My 16th anniversary is right around the corner - about two weeks from today. <P>Our marriage has deteriorated to a point that I don't think we can overcome. She simply has made no real, sincere effort to try to rebuild our relationship. No longer is counseling even a possibility since she refuses to believe it will help. She doesn't believe in the concept, I think.<P>I'm angry, resentful, etc -- all those things that we've all talked about. I just had three weeks off from work, and she's totally withdrawn, spending most of her time in the other room reading books. <P>I'm also still convinced that she's keeping things from me, and may even be approaching an EA stage with one of her newly divorced male friends.<P>So, here's the question...<P>Our 16th wedding anniversary is approaching. I do not have any desire to get my W anything -- gift, card, flowers, ANYTHING. Why celebrate something that has no significance.<P>Am I wrong to do this? Should I just suck it up and do something to be civil instead? <P>I'm inches away from telling her I want out, but then I look at my kids and think otherwise. There is just no love in our household. At Christmas, my W told me she didn't love me, and that she didn't believe that I loved her. She's held that point of view ever since. What's worse, living in a house with no love, or staying there and ignoring the obvious. My kids can't be that out of touch!<P>Help...!<P>--keystone

Hi Keystone -<P>Haven't talked to you in a while...<P>Sorry that things aren't where you would like them to be......<P>I have an idea of a "gift" for your wife....<P>Why don't you give her the gift of hope!!<P>Write her a memoir....your history.<P>Put all the good times, funny times, overcoming obstacles together times, joy, kids, etc.......<P>Then express your thoughts on this time of turmoil and "severing" of the partnership you both had.....<P>End with the knowledge you have now, the realizations of how love matures and the wonderful future once the transitions are overcome......<P>We could help if you want!!!<P>I think that this would touch her heart (and yours in the writing of it), would possibly shake off the despair she feels and would also allow you the acknowledgement of the day with a gift from the heart, rather than something given that's cold or impersonal at a time when you have enough of that going on.<P>I'd do it up real nice....with pictures and everything!!! Something that she can keep forever....look at and remember.....pass on to the kids....<P>It might take some effort, but it just may be well worth it!!!!<P>BIG HUGS,<P>Sheba

I believe we can talk ourselves into anything. Self-talk is so powerful. The whole Plan A thing is simply a commitment to act pleasant and see the good in everything and minimize the bad. If you can stick with that attitude, your love, and her love will come back.<P>You say you see your children and they give you a reason to try. Let that be enough to give you that commitment to try. Didn't you promise to love in good times and in bad? Well, that promise is being tested. <P>Your anniversary is a recognition of the day you took those vows. Significant days like this should be acknowledged and truly celebrated. Though it may not be obvious to you right now and not the easiest thing to remember, there is something wonderful in your memory. Draw on that and don't lose sight of it. If you can see it, maybe she will too. You never know what action, big or small, will change your life. Don't give up.

Hey Key,<P>My best advice is three center mass with a .45<P>OK for real. Hey, dont be a [censored] head. You married this woman becaused you loved her. Who is BSing who? You still do. Life got in the way. It did for all of us here.<P>If you listen to Dr H you can win her back. Is that what you want? What is you final resolve?<P>I was a total and complete idiot to my W. I would have been better shooting my self in the head twice. Just to make sure.<P>I would give almost anything short of my cat, Patches, to get her back.<P>It's not over for me or for you. I have stated proudly that I will be dead for two years before I give up on this marriage. I don't know what it is, I kind of like her.<P>Talk to your W!<P>Act loving and it will come in time.

