After 17 years of a marriage with LB's galore, I fell victim into the love of a wonderful OW whom I work with (aren't they all?) I changed behavior, left a trail, got bagged, received forgiveness, read Harley's books, and we (my wife and I) seemed to be making a go of it. My wife satisfied my #1 need like never before. With three kids, and the addiction I faced with the OW, it just left me confused. I finally succumbed and resumed contact. This left my wife no choice but to tell me to get out. Outside looking in, there are no more rose-colored glasses anymore. My wife is gaining strength through her family, I am shattered. While we shared the lack of meeting each others needs in the problem marriage, I ended up destroying her. I was hoping that the spark between the OW and I would subside, and since I am not the same happy person I was months ago, it is waining. My wife is so hurt by my lies, she can't even talk to me without getting angry. Being away from my children and my home (I just put an addition of my dreams on) and my wife, is overcoming me. I am completely depressed. I am guilty, I am addicted, but I need to return to my home. I tried to tell my wife that I promise not to see the OW anymore and maybe in a couple of months I can return home. She has seen enough lies and says she will never trust me. I am seeing a counselor and started taking Celexa. I am a community leader, somewhat revered by my friends and peers, HS coach... and now I am a loser. Relocating is not an answer, way too difficult, plus this is New England... we don't leave, families are entrenched :-). I make very good money at a well-known Hi-Tech firm and do not want to leave. Financial security is what my family needs right now. Any thoughts, comments and suggestions are welcome.

CMan<P>Welcome to MB. I am the betrayed in my circumstance. I wish my H would join this website. I think it would give him so much support in his time of need. He is going through serious withdrawal right now. In fact, he just called me on the phone to tell me he didn't know if he could make it through this or not. I think you should have a serious talk with your wife about yourself, your intentions, etc. Tell her what you want and what you expect. Let her be angry with you. To be honest, she has a very good reason to be angry. But it sounds as if you are finally coming out of the fog. There is hope. Maybe you could direct her here? You both obviously already know Dr. Harley's principles. I'm glad you are here. We need each other to heal the hurts we've suffered. Maybe through you I can understand my own wandering spouse and through me you can understand your wife's anger. Let me tell you this. NOTHING has ever hurt me as much as my H's affair. I have been through emotional he!! for the last year and there are times I just can't take it anymore. In fact, I recently attempted suicide. I realize now that was a stupid thing to do, but at the time I just wanted the pain to end. I don't know if anything I've written here helps. I get the feeling I'm rambling. But if I can spare just one person the heartache I have had, I will do it. Just remember, meeting your wife's EN's right now is the most important thing you can do. Give it a try. What have you got to lose at this point?<BR><P>------------------<BR>Blessed be.<BR>****************<BR>Keridwen<P>Keridwen_7@yahoo.com

Welcome. I am very, very sorry for the pain that you are in. Wiser folks than I will come along an post shortly, I'm sure.<P>My take is that she told you to get out, but has not filed for divorce...which is good. You can't blame her for being angry now...how long ago did dhe kick you out, BTW? I'm guessing it has not been that long by your post.<P>I think she needs time to process all this. She re-gave you her trust and heart once, and you sc****d up. It will take her a little longer to trust again. You need to build up a track record of "good" behavior. You are being pro-active in getting on meds and working with a counselour. Give her a little time. Give YOU a little time to get thru withdrawal. Meanwhile, a few suggestions:<BR>If she won't talk to you now, send an occasional note just to say hi. <BR>Stay involved with the kids. <BR>Be calm, respectful of her feelins and 100% reliable. <BR>Do not ever get defensive...she needs to know that you are not trying to justify your affair.<P>Read and post here...we'll listen!!!<P>Kathi<P>

Cman: Well it looks like you have alot of issue that need to be addressed. You are seeing a counselor and that's a start. You know in your heart what you need to do to regain your place in the marriage. However, your action to heal yourself, your wife, your children and your marriage will depend on how committed you are to following through on not contacting the OW. As you already know, having an OP has caused you and your family great pain. I know because I too am a betrayer. You will go through withdrawal symptoms and depression, but you have to hang tough. It will take some time for your wife to trust you again if ever. You have to concentrate on healing yourself in the meantime. Don't discount her(wife)feelings, because like you she needs time to heal. You might want to seek a marriage counselor unless the one you are currently seeing does that as well. Also, you will have to make a decision where you want to be--wife or OP. Then understand someone is going to be painfully sacrificed. Preferrably it will be the OP because in the long run, your family will be well worth the effort. Good luck to you.

I'm sure NSR will be along directly to give you the Welcome Wagon speech but I wanted to add something to this. I am wondering if you and your W go to counselling? I would strongly suggest it, if not for your sake but for the sake of the kids! <BR>I think your wife may be inclined to work with you on this one because of the kids....but I think it might help the two of you! Anyhow I would suggest checking this out. I know that you've done your reading with her then she should be aware of the withdrawal problem and at least your honest enough to admit to it! This should count in your favor and maybe you need to point this out to her somehow.....Plan A should be familiar to you and I would definately plan on using it. I would also remind you how hard it is to swallow an affair the first time around without having to swallow a return to that point. You must develop patience at this point! I am praying for you, God Bless!

