to church there in the morning so I will see how it goes. Thanks Again!!

hello there, I am sad for your situation, i can understand your situation a bit! i am not a pastor but i am a workaholic! i work very hard to put money in my pocket and food on the table. at the expense of my wife and two girls. i think that your husband should step down for a little while until he gets this straightened out! it is not healthy for him to be giving other children of GOD advice in his condition! ( better to tie a millstone around his neck and cast him into the sea than to lead one of his chosen astray) i found that a holiday really helped us realize that we are co dependant and that we need eachother! sadly that was our honeymoon and now we are separated! only my affair was the kicker that brought her OUT of her depression! i wish you GOD's strength and pray that he reveals his plans to you!

ULTRAD,<P>Maybe the meds your His on aren't really doing the trick??? He stillsounds very angry and depressed.<P>IF he can get over this - get the counseling HE needs, too, I think he would be an even BETTER pastor - really be able to understand the problems of the flock he is ministering to. <P>Continue to pray for your H. He is dealing with alot - Do you think the embarrassment may be a little too much for him to handle at this time, since he is a pastor?? EVERYBODY commits sins - they are just DIFFERENT sins. Too bad your H can extend the arm of repentance and forgiveness to thers and not to YOU!<P>Keep praying!!!!!! I will keep you in my prayers,too.<P>Roll Me Away<P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

Ultrad,<BR>It is nice to know that you broke it off and that you want to reconcile with H. God will have to work on him. There is nothing you can do outside of praying for him. As I read your post, I couldn't help but wish that my W would do as you are doing.<P>It appears that he had neglected you without making time for the both of you to be together. I know it is difficult when you are going to school and working. I felt guilty when I was working on my Masters degree. I had little time to spend with my W and our oldest son at the time. We gat into a lot of debt and she felt neglected again because I was always working to free up money to do things.<P>My heart goes out to you along with my rpayers that God will open his eyes. MONDO HUG!!!!!!!!!!<P>------------------<BR>God Bless,<BR>Rob<P><BR>

ULTRAD,<P>You asked: what we think about a Pastor acting like this? Yes! He is human. You know when you stand very close to the fame and stumble your are likely to get badly burned. If he was not so close to God and the chruch your affair may not have hurt as much. RMA suggested that he may be embarassed because of his position and everyone in the church knowing what has happened.<P>I suspect that is very true. More importantly he probably feels that everyone knows he failed in taking care of you. "A good Christian woman would not do this without good reason". You stated that the church understood your attempts to reconcile. That is good, however in his depressed state it just isolates him further. At this point he feels he has failed you, his family, and God. This is a very heavy burden to carry.<P>I have no real suggestions for him to get rid of the anger, but you might help him by going to plan A as described at this site.<P> Further, since I suspect he is taking a considerable amount of the blame for the failing of the marriage (It clearly was failing if you had an affair), I would suggest you talk to him about forgivness. Giving him your forgiveness for his failings in the marriage. It is a start. It may not be well received initially but this is going to take time and more time. It will take hard work and prayer.<P>There are many things your H probably feels about his relation with God, not the least betrayed as he give this effort and dedicated his life and lost his wife and family. I am not saying you did anything wrong in making the move but his interpretation will probably be that he has lost his family.<P>Enough conjecture. Please try to understand where he is in his feeling as best you can. It will help you reach him. Please give this alot of time. It does take time to get over these things. And as I'm sure you know, get him into counceling. Is there a Senior Pastor who was his mentor that could talk to him about getting the help he needs? <P>So much more but I am sure people here will give you good advice as more information revealed and you continue on this long and painful journey.<P>God Bless You, Your Children, and most of all Your H.<P>P.S. You asked about God's role. I would not presume to understand the plans God has for you, H, and family but rest assured that there is one. That does not mean that there will not be much pain. Your H is already experiencing that right now. He feels he has lost his wife and children in this mess. And he may lose his ministry. Very very hard. Please keep your faith and patience; your H is going to need it.<p>[This message has been edited by Just Learning (edited November 28, 1999).]

