Today I finally asked in our counseling session whether ow in any way acknowledged my h's birthday a few weeks ago. (affair ended by H ten months ago) First he quickly said no. Then he reflected a bit and said she sent him an email wishing him a happy birthday. I was so disappointed. I did not let my anger show but said it was a violation of the no personal contact understanding they are supposed to have. (I also wondered about his swift denial) He said nothing further. I was just starting to get to the point of feeling like perhaps I don't need to confront her. Now I feel as if this gives me another reason. I have also recently learned that when my h tried to end the relationship she didn't want to and continued to pursue him for two months - successfully and with a transformation of what had been an EA into one with physical contact. <BR>Did I not make a bit enough fuss about the birthday greeting contact OR I am simply making too much of it?<BR> Simone

Simone,<P>I am glad your H felt "safe" enough to be HONEST. He needs to be HONEST at all times. I guess in one way, he can't help it if she contacts him via e-mail, unless he has a way to change his e-mail without her finding out what the new address would be.<P>You do need to keep reinforcing to your H about the no-contact. But, ultimately, it is HIS responsibility to do everything he can to stop the contact. He should send her a message you see to leave him alone.<P>What did your counsslor say in the session when H said she had sent him the e-mail???<P>Roll Me Away<P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

The Bday greeting shows her true colors, not his. The OW pursuing him and getting him physically involved is interesting, too. Sounds like OW had more emotionally involved in this than your H did.<P>Maybe that is why he does not want to share details. Maybe the "facts" are worse retold than they ever were in his heart.<P>I believe my H was sucked into his thing, although it certainly didn't take much suction. I think he spent most of his time pulling away and with her in pursuit. If they had known each other or had continued contact, I would not be as "lucky" for my H to have had as brief affair as he did.<P>Maybe you H knows your devastation is much deeper than his emotional involvement ever was, and he wants to minimize the impact.<P>Be careful about reacting to what you learn. You will reinforce the idea it is not safe to be honest.<P>Did you ever remake your questions list and did your H ever follow up on it?<P>------------------<BR>Faith, Hope, Love Remain,<BR>but the greatest of these is Love.<BR>1 Corinthians 13:13

Simone--<P>She contacted him...technically out of his control. One idea would be to cancel that email account and open a new one, unknown to OW. If H is willing to do that, it's an effective block to any future contact she may attempt online. And also gives her a big message!<P>I've thought about similar feelings in the past when women have shown blatant interest in my H...it feels more like a territorial thing than jealousy to me when it's the woman being aggressive. That feeling that rises up, like "hey! he's mine!! grrr, hiss, spit" At a bar one night after a particularly aggressive woman started to slither around my H, I consoled myself with thoughts of using my Bic lighter on her over-processed, straw-like hair...and felt MUCH better. <P>Curious q...did your H acknowledge OW's bday greeting in any way?

Simone,<P>I agree that this was out of his control. But, he can certainly put her on a BLOCK SENDER on his e-mail account. That is alot easier and more practical, than changing his e-mail account.<P>But, the truth is she can still find plenty of ways to contact him, should she choose to avail herself of the other methods. But, blocking her e-mail is a must! <P> She was obviously testing the waters. By waiting until his birthday, it means that she waited until she had a "reason" to e-mail him. That is a GOOD sign. She clearly does not feel entitled or welcome to just e-mail him at her whim. Take comfort in that! Don't make too big a deal out of it, but do insist that he immediately BLOCK her name.

Simone-have to say I agree with both FHL and Lucks. I would ask you H as a measure of good faith if he could possibly change the e-mail account or make it so she is blocked from communicating with her. <BR>That he told you is great-he believes in the two of you enough to be honest with you. That is difficult at best at times, I know. My H is telling the truth continually and I think it's great that he feels good in this but sometimes he tells me things I wonder if I wouldn't be better off without the truth!!!!<BR>I think it's hard, yet I would start the conversation with him, if you hold it in it will only continue to bother you and that would eventually affect how you treat him, that much I have learnt! God Bless!<P>------------------<BR>Chick's <BR>Bren<P>You won't see things until your ready to not be blind!<P><BR>

