i am a 30 yr old female, married 13yrs near the end of this yr shortly after my 31st birthday. i had an affair and my husband chose to stay. however, he brings it up everyday. it's been over 2 yrs since it was discovered. i've gone for conselling. my therapist told me that i didn't need counselling, he said my husband did. my husband won't go. but yet he wants 2 know everything that is said between us. i am angry cause i feel if he wanted 2 know, he should have came with me. we have 2 boys, & a beautiful brand new house that we designed and built. he tells me everyday he can't take it. he reminds me everyday of what i did and he stills want me to say that i'm sorry daily. pls offer some suggestions. thank you...female stranger<P>------------------<BR>female stranger

[QUOTE]Originally posted by female stranger:<BR><B> my husband won't go. but yet he wants 2 know everything that is said between us.</B><P>Obviously, you still have unresolved issues to discuss with your H. He probably feels insecure in the marriage, is tormented by thoughts of you and your lover together, perhaps doesn't know what happened and why it happened, or if it will happen again....<P>You rather cavalierly say that your husband "chose to stay", as if you don't have much interest in whether he did or didn't. If that is the attitude around the house, no wonder he is broadcasting pain on a daily basis.<P>Two years is a long time. Think about what you can do to ease his mind, rebuild trust, get into a state of intimacy where he will be secure in your relationship. Also, once you are doing these things, he needs to understand how you feel about the constant sackcloth and ashes treatment. <BR><p>[This message has been edited by Mike C2 (edited July 11, 2000).]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mike C2:<BR><B>[QUOTE]Originally posted by female stranger:<P>Mike: i entered the phrase, "chose to stay" to quote his exact words. i was releave that he wanted to try. but his demands are killing me. if i am what he feels is 5 minutes too late from arriving from work, he freaks. he accuses me of being with someone. if i look in a direction that has men, he's positive i must be checking them out. if we watch a movie, he's certain that i'm having fantasies about the actor. throughout or 15 yrs together, the ironic part to all of this is, whenever i was having feelings whatever they may have been, i would express them. he would take offense rather than try to resolve and i would end up apologizing for how i felt. i just got so tired of it. i did everything. from work, to housework, to carry the boys, to having them and changing diapers and feeding, and laundry and yardwork etc, etc. i did everything. and he never said thanks. but he felt i should have known it cause we remained married. i loved him and still love him but i can't keep being "trashed" everyday. i'm going to ask him to go for counselling just to see if it can help him. and i am going to go back to my therapist. btw, thank you for your post...female stranger<BR> my husband won't go. but yet he wants 2 know everything that is said between us.</B><P>Obviously, you still have unresolved issues to discuss with your H. He probably feels insecure in the marriage, is tormented by thoughts of you and your lover together, perhaps doesn't know what happened and why it happened, or if it will happen again....<P>You rather cavalierly say that your husband "chose to stay", as if you don't have much interest in whether he did or didn't. If that is the attitude around the house, no wonder he is broadcasting pain on a daily basis.<P>Two years is a long time. Think about what you can do to ease his mind, rebuild trust, get into a state of intimacy where he will be secure in your relationship. Also, once you are doing these things, he needs to understand how you feel about the constant sackcloth and ashes treatment. <P><BR>[This message has been edited by Mike C2 (edited July 11, 2000).]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P><P>------------------<BR>female stranger

Hi,<BR> It is very unfair what your H is doing to you.No one should have to be reminded and trashed daily over a mistake they made two years ago. Your H needs help if your marriage is ever going to survive.This is as close to emotional abuse as it can get.What makes him think he can beat you up with this day after day and expect you to live like that? I'd ask him how he'd like the same kind of treatment,in a non Lbing way.<P>When H and I were new to recovery,my counselor told me that I was the one in the relationship that would decide if the marriage would last.I had a hard time putting the past behind us(it is easy to ruminate on these things).She told me that if I didn't let it stay in the past and focus on the present and the great changes H was making and hope for the future H would finally become beaten down enough that he wouldn't be able to live with it anymore.It's just not right to continually harass a person who is trying hard to mend things.Credit must be given where credit is due.I really feel for you.<BR>I'd let H know that although he chose to stay and not let the affair ruin the marriage,his continuing behavior is killing it. I'd separate unless he got some kind of help to resolve his anger and resentment. I wouldn't intend to endure his abuse indefinitely. Poor man sounds torured himself.Good luck to you and stay with us for moral support. There are lots of wise people on this board who will be able to help you out.Hang in there and work on doing a good planA while being honest with H about how his behavior is effecting you and encouraging (if not insisting) him get some help.<BR>

