She called after the Thanksgiving holiday because I had left her a message requesting her to back off and give our family a chance. When she called I told her that my H and I were re-committing to each other and she needed to move on. She said that before she left for the holiday, the plan was for him to move in with her after Christmas. She wanted him to tell her. I handed the phone to him and urged him to say it, but he couldn't. She just kept talking until he changed his mind. He said that he needed to go to her because she was so upset and all alone - I told him that he couldn't go. He said he needed to return her keys, I said he couldn't go - I would take the keys to her. He wanted to know what I would do if he left me. (My God, haven't we been over this and over this?) I told him to think carefully because I have been very understanding and supportive of his emotions, but I have reached a point where if he leaves - I will turn vengeful. He will not be welcome to return, and he wil certainly be taking his share of the debts.<BR>After about 10 agonizing minutes, he handed me the keys.<BR>When I got to her house, she didn't seem to be as upset as I would have been that he wasn't coming to her. I would have been laying on my bed, bawling my eyes out - she was watching television. But needless to say, she wasn't real happy to see me.<BR>She let me in, offered me a seat, and asked me what I wanted. I told her that I was returning the keys and that she was out of the picture and to stay there (more or less). It was all very civil. She critisized me for the way I had treated my H (withdrawing for the last few years), and critisized me for allowing my kids in on their secret. I told her that they are a part of this as much as I am, and they are 9 and 12 years old - not babies. They knew something was going down, and anyway their dad told them not me - and only because he said he was leaving us. This was a week ago. Things change from day to day.<BR>Anyway, she said that she was not playing games, and that I didn't have to worry - she wouldn't be seeing him anymore. This was horse s**t and she didn't need this drama in her life.<BR>I felt so much better after talking to her. Even if she was lying about her involvement, I know that he would not be happy with her forever. She's old (50)and she looks it(we are 37 and 39), she has nothing (lives in a one-bedroom apartment with hardly any furniture)(we have a beautiful home with 4 bedrooms and lots of extras), and I told him yesterday - I bet she hates heavy metal music! He may be able to give us up - but his loud music? Never! (kidding) Anyway, I think he is finally finished with her.<BR>He told me that I am a hero. He didn't have the strength to hurt her and finalize the break-up, but I was there for him to do it for him. I wish I could promise him that that would be the end of it. The psych and I both warned him that she could come after him, but he says he finally has his head on straight and he loves me and our life together. She will not win.

Way to go. I am so proud of you. You handled that beautifuly. I can't imagine how hard that had to be. You were smooth. You go girl!!!<P>------------------<BR>To thy own self be true.<BR>*Viki<P><BR>

patience,<P>Proud of you for having the strength you have... and your husband didn't...<P>Brave thing you did. Sometimes confronting the OP is misguided... but your's worked out well... and thats the most important thing! <P>A couple of thoughts... quotes from <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi6070_sa.html" TARGET=_blank>"Surviving An Affair"(SAA)</A>...<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Permanent separation not only helps prevent a renewal of the affair, but it is also a crucial gesture of consideration to the betrayed spouse. (page 55 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>...maybe your husband should find this quote and read it... and of course...<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Without total separation, marital recovery is almost impossible. (page 56 of SAA)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>If you haven't done so yet... for complete closure... do consider getting your H to tell the OW that the relationship is over in a letter (sample letter on page 58-59 of SAA). Make sure <B>you</B> write this letter <B>with</B> him! Make sure, like the keys, <B>he</B> doesn't deliver it!<P>Again... I'm proud of you and your tenacity.<P>Recovery, will itself be a bit of work too...<P>Best wishes...<P>Jim<BR>---------------------------------<BR>Where two or more are gathered...

Way to be tough and set some boundaries. Your h is still in withdrawal so you may have some more rough days ahead but you can make it. Just be real supportive and don't look for miracles. My h withdrawal took about 4 months with absolutely no contact. Trust me its not easy. There have been many days when i wonder why i'm doing all of this. Hopefully it will all be worth it in the end. Things are definitly looking better around here. Now we are to the point where we can actually start to work on us. We both know that we belong together, its just how we go about staying that way!

patience:<P>Welcome to MarriageBuilders (I'll leave the full welcome statement for NSR).<P>Now, the description of your process leaves me some worries---it's very much not in the "MarriageBuilders" way. You threatened your husband, and demanded that the affair end. Be aware that when using this approach, the affair has a decent chance of starting again. You said that the OW "won't win". But if you fight her by being disrespectful of your husband's feelings (even though you don't like them), by making demands, and by threatening vengence, I'm giving the OW better odds. So, my advice below is to increase your chances of success.<P>To be effective in recovery, you need to change behaviors that have pushed your husband away (he needs to do all the same stuff for you too---but because he's the one who doesn't "love you" as much right now, he's probably less willing).<P>Your first set of goals should be to identify and eliminate lovebusters: Selfish demands, disrespectful judgements, angry outbursts, dishonesty. There is a questionnaire available on this website for identifying lovebusters---I'd suggest that your counselor take you through the process of filling this out, and then sharing it with each other. When your husband tells you what your lovebusters are, you should just be listening and taking notes---no defensive comments whatsoever. Only speak if you need some clarification, or you're telling him that you understand.<P>After you identify lovebusters, you're then ready to start learning the new behaviors to eliminate them. Again, if your counselor is any good, they can help you with the exercises necessary to stop these.<P>Once lovebusters are under control, you can then start to build love by meeting emotional needs. It's the same process (but a different questionnaire)---your husband will identify his important emotional needs, and then you will make a plan together to meet them (using the Policy of Joint Agreement).<P>As a starter book for this, I'd recommend that you read "Give and Take". It has elements of Harley's books "Lovebusters" and "His Needs/Her Needs". If you can afford it, get the complete set.

patience: I'm so sorry that you are going through this. These persistent OW make me nauseous. It sure doesn't help when our H's are too chicken to be harsh with them to begin with. Why is it so easy for them to symathize with the OW instead of their own spouse's?<P>I very recently had a similar experience where our OW, after 9 months of NO CONTACT, tried to worm her lousy self back into our lives via e-mail. I intercepted the e-mail because my H responded to her (My post is called "OW trying to weasel way back in....").<P>Thank goodness I found the first attempt at e-mail contact because I was able to nip it in the bud. I was grateful that he suggested and initiated the NO CONTACT CLOSURE LETTER to her.<P>I hope that your H will do the same thing....if it ever becomes necessary. Don't be surprised if your H goes through some withdrawals. K has some good suggestions here. Follow his advice. I wish you all the luck in the world and some hugs too. You can get through this!

hi patience, YOu are very brave and you know yourself! Good job at returning the keys. Read k's post over again, some very good points. No threatening is very important, and so is no contact, by either of you. Be careful, keep your head on!

Good show, sister!!! (I am waving my arm around and snapping my fingers like they do on Jerry Springer)<BR>Dylan is GREEN with envy, she says "You GO, girl!" and doing the same waving finger thing!<BR>We are in agreement with Jim, on this... a follow up letter from your H would be a good idea. Lock the door and throw away the key!<BR>Glad to see he's off the fence.<BR>Deut and Dylan