Last post got sooooo long, I had to start another thread...<P>FA --<P>I don't remember. How long have you and H been having problems? Wasn't there a death in the family that kinda triggered a series of events.<P>With my W, I first confronted her about an OM over two years ago. But, I'll admit, I can trace back the source of of marriage problems as far back as seven or eight years!<BR>I'll admit that the source of many of those was me, and my W made the efforts to reconnect. It just was too late before reality came and knocked on my door. Maybe too late since the roots of damage run deep.<P>--keystone

Keystone,<P>I'm on a needed break here from doing those dreaded taxes!! Boy, I hate this time of year! LOL<P>Anyway, yes, problems started as a result of his brother dieing, actually it will be 8 years ago this month. But if I look back I find they actually started way before that. About the time our first D was born. <P>My H is the kind of person who like all the attention being on him. When we had our D attentions shifted, which is a natural process. Thats when and I can see it now he started working more and not being home as much. Things just snowballed downward from there. The lack of communication was definately effected and time spent together was not what it probably should have been. <P>He keeps telling me he works so much to provide for us. I keep telling him theres more to life than money! That time spent with us as a family or me as his partner means more than all the money in the world. As far as I'm concerned there will never be enough money so why kill yourself over it. Enjoy what you have here. But he just can't seem to get past that. <P>Your last two lines make a lot of sense to me. In some ways thats what I have been thinking. Is the resentment so deep that I will not be able to get over it? <P>Is it too late? Sometimes I think its worth a shot but then their are other times that I think it will never happen and why make everyone miserable by living like this.<P>My thoughts for today, now its back to fighting with payroll to see if they can straighten out this W2 thats wrong! <P>Have a good one!<P>falsely accused

Not yet ready to do the taxes. But, then when am I ever ready. Thank God for TurboTax!<P>A near fatal accident, the birth of my son, alot of work away from town, and a home remodel from hell all in a short period of time contirbuted to my marital problems. It all snowballed from there. I guess in coping with some of those problems, the marriage suffered. Here we are today...<P>Regarding jobs/careers:<P>I'd give up my job in a minute if it meant anything to our marriage. I've worked long and hard to build a career, make real great money, won national awards in my profession, have a wonderful house. SO WHAT. If you don't have the realtionship, the rest is useless. <P>In truth, I believe that my W actual likes the fact that I'm not around much of the day. By default, it gives her "space".<P>Anyway, I'm bacl to work for a while. Here's a thought to leave you with today.<P>Been a bad week. Just remember, the week is almost over since today is Friday...<BR>...In Australia.<P>If only I was in Australia!!!<P>Good luck with the taxes!<P>--keystone

Keystone,<P>LMAO at that one! Yes I have to agree bad week, but I would rather be in Hawaii helping my relatives with the wedding thats only 2 weeks away!! Now doesn't that sound good, too bad I can't go! <P>As you can see I'm still around! I need all the help I can get with these taxes this year. When you have incompentent people making up W2's that are wrong(I majored in accounting in college, so I should know!), and they are telling you they are right it doesn't help much. <P>So off to fight with some stupid payroll girl that doesn't know her @$$ from her elbow and get all this frustration out before H comes home!! <P>I like the thought of Australia too! Hard choice!!<P>falsely accused

I just wished that my H would give up his job to fight for us. I think his long hours and time away from our family and maybe his job going to his head lead to his affair. I told him one time I was not one of his employeeds i was his wife. It was one of those time he was treating me like I was a servant.<P>I hope you W realizes what you will do for her and your marriage.<P>Why is is too late a lot of the time to restore our marriage when we finally have figured our what went wrong and want to correct. My H just flat out told me last night he wants out our marriage so he can start other relationships. He just came back home last week and I thought wanted to make it work, go figure.<P>Hang in there you sound like a great guy!!