CMan,<BR>I understand, but only because I am 2 years into recovery, and I have been where your wife is.<BR>I think Counseling TOGETHER is the best way, there you can talk infront of your wife to the counselor and your wife will hear. But, She will also be able to hear if you are telling the truth, so be sure you are ready to want her only. You may be going through a difficult time too, but, your wife, believe me, is THE ONE HURTING THE MOST. Sorry, you chose your fate, she didn't. <BR>I also think you should be together to work on this. Even if it is separate rooms right now, but the same house. You are doing more harm as the days go on. <BR>A pack or agreement can be made, every step towards togetherness helps. <BR>Document all your where abouts, phone often, go everywhere together, even to the store, at least give her that option. Let her right down your milage, meet you for lunch or come home, write her little notes every morning, about how you feel towards her, or how you will miss her, or just say, tomorrow will be a better day. ( I have over 600 notes from my H, and still coming) bring her flowers, touch her when she passes you, tell her everyday how sorry you are to have done this, or that she is sad, how sad you are, how stupid you are, how you hate what you did, how you dislike the OW now that you realize what kind of person she is to participate in such a terrible disstructive act. Put all your efforts into your wife, you will not only start forgetting the OW, but you will regain respect from your wife and for yourself, plus, you will start regainning her trust. You have to work hard, you have to take what your wife gives, (I really think you need it, deserve it, and Want it.) She has to go through lots of different emotions, bumps, and ups and downs. She needs you to be patient, understanding, and above all excepting of her moods with out anger on your part. <BR>Your depression will improve when you see her start turning around. By how you are feeling, it shows how remorsefull you are. That says alot for you. You just have to work through this,,,,,,also this shows your children, I don't know what their ages are.....how not to throw in the towel. A big lesson for them is here to learn. You may have broken one of your wedding vows, but there are others to honor!<P>If your wife want's to talk.....I would be glad to e-mail her. <P>Almost Happy (Finally Happy)<P>--------<BR>TIME

Welcome to MB, CMan! I wish you'd found us sooner, but I'm glad you're here now. I hope we can help you.<P>First of all, You Are Not A Loser. Let's get that clear from the start. You've made some p***-poor decisions regarding your marriage, but a loser wouldn't realize that he'd made bad decisions and he wouldn't go anywhere to try to get help. You're here and you're saying you were wrong, so you must not be a loser.<P>It sounds like you have some pretty big shoes to fill, being a community leader who is well-respected by his peers. It's okay to not be perfect. Have you ever read "Pappy" Boyington's autobiography? Pappy Boyington was the leader of the Black Sheep Squadron in WWII. He was a genuine, no holds barred war hero, but he got addicted to alcohol and made a mess of his life before he got back on track. In his autobiography he says (loose quote), "Give me any hero and I'll show you a bum. Maybe he doesn't know it yet, but he's just a guy and the mistakes hurt just as bad if you're at the top of the world or at the bottom." You're just a guy, CMan. Don't let the pressures of who you "ought" to be get in the way of you being who you are.<P>Now let's turn to your wife for a moment. She must be a pretty neat lady or you wouldn't have wanted to stay with her for 17 years. Right now, she is in incredible pain. There is absolutely no way I can describe to you what it feels like to find out that the person of your dreams has broken the vows that you both made before G*d and man. She already took you back once; she's not going to believe you right off the bat now. You can't just say that you'll give up OW, you're going to have to prove it.<P>I realize that you're having a really hard time overcoming your addiction to OW. I bet that some of the WSs who post here can give you some good ideas on how to stay firm and not give in to the addiction again. I don't know the answers to that, but I hope I can offer some ideas on what to do to try to win back the woman you love.<P>Respect your wife's pain. I read where you asked if you could come back in a couple of months. I know that if I were in her shoes I would be thinking, "Sure, he can back off from OW (well, I'd use a stronger phrase) for two months, but then we'll be right back where we were." You have to SHOW her that you can stay away from OW. You have to convince her that you are 100% committed to doing what is Right, even though OW feels good. Your wife isn't going to feel good about herself or about your marriage for a while. Respect that she is working through her feelings and don't be surprised when she doesn't get better right away when you tell her the affair is over. It's going to take time.<P>Read, read, read, and then put it all into practice. Reading the books doesn't do any good if you don't take the ideas and make them your own.<P>I'm glad you're seeing a counselor. (Aside: how do counseling sessions go in New England? I didn't think you New Englanders ever talked... ) I hope s/he can help you sort your feelings out.<P>Sorry I got so long-winded! I hope that I helped more than I hurt.<P>Hang in there, CMan. We're pulling for you! --HBC<p>[This message has been edited by HurtButCoping (edited April 04, 2000).]

