This is something of a repost. I am really wanting to hear some more hopeful stories than what seems typical on this forum.<P>Frank Pittman calls an affair "temporary insanity." So much of what i read in these posts describe the irrational, confused, bewildering rationalizations of formerly reasonable people, now messed up by an alliance with someone other than their spouse. <P>There seem to be precious few success stories. Usually, through plan A or plan B, the betrayed spouses are hanging on for dear life, looking for any signs of hope, with the betrayers continue to rip them apart with apathy, vascillating etc. <P>My W is absolutely stuck in this place of making decisions totally opposed to the woman I and her friends have known. The affair is long over, but the insanity/confusion/disorientation stubbornly persists. <P>Any encouraging thoughts out there?<P>I have been in a kind of modified Plan B. Plan A when I have to be with her (usually related to our kids), Plan B the rest of the time. It is just too painful for me to continue to reach out to her when the answer is always no, and her resolve to finish the divorce so strong. <BR>

doc,<P>I don't want to give you the idea that I'm giving you a success story right now...<P>Your perception is quite accurate...<P>Most of the success stories are from those you have had their spouses realize there was something amiss in the affair... <B>early on in the affair</B>...<P>Most also don't have an "anger" from the wayward that is persistant... strong... and shows no sign of abaiting,<P>My situation is very close to your's...<BR>I am trying to Plan A... and there is absolutely nothing I can do to make my W want to have anything to do with me.<BR>Her words are angry toward me...<BR>Her expression is angry...<BR>Her body language is angry...<BR>She uses foul language toward me...<BR>She knows of (maybe encourages) OM to use foul language against me...<BR>She hates that I have the kids...<BR>...(she left me and them 6.5 months ago)<BR>She just hates....<BR>She is trying her best Plan B against me<BR>...(she will not contact me at all...<BR>....only wants to talk to the kids)<BR>She want to cram this divorce she started down my throat...<BR>...and disregards everything we had at one time agreed to (about 90% of Property Settlement)<P>How do I go on???<BR>How do you go on???<P>...I'm not 100% sure...<BR>...but one thing in my favor is that the OM is very "money" conscious... and when he finds out that my W owes my stepson about $30K-35K in withheld SS benefits and when she left she closed out the account with about <10% of it!... I really feel the OM will leave when he finds out... lies that their affair is built on... will bring them down.<P>Is there something that will bring your W and her OM down?... I don't know.<P>Does it guarentee her coming back to me?... No!<P>Is it worth waiting for?...<BR>...that's a tough call...<P>...I think it is... even if my W doesn't come back... I've learned here to be so much more than I was... and I can be an even better H... whether to my W or some other very lucky woman...<P>Working on self... is what MB is really all about... whether in <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html" TARGET=_blank>Plan A</A> or <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html" TARGET=_blank>Plan B</A>...<P>Prayers... they keep me going... <P>Jim

Jim<P>Wow, what parallels in our situations. The only difference (and a big one, I think) is my W's affair ended last summer. At least, by all appearances. I don't have reason to doubt this, other than the deepened commitment to divorce me. <P>My W has been very nice to me since we resumed the divorce process. Prior to that, it was cold silence with occasional outbursts of fury. She has become a woman i barely recognize in many ways.<P>How do you deal with the kick in the gut that you feel - when she was the one who betrayed your covenant, but now vents her rage on you, like you're the problem? I don't what it will take to get over that one.<P>I know I have contributed to the failures in our marriage, and have expressed my desire to work on those issues, but the door is closed.<P>Thanks for your post. It was realistic and clear, and encouraging in an odd way (I dont' feel as crazy or alone).