my3kids,<P>I have to agree with you that if my H would have given up some of his time at work for us, things might be a lot different now. My H uses work as an escape to the problems here. <P>And as keystone and I have been discussing, is it too late to try and fix what has been done? I'm hoping its not to late, but I just have to wait and see. Taking it one day at a time!<P> <BR>keystone, <BR> <BR>As far as your statement that your W likes the fact that your not around much because it gives her space. <P>Well, I feel that way a lot depending what type of mood H comes home in. If hes in a mood when he walks in the door I hope its a night that he will have to eat and leave for the other job. That sounds terrible to say but the girls even feel that way and have told me they like when he has to go back out to the other job a lot because no one wants to deal with him yelling or being nasty with them. <P>They have said to me that there is so much less stress when he's out working. Everyone seems to be on edge when H is home. <P>P.S. Still didn't straighten out the payroll clerk, I guess theres always tomorrow or to go over her head to the accountant who does their books! <P>falsely accused <P>

Sorry about the delay in getting back. Work has been h**l, with one crisis after another.<P>My3Kids:<P>Regarding giving up work time or even a job for my family: <P>I will say this. I don't know that I would have agreed to giving up my career a while ago. Now,seeing what I've lost -- my marriage -- I'd give it up in a minute. <P>To do my job properly, I've got to be on sight for at least a normal shift. That shift runs normally twelve hours, plus the lunch break. Bad days go long, and good days (there are a few), slightly less than twelve. Often times, this profession takes me on the road, and for extended periods of time. <P>You simply cannot succeed in the career without doing this. I was driven to succeed, I'm a profectionist, focused. I am the sole income provider, so success on a family level was important. My W wanted to remain a stay at home mom, and I wanted to provide that opportunity for her.<P>In hindsight, I should have chosen less loft goals in a more humane profession!<P>FA --<P>First, I hope the taxes and the payroll clerk got it together. Approaching tax time is always soooo much fun.<P>Regarding my being away and "space" for my W:<P>Sometimes it actually works for me. As you know, this constant stress and chaos gets overwhelming. These days, I do welcome the time alone, if just to try to clear my head. Lately (because the doc said I have to go for health issues), I joined a gym and I'm going religiously. It is giving me sometime to clear out the negative thoughts (maybe not ALL of them, but...) and get my own space. I just wish I didn't have to take it to that degree.<P>Regarding V-Day:<P>I think I told you that I sent my W a humorous card, nothing too romantic. I keep the message simple, although I did sign it, "Love, G". Hopefully, not a LB! Also sending some tullips for Monday am delivery. Again, didn't want to LB by sending roses, but wanted to keep it special.<BR>I did send a single red rose to my D -- she'll get a kick out of that!<P>My son -- he and I will share candy if we get any. I'll be curious to see if she gives me anything.<P>I e-mailed W a few days ago about V-day and maybe getting together. Nothing too big a deal, just a suggestion that it would be nice if we could get away between the kids schedule for a dinner. No response. When I've been home, she hasn't mentioned the e-mail, or any other e-mails that I've send lately. I'm not pushing, either. I just want to see what develops on it's own.<P>This weekend and Monday promise to be real "special". I say that with dripping sarcasim!<P>Hope your day's better!!!!!!<P>--keystone

keystone,<P>Well, the taxes are on hold until the payroll clerk gets her act together. She told me today that she has no clue what to do to fix this, that she has to contact the controller and accountant. I could fix it myself(I know what the % and figures should be) but thats not going to help me in the long run. So, I sit and wait! I'm not stressing myself over it, eventually they will figure out what they have to do or they can hire me to do it! <P><BR>Well, still no news on H making the doctor appt. So, as he went to get up from the dinner table and couldn't stand up straight, I just looked at him and didn't say a word. As I sit here and type as the girls are getting ready for bed, H is in the living room sitting up on the couch with his head slouched forward sleeping already. There has to be a health issue behind all of this. This is one of the reasons I don't sit with him while he watches TV. But, no LBing here from me tonight!<P>I understand the "space" thing all to well, as much as I want H to be around sometimes its not worth all the added stress.<P>As for V-day, I have to go out either tomorrow or this weekend and I think I too will stick with a funny card, but I don't know what else to get. This has been really bugging me today! I really don't want to get him candy especially with whatever health issue he might be having, so I'll have to find something. <P>I like your idea of the tulips, good choice. Roses may be pushing it a little. I don't know if I could appreciate something like roses right now with the way things are. I would probably prefer a nice house plant or something along those lines. <P>I like the idea of the rose for your D, I think that is really sweet. I usually buy for the girls, H doesn't, never has. I don't think H realizes things like that can mean a lot to them. <P>Sorry to hear your W hasn't mentioned your email that you sent her. That is a really nice gesture on your part. Maybe she will surprise you and you'll be able to have that dinner with her. <P>Yes, a real special weekend and Monday on tap! I understand your feelings exactly!<P>falsely accused<BR>

