Hi all,<P>I've had a exceptionally bad weekend. Emotionally. I have thought back over the years that encompassed my relationship with my stbx. 18 years in all. What I believe is that I never fully trusted him. I don't think he gave me reason not to. It's something I just didn't completely do. I always have had a jealous streak in me. Even when I know he was off working his butt off for the family, working late, working weekends, the old green eyed monster would creep up and begin to stir up negative feelings in me.<P>After this weekend, I would have to say that in my opinion, this in fact is the most destructive emotion in both men and women. It can destroy relationships of any kind. It will destroy marriages. Perhaps my being insecure, and OVERLY JEALOUS all the time was one of the primary reasons for his affair. I was needy, clingy, and whiny. I'm still this way. Maybe I smothered him to the point where he was suffocating and couldn't take it anymore.<P>I'd like to know how much "jealousy" played as a factor in everyone's situations? Both betrayed and betrayers alike... Some other points of view would be very beneficial to me. Just something to think about.<P>Thanks,<BR>Tanya

Tanya,<BR>My H and I never had problems with jealousy. It was (in my opinion) one of the better things in our marriage. I always trusted him and he trusted me. Maybe that's why I was so blown away when he DID have an affair. If you would have asked me just a year ago if this would ever happen to us I would have said "absolutely not!" Yet here I am, H has left me for the OW and I'm about to file for divorce. I think being jealous probably can contribute to problems in a marriage, but that's not what happened to me. I found that lacking trust in my H in other ways hurt me. Not completely sharing myself. Keeping myself closed off for fear of being hurt. Typical responses for someone like me who suffered child abuse. I think there is a part of me no one can reach. So in that way not being able to trust has definitely hurt our marriage. Well...there's really no marriage left to hurt. Just 3 kids and a bunch of bills. It's hard to believe we've been reduced to a file in some lawyer's office.<BR><P>------------------<BR>Blessed be.<BR>****************<BR>Keridwen<P>Keridwen_7@yahoo.com

TL, I've been tough on you in the past, but you've hit the nail on the head here.<P>Jealousy when the spouse doesn't do anything to provoke it is a function of low self-esteem.<P>That you've recognized this is a HUGE step forward. If you're not already in counseling, it's time for you to do so. You need to heal that part of you so that you can go on and have a HEALTHY relationship next time.

jealousy was not a factor at at all for us...in fact when he first told me he wanted to leave, I only asked if there was someone else as an afterthought, and took his denial at face value. We trusted each other completely. We just let old hurts simmer til things grew out of proportion. <P>We are in recovery now, and getting better.<P>Kathi<P>

Hi, TL. Wondering how you were doing with the latest news you've had.<P>You know, every situation is different, but you're recognizing so many things lately. I'm very proud of you. The first step to getting past them, you know?<P>I know you're not happy with so many things, but I've seen you take such strides over the months (ok, we ALL have some backslides, right!). Just hang in there, ok? Keep your head up and taking positive steps. I've seen so much.<P>Lori

Tired Lady,<BR>I think jealousy played a part in my EA. How big a part I'm not sure. My wife has always been extremely jealous and smothering. She had an extremely sensitive attena when it came to my interactions with other women - or maybe their actions towards me. She would say, "She was really coming on to you." But to be honest, I would not have seen it (most of the time). I didn't look for the vibes or usually chose to ignore them.<BR>At first, the jealousy factor was kind of an ego builder for me - "she really likes me and wants to keep me!" But after a long while, it became an albatross around my neck. It became, "She doesn't trust me, and I'm not doing anything to be mistrusted for!"<BR>So when I became vulnerable to the EA, one of my reasonings was that, "well, she doesn't trust me when I've always been good, so I might as well live down to her expectation. What difference does it make?"<BR>Maybe it is the idea that if she couldn't trust herself (she had an affair several years prior to mine) to remain faithful to me, why should she trust me? I might be like her and be untrustworthy.<BR>At any rate, I think it is an important factor. The roots of jealousy in any relationship should be explored and corrected.<BR>Pilgrim

