I just realized that it's really only been about 2 months or so since I actually confronted my W with the fact that I'd seen her with the OM in his car. Before that, I would occasionally do what I call "voicing suspicions" that she was having an affair, but never really confronting her (even though I did know for certain for nearly a year). Then, when she'd deny it, I'd usually apologize and everything would be back to abnormal.<P>My Q is for betrayeds (and betrayers) who've gone through this. I'm interested in stories where the betrayer did not "voluntarily" confess their affair but had to be confronted. As the result of a confrontation like I've recently done, about how long did it take for the betrayer to come around (if ever)? Did repeated confrontations (like I'm doing, because I repeat my story every time we have a fight) speed up or slow down the process? Thanks.<P>Regards and blessings,<P>--Wex

i think it took longer- just beating it out of her thru repeated lovebusting - i couldnt just let things happen on there own. <BR>i just leave it alone- she finally confessed. but she still wants out because she is not ok with herself.<BR>i look back- i think she wanted out anyway.

I found e-mail conferming my W's affair. I left her that night, she confessed everything and I came back the next day. So there was really no time of denial. Her affair did last for a month, and there was a lot of torment going on, but I never even suspected an affair untill it slapped me in the face. So there really wasn't any denying it, but I don't know if that was caused because of the proof, or because of the shock of me leaving.

Wex, <P>First, thanks for your comments in my thread. I'm afraid to post any more in that one become some people were getting offended that it was too big - I guess size <B>DOES</B> matter! (sorry - out of character there)<P>As for me, I pretty much voiced suspicions at first. I questioned whereabouts and got lies as well. When I got through her email password, I had proof and that's what did it. She could have denied it, but it was in black and white and any logically thinking person could read it and know what was going on. <P>During the proof bearing confrontation - she admitted what was going on and she did back off. The OM ran with his tail between his legs and dropped her like a brick. Several months later, she just had to see him again and so here I am - again. Confrontations since the proof bearing one, have always lead to the "we're just friends now". And, by me denying her this friendship, I am controlling and maniulative. I have more success in talking with my kids than I do her concerning this issue. <P>Wex, you have to get proof. Some how, some way to bring this to closure. I don't know of anyone here who has struggled with not knowing 100% more than you. Keep trying or should I say spying.<P>SHA <BR>

Wex,<P>I think I have mentioned to you in the past,,my H denied, denied, denied. During the very few clues that I had in the beginning, he had good answers and I really didn't believe he was having an affair. Just suspicious, I thought. <P>My H didn't admit until I had POSITIVE-no-gettin'-outta-it proof. I think all my prior accusations merely made his affair more appealing, more exciting, more desirable. Remember, it's the fantasy, the excitement, the danger, that makes it so thrilling. And I added to that by accusing. It gave them something else to talk about, to plan together, to team up on. You know, the old "It's you and me against the world, we can do this together,nothing will keep us apart" mentality. <P>Wex, when I finally knew the truth, I told him it was over. It was no longer a game. I was done. We only decided to try again after his promise to end that relationship and NEVER see her again. He has kept his promise and things are great after 23 months. If I hadn't had positive proof,,he probably still be seeing her and still denying today.

Wex,<P>I knew nothing until I walked in on my H during our vacation when he was in th emiddle of writing an e-mail to her. H had brought the laptop along to work ona vert important project he needed done right after we were to get home. The e-mail part I read said..<P>"Yes, I got all the lovely cards you sent."<P>That's all I could read. When he saw me look at the screen, he flipped the lid of the laptop down and pretended to be looking for something. it was ridiculously fake, but I just walked out of the room. As I stepped into the other room, my brain acknowledged what I just saw and my heart nearly exploded. I felt weak and fell to the bed. I sat a minute, got up and walked back into the other room. I said, "H, are you sending an e-mail to someone that you don't want meto see?" H denied. I then said, "H, are you sure you don't have something to tell me?" Then, he said yeas and confessed. Affair was only 2 months old at that time - 1 month EA and one month PA. For the life of me, I could not believe he was AT THAT POINT willing to throw our marriage away for a woman living in another state he had seen 4- 5 times and never spent more than a night with on 3 occasions at that time. Well, the rest is history.....<P>Roll Me Away<P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

Wex,<BR>My stbx never lied any of the time. The first time she didn't come out and say she slept with him till I asked her(my second question.)<P>The second time when I found out he had called and she had called and asked, she readily confirmed.<P>And the last time, as soon as I asked if she was involved again, she said yes.<P>Don't know what thay proves, she did lie to me by not telling me the truth about the situation, her not wanting to stay married to me!<P>I agree that you do need to find proof, whether she is lying or you are just crazy !<P>Hang in there and good luck !!!!!