Roll Me Away - I really do appreciate his willingness to be honest now, even though it was preceded by many months of refusing to talk about his "distraction" as he calls it.<BR>I now see progress in that I felt safe enough to ask questions (without overwhelming fear I'd push him away) and he felt safe enough to answer honestly.<BR>You asked what our counselor's response was when told about the birthday email. She said it obviously didn't mean much to my H. When he first said the ow did not acknowledge his birthday and then corrected that statement by disclosing the email, the counselor said it meant so little to H that he forgot. I am still trying to reframe it that way.<P>Faith Hope Love - I agree that I shouldn't get too excited about the birthday greeting because it really shows more about the ow and her lack of respect for boundaries than it shows about h. My H is not the one who wrote it. Also he said he did not respond to it.<BR>You are fortunate your H's affair was with a hussy he met in a bar, not someone he works with and is respected by everyone. My H's ow was the recipient of a "woman of the year" award from a national professional association! - would I like to tell them a thing or two - some "woman"!<BR>I have heeded your warning to not react to what I learn from H's honesty. In fact, he answered all my questions in their original form and more. The answers, though painful to hear, for the most part were not nearly as devestating as what I had been imagining all these months when he refused to provide any information about their secret life. (I was planning to post about my interrogation sessions - which took three hours with our therapist - but haven't had much time. I am also still kind of mulling it over first. Thank you for asking.<P>Lucks - You are absolutely correct that I should not place any blame on my h for this event - unless he hasn't made it perfectly clear to ow that there is to be no personal contact. Unfortunately, my h can't block her email as she works for him.<BR>My H did say that he did not acknowledge her birthday greeting at all - and that he should be commended for.<P>Skye - I do fear she was "testing the waters" (my therapist said the same thing!)<BR>Her testing the waters and lack of respect for boundaries and marriages, both mine and hers, frightens me -- she is so damn manipulative.<P>Chick's - Yes, I now see it as less of a threat and more of a big step for my H to have been open and honest. I do however, find it odd that his honesty about the birthday greeting hurt more than some of the details I recently learned about the past - maybe I am finally making some progress focusing on "now".<P>Thanks to all of you for helping me through this one. Now I am going to give H a big hug, thank him and tell him how his honesty helps us, and commend him for ignoring her email.<P> Simone

If anyone is still reading this post I have one more question: Next week is ow's birthday - does anyone have any good ideas for a birthday greeting? - dignified yet clear.<BR> Simone

Skip it. Show more class than she does. If you do need to say something to her, do it directly.

I agree with FHL... do it directly and don't wait till her birthday. <P><B>OR</B><P>Let it go now.<P>Your choice. My opinion? If she is still pursuing as of two weeks ago, do it now. You'll look foolish and will accomplish nothing if several months go by and then suddenly for "no reason" you suddenly confront her.<P>Good luck!!<P>------------------<BR>The good life is a process, not a state of being. It is a direction, not a destination.<BR>-Carl Rogers<BR>

Simone,<P>TOTALLY INAPPROPRIATE!! <P>It will be the biggest strategic mistake that you can make! <P>Flashing the red cape at the bull...is just asking for trouble! Trust me, she will take you up on your challenge.<P>Do not let OW set the agenda!<P>Things are going well...don't blunder now!<P>Stay out of the fray. Don't give her an importance that she does not hold any longer. Don't you be the reason, she re-enters your life.<P>Never let your enemy see you sweat. Don't let her know how insecure you still are. <P>Always deal from strength!

FHL, new_beginning, and skye - Thanks for getting me focused again. It really was a stupid idea and I should know better from all I've learned on this mb.<BR> Simone

Now H says he did respond to the birthday greeting. I am sure in our counseling session he at first acted as if he didn't even remember getting it, then said he did. Now two days later he says he did respond but was too pissed off I would even ask that he couldn't tell me that he emailed her back and said "thanks. but you won't be getting a birthday wish from me". He said he did that to set boundaries. guess I just accept that but it makes me question the veracity of anything he says when he can't be truthful in the moment. Oh well, I know my issues are so petty compared to what so many of you are coping with. Maybe I don't even belong here anymore even though I am still struggling.<BR> Simone

Of course your H should be completely honest, with no probing.<P>However, ask yourself this...what do you think his motivation was for skirting the issue?<P>If he was trying to protect you or protect himself from what he would consider the meaningless, that is different that withholding the truth in an attempt to deceive or manipulate.<P>Make him feel safe. Reward the truth.<P>------------------<BR>Faith, Hope, Love Remain,<BR>but the greatest of these is Love.<BR>1 Corinthians 13:13