Hello all. For details regarding my situation please refer to my recent "I Feel Like I'm Dying" post under JUST FOUND OUT...<P>Well it's been about 6 days since d-day. My emotions have been all over the place. As I mention in my other post... I am a principled man... my soul tells me that this whole affair is WRONG... bordering on EVIL. Since I've been trying to get my wife to see that I am sincere in my desire to understand her and meet her needs that I now realize I failed to meet... I have been watching the kids while she leaves and "talks" (it's probably physical) to the other guy (over the weekend she usually came home around 4am). I've agreed to stay with friends and family to give her space while she tries to 'figure' out what she needs to do to be happy (yup... I'm getting screwed all the way around!) All I've demanded is that 1.) that man not enter my house and 2.) that my children not be brought anywhere near that man or any other man (or woman for my part) until the relevant parties have a ring and a date set for the next wedding. Of course this pissed her off... she said I'm meddling in her efforts to start a new life; however, she agreed because I would not leave otherwise. Yesterday after work I went to our house to watch the kids while she 'went out'. I've always been a good dad and anyone who knows us sees that I am the more loving parent and the kids are closer to me, but of course now I was totally focusing on the kids and we were having a great time, all snuggled up on the couch watching cartoons, when she came home. I could see that she was a little irate with the seen and actually became angry with me and the kids when my daughter wanted me to tuck her in to bed... my wife told me that she needed to do it... that I always took control... so I told my kid's goodnight and to get upstairs and that their mother would tuck them in shortly. Once the kids were gone I told my wife that we had to make every effort to shelter the children from this HELL! They were the innocents in this situation that she has decided to pursue and that they deserved some sacrifice on our part to buffer them from all of this. Of course she got angry with me pointing out (in a vague way) the obvious truth that she was tearing our family apart, at the detrimant to our children, for her own selfish desires. (She blames me for everything... its my fault because I didn't meet her needs... I've said that this is true but it wasn't due to lack of desire or love on my part just ignorance and a lack of honesty and openness, and basic wrong on both our parts. I've opened up to her and told her that I truly want to work this out; however, I KNOW that she is going to pursue the other guy no matter what.) I said that if we did get a divorce we had to do it as friends with the primary focus being on reaching a settlement that was best for the children. My desire would be to get the kids every weekend (she works weekends) and then also be allowed to 'pick them' up after I get off work at least 2 times during the week just to spend time together. <BR>And now I began to see her true colors... I realize now that she has been working this affair / seperation idea for some time. She said that she desires to move back into our old neighborhood into a house that she can afford and an environment that is friendly and familiar to the kids. I said that sounds good, but know that where the kids are I will be... maybe a few blocks down. This pissed her off, I think she would like for me to disappear. She said that she's been 'studying' and determined that most fathers only recieve custody of the children every other weekend and that that is what she would pursue in the legal realm; however, because she worked every weekend she would ALLOW me to have the kids on her weekend also. I was stunned... 8 days a month!... HELL NO!!!!!!!<BR>She knows I would never do anything to harm our children and that I would WANT them to spend time with their mother as long as she and they needed it. I fear that should she get her way... she would use my non-prescribed visitation time as a leverage to get what she wanted or to punish me whenever I did something she didn't like... sad thing is not only do I fear it... I KNOW it!<P>I now realize she is totally illogical and approaching evil. I have to protect my kids. Action must be taken soon. Any insight is appreciated.

<BR>Fof2,<P>I wince when I say this, but you made a big mistake in agreeing to move out of the family home. Whoever moves out of the family home is at a huge disadvantage in the family courts. <P>However, all is not lost. You need to see a lawyer without your wife knowing about it. You may be able to get a temporary custody order favoring you as the parent with primary custody by filing first. I don't know Texas law that well, but its worth checking out.<P>I do know that Texas is a "joint managing conservatorship" state, which means there is a presumption of joint custody. That doesn't mean 50/50, I'm afraid, but it does mean that her fantasy of dictating vistation times to you is very unlikely, even if she is awarded primary custody. See:<BR> <A HREF="http://www.divorcenet.com/tx/txart01.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.divorcenet.com/tx/txart01.html</A> <P>Bystander