FA --<P>Has he made that appointment with the doc yet? You indicated the "healh problem", but is that related to him sleeping or the inability to stand-up straight/fatigue?<P>Sorry, I just worked a LATE LATE night, got four hours sleep, and just returned to the office to start today's wonderful day! UGH!<BR>TGIF!<P>I'm not going to be ablt to check for posts until later today, PST. If we don't talk, good luck this weekend. I hope the days leading up to V-Day are better than I am expecting at my house. A busy weekend is planned, and my W's been a bit more distant these last few days. Of course, some of that could be due to my hours/work shift.<P>With any luck, maybe one of us can come out us this weekend with the "V-Day" meaning "victory" for some positive steps from our spouses. <P>Chin Up!<P>--keystone

keystone,<P>Ok, not having a good day here, I just had a half of post done and AOL decided to boot me off!!! grrr!! <P>Now where was I! LOL <P>No, H didn't make the doc appt yet, I'm still waiting! H's health problems have a lot to do with the way he takes care or lack there of, of himself. He is over weight mostly in the stomach area which has lead to the back problems. He also has high cholesterol and smokes 2 1/2 packs of cigarettes a day(I smoke too but less and am in a lot better shape health wise, so I can't harp on the smoking thing). I believe he also has sleep apnea, because when he is sleeping at night he snores very bad and then will stop breathing and gasps for air, which from what I have read will disrupt sleep.<P>The weird thing is the more he works the better off he is and the happier he is. He's not as tired and has more energy then when he is home sitting around doing nothing. <P>Anyway, enough of that subject! <P>Something you said kind of struck me. Do you think that maybe your W is pulling away due to the fact that V-day is coming up? <P>I have found myself the past two days starting to pull away and I think it might be because of what I am feeling with V-day coming up. I'm not proud of myself for doing this and I do see it, but its really hard to feel something I'm not feeling right now. I'm really starting to feel the stress from it and that bothers me. Just some thoughts!<P>Well, maybe you can suggest to your W that you know that it been hard week for her because of your working so much and that a nice dinner out with just the two of you might be in order. Maybe if you put it that way she might go for it! Hey I'm trying here, give me some credit! LOL <P>I'm not expecting much on this end, so I figured I'd try and help you out. Actually H has off from 5pm Sat until Monday morning, which is a change around here, so I don't know what to expect. I'll keep my mind open and hope for something positive to come out of it all.<P>I'll check back later. If I don't see a post I'll know you were busy. <P>Good luck this weekend! <P>falsely accused

FA --<P>It's late. Sorry I couldn't get back to you earlier. I'll be off line this weekend, so any response will have to wait until Monday am, PST.<P>Exercise! Exercise! exercise! It's help the weight, the cholesterol, and the sleep disorder. My doc just insisted that I get on a program since the cholesterol has become a problem. Stress at work only hurts it more. <P>Ya know what? I sleep better, too. And, have more energy. Aren't you glad I'm NOT a doctor! LOL<P>About my W and you both pulling away:<P>I'm sure it's deliberate. It may not be a conscious effort, but it's because V-Day is near. I like your idea about dinner. I may try it, if we can somehow work the kids conflicts out of the middle!<P>How about you guys go to a movie this weekend? With H off, let him get some rest (takes the grouch curse away) and see a comedy. Don't know what's out offhand, but get a laugh at somebody else's expense. Maybe, if the climate's right, do it as a family. Who knows, maybe all of you guys might enjoy it since the pressure to perform isn't there. Plus, the environment of a theatre may be less threatening than a romantic restaurant with all the "love" around the room. Know what I mean???<P>I agree with the feeling that things aren't right at this time of year. It feels awkward, and I sure my W feels the same. I don't want to talk to her about it since I'm afraid it will just intensify the feelings and result in a major LB. I'm gonna be careful this weekend, and I'll be curious to see how she responds to the tullips on Monday.<P>Good luck this weekend, and I'll hold a good thought.<P>--keystone

