I have been very good about not love busting the last four or five times I've seen my H, who no longer lives here but stops in twice a week for mail and a quick dinner if I offer. We have had a few chuckles, mostly light conversation, and try to steer clear of the issue of his long-distance mistress and the resulting (apparent) demise of our 17 marriage & 20 yr. friendship (right up until last week, he was telling me I was his best friend. Now he says "you USED to be", don't have a clue why that's changed all of a sudden). He occasionally says he's not sure how this whole thing will play out for "us" (and is telling other people that, including his family), and then turns around and tells me he's in love with her and plans to pursue that relationship (told me not to call it an affair) and that leaves me on the back burner. Seems he's happy to have his cake and eat it too. He tells me how his life is his OWN personal business and that I'm not to ask questions about anything, including about the (joint) bills, what he's doing, where he's going, etc. That it's "private". Meanwhile, he gets to drop in here every three or four days and keep tabs on what I'm up to. He is on his way to NYC today(from Vermont) to spend the holiday weekend with OW. I told him I hope he understands I do not approve of what he's doing. He replied "I don't live here anymore, do YOU understand??"<BR>My question: By telling him I don't approve of his affair (said very calmly), did I love bust? By telling him his employees and co-workers are aware of what's going on and that the office is abuzz with it, and that they are dissappointed and have lost respect for him (told to me personally by one employee), did I love bust? I was careful not to raise my voice, force my will, whatever, but felt he should know the word was out because he's trying to negotiate a severence (he's quitting his 20 year executive position, with just a commission job to replace it!) and if his boss gets the word that he blew off a ski show while on the road for the company(while being paid) to spend the weekend with the home wrecker instead, it might jeopardize his settlement. I wanted to give him a heads up on the one hand, and also let him know that I'm well aware of what he's up to on the other. I think he thinks I'm stupid!<BR>I'm not sure this plan A stuff is something I can muster the courage to see through. My instinct tells me to pack up all his stuff and furniture over the weekend, take it to a storage shed & mail him the key to his new post office box, which I would set up for him near where he now lives (his mistresses seasonal ski house) and have his mail forwarded so I don't have to see him one on one anymore. All this being nice just gets my hopes up and I don't think there is any hope. I almost think this would be easier to deal with if I didn't have to see him over and over because it just brings it all to the surface again, and even though he's saying there's a "slight" chance we could work it out, his actions say otherwise. He is hell bent on building a quality "relationship" with this woman and he has told me there is no room for me in the picture at this time, but if they get sick of each other, he might find that he still has feelings for me worth working on. <BR>I understand that Plan A is to help myself first and foremost, but I'm not sure I can take it. I think I would be better off just calling it a day, and if he wants to get her out of his life, then maybe we can talk. Does anyone suggest going to plan B and writing the letter saying I cannot take this emotionally while he is so active in trying to build a new life with someone else, so I wish to have no further contact until/unless it's over with her? Or will that be the end of it? I'm not sure but what calling it quits might be the best answer, and just move on, although Dr. Harley says I absolutely should not be entertaining ideas of starting a new life, dating, etc. All I know is I thought this would get easier from when he first told me he loves me but is not "in love" with me back in late Feb.-early March. It's been almost three months of him manipulating my emotions,calling the shots, making the decisions, and trashing out my heart and I don't know how much more I can take. He doesn't want counseling or to "work on things". Says he's never been more clear in his thinking in his life! Can someone give me guidance to hold me over until my appt. w/ Dr. Harley next week? I feel like my innards are coming out!

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Sooney:<BR><B>I'm not sure this plan A stuff is something I can muster the courage to see through. </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Your H sounds like mine in some ways. Mine also keeps close tabs on what I am doing (nothing to get excited about), but feels his life is none of my business since we are separated.<P>The Plan A really is a good deal for both of you, but more for you. I'd keep Plan A-ing even if you go to Plan B. I'd definitely do a letter and make it a formal Plan B instead of sneaking around in the dark about it and just springing it on him though. <P>I did the same type of stuff you are doing. I tried to give him helpful advice because I could see how his actions could hurt him financially, but he just took it as controlling or me trying to get in his business. He took my words to be moral condemnations and just turned the other way. I know that I can't help him now because he isn't "normal". <P>I don't know if you are ready for Plan B, but I kinda of fell into it when I was in the same sort of place as you. It was just too painful to watch him self destruct. It was too hard to face that he didn't want to try or change. I needed to preserve my dignity and sanity.<P>So, I've been in Plan B for a week. I know nothing can change while there is this evil influence in our lives and I am not willing to do battle with him or the OW. I am not willing to let my self esteem slide into oblivion or put good energy after bad. I am also not willing to let this situation destroy what I know was, for a long time, the love of my life. If I lose him to this, I will still have some good memories. I will still have my dignity and know that I did everything I could. <P>Keep the faith and try to see the blessings you still have in your life. I'm right here with you, and I can tell you that this isn't the end of the world. We will both make it, either with him or without him.<P>For me, I know I am in the right place and doing the right thing. When I was struggling, it just all felt so wrong. When you've done all you can then let go and let God, it just all feels like it is happening the way it is supposed to. We'll be alright. Have faith.