It sounds like you're having a tough time, Keystone. Hang in there.<P>My advice is to give her something if you have even a tiny hope that your marriage might be saved. Whether you're doing it for your children or yourself doesn't matter. What matters is if you want to keep trying.<P>My advice: send her a beautiful bouquet (as long as she doesn't hate flowers--if she does substitute a large box of chocolates or a teddy bear or whatever is really HER cup of tea) and enclose a note reading something along the lines of, "I will never forget this date sixteen years ago. You are as beautiful now as you were then in that white dress. I miss you. I dream of you. I will love you always."<P>Write the note that you would like to receive. I don't know if your marriage can be saved, but I would advise you to not let it slip away because you didn't acknowledge an anniversary.<P>All the best. --HBC

Hey, gotta write quick. Hubby on his way home.<P>Today is our 13th anniversary. Things have been horrible since last year. But here's what I did (by the way, I'm notorious for forgetting anniversaries, birthdays, important milestones, but I digress)<P>I thought about ordering flowers, dead or painted black roses. Nope, too hostile. Then I thought about telling H "Why should we celebrate something you had severe doubts about, when you've been so miserable all this time? Why don't you take OW out to dinner instead?" (I can be a real B*****)<BR>But instead, I ordered a dozen red and one pink rose to be delivered to the office with a funny message and "I love you" at the end. <P>This was the best thing to do. By the way, last night he ran out late to the store, I guess he was buying a card, which made me think "Dang, I forgot to buy HIM a card - what am I going to do?" and I looked through my stock of Humane Society cards. Found a hunting dog licking the ear of a baby fawn, and inside I wrote "Happy Anniversary Dear"<P>He was thrilled. (Or so I believe - he could be acting.) We are having an awful time, we're fighting and in counseling, and haven't touched each other in over a year. But we're still in the same house. And he's attending counseling sessions and doing the homework which he hates but he does it.<P>Also, I handed him the "His Needs/Her Needs" tape to listen to in the car. I'm listening to it (THIS IS NOT A PLUG. The tape is excellent. So are the books.)<P>Go ahead, make a fool of yourself. Pretend. Be a grownup. That is what grownups do. They put themselves on the line, they take risks, when there seems to be no hope. <P>If she doesn't warm up after your efforts (others here made great suggestions) think about Plan B. Good luck.<p>[This message has been edited by Bellevue (edited June 27, 2000).]

Well, yesterday was our 30th anniversary, and I did <B>not</B> want to celebrate it because I still do not feel really loved by my H....I mean, more than just being loved as the mother of his kids...y'all know what I mean. Also, an anniversary is the celebrating of the vows we made to each other; well, I don't have any vows from him anymore, and he has made it perfectly clear that he does <B>NOT</B> want to renew our marriage vows.<P>Now, last year, we went out to the casino for our anniversary. Without asking me, my H asked friends to join us. We got there before the friends, and after we ate, H told me to go on and play the slots because he just wanted to walk around by himself for a while. He did not make love to me....for the first time in 30 years. He did not get me even a card, but sent me a silk flower arrangement two days later, out of guilt after our friends sent me a big bouquet. All this happened AFTER I had told him that I wanted us to have more romance in our marriage.<P>Well, we just got back from a trip this weekend. I guess it was to make up for last year or something; or, maybe it was to force me into celebrating our anniversary, since I have told him that I no longer feel married..that I feel like we have just been "shacked up" since he boinked the STD Tramp. I no longer say that we've been married X number of years; I say that we got married on June 26, 1970...but he's tried to force me into saying that we've been married for 30 years.<P>On this trip, he told a couple of people that we were on our 2nd honeymoon. GAG!!!<P>Monday afternoon, after I thought maybe we were going to get through the day without making any big deal about our anniversary, he said, "By the way, happy anniversary."<BR>I managed to quietly say, "Thank you." He said, "Well, boy! That really sounded enthused! What's the matter with you?" I told him, "I'm not into celebrating anniversaries anymore."<P>Well, he went into a pout. After we got back to our camper, he went to bed for a nap, still without talking or anything. After a while, I started fixing our supper. He got up and said, "Well, I thought we'd eat out tonight." I said, "That's fine. There's nothing here that can't wait until tomorrow." He said, "No, I don't want to go out to eat now." I said, "Well, then, we'll just eat this." He said, "No, I don't want anything." I said, "Well, it's here if you want it," and sat down to eat. He said, "Well, I don't want to go out to that show tonight." (We had tickets to Mickey Gilley.) I said, "That's up to you, but I'm going." I managed to be very civil in my tone and manner during all this, and I had even tried to engage him in chit-chat after the "happy anniversary" thing to show him that I wasn't mad or anything.<P>Finally, he said, "You're still punishing me, aren't you?" (ME punishing HIM?? After the little exchange we just had? HAH!)<P>Anyway, I told him, "No, that's just the way I feel...as I've already told you several times."<P>Anyway, the upshot was that he did sit down to eat supper with me, although THEN I puddled up. We DID go to the show and had a good time. He got over his pouting spell. The only other thing was that Mickey Gilley made a point of recognizing others' with the same anniversary and H told me that I should have told them that it was our anniversary. <BR>????????????????????????????????????????????<P>Does he just not get it??????<P>And, then, today, he made a point of telling someone that we went on the trip to celebrate our anniversary.<P>And, as far as 2nd honeymoon goes, we did make love....ONE TIME....on Saturday night!!! Golly gee!<P>I did tell him that I appreciated the thought behind the trip. He asked, "What was the thought?" I said, "Well, I assume you were trying to make up for last year." No response on that one.<P>Anyway, I know what you mean about anniversaries. I did let my H know that I love him and enjoy being with him , even though I cannot abide the thought of ever celebrating June 26th again. <P>Since your wife is still in lala land, I think that you probably should do something nice for your anniversary. I know that my H has no intention of divorcing me, so I feel a little stronger in terms of stating my needs a little more now.