keystone, <P>Yeah, I know its late especially here on the east coast. I'm not having a good night here, so I'm still up. I was writing my girlfriend a letter and decided to check in with the site. <P>I did a funny thing tonight and went into a post here that from the topic I know I should have stayed out of and talk about flashbacks! Wow, things that have been haunting me are coming back tonight really bad. <P>That and the fact that some things occured tonight with H is making this a difficult night. <P>I was really good tonight and I guess because I explained my feelings on here this afternoon, I knew what I was doing and I tried not to distance myself so much from him. But then I just got the feeling when he came home tonight that hes pushing me further away to see what I would do. I don't know how to explain it all.<P>I was laying in bed and he had his back to me from the minute I got in and I just started crying so I figured I would get up and have a cup of tea. <P>Anyway, I'm up and I don't know when I will finally get to sleep.<P>Oh by the way I know about the exercise thing doc! LOL I had a bad car accident last January and the doc told me the same thing. Exercise is the key to health!<P>Oh well I hope I made some kind of sense here.<P>I'll keep good thoughts that maybe your W will go for that dinner !<P>Have a good weekend!<P>falsely accused

FA --<P>Happy V Day!<P>Sorry your Friday pm was so bad. Hope you got some sleep, and eventually got the weekend turned around.<P>Here's an update from this morning...<P>Got a card left on my gym bag this morning. Surprised, but not shocked -- I know she went out and got the card Saturday evening. Incidentally, I got the card I gave to her LAST WEEK. Oh, well. I guess I shouldn't be too critical.<P>The card was humorous, not romantic. She did sign off with "love", which I'm shocked. After all, she said she didn't love me, and didn't believe it when I said "I love her". Maybe it was an accident, and she slipped when she signed off.<P>This whole weekend she was distant. Not a lot of interaction, and very little direct communication. She watched movies on cable, usually in a room not occupied by me or the kids. Even when I got home on Friday night, she rarely took her eyes off the tv to even look or talk to me. After about five minutes of talking to her ear, I gave up and got ready for bed.<P>Quite frankly, I felt she didn't want to even be there. We didn't sit next to each other once, and I can honestly say, I'm getting used to it. I believe it's over. As I may have mentioned to you in the past, my youngest has a birthday coming up soon. I don't want to forever tarnish his birthday by moving out and seperating. I think I'll wait a few weeks.<P>Saturday night didn't help. My D was having trouble with her homework, and I was helping out. It was a rather involved math project, and she was having some trouble. Eventually, after a while, she realized that she has misinterpeted a direction, which meant that all the subsiquent answers were invcorrect. She got frustrated, and started to cry. I don't blame her, since she spent about one and one half hours on it to that point.<P>Out of frustration, she started to madly erase eveything she had done to that point. I shouted at her not to, since I wanted her to check again since she may have not been so far off. With 1.5 hours of work so far, she couldn't have been that far off.<P>Well, she screamed at me. She stated that I always yell on the weekends and after work. That I always yell at her and her mom. And, that she hates it.<P>Needless to say, I was stunned. Yes, I've been known to yell. I don';t think alot, but these past months I have over my own frustration at my W. I really beleive that I've not yelled for a long time.<P>My W camwe to D's aid. To that point, she had not helped one bit with the homework. And, at no time did she say anything to dispute my D's accusation.<P>My son, who was in the other room, came to my aid. I'm sure he saw the shocked look on my face. I was totally thrown!!! He said that it's not true, and that D was wrong. That she didn't mean what she said.<P>My D later apologized, but the damage was done. My W never said anything to dispute it.<P>Anyway, how is YOUR V Day. I hope better than mine.<P>--keystone

