Let me start off by wishing each and every one, a Very Happy Easter. This particaular holiday seems to have more meaning to me than others. I can't really explain why, but it does. . .So once again, A Very Happy Easter to all.<P>As many of the old timers who know me are aware, my W and I are together. We are doing very well considering everything we have been through. We are more than a year past D day and progessing. As I am sure many of you have done, we spent the weekend travelling from one relatives to another to celebrate the holiday. It has been a very busy weekend, and I have some things I would like to say here tonight.<P>If anyone can offer any insight, I would appreciate it very much.<P>Maybe a little history is in order . . . My apologies to the old timers for repeating myself here. 26 months ago, my W walked out on me. I came home from work one morning (I was working graveyards at the time) to find my W and D (years old at the time) gone. We had had an arguement the day before over being evicted from our apartment (I had no idea we were behind in rent, by the way). When I got home that morning, I found a note taped to the TV telling me that she couldn't take my abuse anymore, and that she needed a few days to sort things out. As I looked around me and around the apartment, I discovered that 99% of my W and our daughters belongings were gone.<P>The very same morning, my W filed a restraining order against me claiming that I had threatened to kill her, our D and all of their friends.<P>Aproximately a month later, I showed up in court (70 miles away) without a lawyer. I tried to find a lawyer, but was unable to find anyone who was willing to help or defend me at all. In essence, I was accused, tried and convicted of abusing my family. I was "granted" 4 hours a week visitation with my D, but I was required to travel 70 miles each week in order to see her.<P>During the next few weeks, My W filled out divorce papers. Approximately a month after going to court, My W slept with a co worker, while at work. I did not find this out until a little over a year ago. During this time, she contracted an STD.<P>A while later, I My W tried to have me arrested for violating the restraining order. I tried to call her, at her direction, to set up my visitation with our D the next weekend.<P>To try and make a long story a little shorter. . .It took six months before my W and I reconciled.<P>Within a few months of our getting back together again, my W begame engaged in MANY Internet / Emotional affairs. When I discovered these, I thought I was going to die. Everything I had experienced during the six months we were seperated, came back and was amplified tremendously. <P>It was around this time that I found MB. I read here a lot, though I was afraid to post.<P>Then a few months later, I discovered my W's physical affair. . . Once again, everything came back only much much worse. Soon there after, I began posting on this forum.<P>My W finally sought out counseling. We tried talking with the minister who had done our pre-marital counseling, but he wasn't willing to help us. We eventually were able to get a few counseling counseling sessions through a program at my work. That counseling cobined with the advice and support we found on this forum, helped us along the path to recovery to where we are today.<P>So why am I writing now?? Well, during the course of all that has happened, I learned that my W leaving was at the strong urging of my IL's (Who are both divorced and remarried). While the financial support of everything that happened came from my FIL, the majority of "pressure" came from my MIL and SIL's.<P>Our first destination this weekend was to my MIL's. To this day, my MIL has not admitted any fault in the problems my W and I have endured. I have mentioned on this board, and to my W, that until my MIL apologizes to me and to my W, I don't think I will ever be able to forgive her.<P>My FIL on the other hand has at least made efforts to repair the rift between us. He too has not apologized for his actions, but he has tried to improve things between us. There are still times when I am very uncomfortable being around him. While we were at my FIL's, we sat down at one point and played the game <I>Taboo</I>. One of the words I had to get my W to say during this game was <B>arrested</B>. The first thing that came to mind was to say "You tried to do this to me." That was the only clue need for her to guess the word. My FIL said nothing, but his current W was obviously confused by this clue, and even wrote the word down on the score sheet, as if she intended to ask about it later. I don't know if she ever asked my W about it or not.<P>During Church this morning, as I was listening to the minister talk, I found myself wanting to cry. I know that I need to be able to frgive my IL's for their part in our problems, but I don't know if I can. They helped to cause so much pain . . .<P>While we were driving back home this morning, my W mentioned that while we were at my MIL's she had been talking with one of her sisters, and found out that the other sister, had recently had an abortion. I don't know if my W noticed or not, but I sat there and cried. I didn;t really say anything, I cried softly to myself.<P>So many times on this forum, people have talked about memories and "anniversaries" which they are having problems with. Many times the advice that is given is to Make "that day" the own again. To do something special together which will forever make that day theirs again. Unfortunaelty, I been unsuccessful in this approach, and have found myself dealing with one of these "anniversaries" once again. . .<P>This coming Friday will be two years to the day the my W first slept with the OM. She has told me that she only slept with him the one time, and I believe her when she tells me this. Yet a part of my mind still has some doubts if this is really the truth. The hardest part for me though is thinking about, and imagining the thoughts which went through my W's mind during this time two years ago as she planned having sex with this person for the first time.<P>I don't know how to make "that day" ours. In my mind it will always be "their" day.<P>I'm sorry for making this so long. I just needed to get this off my chest. If anyone has any advice or insight, I will look forward to reading it.<P>God Bless

