Thank you for your words of encourgament, I do appreciate them. I think I have finally let go and let God, It has given me a peace that I'm thankful for. God Bless

Brown, I'm going to say extra prayers for you today. It appears that your husband is headed in the direction home, so we need to pray that the Lord keeps him on that course. The Lord will handle your divorce situation. You are doing so well, Brown. I can feel the peace in you through the words you type. God bless you.<P>NewDay - I'll be checking out that devotional. Also, the OW in our case also went back to her husband. She left her H for mine, and they got divorced over my H & OW's affair. I, too, pray for their marriage to be restored. I don't know if they've remarried but they live together. <P>SueB - thank you so much for posting these great verses. I've saved the link to Charles Staley's site and will visit when I get home tonite. <P>

I am so sorry for your troubles.<P>I didnt even read your note or notes, but I bet I know your life.<P>Abuse after abuse after abuse. I need not detail it. First of all you either need to step out or kick him out. This is for your sake. <P>I am a son of an alcoholic, and the wurst thing that happend to my dad was that my mom stayed with him. I dont know what the outcome would have been , but I assume more positive than negative. There is a place called alanon and this should help.<P>If you are depending on him financially, dont worry just get out or keep him out. Work and take care of your kids if you have any.<P>If you have any kids I am sorry for you, because they might hate you for not being strong and living him before. I do hate my mon for that and for a lot of other things.<P>I hope this doesnt make you sad. My intention is for you to snap out, not to be more depressed about it.<P>First, you need to be sure that your husband is not a bad person, he is just sick, and his sickness is the cause for all your troubles. Beleive me he does not intend it to be this way.<P>You also need to realize that you are more likely than not, sick, becuse his sickness has made you ill too. Please help yor kids if you have any and send them to alanon. This doesnt cost, if your are finacially tight. <BR> This is a matter of 2 results, and neither has to do with you. You have to understand it. It is a sickness very well documented and dont feel like your turning your back on your husband. To rules to leave a marriage is verbal abuse and physical abuse.<P>Back to the 2 endings: 1.He is going to die or end up in jail becuse of his sickness. No other outcome.<BR>2. If he relizes to be sick and wants help, he is going to get it, it is not up to you under any circumstance.If he goes for help, he will understand that his family needs to disintoxicate from him, and after years of reasuring he han be accepted again. But this hope does not need to be present. <BR>Since, you know this outcome is one in several thousand cases. Just let him go.<P>Good Luck! Talk to your kids about this and visit help. Also, ask them for forgivness and tell them how much sorry you are about this situation. If they are in Alanon they will understand. Again Good Luck. <P>Praying wont do any good, actions will.<BR>Probably God already gave you signs and you didnt understand them, or didnt want to?<BR>Sorry for being so straight forward and if I hurt your feelings. The intention is for you to do something. What? Start by Alanon, you will find wives and kids like yourself and yours.<P>Son of alcoholic.<BR> <P><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Alcoholic's Wife:<BR><B>I am so confused right now - I've prayed and prayed that the Lord go before me in everything I do and say, and it still blows up in my face. I'm having a really hard time tonight trying to deal with this alcoholic who blames me for EVERYTHING wrong.<P>My husband has been drinking today - He just got home about 30 minutes ago. He's not drunk but had enough to drink that he is unable to control his anger. He is extremely angry with me again about his sentence to go to spousal abuse counseling. I believe that if he wasn't in so much trouble now, he would have hit me tonight, he is so angry. He is blaming me, says I screwed up his life by forcing (?) him to go to counseling. He screamed at me that he wouldn't have to go to the #**#&$ counseling if I hadn't had him arrested. He was just livid, hollering at me, one minute saying he wants to end our marriage, next minute says he didn't say it, I must be crazy. I was calm, told him repeatedly that I love him more than anything in this world, but he has to stop blaming me. Of course this just made him madder. I told him I didn't want to talk to him about it because he'd been drinking. <P>He kept asking me what did I want to do, we had to settle it right now. Apparently his atty. had told him in order for the trial to be cancelled, I have to agree to this sentence. This is what we got into the arguement about last Friday - I was angry that his atty. took it upon himself to make another deal with the prosecutor without me having a chance to discuss it with my atty. - the Prosecutor. I had told my H then I wasn't agreeing to anything until I could talk to the prosecutor. I've tried several times this week to talk to him and haven't been able to reach him. I felt that my H wasn't telling me the whole truth, because he let it slip that he had a choice between 1 yr. probation with no alcohol, mandatory AA, and counseling or the 6 mos. of spousal abuse counseling, or a jury trial. He had led me to believe that the prosecutor changed the offer. Again I felt betrayed by him. If I would have had my say in this I would have preferred he took the no alcohol sentence over the counseling because his alcohol abuse is the root of all of his problems, and all of our problems. So, I felt like my H chose the easy way out - keep drinking but go to counseling. <P>Anyway to keep a long story short, I ended up in tears, upset, afraid of losing what we've accomplished, and totally unloved. H went to bed mad, nothing is settled again. I guess he has to give his atty. an answer tomorrow. The last thing he said to me before going to bed was that the outcome (whether I agree or not) would settle whether or not he stays and works on the marriage or leaves again. He is in one of those moods where he wants to give up and go back to drinking himself into a stupor all the time. He is manipulating me into getting his way and I don't know what to do. Part of me says I must do what he says to be a submissive wife, and the other part of me says that I can't let him twist things around and blame me anymore. He swears at me and calls me horrible names. He wouldn't do this if he hadn't been drinking. My stomach is just in knots and the tears won't stop. Why does he have to drink and ruin what we have?<P>I have been trying so hard to please him, I kept his dinner warm for 3 hours, I greeted him with a hug and kiss & didn't say anything about him staying out late drinking, so why does he attack me with his hateful words? <P>Dear God, why does this man want to hurt me so much? All of this pain is becoming overwhelming. Please pray with me that the Lord resolve this problem. Thank you for being here and listening. <P> </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>