keystone,<P>Happy V-day to you too! <P>Well,I see you had a heck of a weekend. Sorry to hear that it wasn't more pleasant. <P>The thing with your D is something that goes on around here all the time. I don't know your situation but in my situation its not that H yells so much as his tone of voice when he speaks. Females I believe interpret this different from males. I'm always telling H that its the way he says things not what he says. Maybe the same in your case, I really don't know. <P>At least she apologized. A lot of times I don't get involved in what the girls say to their father because I think maybe that he will finally "get it" if it comes from them instead of me. I can't blame your W for not getting involved in some instances. <P>My update: Sat. night he came home from work and I really didn't feel like cooking(or eating for that fact) from the lack of sleep the night before. So I asked him what he wanted to do for dinner. H & the girls decided on going out, so I said ok. <P>Well, biggest mistake I think! D#2 started crying when we were seated because thats not really where she wanted to go, but didn't want to disappoint H. D#1 was upset because they took her favorite thing off the menu. Can you see where this is going?? <P>Well, after dinner H asked me if I wanted to go anyplace or do anything. Not a good time to ask me a question like that after what had just happened(plus the fact that money is extremely tight this month, which he wouldn't have a clue about since he doesn't even know what bills we have!). So I said no lets go home. <P>We no sooner walked in the door and I was taking care of the dog and H was already online. Thats where he spent most of his night. Then he went onto the couch from there and fell asleep. Fun night!<P>Well, Sunday he spent almost all day online while I was busy doing 7 loads of wash and cleaning and cooking dinner for Sun & Mon nights. After dinner he sat in the recliner and went to sleep while I cleaned the kitchen for 2 hours. <P>So as you can see my weekend was about as good as yours! Not much in the sleep department for me either, so that doesn't help. <P>As of right now I haven't gotten anything for V-day! I got up at 4:45 to take my shower and he was still in bed(at least I thought he was). I came out and he was gone already. Not even a good morning. But then again this is what happens every morning so why should today be any different! <P>To think he spent all this time online this past weekend and I didn't even get an email card! The funny part about this is when I signed on this morning I thought there would at least be that. So I checked the temporary files and saw he was in all kinds of card sites so I wonder who got all these cards!! Not me thats for sure. <P>I guess I'll have to wait until H gets home to find out how my day will end!<P>Its interesting you said your W signed the card with "love". I just came back from the store after finally deciding what to get for him and I did too( I wound up getting him a CD and a small box of candy, oh and a funny card!). I have been trying to say this to him at night when he tells me he loves me but the past few nights I just can't. It makes me feel sad.<P>This is the first time I have bought the girls something and not signed it from both of us. I don't know why I did this its just the way I feel right now. I feel he had plenty of time this weekend to go out if he really wanted to. I suppose he'll stop somewhere on his way home from work. I really don't know anymore. <P>I know its going to be a hectic night here with D#2 having religion classes and running with that and homework, so I don't expect to much. <P>I hope the tulips went over good for your sake. Something, anything positive at this point will help!<P>I'll check in later. Have a good day!<P>falsely accused<BR>

FA --<P>I'm so sorry to hear that it was a cr**y weekend for you. It sounds like Monday couldn't come soon enough.<P>Try to think positive. Perhaps your H decided that the e-cards weren't good enough, and he better look for a real, old fashion touchy-feely type of card. Or, maybe something else instead.<P>And, if nothing come, go out and treat yourself. Even if it's just a starbucks and a piece of cake. He may not be able to meet your needs right now, but you have to try to meet you own. It might also give you a break from some of the crazieness. Of course, you said tonight's busy with D#2, so maybe the starbucks has to come sooner.<P>I saw something interesting in the office kitchen this morning -- a heart shaped bagel. Kinda neat idea. Maybe for another time.<P>Anyway, hang in there. I'l check back later.<P>--keystone

keystone,<P>Little quick update here. H just came home(he's in the shower now so I have a few minutes). <P>Well, as I thought H put a lot into this V-day. He stopped at a local convience store and pick me up a $2.99 bouquet of flowers and a single rose for each of the girls. No cards! I guess I should be thankful for something anyway, even though I haven't figured out what yet.<P>Oh well, what can a person do! I'll be back later.<P>falsely accused<BR>