ES,<P>Forget the past dates/aniverseries. Look ahead to the future and what can be !<P>Bob<p>[This message has been edited by RWD (edited April 23, 2000).]

Hi ES. I remember reading about you and your wife's story, and I have the utmost of respect for both of you. You're working through these issues <B> together </B> and that's what matters most. <P>I was the betrayer in my marriage (almost two year affair), and a year later my husband betrayed. So we're working on some issues ourselves. I did want to mention about the in-laws, and I don't know if this hits close to home or not. During the time of my affair, I didn't always attribute mine and H's problems to my parents exactly as was happening, but I touched on certain areas. This was totally unfair to H because I wasn't relating the incidents correctly as far as H saw it. Their opinion of my husband wasn't the best, obviously. Your in-laws may not know all details, only what your wife told them. They are naturally looking after their daughter, and not having heard your side of the story, are looking out for her best interest. This is why it's so important not to include other family members in personal problems when there is chance of reconciliation.<P>You have doubts about what your wife has told you. Maybe you could sit down and honestly try to discuss this with her? Letting her know how important it is that you know the ENTIRE truth? This can really eat away if you feel something is not being divulged. Also, your wife has chosen to be with you, so hard as it is, try to work from this day forward. Forget the past (I know...easier said than done!) and look toward the future.<P>I really think that you are feeling just a little insecure about what's happened (and rightly so) and not sure about the past and future right now, or you wouldn't be feeling this way. It's okay to tell her this. Opening up to her and her to you will eventually lead you both to complete trust with one another. I have just gotten to this point with H, and I've missed this for so long. I felt as if I didn't know the whole truth, but when all of my questions (and his as well) were answered over and over and time had passed, we did start to become trustworthy to one another. It's such a great feeling, I hated the insecurity that accompanied betrayal and my husband had to go through this first and hated it as well.<P>Take care <p>[This message has been edited by Connor (edited April 23, 2000).]

Wow,<BR>Even though I have read many replies from you....I never really knew your "story". How heartbreaking. You are truly a man of forgiveness.<P>If you know my story.....some of yours is like mine. We both endured so much....you were able to reconcile and for that I am so happy.<P>Now back to the forgiveness part. Maybe your problem isn't the forgiveness, but forgeting. It is a whole lot easier to forgive someone that you love....so unconditionally. That is what is so horrible about all of this.....everyone who gets involved. I had often heard in the beginning (after he left) that we could never work things out because too many people knew. How his "pride" wouldn't let him come home, and he was the betrayer. I don't think it was pride....but all the lies he told, that wouldn't allow him to come home. But like you....I was more than willing to forgive him for those lies....because I loved him unconditionally.<P>First of all you have to realize that they were only protecting their "little" girl. She may have said some things to them....that might not have been true, so they had nothing to go on but what she said. Think about it....there are 3 sides to a story....his, hers, and the truth. Although we all would like to think that "our" side is the truth....it might not always be, because we don't know what our words or actions did to that person...only they do. I always hated when my stbx would say.....that couldn't have hurt or I didn't mean it that way. Well it did hurt and I did take it that way.<P>Sure...you can make special days.....special anniversaries......because many make themselves. Remember the song that was playing when you used to date......or the way something makes you remember when you first kissed......why can't they happen again. This is a "new" marriage....so to speak. With new memories....new challenges. A time to throw away all the bad crap....and live for the good ones. You two have made it.....you love each other....chose to stick it out for each other.......wasn't that a special day when you got back together. Those new memories, backed by all of the old, "good" memories, make for one great life. What a lucky couple you have become....how special.<P>Smile....forget about trying so hard to "make" those days "special" days....all of your love will take care of that.<P>Best wishes to your wife and you<BR>Nancy

