I have read many of these forums but none seem to address my problem entirely. I found out my S was having an EA with a subordinate after returning from a job away from home. He denied, lied, justified etc. While away I took the opportunity to get close to God and after a visit home before job ended I felt God confirmed my suspicions. Like you all, I had no idea, this was not like my S at all. I told God If he would bring my husband and children back to him I would do anything. Only now I'm finding it hard to even trust God. I told my S that I would forgive anything if he would tell me the whole (stress whole) truth. I apoligized for my part in the unhappiness of our marriage and said I would change. Problem was I was unhappy from the beginning, he never talked to me, wanted me to be June Cleaver. He never had time for family, went thru surgeries, kids illnesses, etc. alone. I just thot he was a quiet person. Knew him for several years before marriage. After finding out, we moved b/c of his work, all along I kept saying just tell me the whole truth. Week after first finding out, caught him on email, threatened to tell his boss if he didn't let me read them. He took me to a desolate place and said was I willing to lose him for knowing the truth, said yes. Told me of a 2nd ow, he was involved with at the same time as other, said no sex, email spoke of hotel room one night, still said no sex even tho I don't believe it. 3 month later I checked his privaate email, oh by the way had a one night no intercourse sex thing with this woman you know, email from her, he tried to deny. I called someone who knew, his co worker, she told all. Went to counseling, counselor wanted no details, said I didn't need to know whole truth. 4 or 5th counseling said I'm not ready for the repair, knew there was more. Counselor told H he should come clean for his own sake too. I had no idea what was coming. SAid it started after 4 mths of marriage, I was w/child. One nighter, stranger. 1 & half year later another stranger one night, I got HPV doc didn't tell me it was STD. 1 yr later another stanger, one ngter, all involved alcohol and being apart for job. supposedly 4 ys nothing then EA w/another co worker. I'm having a hard time accepting that there isn't more. Says he's so sorry, never showed any emotion until the final confession, cried and cried. Says ashamed, selfish, pure selfish, never even cared about the ow any of them. Counselor said he's a narcissist and now that I've read up on it wonder why I didn't see it before. I begged many times thru out marriage to go to counseling, told him I was unhappy, he never said he was unhappy, always avoided conflict or admitting we needed help. SAid he would o to counseling w/me for me. He doesn't need any, he thinks. He can just say he'll never do this again, loves me so much. After reading emails dates included, realized he was writing me love letters and notes and calling at the same time he was doing the same with the last 2 ow. Does this man need some serious counseling with some straight talk, or am I just crazy. Can you live a selfish, double life, truly loving your S while carrying on like he did and then all the sudden wake up to how wonderful your S that you've betrayed is. I've gone thru so much dispare, kids don't know, almost lost faith in God. I realize I could've done better in some areas, but even in my unhappiness, unfullfilled EN I didn't go that way, the opportunities were there, but I believed in him, trusted him, didn't think anyone would love me like he did. Now I don't believe he did. I don't know what to think, after taking EN quiz I realized my greatest need in all realationshipes is Honesty and Openess. This makes all this soooo hard to accept. I don't want to go thru this again, not sure I want to stick this out at times. He has been wonderfull, filling the bank, but since I never suspected before how can I know for sure. Sex we both say has always been one of the best thgs b/t us, counselor says sex addiction not problem, so what is? Admiratioon addictioon. The ow I know of all were married or in a relationship, their SO don't know, I don't think. I am humiliated, broken, and have lost myself thru this, wondering if I will ever recover. I know you'll say trust God. But what I didn't tell you was I have known God since a child and thruout most of our marriage have always been the one who pushed church, bible, personal morality. Why did he let this go on so long? 16 yrs. <BR>Sorry this is so long, been waiting along time to post, b/c of BBNC I finally saw some hope. Do you betrayers really love your S and care nothing for the op, is that possible, can you be that selfish. I read the I love you's, your beautiful, want to share everything, body soul spirit, same was written to me during the A's. Does he need some serious couseling? Help

I am not a counselor so I don't feel qualified to speak on what disorder your H may or may not have.<P> But I can tell you this, "Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?...But in all these things we overwhelmingly conquer through Him who loved us. For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor demons, nor the present, nor the future, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor anything else in all creation (NOR ADULTERY OR FAILING MARRIAGES-my words) shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord." Romans 8:35-39<P>Hold firm to God's promises! Find your strength in the shadow of His wings.