JAR - I disagree wholeheartedly with your statement "Praying won't do any good, actions will." <BR>I have faith in God, JAR, that He in his perfect timing will heal my husband. "Because of your unbelief: for verily I say to unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of a mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; AND NOTHING SHALL BE IMPOSSIBLE UNTO YOU" Matthew 17:20<P>You are so WRONG. Prayer is the answer!!! Matthew 18:19 "Again I say unto you, that if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven." Praise the Lord! <P>You said "I didnt even read your note or notes, but I bet I know your life."<P>If you had taken the time to read the posts, as well as some of the others I've put up, you would see the wonderful changes that have been made in my life, AND my husband's life, as well as many others who pray for their husbands. All, and I MEAN ALL, the glory goes to GOD. Because he answers prayer. Again, I must say that "PRAYER AND LIVING LIFE FOR CHRIST IS WHAT LIFE IS ALL ABOUT"!!!!!<P>I have been to Al-Anon, but Al-Anon alone was no help, what has helped is Prayer along with Plan A. <P>And yes, I have talked this over with God. He wants us married, and together. God's word says in 1 Corinthians 7:13 "And the woman which hath a husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him. :14 "For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now now are they holy". For God hates divorce. Being a Christian means to carry another's load when they are down, not to condemn them. <P>As soon as I read your post, I was overcome with a intense feeling that the Lord wanted me to direct these verses to you. These are his words to you JAR. Heed them. <P>"Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder." Mat. 19:6<P>I will remember you in my prayers.<P><BR>

Jar,<BR>Aw is so right, Prayer is the only way. God does answer prayers, and not always the way we want. He does answer prayers. God is always with us. I will Pray for you.<P><BR>Aw,<BR>The power of prayer. You know how powerful prayer is, and I'm praying with you, don't give up, God doesn't want us to give up on anyone. You are doing what God is telling you. I know I read your post and I know how God does answer me. I also know how hard it is. Praying together for God's will. IJN.

