I just talked to my W about that child care schedule. Next weekend is her (our?) nephew's birthday and whether or not I go will determine how we split up the weekend. The frustrating part is that she will not ask me to go with her and I told her that I would feel akward showing up without being invited. The reason for her not asking me is because she doesn't want me to assume that she wants to get back together just because we go to a party together. She repeats this every time something like this comes up. I'm not quite sure what to make of this, does this mean that she doesn't want to get back together but is not ready to tell me, or has she not made a decision yet, or what?<P>The OC is due at the end of October and I have a feeling that she will not do anything until then (if then). I don't think I can wait that long. I'm to the point that I want to sit her down and tell her to make up her mind now. It's been 10 months, we've been separated for 8, and I'm running out of patience. (If OC is early the way our S was, the birth will be on or about d-day, aren't we supposed to create good memories?) I'm ready to move on with my life.<P>The other part of my frustration goes back to Leilana's post about retaliation affairs. I could never do this, but, it has been over a year since I have had sexual relations with a woman and, like Betelguese, I'm feeling a little "anxious". Even if we get back together, I have a long wait given her pregnancy. In that case, it wouldn't bother me as much, at least I would have something else to occupy my mind. As it is, all I do is sit around and wonder what the heck I'm doing.<P>So, the bottom line is, I want her to make up her damn mind, already. I keep thinking of The Clash...<P><I>Should I stay, or should I go,<BR>If I go there will be trouble,<BR>If I stay it will be double,<BR>You've got to let me know,<BR>Should I stay, or should I go?</I><P>I just realized I didn't ask a question, I guess I need some encouragement to hang in there at least until the birth.<P>Steve<BR>

Hi Steve,<BR> Please hang on and try to go easy on her until the baby is born. Those last few months of pregnancy are a very emotional,hormonal time(you must remember from when she had your son). It's not ,by far the best time for a woman to make any life decisions. She needs your support right now.To pressure her IMHO would not be fair and would likely be a huge LB.Be patient, Oct will be here before you know it.Good news is then....you'll have to give her emotions and hormones a chance to even out from being postpartum.Can you try hanging on until Dec?

Hi Beerman2,<P>I agree with Motherhubard, you need to wait. Absolutely no big decisions until after birth and then aft the hormones have calmed down and are stable. Otherwise you'll both be making a decision not based on fact but on emotion, and it very well could be fleeting.<P>Say, is it okay if I get mad at your W for getting pregnant w/OC. My H did this twice and I know how you'e feeling. She's a big dummy for doing it and you're a really wonderful guy for being there for her, Hon. You are very special and if I wasn't married I'd definately have my eye on you (whoops! Major No No regarding MB Rules - so sorry ... just schmoozing)<P>But honestly, that child is very lucky you are gonna be there for them. What a Big caring heart you have.<P>Jo

I fourth (? ) that motion. I can guarantee that she is emotionally unstable, with all that's going on and the wonderful (NOT!) hormone ruckus of pregnancy. Give her peace until after probably six weeks after the baby's born (after the withdrawal of pregnancy). <P>As far as the other issue, I don't really know what to tell you except to watch Cinemax late-night on weekends Sorry, have I mentioned I've turned into a total cynic this week. *lol* Best of luck!<P>Ali

Steve,<P>Feel like crap that I caused a frustration!<P> I was trying to help strengthen our (betrayeds) resolve. For us NOT to mess up/complicate our lives any further by letting our need for desirability reassurance override our other goal.<P>Hey, just for a day--what if you lived like you've never been hurt? I know you've heard this before. Listen again. <P>What if you lived like you expected to have good things come your way that day instead of "how am I going to continue to live like this?" <P>What if just for a day you saw your W as not someone you are almost getting a D with and who is carrying OM's C but as a person you feel love in your heart for--as another human being--for all her good qualities--and didn't expect anything in return from her? Just wished that only good things came her way? And what would happen if you let your reactions and words and actions reflect that?<P>Wonder what kind of day that would be.<P>Are you up for any temporary amnesia from the daily pain you keep on pulling yourself thru?<P>Can you give yourself some temporary insanity and wake up jammin' and groovin' and not thinking a negative thought for a day?<P>Ok--if a whole day is too much--break it down to something that's manageable and do it. If it's only for say, an hour or two--do this EVERDAY you can manage.<P>Do the things that build YOU up, Steve.<P> Take a vacation from the rest for a while, you're pooped--depleted--strung out. <P>Do the Tom Cruise/Risky Business theme dance! <P>Do the thing that makes you happy.<P>And if you're looking a little <I>too</I> happy and it makes your W wonder what you've been up to, so be it. <P>Just stay away from the day spa. <P>

