So how do you know if there really is zero contact with OP in your spouse's life? Just trust them? Just tonight, my H started telling me about something like we had had a conversation about it earlier - I didn't have a clue what he was talking about. Maybe he's getting his conversations with the two of us mixed up?<P>And to everyone who responded to me last night: I'm not really sure what to do <BR>How do I know he's telling me the truth or just telling me what I want to hear?

Hi RC,<P>First they must agree to the no contact or you're right back to square one. Deciet, lies, etc.<P>You suggest that they become accountable for their time and place. If they are going to be late coming home from work a call would be nice. [caller ID doesn't hurt either] E mail, pager, cell phone, calling cards are all open for inspection.<P>Sure it's not difficult to get other E mail accounts, a second super secret squirrel pager, dual number cells or more phone cards. It does make it that much more difficult. They have to earn trust. It is not freely given anymore.<P>Don't treat them as a child, they will resent that and you will defeat the purpose. When they call ask what would you like for dinner, hey about a movie? I just like to hear your voice. Make it pleasurable to make the call. <P>It's getting late and I'm still on a high from this AM. Hope some of the babble makes sense.<P>Wishing us all the Best.<P>Tim

Hey Medic,<P>Thanks for replying. So, here's another question - what if they feel that your asking them to account for their time and such is a lovebuster to them? I seem to go 'round and 'round with this.......my H seems to think that it's all my problem - that I don't/can't/won't trust him anymore, even when the proof is in front of their noses they'll still deny. <P>Had to come back to add something: I miss dating. My H and I haven't done that in a long time - I've asked him, but he just isn't interested in dating me anymore, I guess. <p>[This message has been edited by RCoaster (edited March 07, 2000).]

Hey RC,<P>I believe that if I am presented with this in the future I would have to let Val know of the extreme pain that I felt over her mistruths and white lies and that a certain portion of the unquestioned trust that I once held for her is tarnished and in need of repair and she is the only one who can reinstill it in me.<P>I would like to see her try to gain that honesty that I held so high and in this small way of showing me some respect in just letting me know where she is and if I should expect her late. I would also explain that I will be totally honest with her in the same way if she desires. [sugar coated non LB request] Can you tell I'm a businessman?<P>I should save this if she would like to try.<P>We tried the dating thing also but I was too pushy for results. I getting better!<P>Tim

RC,<P>I know what you mean. My H will say "remember XXX" and I will stop him and tell him he must have been talking with someone else because I don't know what he's refering to. <P>Sometimes he takes it well and explains what he's talking about, and sometimes he gets mad and insists that we had the original conversation and I'm playing head games with him. <P>I, also, wonder if it's a conversation he had with OW, forgot it was her and thinks he talked to me about it. <P>I wonder if the times he gets mad is the times that he suddenly remembers that he put his foot in his mouth and it's himself that he's mad at for making the mistake? <P>Maybe the times that he doesn't get mad are when he talked to someone else (mother, sister, etc) instead of OW.<P>If you ever figure it out I'd love to know.<P>But, I have found the best way to react is to simply be honest and tell him that we have never discussed that subject or did that activity.<P>Keo<P><BR>

Maybe I just lucked out here. We have no choice. PT works on the same jobsite as H and is pursuing him relentlessly (she even asked him to drive her in the u-haul to FL the first weekend in April when she's supposedly gonna MOVE! He's telling her today that we'll BOTH be glad to take her if she wants! She oughtta love that!!!) Anyway, so I KNOW there's contact.<P>At the beginning, before he came home, he asked me if I could ever trust him again. I told him that, in deciding to rebuild our marriage, I made the DECISION to trust him. I wasn't gonna ask questions (much, anyway, and so far, I haven't), but I counted on him to let me know whenever he talked with her. That way I knew I could always trust him. Face it, even if I asked, you never know.<P>I sorta know Robert. He's a lot like me and responds to positive things. So, he's been great. Supportive and understanding and lets me know everyday ("You know, I didn't even run into PT today" or "She gave me a letter today, it said....., do you want to read it?") Because he's been so great, I've found it easy to take this news just like the REST of the news of his day and, because I have reacted this way, he keeps telling me.<P>I know this wouldn't work for everyone. Robert's an honest man (even DURING his affair and our seperation) and I really believe I can count on him. But I DO know that, if I pushed him, he would clam up in a heartbeat!<P>As far as the "dating", I've just sorta made some easy plans for the past few Fridays and let him know about them. If I left it to him, he'd come around every now and then, but not regularly. But he goes along with them, says that sounds like fun and has a good time when we go. Right now, I'm making sure that it's things I like, but he REALLY enjoys. Makes it easier. Soon, I hope, Fridays will be a wonderful habit.<P>Good luck to you, RC. Sometimes you just have to try to trust, cross your fingers and pray. After all, you never REALLY know.<P>Lori<P>

