I don't have a lot of time - I am at work right now. I had a session with Steve Harley this morning.<P>Most of the session was getting background info on me, H and the affair history, etc.<P>The two things Steve told me of improtance were this:<P>1) Give your H a reason to be in-love with you AT ALL TIMES<P>Ok, that I can try to do by being nice,etc. We had previously reviewed the emotional needs forms and both felt up until the series of crises, we each pretty much met the other's emotional needs. We felt our affairs were due to taking our focus off the marriage during the crises and I had the EA and later he had/still has the PA, but is now in-love with the OW and feels he can't get over those feelings for her.<P>This was the hard part:<P>2) Steve told me to go to a STRICT PLANB. Yikes - Diana, I know you are sitting there smiling going I told you so, Desiree.....!<P>THIS IS THE KICKER, THOUGH>>>>>>>>>>>>>><P>I told Steve I had been trying to move forward with my life. He said WRONG, WRONG, WRONG! Steve told me that I am sending my H the WRONG MESSAGE - That I don't care about him nor the marriage anymore and am moving on. <P>I asked Steve how can I move on if I don't try to move on??? Because my H might not come back......<P>Steve said - YOU DON'T. I need to consider myself in a HOLDING PATTERN if I still want my marriage. CR@P!!!!!! Does this mean I have made ANOTHER BIG MISTAKE??????<P>I am somewhat upset because now I am worried I have unintentionally done the WRONG thing YET AGAIN!! <P>Steve told me to get the PlanB letter together and e-mail it Steve for his editing, so I can get to my H ASAP. He also wants to talk to me again this Friday for some more suggestions.....<P>Oh, I feel so confused yet again about my self and my situation..........Medic, where is that tool to get my head out of my @ss????<P>I wish just ONE THING about all of this could be easy or simple............ <P>Whoever said that love is simple???????????<P>Please send help..............<P>Desiree<BR> <P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

throwing you a life preserver......<BR>here, quick......catch.....<P>((((((((((((((desiree)))))))))))))<P>Dylan

{{{{{RMA}}}}}<P>I'm sitting here thinking whether or not I should call Steve. You seem to have gotten pretty far after one session. <P>Holding pattern ay - gosh, I've heard that before. <P>Hang in there RMA, and let us know how the letter goes.<P>SHA<P> <P>

RMA,<BR>Did you clarify the term "moving on"? So you know what you aren't to be doing?<P>I considered moving on to be taking care of me and my kids, concentrating more at work, exercise, going out with friends (female or in groups). None of these would be detrimental to my H or marriage.<P>I'm just curious what exactly Steve was talking about.<P>I liked the reminder to give H a reason to be in love with you at all times.<P><P>------------------<BR>Lor<BR>"Do not get tired of doing what is right, for after awhile you will reap a harvest of blessings if you do not get discouraged and give up. (Gal 6:9)<P><BR>

RMA,<BR>I think what I'm doing is moving on woth my life. I don't contact stbx, unless it is to yell at her, and I'm not telling her anything about the kids as I am acting as if she will be out of their life which I totally believe.<P>It didn't sound like these were things you were doing.<P>Hang in there!<BR> Bob

Dylan,<P>Thanks for the live preserver - sometimes I think I am drowning even though I seem to be swimming as hard as I can...!<P>SHA,<P>OK, you scardy cat - I did it first, so NOW YOU HAVE TO DO IT! K made me do it - with all that badgering to you, I felt the vicarious jab and did it for me! Do it alone for the first session if your W doesn't want to. <P>Yes, we got pretty far along. One of the other things I did was to send Steve a pre-counseling e-mail with the history of this "whole fine mess I am in, Ollie." Gee, it looks so simple to clear up on paper....sigh! Anyway, what K kept hammering into you - it's only $85 per session and I figured what the h@ll do I have to lose? <P>I have so many uncertainties about what I am doing - is it wrong....is it right???? I have gone from a self-confident decisive person who can't seem to find her way out of a paper bag when it comes to my love life (or LACK of, I should say).<P>SHA, just do it - it's only a little money in the grand scheme of things - I did it from my desk at work this morning.<P>Lor,<P>Well, I think Steve was chiding about my decision to REALLY try to move on - to forget my H and move on. <P>I am not dating and have no plans to. I have not filed for D, but wondered whether I should or not. I am going out with friends and doing things. I questioned Steve alot about this.<P>I personally HAVE been giving my H the idea that I am trying to move one, because in actuality that I s what I have been striving for. My counselor wants me to do this as part of my disengaging from my H so I can be prepared emotionally if he does not come back.<P>Steve says I have to be VERY careful here. I need to continue to try to have a happy and fulfilling life WITHOUT sending him any signals that I am trying to kill the love for him and get over him. But, it truth, those are the signals I have been sending him. Geez!<P>So, he wants me to get the PlanB letter together and to him ASAP so he will know that I am still interested.<P>I just got 3 jokes on e-mail form my H. But, I was one name in a long list of people he sent the jokes to. So, I sent him back and e-mail and thanked him for the jokes and said "How are you? I miss you very much, Desiree"<P>Don't know if I was supposed to do that, but I am a little worried since I never gave him a PlanB letter, so did it anyway.<P>All, I am trying to do the right things here......wish I knoew exactly what that is!<P>Desiree<P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