Hello Old Friend....<P>Oldie Sheba here!!! LOL!!<P>It is soooo good to hear from you!!<P>First, Take a BIG HUG!!!!! Rough day for you...and here's another BIG HUG for Hopeful, too!!<P>You guys did good with making the effort to see ALL the relatives...I am very proud of you!!!!<P>ES...as far as forgiveness - True forgiveness is not something you "give" to someone! It is something that you ALLOW yourself to have....you need it to be able to move past a hurt or disservice done to you by another. It really has nothing to do with MIL.....<P>She is the one who must face her own contributions to the destruction she was a part of...you cannot force that. You can't stump your own growth and healing because of it either!! <P>I truly understand that you need an apology...in a perfect world you would get one. MIL if far from being in a perfect world, wouldn't you say? Even the olive branch offered through FIL by his show of acceptance is all that it would take to alleviate your pain...but I don't think MIL has it in her to be that sensible and compassionate to others....Look at the harm to her own daughter!! Why would you think that there would ever be an acknowledgement to you? <P>She is just messed up, ES...you have to work it through for yourself or else you will keep it in the forefront and put up your own roadblock.....it's not worth it!! Just accept the fact that this is how she is and all you need do is show respect because you are a better person, who loves her daughter. If you keep this as important in your thinking - you may inadvertently keep Hopeful on eggshells everytime a family event comes around.....you wouldn't want that, right? Acceptance of her character - forgiveness and God from the goodness of your heart is all you can hope for!!<P>Let go, let God....He can figure her out!!!<P>About the "anniversary date"....what do you mean you can't do anything? Sure you can......what is your and Hopeful's schedule that day? Work some time together and DO SOMETHING!!! Use your imagination....occupy your thoughts about this instead of MIL!!! YOU CAN DO IT!!!!!<P>I don't care if you both call in sick, send D off to school or a sitter and stay in your jammys and play games, watch cartoons and eat junk food!!!! DO SOMETHING SPECIAL!!!! YOU BOTH are worth it!!!<P>BIG HUGS and a Howdy to your beautiful wife!!!<P>Sheba<BR>

Oh, and HAPPY EASTER!!!<P>Duh...<P>Love Ya,<P>Sheba

ES,<P>I remember seeing some of your post here. I am a betrayer.<P>this is my suggestion. This has helped me to get where I am today.<P>PRAY PRAY PRAY!!!!!!!!!!!<P>I had alot of resentment toward my H for the past nervous breakdown that sent me back to a child. I had to learn to crawl, walk, and talk all over again. This was 2 years beofre my affair. He was very verbally abusive. All I done was Pray for God to take all that away. AND HE DID!!!!!!<BR> He will take it all away. Just pray for it! I promise it will help. <P>As far as what W tells you about the OM. Your on the road to recovery now!! FORGET IT! I know it is hard. Let bygons be bygons. Otherwise u are going to drive yourself crazy!!!!<P>Prayers to u<BR>Renee<P>------------------<BR>