When your H tells you that it is YOUR problem that you don't trust him, state nicely that NO, it is now your problem too. He had no problem bringing the no trust into the relationship, and now that he still wants to be married, then he should have no problem bringing the trust back, no matter what. Yes, it is good that he is still with you, but you will not make it if he insists that everything is YOUR problem. My H says the same thing and our counselor, stopped him in his tracks and let him know, that everything IS NOT MY FAULT ALONE, and she will not hear any of that in her office! SHUT MY H RIGHT UP, and I FELT GOOD, because I was not LB but the doc handled it for me. Now it's a different story if he believes it, but it was just nice having someone with no ties to us, tell him that it is not all my fault and my problem. Have you tried counseling?

I just recently found out that my h has been having contact with ow since day 1 of discovery 8 months ago. It was heart breaking and very depressing. I truly believed that he was not having contact. Now how do I trust him again? I'm not sure. One thing I do know though, its not for his benefit that I must trust, but for mine. Let's just say that during the last 8 months I have checke up on him, all that did was cause him to be more secretive in contact. He had access to her internet account -- we had the same carrier so he would just go on as a guest under her account and I could not trace it (a key stroke logger would have revealed this but??). He bought phone cards and called her from work. The thought that I can keep track of every $10 in his wallet is a little unrealistic. The only reason I am telling you this is because if they want to continue contact, they will find a way. Things have been going well between us so I was very surprised to find out about the contact. I finally found out by searching his wallet and finding the used phone card. No doubt your h is telling you what you want to hear. i just hope that a little bit of truth sneaks into what he says. In no way is it strictly your fault that you question his every action. What I have found that somewhat works (my h doesn't want to go to counseling -- thinks we can fix this all on our own I will take Dr. Harley's book "Survivng an Affair" and go by exactly what the book says to do. i want to show my h that all of these ideas are not mine, but a professionals. It gives validity to the idea while also allowing him to direct his anger at the suggestion toward the book, not me. Sometimes its effective, sometimes its not. In the book it says to ask your s if they have had contact with the ow. To have them call you when they are going to be late, to account for all of their time. The only challenge is that I get tired of being the one that has to police our behavior. That is just something that i have to bear at the moment. We will get through this. Just think of all the strength of character we will have when we do.

T24G and Derby,<P>Just a quick response before I have to get back to work. My H went to counseling w/me a total of 4 times - OW was still 'staying at his place' before he moved back here...another problem....and when I found out about it was when he discontinued counseling w/me. <P>I have, and do, ask him if he has had contact with OW, but his response is anger that I am asking him....I am nagging him about it. Although I see his point - that I <B>should</B>(?) trust him to tell me when he is in contact with her - I know that he <BR><B>doesn't</B> tell me when it occurs. Between a rock and a hard place. Also, I'm not so sure anymore that it is a good thing that he is living here. My anger towards his continuing association w/OW, either by phone or in person (I have no proof of the in person contact, of course) is spilling over into my saying things in front of our children. This is <B>my</B> fault and I take full responsibility for this. I am just too upset and don't control myself well.<BR>But, I don't know if he really wants to stay, other than that he misses the kids when he does not live here.