JAR,<P>Your anger and hurt just pours out of your post. I don't know if your mom was a prayer or not and you felt like it accomplished nothing. You are right in that Ala-non is helpful to many, but probably understanding more about codependency and how tough love, used properly, within the guidelines of scripture, for action is far more healthier for both the alcoholic and co-alcoholic. (or any type of dependency for that matter) Paul often berated christians for their actions or lack of action in addressing behavior. And sometimes in trying to live in the spirit of love, we find difficulty in speaking the truth in love, in forgiving as Christ forgave us, in letting go of those hurts that bind us to the past which create bitterness and resentment and can pass from generation to generation. We sometimes mistakenly allow abuse to occur in the spirit of submission or love, thinking that we are doing as Jesus did, forgetting that He was not submissive to those things not of God. He chased the moneychangers out of the temple, He berated others for not allowing children to come to him and more importantly, He chided us to look to those children in their innocence for the amazing ability to love as we as adults are sometimes unable to do. He wept for Jeruselem but He never stopped speaking truth to them in love, even though they didn't want to hear it or were enraged by it. And always, He came before the Father in prayer, wanting His will to be first in His life. <P>I too, once lived with an alcoholic. When he began to be verbally abusive to the children, I did not, in the spirit of submission, allow him to continue that behavior. God gave me the children as gifts and caring for those gifts included protection. Speaking the truth in love wasn't easy, striking out verbally or leaving was easy, but to calmly state limits in an honoring way, to stick to one's guns, as AW has done, to allow consequences for behavior, as her husband will, shows far more love. This is not an easy thing to do JAR and I don't know your particular situation, but I do know that bitterness and anger can seep into all of your relationships and spoil them just as one rotten apple in a barrel can ruin the whole barrel. It took courage for you to speak out in a woman's forum and share some of the pain that you felt as a child. The love chapter in the bible, 1 Cor. 13 states "It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres." (verse 7) I suspect that you weren't protected even though you may have hoped and tried to trust and persevering finally became too much for you. The thing to remember is that you are now a survivor of that experience and you have far more empathy for anyone having to go through what you went through as a child. As you heal from the past, you have a strength and the ability to comfort others, encourage them, etc. in a different way than you experienced as a child, to show a healthier way of confronting the problems of alcohol without running from it. The love of Jesus, when applied in our lives, enhances our understanding of what we went through, because He went through far more than we have gone through and so He understands pain. In the beginning of His ministry, His mother and brothers wanted Him to stop speaking, whether it was the love of a mother out of fear or embarrassment within their community, who knows and maybe it doesn't matter. When we develop the relationship with Christ, understanding that none of us are good enough to get to heaven on our own merits, we have the assurance and encouragement to tackle anything that comes our way, because He did. <P>I will be praying for you JAR, for healing and for God to reveal Himself to you in a way you have not experienced before. Who knows? This might have been God's plan for you to stumble into our little forum, that you might finally have the peace which surpasses all understanding, releasing you from the chains of the past. God Bless you JAR!<BR>

You all said it so well and speak from experience. Amen! Blessings, J

I ask for an apology from AW and the other readers. <P>I know that anger and hate splashed all over my posting and I am sorry.<P>As for the prayers wont do good, I retract and reafirm that AW should keep praying as this brings peace to her, but please act as well.<P>Like I said, being an alcoholic doesnt make anyone a bad person, but it makes him a sick person ,thus , sickens the ones that depend on him, hence, Wife and Kids.<P>Im not that savy in the bible, but I beleive there is a word that says that someone should keep away from those who dont let them grow. Abuse certainly doesnt make anyone grow.<P>Maybe, divorce is not an answer, but a separation defintely will help. You dont know what comes next with an alcoholic, and Life is certainly threaten. Please save your and your kids lifes. Alcoholism was probably not a sickness the bible dealt with back then, and this is another time. I definatley hope so, but statistics will show you that a man hardly overcomes his "alcoholic behavior"<BR>He can be clean with out a drop of alcohol for years and his behavior is still present. This behavior wont change unless the man is consious that he is sick and he efforts him self to cure his sickness. Tell an alcoholic man that he is an alcoholic or that he is sick and he will never beleive you. You need time to heal and so do your kids. This doesnt mean to stop loving him, it means that you need healing to be able to heal your man. When have you seen a mentally sick person cure another mentally sick person? <P>Do you realize you are sick? Dont be afraid.<BR>I am, my mother is, and my brother and sisters are. This doesnt mean we are bad. <P>It means we need to heal, and being present(In the same house of the alcoholic) wont help. <P>Please give yourself and your kids a chance to heal yourselfs.<P>Somebody asked me if my mother prayed, and I can tell you she did enough for all of us. But she prayed and prayed, and went to church and church, and preist to preist, and the outcome? She is still with my dad, still suffering, geting sicker and sicker, etc.<P>I dont want this to happen to you. One of the thigs that intrigues me and makes me mad and sad is that uncounsiuosly she could not bare with me making my wife happy. Its, like because she suffered, she wants my wife to suffer. Poor lady, I know she doesnt do it on purpose but she does it. Will you have the same effect on your kids, I hope not, and the "only" way this will not happen is if you heal yourself, as well as your kids. Sharing a home is not the answer.<P>I hope this helps you make a right decision.<P>IF by any means my way upsets anybody, is not intended. Just speaking frankly and with a purpose. <P>I thank you for your prayers.