I'm not a counselor either and I will admit that I, too, feel disappointed to an extent with my H as well as God. Having said that let me now say, too, that I also realize that He does not do things based on what I want. Just because I have suffered as I have, I'm sure He has His reasons. Which I will get to in a moment.<P>Before I get to that, I want to add this, that I also believe that without my faith in Him, I would be in much worse shape than I am already. Do you have the verse called "Footprints", there is even one called "Buttprints" as it turns out. Let me know and I'll share it with you. I keep this and the Serenity Prayer in my heart always. Not sure which one I call upon more.<P>I'm not a holy roller nor very knowledgable on the bible, but in getting back to this thing about "reason" I have come to believe that God does "allow" us to experience such things for a reason. (Perhaps the Buttprints verse explains that.) My H has betrayed me twice but I've gone through hell 4 times! Three times just with the same woman because of his continual lies.<P>It would be really easy for me as well to lose my faith. But I also feel given all I have lost already, I will not allow my H and his sick behavior to separate me from God. <P>Getting back to the reason, each time I've gone through hell over this, I have learned something about me, about my H. Even this time, which has been by far the most painful experience of them all, I have learned. And what I have come to realize is that until I finally learned what I needed to learn, this is going to keep happening to me.<P>My H is the type of person who doesn't wake up until he hits rock bottom. So I'm finally letting him hit rock bottom. Applause to me, he finally moved out last night after 5 weeks of me politely stating that I needed for him to do so. I've been helping him so much through all of these betrayals that I never gave him the space to grow up and figure himself out. <P>Early on when I posted about this particular incident I am going through, I was given a verse called Letting Go because I didn't know how and knew I needed to. It has been very helpful to me becasue in following the list, my H has finally come to realize he has hurt me so very deeply. NOt that he didn't hurt me this bad before, but like I said, because I was right there ready to clean up the mess he felt he could do it again and again cause I demonstrated very clearly I would forgive him.<P>So this time I learned...I am refusing to clean up anything until he first changes. I am "letting go", as hard as it is, and standing back and watching if he succeeds or badly fails. and if he fails, I divorce him. It's that simple and yet that hard.<P>I believe God has done this "to me" so that I could learn that I needed to let my H grow up. I believe God "allowed" my H to do this so that he could get my attention in order for me to help my H to grow up. My H needed me, so I have chosen to believe, to figure all of this out so that he could be given the chance to think his life through and make a clear and conscious choice. Maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm grabbing at straws. But this is the only lesson I see that has been learned here. I never gave him that choice before, nor the space...because I was too busy guiding and directing him and so quick to believe his words when in fact, I shouldn't have at all. <P>Had I dropped him on his butt from the start, I don't believe there would have been a second time. But I didn't. Nobody's fault but my own. <P>But here we are, aching and scared and I've dropped him on his butt now. And for the first time in the 17 years I have known and loved him, he is having to make a conscious decision on his life. It's about time!<P>Yes I'm scared we will end up divorced. But I'm much more scared of being hurt again. Divorce is the lesser of two evils. In my case, however, it may be a necessary evil. I don't know about yours. <P>A little thought in the end here about your H and his "problem"...it may be something as simple as he was able to get away with it and so this is why it continued. Let's be honest, I'm sure it was exciting to do something so wrong that brought so much sexual pleasure and then go home and not have anyone know! As hurtful as it is for you to now know, the part he hadn't planned for very well and surely didn't have in mind while he was misbehaving, nonetheless. It may not be anything with a fancy title. This is what my H happens to be telling me and I believe it is true. Because he knew I'd forgive him, so he did it again. (This is why I have a real hard time with the Plan A concept for men like my own H. Plan A only brings the problem on again at a later date. So I feel....)<P>Best of luck to you. Hope this has helped. If you'd like any of these verses let me know and I'll post them for you.

Dear brknhrt,<P>That is such a sad story! My heart goes out to you for how you have suffered. <P>No, you are not going crazy! Your H has, in my estimation, serious emotional problems. He needs long-term counseling by a gifted counselor. Please pray about whether his existing counselor is the right person.<P>Until the deep issues in your H have been resolved, I think any trust you have left should be carefully guarded. He may sound sincere, he may feel he is sincere, but once he believes the crisis is past, the old patterns may resurface unless cured by counseling.<P>I wish I could tell you why God allowed this to go on so long. I can tell you what the reason isn't... It is not that God doesn't care about you.<P>During my recovery period, I wrestled with the question of why God allowed it to drag on for years. Whatever He wanted to accomplish through this mess, couldn't He have brought it to a close sooner? Over time, I came to see pieces that made some sense of it all. Not enough for me to see the whole picture, like He does, but enough for me to trust that He knew what He was doing.<P>He has called you to walk a difficult path. He has entrusted you with an experience more painful than most, even here at this site. God doesn't make mistakes. He will never give you more than what He knows you can bear.<P>One day, when we have come into our rewards, we will know why. Until then, we trust and lean on one another...<P>God Bless You!<P>BrokenButNotCrushed<P><BR>