Popeye, how long did you Plan A? Did he just ignore it? What prompted you to move to Plan B? Have you ever had a session with Dr. Harley? He advised me to Plan A it, but I think he tells everyone that doesn't he? I feel I'm being walked all over by H. It makes me feel bad about myself, not good!<BR>What did you mean by not sneaking around in the dark with Plan B? I missed it . . .Should I write a letter?<BR>Sooney

Sooney:<P>I am so sorry to hear of your situation. You really sound strong--I admire your ability to look at this from arm's length when you are in the midst of such a trying time.<P>Personally, I don't think you've Plan A-ed for very long, but ultimately, the only person who can decide how long to Plan A is you. You are the only one who knows how much you are able to deal with.<P>You asked if what you said was LB-ing. I believe that calmly telling him that you don't approve of what he is doing was not an LB, but that telling him his office was a-buzz and that people had lost respect for him was. I'm betting that one of the things he likes about witchy woman is that she tells him all the time how wonderful he is. That is the only recurring theme I can see in these posts. He wants to be seen as wonderful and is willing to live in a fantasy world to achieve that. He won't listen to you telling him that his world is a fantasy.<P>I can well understand your feelings. Our situations are different, but I think the feelings are similar. A part of me wants to knock H on his keester, and another part of me wants to make it all better than before. It's hard. Only I can decide how much I can take and only you can decide how much you can take.<P>I think the fact that your H says there is a "slight" chance you all could reconcile is a great thing! I think that may be your ray of hope in what he has said and done. He seems to be acting the way WSs typically do--he might just come out of his fantasy the way that Dr. Harley says in his books he has seen most WSs come out of the fantasy. You have to decide whether you can hold on until his fantasy is over.<P>I'm sorry I don't have any more concrete advice, but I wanted to let you know that I think you are doing a great job. Good luck to you. --HBC

Sooney, I may not be able to give you great advice right now because I'm sortof at the same place.<P>My H moved out in Feb. He was really mean for a few months dec, Jan, Feb.....I was blown out of the water and emotionally pulverized. Anything I did then wouldn't have been good for me.<P>I have plan a'd, but I've also tried very hard to give myself some choices and control. I have been a stay at home mom. I am not sure I want to stay here under these circumstances. The kids counselor thinks it is ok for me to move.....H acts so different around the kids and denies he was any part of their lives.<P>Before my H moved out and we sat at a restaurnt and he told me he wanted to explore a relationship with OP coworker, I stared at him and thought "who is this man"<P>Right then, I should have nicely shown him the door....but since he said all of these horrible things about me I was an emotional basket case......<P><BR>Everytime i have taken control of my life,,,,he is wooing me again......<P>Now he seems to have backpedaled saying "I don't want a relationship with her....she just =helps me do more at work. She has shown me a lot....she is my friend....."<P>He acts like she is mother Theresa.....despite the fact she moved out of her house on Mother's day and her H takes her kids when she wants him too, so she can have her freedom.<P>My H is no longer mean...will hug me and even sleep here sometimes...We talk..but not at all about work..that is his life. <P>He really comes in and out of here a lot.. I do know he is "high" at work and seems to be in withdrawal here. He comes over and is very tired and his hands are cold. <P>My H is depressed and will not admit it. Together we went to a Marr counselor and my H was pretty hostile to the counselor and said vague stuff about me.....<P>He also goes to individual counseling, but I think he must not be telling all...like he doesn't tell his counselor that he sleeps about 4-5 hours a night.<P>The marraige counselor met with us individually and thinks H is depressed....<P>My H may be using counseling to keep this "addiction" (work and op) going.<P>I just bought co-dependent no more....<P>For me.....and the kids....I may do plan B also...I need to get off and stop letting him blame me and the kids for his unhappiness.<P>This is his pattern in life. So far. It has always been jobs and his partners...now that there is an "opportunist" working with him closely...he dumped it on me and the kids.<P>I have plan A'd.....and I will plan A again...but I think if I take myself out of the picture he will not be able to blame me any more........I swear it has felt like emotional abuse a lot of the time....<P>So....my advice...You have to do what you need to for you....the bottom line is you cannot control his behavior at all.<P>In my case...the OP is a very good covert manipulator.. She has controlled his whole environment...he could keep denying his problem for a long time.....<P>I don't know if I can take the emotional battering..If I am feeling low, I cannot be there for the kids, and they are feeling quite low themselves. <P>It is sad....but I really think I am enabling him... Everyone tells me (inc. counselors) that I have overfunctioned for him.. <P>But I have to tell you, when I am ready, (feeling strong and in control of myself and my emotions) I will be doing plan B for me!!!!