Cman,<P>Welcome to the MB site. Thank you for sharing your story with us. I can never pass up anything that someone shares on the betraying end.<P>I am the betrayed. The way you have described this has brought tears to my eyes. I know my STBX would never be in your shoes with thoughts like that.<P>All I can say is it is wonderful you have realized what you have done. What about the OW? Is she or isn't she around? If not, I'd suggest get rid of her QUICK. Let your wife see your serious here. <P>I feel pain for your wife, I know how she feels. Its not easy for her to deal with this, I am sure.<P>If you truly want this marraige because you love your wife, and this is not out of convenience, or obligations, than let your actions speak for themselves.<P>Get rid of OW. Dont' ever talk to her again. How can you love someone who helped wreck your life so much. Give your wife space, show her its over with OW and give it some time. All you can do is hope and pray its not too late.<P>We are all here to support you. You will find strength and peace here.<P>I mainly stay on the divorced section of this forum right now. I just was here to post to some people I am hoping recover soon.<P>Good luck and I hope it works out for you. <BR>Dana<BR>

Cman:<P>I'm trying to understand My H's position in everything. He was the betrayer and currently is sitting on the fence trying to make a decision for the second time after returning to her once we separated. I guess I have a few questions for you. Maybe you can help me understand.<P>What made you decide that you wanted your W rather than your OW?<P>How long did it take you to realize this?<P>Feel free to e-mail me at the below address to respond if you wish. I'd really appreciate knowing the other side from someone who's head seems to be coming out of the clouds. :-)<P><BR>Many thanks,<BR>rachelb25@yahoo.com<BR>------------------<BR><p>[This message has been edited by Rachelb25 (edited April 04, 2000).]

CMAN: My h was in the EXACT same position as you were 1 year ago. I could have carbon copied your post for him... Same thing, worked with ow, had affair, I busted him, gave him a chance,,,he succummed to the addiction,,,,,and I booted him..... Within a few weeks,, my h began calling and crying.. We had built a new home.. He missed me, my family, his home, his friends, HIS LIFE! I didnt allow him back again right away,, in fact it wasnt until I read the book Surviving an Affair that I started to realize what he was going through was an addiction. The book helped me understand, and it gave me hope.... We were seperated for 2 months during which time I was tossing the idea of divorce around... H was living with ow...but was not happy, but still addicted, and scared as heck.<P>He moved home after he read some of SAA and other books,,, We started to rebuild, but he was addicted still and suffering from withdrawal. To make a very long story short,,,,,,,after 6 months of ups and downs, withdrawals, slip ups, contact with ow,,my h was finally able to break his addiction to the ow.. Now, 10 months after he moved home,, we are very, very, happy.... The trust has slowly developed, we worked on our emotional needs,,, our marriage is great, and we have officially SURVIVED AN AFFAIR... It can be done,, it is so difficult, but dont give up..<P>I would suggest that your wife try to educate herself on affairs.... and what happens.. (SAA), Private Lies, After the Affair 3 of my favorite books.. Also this site would be a great place for her to get support and gain some insight. If she wants to save her marraige you can... I have been through a nightmare that I never would care to relive,, but I thank God every day of my life that he gave me the strength and patience to ride the ordeal out and to save my marriage. I will never regret it... I also would be willing to help your wife and answer any questions. My email address is PNAGEL@steelcase.com.. I will be going on vacation starting this Friday for 1 week, but would be more than willing to help.<P>I want you to know that what you are going through is typical for an affair and it can be beat.. Do you realize that statistically, only 3-6% of affairs ever lead to a long term marriage,, and those marriages have a lot of baggage with them. If you would,, do a search on a post of mine called private Lies,, its an exerpt from the book and it talks about why a marriage with the op will not work... things that you are beginning to experience already.<P>If you want to save your marriage,, you have to end all contact with the ow,, and you will have to go through withdrawal.. its hard, but it can be done.

Welcome <B>CMan</B>...<BR>I have a post of general welcome I wish to share with you... <P>It has a lot of quick links to many of the <B>most</B> important MB sites...<BR>Click here ==> <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/000002.html" TARGET=_blank>General Welcome for All New Builders(Newbies)</A><P>For some clarity... a while ago... the "main" forum was divided into 4 separate "sub" forums...<BR><A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/marriage/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&forum=Just+found+out...&number=29&DaysPrune=10&LastLogin=" TARGET=_blank>Just found out...</A>...for those new the forum... pre/post "discovery" of an affair or possible affair.<BR><A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/marriage/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&forum=Plan+A/Plan+B&number=30&DaysPrune=10&LastLogin=" TARGET=_blank>Plan A/Plan B</A>...usually after "discovery of the affair"...for those with questions of "what to do now?"<BR><A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/marriage/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&forum=In+recovery&number=31&DaysPrune=10&LastLogin=" TARGET=_blank>In recovery</A>...when a commitment to work on marriage by both spouses has begun.<BR>We are being asked to post the forums that make the most sense with respect to our questions/vents and not just dump everything into the <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/marriage/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&forum=General+Questions&number=28&DaysPrune=10&LastLogin=" TARGET=_blank>General Questions</A> forum because it will give you the most responses! <P>Prayers... <P>Jim

Hi CMan,<P> Yikes, I read your post and thought you were my H!(except we've been married 22yrs and 4kids).We're are now together and went through alot of what Mickey has described. Take her advice, the marriage can be saved and it can be a good one. Break ALL CONTACT at once with OW and show your W you mean what you say........keep posting , we'll help you......LU