Is There Hope?<P>I was just wondering if you could tell me where I could find "Buttprints". That really sounds like something I need to read.<P>John

Thanks for all your replies. Wanted to share how he's been filling the LB. He helps me around the house now and always asking what he can do for me. He does not have password to internet at home, says I can control it for the family. His work is currently not connected to internet. Calls me every time there is a change in time schedule. We pretty much go and do everything together. I asked if this bothers him, says no he likes it, wants to do everything w/me now. Is calm during my occasional outburst (I'm trying so hard to control these LB's they are few and far b/t) always apoligizes for his actioons of the past. He seems so sincere in this all, yet Mr Hyde has not resurfaced yet, I don't believe he can suppress him forever.<P>BBNC- How do I know who the rgt counselor is. Previous counselor told me during private session that he knew after full disclosure that my H was probably lying in the beginning of counseling when he said I knew it all. He said to us both that my H narcissism was close to becoming multiple personality disorder. Told my H in beginning that they would counsel 1on1 and he was going to have to go thru some tough stuff, when they did, nothing tuff seemed to be talked about. Another counselor said this may be a problem area for present counselor that is difficult for him to deal with. 1st counselor admitted he to was a bit narcisistic. On my personal counseling, said I had a problem with the past and anger and needed to go thru some tuff stuff, which he proceeded to explain. When I asked about my H and whether he was going to address his past etc, said my H has a problem with perversion. When I asked my husband to ask the counselor about it he smoothed it over and never explained it to him. I'm feeling pretty disappointed with his lack of help and mercy. We are getting ready to move again and I'm so weary of trying to find the right counselor, but I believe with all my heart if my husband doesn't face up to his past and all he'll go right back to his old behavior, even tho he says he can do it on his own, he said he'll do whatever I need or want him to do. I want so badly to believe him, but I can't. Sorry so long. thought you all might have some more advice.

Dear brknhrt,<P>Your situation is different than most of those posted here. Adultery is hard enough to deal with. But from what I understand in your post, your H has a serious personality disorder.<P>All of us go through trials and disappointments in life. Some more than others. I feel that the Lord has prepared me to counsel others who are suffering from these things. But if your H is borderline multiple personality disorder, I am not qualified to address the unique problems associated with that condition.<P>Learn all you can about the type of life you can expect as the W of someone with that condition. Seek the spiritual counsel of godly people who know both of you. As to locating the right counselor, let peace be your guide. Both during and after the counseling session, search your spirit to see if you have peace that he is the right one.<P>I pray that God would give you clear guidance on the decisions that lie ahead. <P>BrokenButNotCrushed<P>

Brknhrt,<P>I saw your reply on my other thread and thought that I would reply here instead.<P>I don't have a bunch of time right now. Wish I did.<P>My first question to you is...Have you read any of the books suggested? First Surviving An Affair, second After the Affair, third Torn Asunder, and lastly The Five Love Languages? I recommend you read them and any others that are recommended here. I know our beloved NSR has a thread that contains the books and I think links to them.<P>My initial thought about your husband is that he is a philanderer. Now, I am not trying to make a "judgment" here. Just my impression. If that is indeed the case, then yes he needs counseling.<P>If he has a narcissistic personality then that will make it even harder to work through.<P>You may want to start doing some heavy investigation on you and your husband's families past. You may find infidelity there. I did. Believe me it is all pertinent.<P>Our situations are unique and different. Hubby truly loved/loves OW. It has been hard but, we are better than we have ever been except in the beginning of our marriage. Our relationship and family have very unusual dynamics. It is very complicated.<P>God has and I repeat God has gotten me through what I have gotten through already. I trust that God is going to get me/us through the rest of the journey we have to go. I know I am a better person because of all this, although scared. <P>Don't give up hope, faith or your relationship with God. It is okay to get angry with God too. He is our "Father"! Don't we all get angry with our parents?<P>I will keep an eye on this thread. Looking forward to reading your reply.<P>In the meantime <B>{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{Brknhrt}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}</B><P>You are in the right place for advise, support and to vent. I honestly with my whole heart believe God directed me to this site. I know it has been a life line for me. It has been a year now since I started reading the threads here and in May I will have been a member one year. Rely on everything at your disposal. Take everything that anyone gives you here. Eventually in the future you will be able to give back. For now just concentrate on taking here and giving to your husband at home.<P>I will add you to my prayers tonight. <P>------------------<BR><B>God bless you and all of us. We are all going to make it, all of us! With God on our side we can't lose! What God has joined together let no man put asunder. <P>Samantha</B>