Small steps. Small steps.<P>Big steps when you consider that -- on his own -- he got something for the girls. <P>Maybe it should be considered a bit of a victory. He's recognized the importance to the girls, and he did it on his own. Now, if he can apply that same thought towards his spouse, huh!<P>I'll try to check back later. Until then, keep thinking positive and don't LB!<P>--keystone

Unbelievable!<P>She actually sent me an e-mail to thank me for the flowers! And, she signed it "love, *". <P>Should I check my eyeglass prescription?????<P>--keystone

keystone,<P>Thats great news!! <P>I'm happy to hear that she emailed you and signed it "love"! You keep telling me small steps I guess thats what its all about.<P>Sorry I didn't get back on sooner but #2D had a school project and being I'm the only one who knows how to use picture publisher and deal with resizing and printing photos from a disk I had to do that for her, while she finished the tons of homework she had. <P>Anyway, after I posted I had to run up and get #2D from religion class(H was still in the shower) and came home to put dinner on the table and then do this project for her(2 hours worth!). After that I had the job of cleaning the kitchen up from dinner. So thats how I spent my night.<P>I am drained emotionally and physically right about now. As I drove up to get D#2, the tears just started, just as I feel now typing this. This is not easy for me. I look about as sad as those half dead flowers in the vase. <P>I am going to bed very soon and knowing me, I will cry myself to sleep again tonight just like the past few nights. <P>Sorry to be such a downer here. <P>I hope things brighten up for you even more when you got home! <P>I'm trying to remember small steps but its so hard.<P>I'll catch up with you tomorrow.<P>falsely accused

FA --<P>I'm sorry he doesn't seem to get it. You've got to stay strong, though, if for just yourself and your kids. <P>I guess that's where I'm at right know. I figured, since my W didn't seem to be coming around, I was just going to "do my own thing". No sense in wallowing in sorrow and anger since it doesn't seem to be changing.<P>Then, last night an interesting development.<BR>First, my W called me late at work to thank me for the tullips. She sounded more surprised and delighted than I've heard in years. The warning bells went off!<P>When I got home, she met me at the door, again with a genuine smile over the flowers.<BR>Was this real, or was something up? I enjoyed the moment, though with some guarded optimism.<P>A few minutes later, she followed me into the bedroom. She told me that she had gone to dinner with her best friend and her family. Her best friend's H is the "OM". <BR>(If you remember, I say it was an EA with the OM, she denies an "affair", but says he met her emotional needs that I was failing to meet.)<P>She told me that the OM was not supposed to be there. Our kids (who are friends with the other family's kids) had snookered my W and the other couple all into a Valentine's Dinner out. <P>My W had admitted that she would not have gone had she known the OM was there. He was supposed to be at work. She also said that she told the kids not to "put her in a spot" like that again with this other family -- without elaborating on the real reason behind it.<P>This was a BIG STEP. She came to me, without being pressured or provoked, and admitted that she had seen the OM. Even though it was not a planned meeting, she admitted the meeting nonetheless! And, combined with the apparent happiness over the flowers, actual looked like she felt guilty! I thanked her for being honest, and letting me know. I then dropped the subject. <P>Moral of the story:<P>I cannot say that our relationship has suddenly turned 180 degrees and we're "back on track". But, I can say that for the first time in a really LONG time, I see even a ray of hope. <P>The joy from the flowers, and the admission of seeing the OM were BIG STEPS. I think I made a big step in thanking her for telling me without being judgemental, or adding further comment. BIG STEPS on my behalf, too. And after such a long time without any significant steps.<P>Another poster on the MB website has a "signature". I don't remember who it is, but it suggests something about not being able to see until you have been totally blinded. Makes no sense, and I didn't articulate it properly. But, if you find it, it really makes sense. Perhaps it applies in your H's sense, and a bit in yours, too. I know it does in our situation. Plus, you can only effect today -- not yesterday, and hope for tomorrow.<P>Hopefully your today will be better than your yesterday, and your tomorrow even better than that.<P>--keystone