RWD,<P>No, I do not yell at my H at all. I basically have been avoiding him like the plague. Thought maybe then he might start to miss me. I ave tried NOT to engage him at all by calling, or intentionally seeing or being around him. When he pops over to the house or is there late in the evenings when I get home, I have been trying to steer clear of him. When we talk, it is civil, but not friendly and "what's going with you?" anymore.<P>I guess I thought that is what you are supposed to do in planb - avoid them totally, but if it happens, try to stay clear.<P>Now, I am wondering if he thinks I don't care and have disconnected 100%. <P>AAAAAUUUUUUGGGGGGHHHHHH!<P>My brain needs a vacation!<P>I am working on this letter and can't seem to get my feelings on paper.<P>I am still at work - hope I don't cry!<P>Desiree<P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

RMA,<P>Now, I'm really confused. How does one send messages that they are still interested in reconciling the marriage, when there is to be absolutely NO CONTACT. <P>Sometimes, I think I might have psychic tendancies, but I don't think my H does!!

<B>Desiree</B>, <P>Meow. <P>OK, you have me convinced. I know K has been beating on me to do this for a long time, so I will. Actually, I have sent in a request to the counseling center for a time so I'll have to see when we can talk. Anyway, the ball is rolling. <P>Thanks, <P>SHA

RMA,<P>Read the letter Joe gave Sue in SAA.<P>Joe also sent the same letter to Gregg, it did have an attachment just for Gregg.<P>Be strong, and faithful,<P>Bill<P>------------------<BR>BB<BR>

SHA, TEE-HEE-HEE! GOOD! Desiree<P>sindey - got any psychic vibes for me????<P>WilliamJ, I can't write the letter like that 'cause I don't have the darn book. H took all the infidelity books when he left. I have no idea why - I doubt he is reading them.<P>Does anyone out there have a copy of a PlanB on their PC to send me?????<P>Desiree<BR><P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

Hey RMA,<P>I'm in final design work with the "A$$MASTER". It needs a little more work. I am testing it on unfaithful monkeys and well it worked too well. I am still cleaning up the mess. At least his head is out of his a$$ now. and on the floor, ceiling, walls...<P>I copied the Plan B letter out of the book with a few personalizations. It didn't work that well for me. I told myself I was not going to talk to her. Everytime I saw her number on the caller ID, I went to jelly, no, not jam, jelly. Grape to be exact.<P>My new "Plan Medic" seems to be working the best. She called today to tell me the check is in the mail. She sounded upset, not at me, but at something or someone else. <P>Sorry it took so long to respond. The power was out here for a couple hours. Had many more candles going than usual.<P>Did you feel better talking to Dr. H?<P> <P>------------------<BR>Wishing us all the Best.<P>Medic<P><BR>