Ok, that was my creative/fun answer. Now here's a boring and practical one.<P>Ask W for a ride to this party that you're so hot to go for... (is it at a Hooter's or what?! Just kidding, I know what the main attraction for going is!)...with YOU stating first--"Don't get the wrong idea, [insert wife's name here], I just want to be there for dear little [insert brat's name here]'s party and it will look really awkward if I just show up without a personal invite." <P>If she can't say yes to that, oh well. <P>You could try asking her to let you prove you can handle this without any ideas or expectations and if she agrees--vow to play by her rules and be a master at not "being a couple". Put yourself to the test. <P>Just be Steve. A guy who has alot to offer in this world. A guy who can have fun. A guy who can just be. "Shine"--but do it subtley. Don't hang around her. If she comes to you or talks to you--treat her like an old family member or friend that you love--not <I>love</I>. Make a point to enjoy the party and your family. Have that "just for a day" feeling while you're there. Don't expect anything from anybody. <P>Is she right in her belief that she thinks you can't pull it off?<P>By the way, this party would NOT be the place to do your BVD/Risky Business theme dance.

Resilient! <P>Shame on you!!<P>I'm telling Uncle Willard on you! <P>You go directly to my "100 things you can do instead of 'schmooze' thread" and make a deposit there right now!<P>My suggestion that he prance around in his skivvies was oh so much more proper and refined!<P>

Ladies,<P>Thank you for the support. I know that this is a bad time to do anything drastic. I don't want to do anything drastic, I'm just having a bad couple of weeks.<P>I'm going to try to explain where I'm coming from, I apologize in advance for any incoherence.<P>A couple of months ago there was a friend of a friend, and things almost got out of hand. I knew that I wanted to work things out with my W more than anything, but it was awfully easy to say that we had been separated for six months and we were heading for divorce, what difference does it make? Fortunately, she found herself a boyfriend and I haven't seen or talked to her in about six weeks.<P>Which brings us to Leilana's post about retaliation affairs. Bad idea. On the one hand, noone is more vulnerable, we feel unloved, unappreciated, undesirable, uneverything. Someone comes along and tells us that it's not our fault, that we are good people, and, BOOM! It's very easy to justify. This is what we are so angry at our spouses for ("If you felt that way, why didn't you just leave?"). If you want to be with someone else, why don't you file for divorce? The answer is, because you don't want a divorce, you want to feel loved, appreciated, and desired. On the other hand, who knows better than us the devestation an affair leaves behind. There is <B>no</B> justification for an affair, as long as you are married, it's an affair.<P>Occasionally, I see a post from someone who is separated, or in plan b, or both. The post usually goes something like, "I don't love my spouse anymore...BTW, I've met someone". Pardon me, but, <B>NO [censored]</B>! What do you suppose caused the affair in the first place? <P>So here I am, trying to do the right thing, be a good guy. Do a good plan a, no LB's, be pleasant to her, try to include her when I do things with S, and what does it get me? Nothing. "Plan a is not for wimps."<P>Okay, in order.<P>mthrrhbard- Yes, I know. I just need to hear it from someone else once in a while. Remember the goal .<P>Resilient- Actually, I'm not upset about the pregnancy as much as I am about attitude. She hasn't made any mistakes, hasn't done anything wrong, nothing to fix. I guess if we get divorced that might be true, for her. As for the rest, I know you're not serious so thank you for the boost, but that's another problem here at MB. Just look at Nomas. I make it a point not to look at the roll call posts, because I know there are women who are about my age who want a wonderful marriage and aren't getting any cooperation from their H's. What a perfect match. Not what we're here for.<P>Carolina Belle- I <B>do</B> watch Skinemax. It only makes it worse. As you know, there is nothing like having a warm, loving body in bed with you wanting the things you want. As W.C. Fields said, "Some things are better than sex, some things are worse, but there's nothing quite like it." For physical excercise, I'd rather play raquetball.<P>Leilana- You again . I (usually) do all of those things. Lately, I've been in a funk, though, and I'm having trouble getting out of it. There have been family get togethers and I have been friendly, and nice, and all those things because I know she has a lot of guilt (if publicly unaknowledged). She has told me that she feels comfortable with me, so things probably aren't as bad as I think they are. In response to your other thread about moving out, don't do it. If you are in recovery and things are progressing in the right direction, there is no need. If things get worse, try something different. Moving out should be a last resort. Of course, if you feel you need to separate, make him move, you and your child shouldn't have to adjust to a new place. IMHO<P>Right! I'm off to the batting cage and then to the gym, talk to you later. Good luck!<P>Steve

Beerman:<P>Honey, you're a saint. Not many men would go through what you are for their W when she has betrayed them. <P>Temptation is always out there. I'm dealing with it right now. At times it feels like your incentive to stick with this gets practically nil. But we'll be here to remind you of your goal and chide you a little if you promise to be there for us when we need it. OK.<P>So walk it off...or pound that little ball into the wall...or lift those weights until you can't move anymore. Times passes and with it maybe all our pain will too.<P>Buffy

I have to add: Yer 2 cool!!!<P>If there were more guys in the world like you, we wouldn't be up all night with our sob-stories to share, now would we? God musta broken the mold when he made you.<P>Don't feel alone, either. I am at that point where I want to go see the doc and ask if there is a magic pill that inhibits the needs and desires of a healthy woman my age. It aint fair, is it?!!!! A girl can't get out the JC Penney catalogue and look at the underwear section, it just doesn't work. But I am determined to stick to guns in staying morally clean, or else I'd be as bad as the guy who has brought me here. I wanna tear out my hair!!!!