Just Learning-Thanks for your post. And yes I think I realize alot of those things my H is dealing with. He had a meeting with the church the end of Aug without telling me and told the whole church, at the time I think to protect himself they new he was depressed etc. At that time he told them he didn't want to them to treat me differently etc, but things only got worse, too many people involved I guess. He does have a retired pastor and others he talks to but I have heard he has not met them when they have set meetings. He will make appointments with people but not show. It seems he doesn't want to talk to anyone who he knows will offer correct advice. My brother in law is a pastor and they have always been very close, he lives out of town but called him to meet over Thanksgiving-again he didn't show. I think deep down he knows his part in all of this but can't accept it or won't. I have tried and tried to tell him I love him no matter what. The church is trying to be understanding to him during this time, but is becoming more difficult because they know I want to reconcile and he is making no effort. Thanks for your imput, I will continue to pray and take it one day at a time.

You wrote: <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>He had a meeting with the church the end of Aug without telling me and told the whole church, at the time I think to protect himself they new he was depressed etc. At that time he told them he didn't want to them to treat me differently etc, but things only got worse, too many people involved I guess.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Hmmm... I wonder if deep inside, he expected everyone to treat you differently - if he, perhaps, is confused, bewildered and <I>angry</I> that everyone is treating you with such understanding and forgiveness?<P>This is NOT a slam against you, ULTRAD, but you need to understand that most people would rather have an arm cut off than to find out that the person they loved and trusted most in the world has betrayed them. The pain is worse than any pain you could possibly imagine. Only someone who has experienced it can really understand the hurt.<P>One thing I haven't ever understood is how everyone my husband knows can just go on treating him the same way even though he has had and continues to have an affair. Even the ones who know me and consider me their friend as well continue to have the same relationship as always with my husband. Were I not able to overcome this confusion, it could make me very angry - even though I am glad that some of his friends still consider themselves his friends.<P>I guess what I am trying to say is that your husband's anger and hurt might be exascerbated (magnified and made worse, like pouring salt on an open wound) by the very fact that the church community is doing what he asked them to do - accepting you as you have always been accepted. And, as you point out, too many people now know of what he may consider his humiliation...<P>There are many layers to your husband's problems ... The best thing you can do is to remain consistently loving and accepting. Try to understand how much he is hurting - because no matter what he did or didn't do in your marriage, you cannot justify your affair (and it sounds a little like some of that is creeping into your posts...).<P>I hope this has been some food for thought...<P>------------------<BR>terri<BR>I believe in miracles...<P>

ULTRAD,<P>You see here is the problem. You say "The church is<BR>trying to be understanding to him during this time, but is becoming more difficult because they know I want to reconcile and he is making no effort." This would seem that the congregation is taking sides. You may like it but realize as much as you, people here and even he might like to reconcile: he does not have to and he may not be in the mental state where he can do this now.<P>Is it possible that you have been jealous of your H deciding to go into the ministry??? <BR>I was going to mention this yesterday but I decided to see what your responses were to the posts. I ask this for two reasons. One some of your questions about how a Pastor should behave seem to be trying to lead to the conclusion he should not be one. Second, if you do feel this way, it will cause you to view things in a way very counter to your H and make reconcilliation very difficult. <P>You may feel that your H chose the ministry over you. Is that part of the reason for the affair? Please be honest with yourself. The conclusions you reach will make a very big difference in your approach to this problem and an even bigger problem for your H. For example, if he felt that he was going to have to chose between the ministry and you, this is going to place the chance of reconcilliation into a very different light.<P>He may of failed you but your betrayed him. I hope you understand why I am asking these questions. If you are to be successful in getting your H into counseling and recover your marriage the more information about your own behavior and motivation you have the better. If through careful examinination of your role in things, you come to see where your H is sitting in this mess you will be able to help him come to a reconcilliation.<P>Please become familiar with the Harley information ; the plans (A & B); his needs/ her needs; and so forth.<P>Good Luck and God Bless You and Your Family