Medic,<P>Not NEARLY as good as I felt after getting YOUR post!!! The @ssmater!!!!HAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!!! Thiss is THE BEST!!!!!!!!!<P>Hey, we can get Suzanne Somers to demonstrate it on the Infomercial channel!! I volunteer my H for the model that needs this tool to take his head out of his @ss! HAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!LOLOLOLOL!!!!HAHAHAHAHAH!!!!<P>Gee, you are KILLING me! <P>Darn, I don't have the stupid book to copy the letter. I have been trying to get something down all day and it sounds sappy. If worse comes to worse, I will go and buy another copy of SAA tomorrow. I need to get this letter to Steve Harley tomorrow.<P>Seriously, did I feel better - yes and no. I want to see a clear path for getting out of this mess - the "organizer and fixer" in me coming out. There just are no pat answers and no tried and true methods here. But, the STRICT PlanB, which I have not done, has really been recomended to me buy so many. I need to do it. It scares me -seems "permanent". So does the letter. YUCK! I need to find the courage to do this and stick with it. It is for my own good in the long run.....<P>Roll Me Away<P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

Let me know when the @$$master is going into production. I think it might help my beloved.<BR>haha...hehe..<P>Between that and the cheese ball line on my thread my side is hurting again.<P>Bill<P>------------------<BR>BB<BR>

Desiree,<BR>Email me I am totally confused about plan B. I laughed thanks I need it. How do you do plan b but let them know you stil want them. I guess filing for divorce would be a big no no! What else......no dating can understand that but what else. Hope you can explain. <BR>I wish I could afford to call Steve maybe when I get a job!!!!<p>[This message has been edited by SDS (edited December 06, 1999).]

RMA -- When I saw this: <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>the "organizer and fixer" in me coming out<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I was reminded of what a good friend told me when he was trying to help me sort all of this out. It's funny because he talked about this as a male's perspective.<P>He said that when his wife was upset about something, he was always getting himself in deep trouble. His first reaction was to dive in, try to find out what the problem was and organize a solution(a la Tim Allen). This created many problems for he and his W. He said that he learned a valuable lesson in this. Now when his W expresses some frustration or details some problem she is having, his first question to her is: "Do you want me to get involved and fix this?". If she says "No", then he tells her "Alright, then tell me more". He said it keeps a lot of peace in his house.<P>Anyway, not much of this applies here, your comment just reminded me of it.

RMA,<P>I have the Plan B Val letter in MSWORKS but do not know how to import it to send to you.<P>Maybe NSR can help me. Can you say computer dummy.<P>------------------<BR>Wishing us all the Best.<P>Medic<P><BR>

Diana, <P>I am still a little confused about his myself. Anyway, I have another session with Steve this Friday and will post more particulars after I find out. But, I will try to send you an e-mail tonight or in the morning from my notes. <P>Bill, I am running over to your post as soon as I finish this post to read about the cheese ball.....my interest is piqued! <P>Medic, Medic, Medic....<P>You and I have gotten quite a few schemes going lately...we need to consider going into business together If nothing else, we can sell the @ssmaster for comic relief for whatever ails ya....<P>If NSR can figure this out, my email is :<P>dworl@hotmail.com<P>Heartpain,<P>Yes, this is a problem for my H and I. When we did the emotional needs survey way back when, we found we really meet eachother's needs (pre-affairs!) But, H did offer some constructive criticism to me. 2 things: One I like to "correct" him if I think he has said something wrong. This drives H crazy and makes him feel belittled. Second irritant is that I bring my directorship work persona home and try to "direct" everything at home, especially by offering unsolicited advice- makes him feel that I think I am smarter than him or that he can't take care of himself.<P>YIKES! Both of these are true - my personal faults. But, in counsleing, I have worked really hard on these and actually my H even commented a couple months back that he had noticed I was hardly doing these. <P>Worst part was I never saw myself this way at all. I always saw myself as "helpful", when in reality both of these actions are disrespectful to my H and his intelligence and capabilities. My H is an engineer with a degree in English literature, psychology and an MBA. He is very bright and didn't need me telling him what to do, but I did it nonetheless......<sigh>!<P>I tell you, I only seem to figure it out after I have done it all wrong! Thanks for some more insight...<P>Roll Me Away <P><P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

RMA -- To be honest, I have had a little of the same problem. I tended to "take over" to solve even the littlest problems. W just let me do it with no protest which I saw as approval. In fact, she resents me for it even though I was just trying to help. As they say "can't win for losing".

Heartpain, <P>What can I say??? My H always let me "take charge" of certain things and that was Ok. i guess I went over the line on some things and it really bothered him. Important thing is to try to correct irritating behavior, and I am doing that now. If only I could get him to stop HIS irritating behavior....and first thing on my list would be this pesky affair!!<P>Roll Me Away<BR><P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>