keystone, <P>All I can say is don't just ignore your anniversary. Do something simple and from the heart.<P>falsely accused

Thanks to all who responded.<P>I've been away from this site for a while -- mainly be design. I figured there was no sense in spreading the negativity around, and perhaps the break would do me some good.<BR>So, I'm sorry it took so long to respond and acknowledge everyone's thoughts.<P>Well, everyone says don't ignore the anniversary. Can't say that I agree with you all, since I find no reason to "celebrate" something that has totally wasted away to nothing. And, merely offering a token gift is, to me, even more of an insult.<P>I don't know what I'm gonna do. The anniv is at the end of this week. It's really hard to even think of a gift when she has totally ignored those things that I've gotten ehr in the past couple of years -- for birthdays, Christmas, everything. <P>I have come to the belief that there is a bit of MLC in the mix here, too. W just turned 41, and the problems really accelerated prior to turning 40. <P>Anyway, I'm still "noodling" the possibilities of getting her something or not. "Celebrating" I will not do -- what's the point?! At this point, I just trying to remain civil!<P>See. there I go spreading those negative vibes. I'm off to take another break -- timeout keystone!<P>--keystone

Keystone:<P>Better to vent here than to her!<P>I still say that if you entertain any notions that you might get back together with your wife, you should get her a gift of some type.<P>But please note my "if"!<P>If, on hte other hand, you have decided that you have done everything you can for this marriage and that it's too far gone to save, don't go to the bother or the expense. <P>Only you can decide when enough is enough, and not even Dr. Harley says that every marriage can (or should) be saved.<P>Good luck to you, keystone! --HBC

Okay, so tomorrow's the big day. Sixteen years. So here's my decision...<P>I think I'm going with just a card. No gift. Card only, pushing the humor angle and not the romance. <P>I do think the marriage is over. Maybe 98%, and the remaining 2% is going quick. I'm looking with great curiosity to what, if anything, she gets me. My guess, like last year -- zip! I did get a card -- late -- but I got one. Hven't had sex in probably two years, so nothing is going to happen along those lines either. Welcome to my nightmare... When's it gonna end?<P>I'll keep you all posted as to the results.<P>--keystone

Hey keystone, <P>Good luck tonight. I hope you get some kind of positive response from your W. Keep us posted as to how it goes.<P>falsely accused