RWD -- <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Forget the past dates/aniverseries. Look ahead to the future and what can be !<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Bob, this is something I have tried desperately to do. As the saying goes . . Easier said than done.<P>Connor -- Thank You for your reply. I would like to elaborate a little though. . . <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Your in-laws may not know all details, only what your wife told them.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I ocnsidered this possibility. I even sat down a wrote a letter to both of my IL's and gave it to themk explaining what I felt had gone wrong. What I had tried to do to begin correcting things, and how desperately I wanted to make amends for the wrongs I had done in our marriage.<P>To this day, that letter has not even been acknowledged. <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>You have doubts about what your wife has told you. Maybe you could sit down and honestly try to discuss this with her? Letting her know how important it is that you know the ENTIRE truth?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I have done this. In fact there have been several posts by my W and I concerning this very issue. I believe that my W has told me most of what happened, however there are still a lot of questions which I have. Most don't even relate to the infidelities, but to those thoughts, feelings and events which eventually led up to our problems. My W knows that I still have these questions, but is either unable or unwilling to give me the answers. In fact, other than a few instances, she seems to want to act as if the past had never happened. That I can not do.<P>As far as my family is concerned . . .They do know most of went on during that time period. They even went through a period where they wanted to lay all blame on my W. With the help of some counseling I went to early on, I was able to realize my contributions to our problems, and I refused to allow my family to lay all of the blame on my W. I told them that it took both of us to aloow things to degrade to the point they did, and that I was equally to blame. My family has no qualms with my W to this day. They love and respect her, and are always willing to be there for her.<P>I truly have forgiven my W. Had I not done this, we would not have reached the point where we are now. My forgiveness of my IL's is however still a very big issue for me.<P>Mental -- <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Even though I have read many replies from you....I never really knew your "story".<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> No need to feel bad about this. Unless you were around when I first began posting here, you probably would not know much about my story. I must admit that I have been lax about updating my profile, and many of the details of my story, and how I feel as a result, tend to cause wars on the forum. <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Maybe your problem isn't the forgiveness, but forgeting. It is a whole lot easier to forgive someone that you love....so unconditionally.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>You are partially correct in your thinking. This is something which I will never forget. As far as my W is concerned I forgave her a long time ago. As I think I mentioned earlier, if I had not forgiven her, we would not have reached the point we have. My biggest forgiveness concerns revolve around my IL's, not my W. <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>First of all you have to realize that they were only protecting their "little" girl.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> How I wish this were the case. My IL's have never like me since the day they met me. I am 9 years older than my W, and this is my second marriage. Those two facts, coupled with the fact that I have never been a "kiss up" doomed me from the beginning. My W may have more information on this, but this is basically the crux of their feelings toward me.<P>When my W called them after the fight we had over being evicted, I am certain that they figured "This is our chance to finally get rid of him."<P>Sheba -- My dear friend. . .I sat here crying as I read your reply. You are one of the few who has endured my entire time on this board. You have helped me to hold on at times when I felt I would be thrown from the rollercoaster. I truly do love you my friend. <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>True forgiveness is not something you "give" to someone! It is something that you ALLOW yourself to have....you need it to be able to move past a hurt or disservice done to you by another.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I know that you are correct in this, but why is this particular act of forgiveness sooooooo hard for me? I have tried. I have prayed about this many many times, yet I still have a problem with this. <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>If you keep this as important in your thinking - you may inadvertently keep Hopeful on eggshells everytime a family event comes around.....you wouldn't want that, right?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>You are completely correct in this area as well. In fact, while I know that hopeful knows my feelings regarding this, and in fact shares many of them with me, they are after all her family. I try to avoid most all mention of her family as a result, and I definitely do not voice my opinions when the subject comes up. There's no sense lighting a match in a cave full of gas is there. <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>I don't care if you both call in sick, send D off to school or a sitter and stay in your jammys and play games, watch cartoons and eat junk food!!!! DO SOMETHING SPECIAL!!!!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I've tried this with other dates. and it has not been at all successful. hopeful simply blames everything on herself, and mopes around. I am also at a point at work, where I have to watch my performance very closely. In a little over a month, I am do for a very important review, which will determine whether or not I am actually hired by the company or am forced to stay with the Temporary Service. While I understand that work is not the most important thing there is, not being hired, will have a major impact on our life in general. I simply can not afford to take the time off work, either financially or professionally.<P>Life has a very nasty way of inturding, you know.<P>Well my friends, I have to get up in five (5) hours to get ready for work, so I need to call it a night. Thank you very much for taking the time to respond to me tonight. I will check back tomorrow night after work.<P>God Bless<P>