FS-- <P>You might want to check this Harley article out on overcoming resentment after an affair (for insight and to give to your H, maybe):<P> <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5062_qa.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5062_qa.html</A> <P>fs -- this works now!!!<P>[This message has been edited by Mike C2 (edited July 11, 2000).]<P>[This message has been edited by Mike C2 (edited July 13, 2000).]<p>[This message has been edited by Mike C2 (edited July 13, 2000).]

pls repost the link below.<P>my browser cannot find the link.<P><B><BR>FS-- <P>You might want to check this Harley article out on overcoming resentment after an affair (for insight and to give to your H, maybe):<P> <A HREF="http://=http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5062_qa.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5062_qa.html]=http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5062_qa.htm l]http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5062_qa.html</A> <P>[This message has been edited by Mike C2 (edited July 11, 2000).]</B>[/QUOTE]<P><P>------------------<BR>female stranger

FS,<P>My guess is that if your H is still bringing your affair up after 2 years, there is some unreloved issue. He is crying out for something. Could be a more abject apology, the perception of more effort from you to heal the marriage, more reassurance form you that it won't happen again... SOMETHING.<P>Whatever it is, it is eating him up and he needs help to get past this. Is he unwilling to see anyone for help?<P>------------------<BR>But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control.<BR>Galatians 5:22-23

Hello, female stranger!<P>I does sound like your H needs the counseling. He obviously can't get past this. Somehow, you need to convince him to talk this out. I can understand him being that way in the beginning (my H was). But 2 yrs. later??? That's torture on you. <P>My H doesn't question me like that or bring it up or anything like that, and it has been almost 2 yrs. for me, too. We went to counseling for a few months, and I think that really helped. Not to mention, now, we confide in each other when something is bothering us. Don't get me wrong, it was hard for him the first few months, but it's not affecting him now.<P>I really recommend you discussing this w/him and ask him what it is that he wants. What do you need to do, both of you, to make him better? Tell him that counseling would really be beneficial.<P>Hope this helps. Keep posting, hopefully it will help you!

I am the betrayed exspouse who was left for OW. My ex would not talke with me about reasons for affair, why marriage failed, etc. I tried for a long time trying to get answeres to so many questions, and trying to resolve my anger and put closure on this whole mess. It sounds like something is blocking your husband from reaching closure. Have you asked him direcly what it would take for this to be put in the past? I think counseling would be a good idea, but he may have to go alaone at first. I hope things work out.

ah, thank you so much for posting.<P>this is so therapeutic for me to be able to talk about what's troubling me.<P>today is fri jul 14th and 2 days ago i announced that i was ending it. <P>i have lived half of my life with him and have put all of my feelings, wants and desire second only to cater to his first, and unfortunately i find myself still doing it.<P>i live in ontario canada.<P>my h & i just built a 4 bdrm, raised ranch 2100 sq ft 1/2 acre $150,000.00 house and i'm the one who has offered to leave it.<P>i sat with our oldest son last night. he is 12. our youngest is 8. i talked to our oldest about what is going to happen. he understands. <P>for months now our boys have seen me cry. i need it to stop. i need to be happy & so does my H. however, he has admitted that he is unhappy and that i have made him this way.<P>my H had a terrible childhood. the middle of 5, mother now 53 is in her 4th marriage. he hasn't spoken 2 her since december of '98.<P>his father remarried 26 yrs ago and has never been in his life.<P>he blames a lot on his parents. i can accept this to a certain point but he's an adult and is responsible for what he does.<P>aahh, (sighs deeply) it kills me to know that i've broken his heart, but like all of us in here, if things hadn't been so bad, i would never had been lead up to the point of turning to someone else.<P>untimately i take full responsibility for what i did. i feel that he however does not. <P>for example, i had a lower back problem which i had surgery for, but until this time, the weight went on. i am 5'4", and married him weighing 115lbs.<P>after our first son, at 18 yrs old, i weighed 118 lbs and after our 2nd at 22 yrs old, i weighed 123 lbs. i stayed at this weight for 8 years. but after my back started to go, i gained 40 lbs over 4 yrs and during this time he said the meanest, most hurtful things to me. he wanted me 2 b small again but he wouldn't help with anything to allow me time 2 workout.<P>long story short, i lost 40 lbs in 5 wks. i went about it all the wrong way. and i did it for the person that i had the affair with.<BR>and to make matters worse, i admitted that i didn't do it for my H. this scared him for life.<P>but i do recall one occassion where we were becoming intimate and he was admiring my body after i lost the weight. after 4 yrs of altimatums, lose the weight or lose me, and pointing out ever other beautiful woman and never, ever commenting on my looks, i hated him that night when he was admiring me.<P>by this time, the emotional scares were buried so deep, it didn't matter what he said or did. <P>now, 3 yrs later, after the affair, and weighing in at a comfortable, fit & healthy 130lbs he is devestated that we are breaking up. <P>my H is the most beautfil, attractive man i have ever seen. he is and always will be the one that i ever wanted to most. and it hurts me so to know that i'm losing him.<P>however, also throughout our marriage, time spent away from the house and with his friends was also a stick in my spoke. thru all of this, i am repeatingly saying to him that if all i get from him is a friendship than i'm still lucky cause he has made a wonderful, honest, true friend to his friends. <P>the issue that makes me the most sad is that i feel that i have gotten the develping 15 yrs of his high school age to adult yrs. we started dating in high school. i was 16, he was 17. we were married 2 yrs later and had our first son within a yr. now i'm saddened with the thought that someone else in time to come, will get the best of him.<P>i feel, like i'm sure everyone else does, that i was a learning tool. this sounds cold, but i know with me, i will be sure to never make the same mistakes twice. i will not allow another person into my life that i feel will ever put me thru similar events.<P>so my question today is: how in the world and i ever gonna know that someone else is gonna treat me the way that i need to be after this man that i have spent half of my life with? and worst of all, i still am so in love with him...<P>once again, thank you so much for posting.<P><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 2sad4words:<BR><B>FS,<P>My guess is that if your H is still bringing your affair up after 2 years, there is some unreloved issue. He is crying out for something. Could be a more abject apology, the perception of more effort from you to heal the marriage, more reassurance form you that it won't happen again... SOMETHING.<P>Whatever it is, it is eating him up and he needs help to get past this. Is he unwilling to see anyone for help?<P></B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P><P>------------------<BR>female stranger