fatherof2:<P>I was also in your shoes (as a father of two who had a wife who was having an affair---even after discovery). Although I think that Bystander's advice to discuss your situation with a lawyer is good---I would suggest that you concern yourself more with saving your marriage than trying to get custody of your children.<P>The percentage of men who gain the "custodial" parent role from women who want to keep their children is pretty damn small (Bystander---care to quote a percentage?). The chance of this affair not lasting longer than two years is very great (99%). The chance of you being able to reconcile your marriage is also good---if you have a reasonable plan, and a good coach to help you pull it off.<P>Give Steve (or Jenn) Harley a call at 888-639-1639, and set up some marriage counseling for yourself (I wouldn't worry about your "joint" counseling right now). Steve started counseling me about a week after I discovered my wife's affair---and he did an amazing job with me to help me learn good marital behavior and execute a plan to help my wife return to the marriage. To be honest, it felt like I was working in vain (as far as the marriage was concerned) for a long time---but through my determined efforts, Steve's excellent coaching, and God's help, we ended up saving our marriage.<P>I now have full time custody of the kids, and I have a happy marriage to boot. I think that given you're so early in the process, your best plan of action is to get involved with Steve, and start on a real Plan A as soon as possible.<P>And no demands or ultimatums to your wife---as you can see, they "piss her off". You simply are not in a position to give ultimatums here (and even if you were---ultimatums and demands NEVER BUILD LOVE). Your best bet is to show loving patience and respect---it's very tough to do this when your spouse is slapping you around with an affair, but it is possible. Give Steve a call---he'll be able to help you.<p>[This message has been edited by K (edited July 18, 2000).]

I am with Bystander on the moving out. I hate to see that, since it may color things later. Hope not. If you haven't actually left, DON'T. Tell her that you are soorry, but you cannot leave your children. You will work on an "in-house" seperation. But the kids need both of you. If she wants to seperate physically, let her move out and tell her you understand HER needs. But you do not allow her state of mind to change the type of parent you are.<P>Go immediately to get legal counsel. Don't do anything that can hurt you legally IF this goes to divorce. It may not get to that, but I took action on day 1 to protect my children legally. Figured they came first & my H and I could work things out later. Some think that is a LB, but in my case it actually helped stop the bleeding and cleared the air.<P>The concepts that got my H to pursue counseling were:<P>1) if we screwed up this relationship the same thing could happen over again with new relationship. If counseling works it works, if not I was handing over a better man to the OW. And regardless of what happened to us, he and I would be communicating for at least another 12 yrs about children and that they didn't deserve two angry parents. Stressed that if for no other reason, we needed to go to counseling to get advise on how to "least screw-up our kids".<P>2) the idea that neither one of us liked the thought of another person raising our children. He was ok with OW as a step-mom, but got an eye opener when I mentioned that I wasn't keen on another man helping me raise our boys, but guessed that was what he wanted.<P>3) I told H that I completely understood how hard it was when he was so emotionally attached to another person. That given the option of loosing children, or loosing her, or loosing his family (since they would stand by me & detach from him) was just terrible options. My sympathy for his situation & options seemed to get him to start talking. I then didn't condem what he was saying. He eventually realized how terrible the things he was saying sounded.<P>4) told him that I loved our boys more that life, and was willing to do anything possible to give them two loving parents. That they deserved no less. But if he couldn't try to provide that to them, I understood.<P>Keep conversation simple & DO NOT condem. Treat her like a dog that has been run over and is trying to bite you while you are attempting to bandage the wounds. That is about where the WS is at right now. This is only less than a week & EVERY thing is raw. I hope you have read SAA by Harley. Your W may stay in a full-blown A for some time. All you can do is sit and take care of family & do your best to love them all (including W) will this works out. Start RIGHT NOW being the man you know you should have been (all of us betrayed admit to some flaws). That is the only right thing to do for yourself. <P>Take Care... Carolyn

<BR>K,<P>Women get custody roughly 90% of the time. But that's not really the statistic of interest, its the percentage of women that get primary custody in <I>contested cases</I> that matters. And that runs 80-85%, depending on the study you seek.<P>I don't hide any disdain for this, and I regard it as patent sexism that can only be rectified by a presumption of 50/50 custody. You are right that Fof2 runs better odds trying to fix his marriage than win a custody battle - especially now that he's moved out.<P>Bystander<BR>--<BR>PS: K, what do you think of PM? Are you done reading it???<BR>

Hey Bystander, I'm not done with PM yet---I hurt my lower back, and I don't even want to "think" about doing any of that "rough stuff". And hey, it took me a while to finish off the latest "Harry Potter"...