I have to say that I have never felt my H has trusted me. I have never given him any reason to doubt me. It shows in his actions and words. He is extremely jealous if anyone even looks my way. I'm not allowed to talk to anyone with out an explaintion. It has been slowly destroying our relationship for the past 18 years. <P>To quote pilgrim: So when I became vulnerable to the EA, one of my reasonings was that, "well, she doesn't trust me when I've always been good, so I might as well live down to her expectation. What difference does it make?" <P>Putting he in for the she, thats how I have felt for the past year, especially after the accusations. I feel like he is pushing me further and further out of his life. <P>falsely accused<BR><p>[This message has been edited by falsely accused (edited April 11, 2000).]

Thanks for all your responses. <P>Pilgram has stated exactly what I believe I behaved like and perhaps why my stbx was driven away. He probably felt the same way -- "she doesn't trust me when I'm not doing anything so I might as well live up to that distrust..."<P>Sad, but true. I think these overwhelming jealous feelings have alot to do with your self esteem and confidence. Something I definately don't have alot of.

Pilgrim, I think you live in my H's head. <P>But you've also brought up an interesting point: is "inappropriate behavior" in the eyes of the beholder? And when do you know when alarms going off in your head mean that something's going on, and when is it just one's own insecurities talking?<P>This is what I've wrestled with for two years. I was never jealous of my H's female co-workers until Dragon Lady. Ever. And he was often close friends with them -- in a work context. On one job, he was very close with two of them -- but didn't go out with them outside of work, and when one had a party, he invited me to go along.<P>Then Dragon Lady came along, secretiveness, the business trip to SF followed by declarations of boredom with our sex life, phone calls from her saying, "I really need to see you", 20+ calls a month to her from our phone.<P>And when I'd say something, his answer was EXACTLY your words:<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><B>She doesn't trust me, and I'm not doing anything to be mistrusted for!"</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Only substitute "you" for "she".<P>IF it was only my insecurities talking, the LAST thing I wanted was:<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><B>"well, she doesn't trust me when I've always been good, so I might as well live down to her expectation. What difference does it make?"</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>So, Mr. Pilgrim, what is a spouse supposed to do when one is bothered by this sort of thing? And where does the line between concern and jealousy occur?<BR>

Dazed & Confused,<P>My thoughts exactly....where does the line intersect between concern or just outright jealousy? (notice how jealousy has "lousy" at the end of the word????)<P>TL

Dazed and Confused and Tired Lady,<BR>I would say this. You women probably know your husband far more than they realize. Maybe it is tied in to a woman's intuition. You "know" things about us that we don't realize you know. I would encourage you to think about how your husband feels about his relationship with you and how he feels about his marriage. Then correlate that with his actions/attitude towards other women in his sphere of work. That will cause concern if he clearly relishes the attentions of other women and seems to be reciprocating. If he is indifferent to them or shows by his actions that they are not a big deal, that you are more important than they, quell your jealousy. Attraction is normal and inevitable. If he is acting on that attraction, it is not right and you have good reason to be jealous and to voice your concern. You have reason to be jealous if he's taking an innordinate interest in other women and neglecting you. You intuition will tell you this. But then how do you deal with that jealousy? I would suggest that you voice your concern calmly without being accusatory, fearful, clingy or angry. Realize that we are all attracted to others and our spouse is no exception. Being clingy, fearful, accusatory will drive him away. Try to verbally give your husband something to live up to, i.e. "You are #1 in my life (mean this and show it by your actions!) and I want you to know that I appreciate being #1 in your life." Or, "I like the security of knowing that I can count on you to be faithful to me." Or simply, "I trust you to be a man of your word." If he's a caring man he will want to live up to your expectations and to prove to you that you are number #1 in his life and you have nothing to fear. If he's angry or unhappy with you or your marriage, seeing you as a shrew, you may have a real problem on your hands.<BR>I only took on those attitudes when my wife displayed clear, hostile disinterest in me and our marriage.<BR>I hope this helps.<BR>Pilgrim