Well, last weekend went well, had a great time together. Well a friend, "Laura" emailed him, invited him to a 2nd party that she was having and told him he could bring, "Pam" if he wanted to. (Pam is the girl that he had emailed asking if he could go for the ride next time she and her girls went to NY, claims they are just friends from college, say's I've met her though I don't remember that). Anyhow, that was the last straw, I called H asked him about it. He said that he had asked if he could bring "Pam" to "Laura's" 1st party because they(pam and laura) were no longer speaking and wanted them to be friends again(we were seperated when "Laura's" party took place, i've met her before). Anyhow, I emailed Pam due to the urging of my H and told her about the emails and I felt that something was going on between them. I told her that basically, I don't know what H wanted to accomplish by my emailing her because no women is going to want to be the cause of any friction in a marriage and she could lie to cover for him. I wasn't mean or harsh, but I just told her that being a woman and finding the things that I've find that she would come to the same conclusions (btw, I sent the email to my H too). She emailed back that she is shocked that this has come about, she isn't in anyway interested in H, they are just platonic friends, she's been where I am at and she would never step into anyone's relationship like that and she has morals, and doesn't feel that we should put her between her and my H, she offered to get together with both of us to discuss this further blah, blah, blah. Anyhow, I replied, apologizing if she felt I put her in the middle of my marriage, that it was not my intentions at all, but my H seems to have these women friends popping up that he keeps in his life instead of OUR life and that it is his fault because she popped up out of the blue. I thanked her and left it like that. H hasn't said anything to me about my email to her, I'm quite sure he is upset or embarrassed. I know according to the MB sight that I LB bigtime and this may have done more damage. The thing is I am so tired of this stuff that I don't care anymore of my H outcome. I read the invitation saying "You can bring "Pam" too. HELLO, this man shouldn't be bringing ANY WOMAN except his wife! And their was no mention of bringing me. I told H that I am not mad, just emotionally drained and I am really, really tired and ready to move on and that I am starting to feel that it is okay to look the other way. I was suppose to visit him this weekend, and I know I should go, but I am feeling like I should say no, stay in my home state and do something that will make me happy, go out dancing, go shopping, get my hair done, take care of me since he doesn't seem to be taking care of me and especially since it is going to be Mother's Day! HELLO, does this, 2 steps forward 1 step back ever end? I haven't heard from him and now I am thinking that why would anyone want this drama, especially to have his friends involved, why won't he just leave instead of trying to be secretive, why just go find your happiness elsewhere since I am not doing it for you. I don't ask this anymore because it makes it seem like I am pitying myself, looking for an answer that I can be okay with. This is really stupid, just really really stupid, how can we continue on with this and keep our sanity? It just isn't getting any better and not making any sense anymore of why stay.

i just wanted you to know someone's listening. i go through the same stuff...

I am sorry, I am having so much trouble keeping up with my own "crap" that sometimes I forget just what is going on in everyone elses lives.<P>I almost feel that you should stay home and do something for yourself. Sometimes, I feel that if you don't "come running" they wonder why.<P>It is so hard to love someone and watch them mess up their lives.....it can make you go crazy. Maybe he needs to concentrate on "you" and not on all of his female "friends". <P>I hope everything works out for you...you are a good person that wants to move on and enjoy whatever life holds for you.<P>Nancy

Hi Trying2_4Give -<P>I'm sorry that you had to handle such an incident today.....But I think that you handled it pretty well considering.<P>H was the one who encouraged you to EMail this Pam person, right? Shouldn't be a lovebuster then. <P>A couple of things to point out to you though and I know that you were mad and upset when you wrote this so I hope that you have calmed down enough to have thought it out some. <P>First - this "contact" is something that H RECEIVED from someone who he communicated with while separated right?<BR>HE did not send an invitation to her!! This could have come out of left field for him.<P>More important questions and boundaries need to be addressed than just a reaction to this particular incident. This really doesn't change anything that you and H experienced this weekend. It would be different if you both enjoyed each other and then HE SENT invitations out!!! See what I am saying?<P>Is he still emailing her? Has he told these women that you and he are together again? I realize that this is part of what you were speaking about when you got so upset these last few posts and I stick by my feeling that it will vanish once you two start feeding each other better and happier emotions and attitudes. <P>I think that the weekend was a very good example of what you two can achieve and continue. Just have to keep an eye on what is TRULY important and remember not to react and mirror.<P>Once you show that your behavior is consistant - H will drop this other "nonsense" he brought into his life to boost and amuse himself with. He will, T24G, I just know it!!!! <P>This Pam said that she has no interest in H....well, that's fine. So FORGET about her and forget the other one also!! They are not your problem and need not use up any more brain room!!<P>H might be embarassed and/or angry and might "blame" you - it would only be because he can't use these "women" to hold up to you so you would think that others want him.....get what I mean? That was his part in the "she won't change and act like she wants me, so I will show her that others do..." scenario we spoke of before, remember?<P>Now he doesn't have as much leverage as before....<P>What you have to do is show him that he doesn't need to have any "leverage" at all!!!! That you are more than willing and capable of boosting him.....then he in turn will do the same once he is secure enough.<P>Did any of that rambling make sense?<P>If conversation or disharmony comes up from this....just take an "I want to trust you and thank you for telling me the truth and advising me to email Pam"<BR>I feel better and I hope I won't have to be faced with this stuff out of the blue like that anymore because it makes me question you when I don't want to" <P>Tell him that you and he are doing so well that once all these little incidental secrets of the past are out in the open and dealt with than who knows how wonderful life will be able to be.<P>Or words to that effect that wouldn't be a lovebuster but a love builder!!!! Timing is everything when trying to move forward together. <P>When you both feel safer - a try at POJA about this "friends" business could be the answer....provided there is even "friends" in the picture anymore.<P>BIG HUGS, Take some DEEP BREATHS and do all that you can to bring back your frame of mind that you had over the weekend.....remember HE DID not make this happen today!!! It is residue from before, the bulk of which is in the past. Keep the goal ahead....don't go and get mired in the "then"....<P>More BIG HUGS and let us know how it goes.....NO MIRRORING!!!! YOU can do anything you put your mind to!!!!<P>Sheba<P>PS - Was glad to read about the "shower".....we never really know what we can handle till it happens!!! Way to go!!!! <p>[This message has been edited by Sheba (edited May 10, 2000).]