I started with subtle questions about her about a year and a half or two years before his disclosure. However he was in serious denial until the final three months of the affair - until it turned physical. My initial sweet subtle questions were turned against me and I was told I was insecure, suspicious, envious etc. and I beleved it ...so I spent a lot of time stuffing my feelings, gut instincts about their work related friendship. And what did I become -<BR>a pile of dog **** on the lawn. Even after H said he filed for divorce he claimed there was no one else. Even for the next six weeks he claimed there was no one else . Even on valentine's day (when we were supposedly working on keeping our family together) when he was an hour and a half late for dinner and I went to his office to see what the problem was (no answer on his phone) and found them together "talking" he said they were just talking about work. (ow even greeted me with a smile) Denial is a powerful thing, not only to one's self but to one's spouse. <BR> Simone<p>[This message has been edited by Simone (edited December 02, 1999).]

Simone - Thanks for your story. Those are exactly the kinds of denials I keep getting from my W. I guess she figures that, since I don't really have any solid evidence of her affair, she can get away with this. And she's right. So I'm getting the "you're crazy" treatment from her and sometime it makes me feel like a pile of $hit too.<P>RWD - I do have proof that satisfies me, though it wouldn't stand up in court. A LOT of circumstantial evidence, such as jewelry that I'm sure are gifts from OM. A lot of funny business in the way she schedules her time away. Some out-and-out lies about where she's been and what she's worn, emotional and sexual withholding. The solid stuff for me is basically a semen test I performed on a pair of her panties that came out positive (and it can't have been mine because we hadn't made love for quite a while at that point). And then seeing her together with the OM in his car. This is the real clincher, I think. But since I'm the only one who saw, she can deny this and get away with it. I do resent her going beyond denial and trying to make out like I'm crazy. That REALLY hurts.<P>RMA - Thanks for your story. I guess some betrayers are just tougher cookies than others. I was hoping I'd get a response from my W like you got from your H, but she just dug her heels in harder. One of my mistakes was to wait too long after I saw her with OM to confront her with the fact. I should have confronted her immediately, the way you did your H. But I was so stunned, I waited a couple of months. I was also hoping, I guess, that I'd be able to find out the ID of the OM.<P>Nerlycrzy - I like your statement <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>My H didn't admit until I had POSITIVE-no-gettin'-outta-it proof. I think all my prior accusations merely made his affair more appealing, more exciting, more desirable. Remember, it's the fantasy, the excitement, the danger, that makes it so thrilling. And I added to that by accusing. It gave them something else to talk about, to plan together, to team up on. You know, the old "It's you and me against the world, we can do this together,nothing will keep us apart" mentality.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I'm sure something like this is going on with my W and her OM. I'm equally sure he's advising her (INSISTING probably) that she not admit the affair. I think he has some kind of real hold over her (she's sexually addicted to him and I suspect they do drugs together too). I used to hope she's come to her senses and stop seeing him, but after her repeated denials, I don't think that's likely any more. The next time we talk about this, I'm just going to tell her, you decide. Him or me.<P>SHA - You know, I now figure that the only thing that would get her to confess would be for me to catch them together, in a compromising position so she couldn't get away with the "just friends" bit. (I know this is exactly what she'd try and do.) Don't know how that's going to happen. I thought once I had their M.O. scoped out, I would be able to catch them together in his car or some such, but haven't been able to. I think they've gotten a lot more careful after my "sighting." Ah well, life goes on. At this point, I've pretty much resigned myself to her not confessing. So, yeah, I'm plan to keep after the spying, even if she does catch me occasionally.<P>KLS - Man, that is the way to do it. I wish I had that kind of hard evidence, I'd do it that way too. Actually, I do, but it's not the kind that would convince my W. She finds a way to rationalize everything. Even if I told her about the positive semen test I performed on a pair of her panties - really the solidest evidence I have - I know she'd just start raving on about me spying on her, how disgusting it was of me to do something like that, and how the semen was probably mine anyway. (I know it wasn't, because I hadn't made love to her in quite some time.) Well, you get the idea.<P>covenant - I guess that's my plan too. I've pretty much given up trying not to lovebust. It's just about impossible with my W anyway, because she lovebusts all the time. Now I just bring up the fact that I saw her with OM when she tries to start a fight over something I'VE done or haven't done. And I'm just going to keep this up. If she's going to deny, deny, deny, I'm going to confront, confront, confront. The situation is so bad that I've decided it's better to split than continue this way, so I'm ready if it comes to that. Because no real progress can be made on our marriage until she admits her affair and gives it up, and if she's not going to, then splitting really is the only alternative. In my case, I don't think she wants to leave, so she's in a pretty impossible position, and I feel for her. But there's really nothing I can do. It's her move.<P>Thanks everyone for your responses. Regards and blessings,<P>--Wex

Wex: Drop me an email. Got a few questions for you, and ideas.<P>pmoyers2@mindspring.com

Paul - I forgot my p'word to my hotmail acct. (haven't used it for a while). They're supposed to send it to me. Don't know how long it will take, but I'll be in touch when I get it. Thanks,<P>--Wex