Oh ES....isn't that the truth!! Life sure does "intrude" sometimes!!!<P>Thank you for calling me Friend....I truly care about you two and I only wish that we weren't so darn far apart!!! I wish those Hugs to you both could be in person!!!<P>I think that the reason MIL is such a hurdle for you is that she is your "monster"!!!<P>It's like being a kid and something scares you sooooooo bad.....you are traumatized. Then there are monsters all around...in the closet....under the bed....etc. This "monster" is really a fear that the trauma will happen again.<P>Your "Monster" is real in a way.....your MIL had a significant role in scaring you so badly......It wasn't so much the actions of Hopeful - you have realized how she got to most of what she did, etc. YOU know that her Mother pushed quite a few buttons of the controller for it!!!<P>Subconsciously, you are waiting for her fangs and claws to pop out.....for her to return as the monster and scare you again.......it's like an ever present "on the alert" type of anxiousness!! <P>Am I close? If so, then it is only you who can banish the "monster"....the one in your mind. How you do it is to realize how much power you are giving your MIL over your own mind. She is being put in a position - through your own doing with your focus - of having a control over you.....<P>SHE can't do it again, ES....you and Hopeful have endured and learned way too much to be able to let that happen. If you and Hopeful continue to grow in strength together - NOTHING and NOONE can change your life together.<P>It is not like before....it will never be like before!!! There is nothing to fear!!<P>Your MIL's day has come and gone.<BR>Look at it as a blessing that Hopeful's eyes have been opened to be able to cut the strings of her mother's puppeteering!!!! Have faith!!! <P>I sorta figured you couldn't take the day for Friday....how about after work? Yeah, you might be tired.....how about something lowkey like a walk after dark holding hands and telling stories/dreams/goals to each other!!! No talk of the past events...only of the future and wonderful dreams.<P>Think on it.....perhaps a neighbor can check in on D. And if you have to drive to a nicer and calmer place for atmosphere than do that......<P>If Hopeful mopes....call me and I will pep her up real quick!!!! YOU HEAR ME Hopeful? Be a good girl....no breast beating on Friday!!!! It will be a good day.......<P>HUGS,<P>Sheba<P>

too pooped to read all the replies,<BR>but I will say this.<P>It is significant that on Easter you begin to think of forgiveness for your inlaws. It is a time of resurrection, when as Christians realize that the Lord suffered and died and rose again so we know how important forgiveness is.<P>I think it is wonderful that you are working in that direction. The Holy Spirit is prompting you into moving into the direction of forgiveness to your IL's.<P>Also, think about this - Easter is a time when old things pass away and through Christ, all things are new.<P>I wonder how spiritual your inlaws are, and maybe - ES, you and hopeful will be an example of forgiveness, love, and resurrection. <P>When that anniversary comes, remember that you have had a resurrected marriage, and this marriage has more influence in more lives than simply yourself, hopeful and your child. It is a witness of the saving grace the Lord gave you. <P>Celebrate this week, with the newness you've been given. Do not let Satan, who wants you to dwell on the sins of the past steal your future, or your witness. <P>The enemy isn't hopeful, IL's. The enemy is the "accuser" that wants to destroy your witness. <P>TNT