FS, I'm a little confused. In the beginning of your last post, you seem confident that divorce or seperation is what is best and then towards the end you say you are still deeply in-love with your husband. I know love isn't always enough, but is this break-up a difinite? Is it what you both want or have you just given up and want the easy way out. Don't get me wrong, 2 years of emotional abuse, plus the overweight abuse he gave is a lot to drive someone away, but does your husband see that you are really ready to walk away and does he still not want to get the help needed. Who initiated the break-up? I'm reading mixed signals here.

female stranger:<P>I never like to see a marriage proceed to divorce (especially with children involved), especially if all avenues haven't been explored to save the marriage. And it doesn't appear to me that you've done much "exploration".<P>You've gone to a therapist---and they've told you that you didn't need counseling---your husband does. I'd say find a different therapist: it's unclear to me that this one is helping your marriage. <P>While there's no doubt that your husband could benefit from marriage counseling, I'm betting that you would too. One thing that MarriageBuilder's provides is telephone counseling with either Steve or Jennifer Harley (they're Dr. Harley's kids). I counseled with Steve for quite some time, and I found him to be an excellent, effective coach and counselor. In my situation, it would have been easy to say "my wife needed the counseling"---and that's partially true. But I needed help learning good marital behavior, and I pursued it alone. In the end, the results were remarkable.<P>I would HIGHLY suggest that you call them and set up an appointment: 888-639-1639.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>he is devestated that we are breaking up. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>If he's really devestated, then perhaps he will reevaluate seeing someone for his "marriage skills". And I'd advise you to make another shot at this marriage by asking him to join you in MarriageBuilder's counseling.<P>It's pretty clear that you still have love left for him, and he for you. I'm afraid that you're not really at a point where a divorce is going to solve anything. A healthy marriage is a much better choice for you, for your husband, and certainly for your two children. And I don't really think it would be too difficult for the two of you to heal this marriage---if you get the appropriate help and coaching to develop these skills.<P>I hope that you reconsider, and give MarriageBuilder's a call.<BR>