Beerman,<P>Just here for a few moments but saw your post. Quick question did you not go to the Co. outing you were debating about a month of so ago?<P>I guess my suggestion is to hang in there until the OC comes. However, if I recall correctly you are from CA. I believe that you need to take some care here. You could be held financially liable for this child no matter what once the childe is born and you are still married to your W. If she decides there is to be no marriage you will still be stuck, unless you protect yourself.<P>If I were you I would see a lawyer about this situation. Make sure things are the way you want them legally and then hang in there if you wish. 18 years is a long time to support someone (W and OC) if this doesn't work out through no fault of your own.<P>I wish you the very best of luck at the batting cages . And in getting your W, to see who she is losing.<P>God Bless,<P>JL

Sorry Leilana ..<P>Went to the "Schmoozen" thread and added my deposit.<P>I really am sorry, very inappropo of me.<P>Guess you guys should send me to a "Spa" as punishment, what's the name of Leilana's Day Spa again? <P>Jo

Thanks, you guys, I needed that.<P>The batting cage did the trick, I feel much better now. The bad news is I got a couple of blisters so didn't go to the gym. Oh well, there's always tommorrow. <P>Ah yes, the great state of California. The land of tofu burgers and no fault divorce. For those who don't know, "no fault" means that one can file for divorce on a whim and get half of the assets. Which, for me, means I can either buy her half of the house (which I payed for), or we sell it and split the proceeds. Also, I would probably have to pay some amount of child support for our S even though I have him as close to half of the time as I can get. Of course, theoretically, the bills get split also, so I might be able to break even but that's unlikely.<P>As far as child support for the OC, I'm not sure. I <I>think</I> that as the legal H, I would not have to file adoption papers in the event that W and I get back together. I will definately check on it though.<P>I did not go on the river trip, I stayed home and built a retaining wall in my backyard. I missed a good time too. It doesn't bother me, though, because I had a good reason not to go. If I had not gone simply because she didn't want me to (she didn't), I would have had a hard time with that.<P>Hopefully, this is just a little lull in the action, and I'll be able to snap out of this mood I'm in. Then I can start doing fun stuff like cleaning the bathrooms and dusting, not to mention mowing the lawn . I can't remember the last time everything in the house was clean at the same time! I guess watering her plants would fall within the guidelines of plan a? As opposed to letting them die? <P>Thanks again,<P>Steve

Resilient!<P>I was joking!! <B>I'm</B> sorry!!<P>I really gotta watch my sense of humor sometimes!<P>Luv ya!, L

Beerman,<P>Glad you're feeling better. <P>ThanQ for the encouragement about not moving. I'm presently glued to the spot. <P>But no kids. Yeah, I got it easy, right?<P>If you had that "experience" w/ friend of a friend--and you read my little thread--how come you didn't post what helped you to pull back? It's so damn common and predictable and yet we're not talking about it! Once it's started and you get into that fog, it's too late to talk about prevention. <P>Damage control is so much harder, don't you think?<P>Hope you're feeling stronger soon. Sorry my advice was flat. I just wanted to add that my first reaction when I read your thread was wow, you really are a great guy--but didn't think you'd believe it if you heard it. And I was right. <P>Take it to heart, dude!

Leilana!<P>No need to apologize, sheeeeesh, I was joking around Girl!<P>I still want the number of your Spa and the name of your masseuse. <P>Mahalo ...<BR>Jo<p>[This message has been edited by Resilient (edited August 10, 2000).]

It's rather embarrasssing to admit, but what prevented anything more from happening was her finding a boyfriend, otherwise I would have been in deep trouble. So, the reason I didn't post was because I didn't do anything to stop it. In my defense, once she went away, I didn't pursue her.<P>For those times when you are angry or iritated, I highly recommend strenuous physical excercise. It is hard to maintain a high level of anger when you are physically exhausted. For me the batting cage is perfect because in order to hit well, I have to focus on the ball and not think about whatever else is bothering me. Afterwards, my focus and perspective are back, and, as a result, the return of rational thought .<P>Where is the spa where you can play raquetball and waterski during the day, and play pool and drink beer at night? That would be the perfect man's spa . Oh, in the pool hall, there would be a 10 foot TV that only got ESPN, no Lifetime or any touchy-feely crap !<P>Thanks again for all the support, I do feel much better.<P>Steve