Hi everyone-<BR>I've been lurking here since late February and finally feel it's time to share my story since everyone's been so up front with their's and there's very wise advice out there. My H lost his mind basically last July when he turned 40. I've read a lot about MLC since then and I honestly believe he had a big one. We've been married 10 yrs., dated for 5 and have three kids under the age of 9. He was always a wonderful husband/father, always home evenings, helped out at home. Then he turned 40. He started hanging out at bars, not coming home til early morning hours, picking fights with me to have a reason to get out of the house. He told a mutual friend that since he turned 40, all kinds of women are coming on to him (well, duh, you're hanging out at bars, what do you expect!) Anyway, I started suspecting he was having a PA around Thanksgiving. He had lost weight, bought new clothes, taking longer and longer for quick trips to the store etc. One night he said he was talking to his dad on the phone and then left for the store. I hit redial and got a woman's answering machine. Confronted him and kinda tricked him into admitting something was going on. Told me he wouldn't see her again and it was over. Well it wasn't, he just got craftier in his lies. Found out who the woman was, confronted him at her house in February. He was shocked. This was someone he had picked up at a bar and from what I can tell, there wasn't an EA, it was a PA. We talked and I told him he couldn't live here and continue to see her. He agreed and broke off the relationship. He is very ashamed of what he did but blames it on my lack of interest in sex. The affair really opened my eyes. I admit that with 3 kids and a full time job, sex had little interest for me and many times I did push him away. In a way I feel lucky that this wasn't some woman he works with or was friends with before the PA. Discovery was in late February. He has been home every night and seems to have returned to his "normal" self. The problem is that he doesn't want me to ever bring it up again. This is hard for me cause I want to ask him if she's tried to contact him but anytime I mention her he gets upset. I realize this is a big lb for him and have gone 3 days now not mentioning it. I've been plan Aing big time and bought all new clothes and fix myself up now (too many years of jeans and sweatshirts I realized). Another problem is that he mostly keeps sleeping on the couch. I asked once if he was trying to punish me or himself and he said he hadn't figured that out yet. We have been intimate on 3 occasions a couple weeks ago but then he went back to the couch. Is it his guilt keeping him away or do you think he's still hung up on OW? He told me he didn't love her and I do believe that or wouldn't he have just left upon discovery to live with her? Gosh sorry this got so long.

eyeswideopen,<P>Did your H ever send a "How to tell a lover that the relationship is over letter(on page 58-59 of <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi6070_sa.html" TARGET=_blank>"Surviving An Affair"(SAA)</A>)"? This is pretty important for most FSs in recovery.<P>Are you to the point of setting up a personal <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3500_policy.html" TARGET=_blank>Policy of Joint Agreement(POJA)</A>?... I think the book <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi6010_give.html" TARGET=_blank>"Give & Take: The Secret to Marital Compatibility"</A> was best at explaining it!<P>Any counseling?... maybe with MB?<P>Did you go through the <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi4110_emndsq.html" TARGET=_blank>Emotional Needs Questionnaire</A>?.. for you too?...<P>Sorry to ask all these questions... but to understand where your H is at...<BR>...have to know where he's been.<P> <P>Jim<P>

Hi there, welcome. Even if your h's affair was just physical, he will still go through some withdrawl. Try and be patient, use this time to work on you and your marriage, he'll join in eventually.<P>------------------<BR>You can't live with them, you can't kill them!<BR>Viki

Thanks for replying. I've begged for counceling but he thinks it's for losers. I've printed out and brought home the MB literature but he won't read. Says he doesn't need it. I've read all of the MB info and have been Plan A'ing by myself. He did not write the letter (I didn't know about How to End an Affair at the time he decided to break it off). He broke it off in person. I've been checking up (the OW lives within eyesight of a good friend of mine and she says she hasn't seen him there since discovery so I do believe it's over but I'm also afraid of being duped again.<BR>When first discovered, he walked around for a couple days with a chip on his shoulder, like I took away his toy or something. A few weeks after discovery, we had a long talk and he admitted to another one-night-stand during his insane period - I didn't and don't want details, just wanted to know that it was over. He cried and asked for forgiveness which I did. This sleeping on the couch again has me baffled however.