ES<BR>I'm like TNT. Too tired to read all the responses but I had to respond myself before I went to bed.<P>I just went through the worst anniversary for me. I didn't do well. I honestly didn't think I could be that upset again. I grieved bigtime. That took about two days and I was ashamed and angry with myself.<P>The good news is that once it was out of my system I felt a gigantic weight had been taken off. Very weird. Maybe I should be committed. <P>I am getting somewhere with this. I think you may be expecting too much of yourself. You don't need to take back the anniverseries if that doesn't work. Try tolerating them. Or just let yourself grieve for a while. Maybe you need to do that.<P>You don't have to "forgive" anyone right now. It isn't all black and white. One or the other. Try tolerating MIL. Go slow. Don't beat up on yourself because you haven't achieved complete forgiveness or fully mastered those days.<P>Take a little bit at a time. Make tolerance and acceptance your goals. <P>I knew that happiness and trust were the big things for me. I also knew that I would be expecting too much if those were my goals. So I chose "better" and "safe". Much easier to achieve in less time. The other things will be goals when I feel they are not too far away.<P>We all have so many different things to deal with. It isn't just infidelity. It is all the pieces that go with it so there is no right answer.<P>Slowly ES. Do not make your expectations too high. That is exhausting.<P>Remember fighter and his MIL? I don't think he has forgiven her but I don't think he wants to have her beheaded anymore. <BR>I'll ask him next time I talk to him if he has any words of wisdom on that subject. <P>Take care! Happy Easter to you!

HI Empty Shell,<BR> It's good to hear from you again. So much good advice!! Not much I can add but a view from "THE OTHER SIDE"<P> My SIL and BIL were married 20 + years so we were ALL shocked when we found out SIL wanted a D.<P> She told us of the horror of his abuse over the last 3 years of her M and even suspected (I know I did) an affair by her H.<BR> <BR> The abuse even included putting a gun to her head because she wanted to leave.<BR> The family rallied to her side to support SIL in ANYWAY possible while BIL contunied to harrass, threaten and stalk her.<BR> They divorced and SIL moved to another state with their D to "Get away from BIL" She ONLY told her mother where she was and we comunticated THRU her!!<P> She got NOTHING in the property settlement as BIL "hid" all the assests of his business etc...<BR> We kept limited contact through MIL and life went on. We missed SIL VERY much around the holidays BUT life goes on right? <P> Well, fast forward 2 years after Divorce. We get a call from MIL. SIL is REMARRYING BIL!!!<BR> WHAT??????????? IS SHE CRAZY?????????? WHAT IS SHE THINKING????????????????????<P> My W and I called her to talk her out of it, her other S called, MIL called EVERYONE called!! SIL SAID (More or less) "I Love you but, this is OUR decision" "It's NOT your business. WELL!!<P> It wasn't until 3 years after D that I found out (From this SIL) that the reason BIL did those things (and not that he was right in ANY WAY!!) <BR> WAS SIL, (you guessed it) HAD AN AFFAIR!!<P> The ONLY one that could (kind of) understand what he felt and why he acted like that was ME!!<BR> So I talked to the family (careful not to tell the "Secret") and said "Trust me, what BIL did was wrong, however, we never got the WHOLE story either! They are RE-Married and we need to welcome him back to the family.<P> I'm SURE your IL's were in a similar situation and reacted in a way that ANY family would to "Save" their own from harm.<BR> Your MIL PROBABLY had NO idea of YOUR pain.<BR> And may not to this day. 70X7 !!!!<P>GOOD LUCK & PRAYERS FRANK<P>P.S. Yes they are HAPPILY married and even do "His needs her needs"!! The now have TWO wedding Aniver. !!! PRAISE GOD!!!!<P>------------------<BR>desperate<BR>"If yesterday didn't stop today, Why should TODAY stop tomorrow??" <BR>"Wisdom is why!!"<P>