T24G,<P>Just wanted you to know that, I have been there and my thoughts and prayers are with you. <P>Lila

How are you doing today? <P>Just when you have a sign of 2 steps forward, something cruddy has to come along and knock you down a step.<P>That is okay. It is always like that! Names change, and circumstances maybe a little different, but it always goes like that! That means, that you just gotta keep on keeping on.<P>keep your sights "On the Goal On the Goal On the Goal"....<P>He doesn't have control over others, and odviously part of your objective has to be working at becoming a stronger team. You have to realize where you are at - you aren't there yet, but you are working towards it. <P>And, once you get there you have to figure out how to maintain it. <P>Plan A aint for wimps! (sorry, I really love that phrase!) <P>So you gotta keep the goal in your mind always, and realize that these setbacks are not an indication that your goal is unattainable, but rather that there are bumps along the road that have to be plowed out of the way. No problem, you just have a bumpy ride, but you are still travelin' to your destination, right? <P>Keep on keeping on like that Energizer bunny. You'll get there.<BR>TNT

Well, we kept email arguement going! You know, he'll email me screaming, I'll email him screaming, basically "mirroring" each other. I do feel better though and I THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR YOUR HELPFUL ADVICE. Once again you are correct. So he didn't reply to my last "CUSSING OUT" which is a good thing. I basically told him to either work on his marraige or leave me and let me move on. We did talk after I sent him the email, about some mail not being delivered and we were civil. I am still going to see him this weekend and I don't know what to do about the tension because their will surely be some. Sometimes I wish I had someone standing next to me to hold my mouth shut or stop my fingers from typing when I am in angry mode. All that happens is what start bringing up with the other did/has done in the past to get the reactions that they have gotten and it just gets us angry and resentful. I swear if we could remember this and try to respond in a secure loving manner then I think things could get better, but for some reason we can't seem to get past the anger, especially when the other feels like they are not being appreciated or validated. If he does chose to respond to my last angry post (wish I had come here before responding), then I will just email back that I am done with the bashing back and forth and leave it at that. But I am not as mad as I was yesterday, just dissappointed with the both of us.

Read all you can about this site:<BR> <A HREF="http://www.anger-stress-marriage.com/discus/index.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.anger-stress-marriage.com/discus/index.html</A> <P>Scroll down to the free workbook sample section. It gives steps to understand about anger, how to diffuse it, etc. It is very helpful.<P>I know - gaining self control is really hard. But it is part of what we have to learn - gaining communication skills - it helps us to get to our goal.<P>On the goal....<p>[This message has been edited by trustntruth (edited May 11, 2000).]

I don't know if this will help but what helps me control my emailing with my wife (when I write and cuss her out) is that I write out the email and save it. Then 1 or 2 hours later when I have cooled down I read the email and ask myself if sending this is going to hurt the marriage or help it. It usually is hurtful so I don't send it. I got the gripe off of my chest but didn't cause any pain. It has helped me I hope it helps you or anyone.

Hi Trying2_4Give -<P>How are ya, doll? How's things going this week?<P>Thinking of you and sending some big hugs and positive vibes to you and H.<P>HUGS and Love,<P>Sheba

Hey Sheba! Well the weekend was great, I even stayed an x-tra night due to I didn't want to leave him. The first night was very tense for me. He was at the airport with flowers for me, had reservations for dinner and dancing afterwards (I was too tired for the dancing part). So his actions showed me that he was trying. We spent the weekend looking for a place to live. I did tell him how I felt about moving out of state with him. I told him that it is nice when we are looking for a place for our family, but I really don't know if I can do it, being that I am picking up and moving away from my support system (family & friends) when he and I are not that strong. I feel like he has total control over everything. (I know, I know, Sheba that CONTROL word again). But he is the bread-winner and he could up and leave me at any time and I will be stranded with nothing but worries about where to go and how to take care of the kids. House will be in his name, (my credit is shot to H*LL) car, etc. He has the finances to do whatever he pleases. He disagrees, of course saying that that is how he felt living in my apartment and he had to leave whenever things went bad. We didn't argue about it and beyond that we had a nice time together. I guess what I really feel is that I am setting myself up for failure by moving me and the kids out of state to be with him. I don't trust in him to be there emotionally for me and our marriage. I worry that he will meet someone else and then I will be right back where I started. I think too much about everything. No matter what I know the kids will be taken care of, but I question myself all the time saying "Why leave your home to live with a man that has told counselor and you that he is not IN LOVE with you". That is something that I can't quite get over and forget. I even sent him part of the thread here that contrite (i think it was contrite) sent about it being easier to communicate with strangers than your spouse, and how you have surface communication from fear of anger, disappointment with spouse. Which I believe is our problem, of course no response from him which is common for him, he won't bring up anything if he feels it is conflict, which I hate. But other than that we have been searching for a place to move to so that has been our daily communication lately. So that's where I am at now, we'll see how that changes. Sheba you know how hurricanes can change directions in an instant without notice!!