ok, divorce is not happening.<P>this is only a seperation at this time.<P>we are both deathly afraid of any court ruling that states to whom the kids will be with. <P>we are going to be the most sickly rational people on the face of the earth when it comes to the boys.<P>i've begged him 2 go 2 counselling. for himself, with me or without. whatever it takes. i've read dr. harley's book, 'his needs, her needs'. it was the website posting on the cover that brought me here.<P>my H read the 1st couple of pages and put it down. vowing never to pick it up again. he didn't like what he read, and better yet, he was petrified of what he may discover. i know this cause he told me.<P>the seperation was a mutual decision. in fact, i was just the one who finalized it. i came home from work on tuesday and presented the options. thus being he could stay at the house and pay the mortgage and i would get a place. he can afford the mrtg, i can afford an apt. we are not selling the house yet cause we'd lose too much in equity.<P>anyway, i've tried repeatedly. begging him to go for counselling. finally one day i asked our family doc why she thought my H would not go. her professional opinion, she feels that my H does not want to face the truth all over again when he has to divuldge what happened. he obviously repeats the event in his mind a thousand times a day. my H says that he won't go cause no therapist is going tell him when he should be able to trust me again.<P>i tried to tell him that my therapist did not do this and that i can't imagine that any doc would.<P>in a previous quote, i mentioned that my therapist noted that i did not need help. i told my doc at 1st visit that i wanted him to help me to talk to my H. i wanted to become a better person. i wanted his help 2 do this. i asked him to help me understand what my H is going thru and what could i do to make it better or even go away. i discovered that what my H was doing is called 'indirect conversation'. he would make a comment to something i had said. for instance, when i ordered and purchased dr. harley book, my H came with me to pick it up. the title printed is "his needs, her needs' the subtitle reads, 'how to affair proof your marriage'. upon reading this, his comment was, 'isn't it too late for that?' <P>my doc analized this and called it third person conversation or indirect conversation. the statement was gramarically correct, however it was actually a rhetorical question to which we both knew that answer and extremely demeaning. what could i have possibly said in response to his comment about the subtitle? <P>my purpose for purchasing the book was to try to understand why the affair happened and what i could do to prevent it from happening again. and to understand what he was going thru and what i needed to change in his life regarding me.<P>i loved the book. i found answers. he found fault. any research is lumped into generic findings. he was not going to be labelled as generic and refused to accept that the book had many truths in it. i enjoyed it so much. and i think even this bothered him cause i quoted the book on several occasions only to point out that it put into words that i could read to him how i had always felt.<P>and worst of all, for the 15 yrs we shared, i told him everytime that i felt bad, wrong, disappointed, hurt, scared, happy, tormented... he replied that that is how he is and he wasn't going to change. he would make my cry and he never once, and i mean that, never once said sorry. there was never an effort to try to physically comfort me, ever. never an apology. to resolve the conflicts, i was the one who apologies evertime for over-reating or even having a reaction for something that he did. i wanted the conflict and arguing to end so i apologizes for whatever he did. it was so hard. all those years...<P>i asked him last night why he never changed and why he was so stubborn. he replied with, 'do people change overnight?' of course not, but i feel that he never attempted to change. he admitted that he didn't.<P>again, for the boys, we have agreed that we will be the most civil, controlled, rational parents that we can. <P>i wish that we could post pics in here. it would thrill me 2 have you see this beautiful man, and a pic of me.<P>p.s. i realize that i go from expressing one thing to jumping back and handing out compliments, but i truly would give anything to resolve this and keep our family together.<P>i told him that i would wait if he changed his mind. i said that i would always be there for him. i'm sure these feelings will not be forever, but for right now, it's how i feel. i love him.<P>thank you so much for your input. <P><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by trying2_4give:<BR><B>FS, I'm a little confused. In the beginning of your last post, you seem confident that divorce or seperation is what is best and then towards the end you say you are still deeply in-love with your husband. I know love isn't always enough, but is this break-up a difinite? Is it what you both want or have you just given up and want the easy way out. Don't get me wrong, 2 years of emotional abuse, plus the overweight abuse he gave is a lot to drive someone away, but does your husband see that you are really ready to walk away and does he still not want to get the help needed. Who initiated the break-up? I'm reading mixed signals here.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P><P>------------------<BR>female stranger

thank you for the post.<P>he can't put this behind him ever.<P>as you will read further down the page re: his mother & her multiple marriages scared him in the sense that he didn't want to become like her. or plainly a divorced parent.<P>he has 2 older brothers, the oldest is 39, after 18 yrs with his 1st wife is married again, while his 2nd oldest brother is on his 3rd marriage and 2 girls with the other 2 wives later. he didn't want to be like them. he wanted to be the different one. these are the kind of issues that he deals with, not only what happened between us. however, it has affected us because he never sought help for anything ever in his life.<P>i guess some people do not see how a psychatrist could help us with mental problems yet we immediately seek physical medical help from GP's & orhto's & surgeons. it's ironic isn't it. the cliche seems to be of course, these people feel they will be seen as having a dark cloud over them seen by others in society if they choose to seek professional pshyciatry, but are brilliant and logical when they choose to find the "perfect surgeon."<P>enough already. i'm talked out today.<P>i need to collect my thoughts over the wknd.<P>on my street, with my brand new house, there's a huge street party tonight. i'm glad cause i feel the need to have a mental release from all i'm dealing with.<P>my H assured me he will stay and plans to have a great time. there will be families from all 25 houses that have been built. the weather this afternoon is sunny, warm and perfect to sit back and visit and meet and learn with my neighbours.<P>have a great wknd.<P><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by db713:<BR><B>I am the betrayed exspouse who was left for OW. My ex would not talke with me about reasons for affair, why marriage failed, etc. I tried for a long time trying to get answeres to so many questions, and trying to resolve my anger and put closure on this whole mess. It sounds like something is blocking your husband from reaching closure. Have you asked him direcly what it would take for this to be put in the past? I think counseling would be a good idea, but he may have to go alaone at first. I hope things work out.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P><P>------------------<BR>female stranger