And like the others, I was too tired to even sign ON last night!!<P>Hi ES....been missing you. You've got a lot of wonderful advice here. Can't change that woman, you know that!!! She is what she is and since SHE has no desire to be any different or even realistically SEE what she does to people (like Sheba says, look what she's put Hopeful through), nothing's gonna happen now.<P>But a lot can happen inside of you. Heck, darlin, look how much has happened inside of you AND hopeful so far!!! You don't need an apology. You really don't. And you don't need to hold on to those feelings...it's not good for you. Time for more compassion and forgiveness. Yeah, I know, you should be pretty good at that by now!!! You can forgive without her repentance. For you and Hopeful, you have to make that decision. <P>OK, so you can't take off for the "day" but you can make special plans. That's been a goal for Robert and I....taking each place, each day and turning them into something for US - taking it back. I know you can do it too!!! <P>Hang in there...hold that wife of yours and draw some strength from each other. I know you two can do it.<P>Gotta take d to school. Love to you. And give a big ole hug to hopeful for me!!!<P>Lori

Wow! Nothing like an Old-timer with a problem to bring out the rest of the old-timers! Sorry it took me so long to get here, but I couldn't find my walker!<P>ES:<P>I think you've already taken the biggest step toward "getting over" your difficulty with your in-laws -- you've written your problem out. You've put it down in words and put it out there. You've defined it.<P>Now, go back and look at it. How big is the problem, really? You know what you want out of life, right? You want a happy, healthy family. You want to end the feuding and forgive, right?<P>Well, ask yourself this: What has happened in all of this that is SO big and SO terrible that you can't find it in your heart to forgive and start over?<P>So what if MIL won't acknowledge what she's done? I think you secretly fear that if she doesn't admit it, she'll try it again. Maybe, maybe not. However, there ARE no guarantees in life.<P>You need to be the bigger person here. You need to be DETERMINED to bury the hatchet. Perhaps you could go to her and sit her down and tell her what you've told us. Tell her that for two years you've blamed her and FIL for a lot of the rift between you and Hopeful.<P>Then, tell her that you think you've been unfair in assigning blame to them (even if you don't believe it). Tell her that you've finally come to realize that the problems you and Hopeful had weren't MIL & FIL's fault, it was because you and Hopeful didn't communicate the way you should have, didn't respect each other the way you should have, and didn't treat each other the way you should have.<P>Then, tell her that you feel this horrible tension still between you and MIL, and that you want to clear the air and wipe the slate clean so that you can feel comfortable coming back to her home. Make sure she knows that you acknowledge that her presence is important in your wife and daughter's lives, and that you want to let by-gones be by-gones.<P>If she can't agree to bury the hatchet with you, then it will be on HER shoulders, not yours. You've got to make the first move and just DO IT, whether you want to or not.<P>It's the only way you can cleanse the past and hold out hope for a brighter future. I know it's hard, but you can do it. I've always had faith in your ability to be strong. You've already proved it by repairing your marriage. Now, just be the adult in your relationship with your MIL. She may never like you, but she'll HAVE to respect your desire to do what's best for your family.<P>Try it. <P>------------------<BR>/// Lone Star * ///<P>

ES - I can identify with a couple of the points you made(BTW, sorry I'm late). My MIL was continually counseling W that if she left, I would become physically violent. There were times when I was in the apartment that W would see something out of place and wonder if I had been to the house(I had not). MIL would encourage her that I had and that I was probably sitting in my car somewhere near the house. She also often complemented OM and encouraged W to have a relationship with him purely on W's description. She never met him.<P>How she knew all of this I've never figured out because MIL never really took the time to get to know me and treated me often with disdain. I've often wondered how I will treat her if I ever get to see her again. I'm pretty sure I can forgive, but I'm not sure I will ever return to the feelings of wanting her to accept me as part of the family. I will certainly filter everything I say to her to prevent me from letting her in too far.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>She has told me that she only slept with him the one time, and I believe her when she tells me this. Yet a part of my mind still has some doubts if this is really the truth.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Man, this has my name all over it. I, too, have visions of their being together. I cannot control when these happen. I had a real problem for a while, when we were intimate, that I would have one of these "flashes" and would temporarily "lose it"(if you know what I mean). Those mental pictures cause a real nauseous sick feeling that takes minutes to overcome. I know I'm years away from that disappearing completely. The only thing I can do is to consciously replace that mental picture with a pleasant one once the sick feeling dissipates.<P>You are a very good man. You will get over all of this and eventually be able to forgive your ILs. But forgiveness is not forgetting. Just don't let the memories poison your future, for your sake and your W's. We have a long row to hoe but the sooner we start, the quicker it will be over. As Bob said: "Look ahead to the future and what can be".<P>Luv ya, man...<P>--DeWayne--<p>[This message has been edited by Heartpain (edited April 24, 2000).]