I don't really have much to add. Get back into the house today. Sleep on the couch or in the garage if you have to, but get back in that house.<P>Another website that may be helpful is the Father's Right's to Custody website at <A HREF="http://www.deltabravo.net/custody." TARGET=_blank>www.deltabravo.net/custody.</A> They are not for saving marriages, but they do have a wealth of resources on how to get and maintain custody if things go south.<P>It can be done. I am a dad that got primary custody of my two children, a 6 yo boy and 1 yo girl. Keep the best interests of your children in the forefront.<P>Good Luck to you.

<BR>K,<P>Ouch, I have scoliosis so I know about back pain. Not fun. I hope you recover quickly!<P>Keep me in the loop on your PM progress. I want to converse with you about it when you're done.<P>Bystander

Hi ...I am so sorry for your pain! but I must say staying focused on the one most important thing in this world will pay off! And of course that is the children. You both will survive but those children need you closeness more than ever.Your right they didn't ask for this, they at least deserve one parent who's priority is in the right place! God luck and strength to you.<B>Hello all. For details regarding my situation please refer to my recent "I Feel Like I'm Dying" post under JUST FOUND OUT...<P>Well it's been about 6 days since d-day. My emotions have been all over the place. As I mention in my other post... I am a principled man... my soul tells me that this whole affair is WRONG... bordering on EVIL. Since I've been trying to get my wife to see that I am sincere in my desire to understand her and meet her needs that I now realize I failed to meet... I have been watching the kids while she leaves and "talks" (it's probably physical) to the other guy (over the weekend she usually came home around 4am). I've agreed to stay with friends and family to give her space while she tries to 'figure' out what she needs to do to be happy (yup... I'm getting screwed all the way around!) All I've demanded is that 1.) that man not enter my house and 2.) that my children not be brought anywhere near that man or any other man (or woman for my part) until the relevant parties have a ring and a date set for the next wedding. Of course this pissed her off... she said I'm meddling in her efforts to start a new life; however, she agreed because I would not leave otherwise. Yesterday after work I went to our house to watch the kids while she 'went out'. I've always been a good dad and anyone who knows us sees that I am the more loving parent and the kids are closer to me, but of course now I was totally focusing on the kids and we were having a great time, all snuggled up on the couch watching cartoons, when she came home. I could see that she was a little irate with the seen and actually became angry with me and the kids when my daughter wanted me to tuck her in to bed... my wife told me that she needed to do it... that I always took control... so I told my kid's goodnight and to get upstairs and that their mother would tuck them in shortly. Once the kids were gone I told my wife that we had to make every effort to shelter the children from this HELL! They were the innocents in this situation that she has decided to pursue and that they deserved some sacrifice on our part to buffer them from all of this. Of course she got angry with me pointing out (in a vague way) the obvious truth that she was tearing our family apart, at the detrimant to our children, for her own selfish desires. (She blames me for everything... its my fault because I didn't meet her needs... I've said that this is true but it wasn't due to lack of desire or love on my part just ignorance and a lack of honesty and openness, and basic wrong on both our parts. I've opened up to her and told her that I truly want to work this out; however, I KNOW that she is going to pursue the other guy no matter what.) I said that if we did get a divorce we had to do it as friends with the primary focus being on reaching a settlement that was best for the children. My desire would be to get the kids every weekend (she works weekends) and then also be allowed to 'pick them' up after I get off work at least 2 times during the week just to spend time together. <BR>And now I began to see her true colors... I realize now that she has been working this affair / seperation idea for some time. She said that she desires to move back into our old neighborhood into a house that she can afford and an environment that is friendly and familiar to the kids. I said that sounds good, but know that where the kids are I will be... maybe a few blocks down. This pissed her off, I think she would like for me to disappear. She said that she's been 'studying' and determined that most fathers only recieve custody of the children every other weekend and that that is what she would pursue in the legal realm; however, because she worked every weekend she would ALLOW me to have the kids on her weekend also. I was stunned... 8 days a month!... HELL NO!!!!!!!<BR>She knows I would never do anything to harm our children and that I would WANT them to spend time with their mother as long as she and they needed it. I fear that should she get her way... she would use my non-prescribed visitation time as a leverage to get what she wanted or to punish me whenever I did something she didn't like... sad thing is not only do I fear it... I KNOW it!<P>I now realize she is totally illogical and approaching evil. I have to protect my kids. Action must be taken soon. Any insight is appreciated.</B>[/QUOTE]<P>