Hi JAR<BR>Thanks for taking the time to read our responses for for writing back. I do forgive you for the anger that splashed out. <P>And yes, the codependent person is sicker than the alcoholic. That was a tough one for me to swallow at first! Learning to get out of the dysfunctional behaviors that allows the alcoholic person to stay the same way is hard but it is doable within the marriage. I do believe there is a way to set boundaries and to allow consequences to fall on the alcoholic person. I do believe as we seek the Lord's wisdom and His character, we can become the women God wants us to be. God has given only one provision for divorce and that is fidelity, but I also believe God can even heal those things. God does say even if a woman leaves her husband, she is not to divorce him and I do believe this provision is applicable in those boundary setting situations if the husband is abusive, etc. Codependents have a tendency to look at verses such as in Phil 2:3-4 Do nothing out of selfish ambition or vain conceit, but in humility consider others better than yourselves. [4]Each of you should look not only to your own interests, but also to the interests of others" and see only verse 3 and ignore verse 4. In recovery, we need to apply the statement "I consider you in considering me" in that my actions or inactions do impact another, but I am still to honor God by my actions. We are not to enable the alcoholic but neither are we free to be disrespectful or dishonoring to him. We can love him enough to allow him to fall on his face but we do not have to sit in the mud with him. We can hand him a towel via encouragement, prayers, etc. but it is not our resposibility to clean up the mess he made while falling. We can pray the prayers of this book we are studying, learning more about ourselves and the role we have as a wife, but we cannot usurp the headship that God has placed our husbands over us. We have to look at our boundary issues in light of what God says to us, "what would God have me do" "what would Jesus do" as He is the great example for us. He sacrificed His life that we might be reconciled to the Father, we cannot sacrifice our lives for the same purpose because it has already been done. We can, though, love with a sacrificial love, much as the Proverbs 31 wife did, and thus honor our husbands. We do not place our husbands in the position of meeting our happiness because God already does that. In this we can learn to live in peace in an unpeaceable situation. <P>PHP 2:12 Therefore, my dear friends, as you have always obeyed--not only in my presence, but now much more in my absence--continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling, [13] for it is God who works in you to will and to act according to his good purpose.<P> PHP 2:14 Do everything without complaining or arguing, [15] so that you may become blameless and pure, children of God without fault in a crooked and depraved generation, in which you shine like stars in the universe [16] as you hold out* the word of life--in order that I may boast on the day of Christ that I did not run or labor for nothing.<P>In learning to be the woman of God, and live in an alcoholic situation, we do have to be careful and not allow bitterness roots to grow in us, thus becoming a martyr and "suffering" so. The challenge we all have had in this forum is to identify what we are feeling and not be a whiner or complainer, but to state the feelings and to look for how God will encourage us through one another with His Word. Sometimes we are exhorted by the Word, sometimes encouraged, but always our goal is to become what He would have us become.<P>In your relationship with your mother, I pray that you will be strengthened to learned how to disengage from your mother's negative behavior's and her sadness over your happiness in your marriage. As you learn to set boundaries to stop hearing the "complaints" and learn to hear the heart of your mother, "gee you must be sad," "gosh that must have been tough", "I have confidence in you that you will figure that out" etc. you free yourself from the illness and find you do not have to "fix" your mother or her relationship or anything else. You wil be showing your mother far more honor this way by stopping the ohter bahavior. She will try to make you feel guilty, but you have to ask yourself what is the truth in the matter, what your motivation was for saying whatever you say. If it was honorable, then let it go, if it wasn't confess it and apologize. The key I use for myself is the HALT method- and maybe some of you ladies out there doesnt know what this is, so I will explain it. H=hungry, A=angry, L=lonely, T=tired. When I am experiencing any other of these things, I know I am back in the codependent groove and I have to figure out what I can do to get out of it, whether it is a boundary I must set or a truth I must speak or something I have to address or to forgive. HALT tells me to stop doing what I am doing....it might be the Shut Up and Pray time for me that our book talks about.<P>Again, I am grateful that you have chosen to write in our forum and I pray that God will touch your life in a way, that you can hear His voice calling you, that you can accept the gift that He offers you to be free from all encumbrances that bind you.