Before I try to respond individually, I would like to say thank you to all who have replied. It really means a lot to me.<P>inamess -- Sorry I missed your reply last night. You must have been post at the same time I was. <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>PRAY PRAY PRAY!!!!!!!!!!!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I have done a great deal of this. I continue to pray every day for strength, understanding and compassion.<P>This revelation in itself is a tremendous step. I have had a very hard time with religion as a result of everything that has gone on. I have been trying to find my place with God as a result and this, at times, is just as difficult as the infidelities. <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>FORGET IT! I know it is hard. Let bygons be bygons. Otherwise u are going to drive yourself crazy!!!!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I am afraid that I can't do that. I have a very detailed sequential mind, and in order to process everything correctly, I need to know the facts. It's the only way I know how to do things. Sure, it can make things very difficult at times, but this is the only way I know.<P>Sheba -- <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Subconsciously, you are waiting for her fangs and claws to pop out.....for her to return as the monster and scare you again.......it's like an ever present "on the alert" type of anxiousness!!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>You know what . . . You are exactly right here. I really hadn't thought of it that way, but your are absolutely correct. The worst part, is that this "fear" scares the hell out of me.<P>TNT -- Thank you. Your insight is very keen as always. I would like to think that my desire for forgiveness is my own growth speaking, but I am sure that the holiday, and what it stands for has a very big impact as well.<P>wasstubborn -- <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>I think you may be expecting too much of yourself. You don't need to take back the anniverseries if that doesn't work. Try tolerating them. Or just let yourself grieve for a while. Maybe you need to do that.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>In a way, I think you are right here. By going full force in Plan A during everything that went on, I don't know how true grieving I really did. I know it still hurts. And I know I want the pain to go away. <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>We all have so many different things to deal with. It isn't just infidelity. It is all the pieces that go with it so there is no right answer.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I think I tried to say something to this effect before, but you seem to have worded it much better than I could. The majority of the Affairs, I already have answers to. The majority of my questions revolve around those pieces that don't go with it. . .<P>PLEASE HELP -- Thank you for sharing this story. I too had people try and tell me I was crazy for wanting and "taking" my W back. I still think it was the right decision.<P>lostva -- <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Time for more compassion and forgiveness. Yeah, I know, you should be pretty good at that by now!!! You can forgive without her repentance. For you and Hopeful, you have to make that decision.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I think that some type of repentance from my MIL is needed. Not only for me, but also for hopeful. As Sheba said, she has become a "monster" that we are forced to always be on guard against. We have enough to work through on our own, without that "demon" lurking around the corner.<P>Lone Star -- Couldn't find your walker . . . What are you going to do when you get to be my age . . .<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>I think you secretly fear that if she doesn't admit it, she'll try it again.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>YES I am afraid of exactly that. I have seen her be a spiteful vindictive person in the time that I have known her. She lost the battle when hopeful decided to give "US" another chance. She was very angry and very bitter, not only toward me, but to hopeful as well. So yea, I am afraid she will try again sometime in the future.<P>You know, I have thought about trying to "lay everything" out for my MIL. I have even started writing a letter on this subject several times. I don't know if I am strong enough to do it face to face though. <P>Maybe I should start the letter again . . .<P>Heartpain -- <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Just don't let the memories poison your future, for your sake and your W's.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>This is one of the reasons why I think forgiveness is so important to me. I realize that forgetting is not going to happen. . .But if I can't forgive, then the poison will intensify.<P><BR>Well, I guess I went on forever again. Thank You All.<P>God Bless <P>