Doc,<P>I have a question for you how old is your wife? Is she in her 40's? How od are your children? There are reason for my questions and if the anwers are what I think they might be I might be able to shed some light here.<BR><P>------------------<BR>di<P>

What's Up,Doc?(sorry,I couldn't resist)<BR> My guess is your W is in her 40's?Perhaps she is going through the same delusions my W is.She's 43 and started an affair with a 31 year-old man.When I found out,she wanted an"immediate divorce"(as in yesterday).No major problems,no fighting,no nothing.She moved out,and is living with him.Sounds like a major MLC.Perhaps this is what your W is going through?Does she have a lot of past regrets,feeling old,restless,life passing her by,and blaming you for it all?The resolve to divorce in this period can be very strong.Do you think this is what's happening with your W? --Murph

My W is in her early 40's. Definite possible MLC, among other things. Feels very complex to me, related to family history. Children are 11, 13, 15, 17

doc, <P>All I know is what I went through about three years ago. Now I didn't have an afair, I am no sure why except the opportunity never presented itself. I would like to think I would have been strong enough to say no but I really don't know what I would have done. <P>But I do know the feelings I went through ( maybe this is why I am more understanding of my H) At that time I didn't love my H at all of course I didn't love myself either. I withdrew completely. I wanted to be left alone. There was a big do not touch sign on me. I was depressed and very angry. I was not were I wanted to be in life and my life was over. All my dreams were not ever going to come true. And of course the big one I was premenopause. It took about two years to realize that life was not over. I was just starting to really come out of this when everything hit my life. Son's kidney problems and H's affair. <P>I was not there for my H when he needed me and of course he was not there for me. We did everything wrong. He never did reach out for me. I was still coming out of this on my own so I wasn't reaching out for him. <P>What I am trying to say is that you have to continue to reach out and if there is anyway for you to talk her into getting a complete check up do so. I would imagine that she needs to have her estrogen level checked also. <P>Believe saying that part of this might be medical is not a copout nor is it an excuse for what has happen. But it is something that can help a person reach this point and by getting medical help it could be what starts her on the road to recovery. Anyway it makes it easier. <P>Of course this is my opinion based on what happened to me. I am on estrogen it has help my moods a lot. I feel like a different person to bad my H isn't around to see it. But I do think he has begun to nottice it.<P>Again my two cents worth.<P>------------------<BR>di<P>

sds<P>My W was terrified, even obsessed, with m.pause. But I know she has been to a doctor several times throughout the year for hormone related issues. But we are literally not talking at all. Any suggestion on my part that she is the problem further infuriates her - I could never, for example, suggest she be evaluated for depression or thyroid or hormone problems. It would be interpreted as a copout. I've talked in general terms with her (our) doctor, and he is aware of what is happening. <P>I don't disagree with your ideas, I am just in no place to suggest anything.

doc,<P>You know in reality, we are all the same boat. I know that my H needs to be on antidepressants and problem have his hormone level checked. I do know there is such a thing as male menopause. BUt like you I can not suggest any of this. It sure would help if we could make thses suggestions. <P>Not being able to help them makes is so frustrating. Actuall I guess them not letting us help is more the case. Her fear of menopause tell a big part of her story just like my H's fear of growing old. <P>I can understand both because I told you I had to deal with those issues. I wish I could say more to help. Sorry.<P>------------------<BR>di<P>

Does anyone know of any success stories where the betrayer is consumed with rage? Do anyone know of any cases where they eventually got over it, and stopped blaming the betrayed for virtually everything?

I have the same question as Nellie1 - any betrayers who stopped blaming, recovered fromt their rage, owned what they had done, and sought restoration? Any success stories, not just in recovering from an affair, but recovering from the more extreme rage that some betrayers seem stuck and bound up in?

I am another person who would like to know if the betrayer ever stops all this rage. my husband has been seeing another women (but he denies it) and he wants a divorce. since I am contesting it, and I have also refused to leave the house, he has become one very angry person. He is not the man that I married anymore. He has become a mean-spirited and very sneaky person towards me. He will do whatever he can to make me miserable, short of anything illegal. (as of yet) It does not matter what I do or don't do. He will become angry at me for acting very nice. Last week he tried to get me thrown out of the house by filing for an order of protection against me. His reason was that he was afraid I was going to steal his truck. Of course the judge did not force me to leave, and my impression was that he was quite angry with my H for this wasting of his time. We have to go back to court one more time over this. I don't know what my H will try to do next. And I don't know what I should do next. At this point I wish he would move out, but there is no way that I can force him to do that. I don't know how much longer I can live like this without losing my sanity. nancy