I can only offer a little perspective from my story. <P>In my case, my marriage lacked intimacy (both were at fault) and I was completely sexually frustrated for years. I have (in my W's opinion) stronger than average libido, and that is true for all the males in my family. Sure my wife would "do it", but rarely participate. Needless to say, I was ripe. A younger woman completely seduced me with admiration and lust. She constantly covered me with superlatives, calling me her Adonis. She was very attractive, so I easily followed suit making her feel like a goddess herself. Meanwhile, my wife never once in the last ten years commented positively on my physical appearance (which I work at), but I always did of her. I was weak, soon after I was well into a PA then an EA with the OW. <P>We as men have to understand that when children come on board, it is a major-league change, we are no longer numero uno. My W's priorities were our kids, I soon became number 4. Woman have to understand that this is very difficult for us and is not a change we welcome. Our frustration leads us to stop meeting our W's ENs if we even knew what they were. I wish I read HS/HN earlier, but it was too late for me.<P>Maybe your H has some fantasies that were met with the OW. Would he be willing to talk about them? Would you be willing to meet them if they weren't too outrageous? <P>The OW in my life replaced my W, and my goal is the get the W to replace the OW. It is a long road to go.

EWO,<P>Is it possible he picked up a STD and is sleeping on the couch to A) avoid you discovering it and B) reduce his own temptation so as to avoid giving it to you?<P>Since his PA has he been tested? Have you been using protection?<P>Sorry to bring up such an unpleasant possibility, but it is the first thing that came to mind based on the circumstances. And it is better for you to confront this issue than ignore it.<P>------------------<BR>But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control.<BR>Galatians 5:22-23

FL - Thank you for your perspective. I do realize now in trying to figure out why this happened that I definitely put the children before my H's ENs and he had said so many times without me "hearing". I believe he did learn a few new tricks from OW from things he wanted to do during the nights we were intimate. I did not object at all. Maybe doing that brought back memories of OW? I just wish I could stop feeling so sad, sometimes bitter, sometimes just plain angry. I wish you luck in winning your W back. I would think the first step would be to get rid of OW and then try to win her back. Replacing OW with W wouldn't work in my book. <P>2sad - Night of discovery I told him he couldn't come home because of the threat of STD's. He assured me he used protection (and he'd have been nuts not to from the look of the OW - definitely been around the block a few times if you know what I mean). I probably should have insisted on blood test but didn't. Wouldn't it be too late now anyway for that to be the reason?

This is mostly a response to FL. First of all, I'm extremely impressed with your answer to this woman. I think you hit it right on. It's very, very true that it's tough on men once kids enter into the picture. Thing is, a lot of them won't admit it. More should and maybe there wives would know where they are coming from! In my husband's first marriage he told me that sex and intimacy wasn't often to begin with and almost totally disappeared upon the birth of their first child. And yes, it's very true that if the om or ow is a more "outgoing" or exciting lover the cheating spouse will have a difficult time going back to what it "was". This especially holds true to an affair that is physical only. Once you receive that "high" or fantastic sex it's very hard to get it off of your mind. To the original poster, it's wonderful how in tune she is and I think in the end everything will go down the right path for her and her DH.

EWO,<P>He lied, misled, and deceived you while cheating on you, but you took it at face value when he said he "used protection" with his mistress?<P>IMHO, I wouldn't depend on his word when it comes to a major issue (your health and even your life). The consequences are too high. You should not have unprotected sex with him until he gets tested and is proclaimed clean. Sorry.<P>------------------<BR>But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control.<BR>Galatians 5:22-23

IWO - I did end it with the OW, but like many others here, I am separated. Like many others, it took that perspective for me to break the hold. Like many others, I suffered big time withdrawal and succumbed to the magnetism a 2nd time. Sexual-speaking, the OW was heavenly. Multi-orgasmic, spontaneous, athletic, adventurous, dressed to kill, etc. It was a stranglehold that was very, very hard to break. I couldn't. I still struggle, but I am on the road back. It was a real-life fantasy that would've bordered on fiction if you read in in Penthouse Forum. In this arena, my W could rarely compare well with the OW, but in many, many other areas, the OW could never compare to my W. It has taken me a while to figure it out. I just hope it's not too late.

FL - I hope it's not too late either. I wish you the best of luck. I've been trying to be spontaneous and exciting with my H and I'm wondering if he thinks I'm trying too hard or that I'm faking it and this is a turn off? I've tried talking about it but can't seem to get a reasonable response. He says right now all he is concentrating on is work and getting us back on track financially (apparently all that "overtime" wasn't actually adding to the paycheck) so that he needs his rest. I'm trying to be patient but am getting discouraged. Again your insight is really appreciated.