Sorry this is long, but here goes...<BR>It finally happened- he admitted it. It's been going on for 2 years with apparently very sporadic communication, mostly on cell phones- sex "several times". He said that our problems have nothing to do with their relationship. I managed to get through the conversation with only a couple of outbursts. He was relieved, said he had wanted to tell me lots of times. Apparently her H has been abusive and she begged him not to tell anyone. He appologized profusely and explained how he had become a person he didn't even know. One lie led to another... and he detests liars. Apparently her H has become suspicious. She is planning to leave him but hasn't yet. My H moved out last week. He couldn't/wouldn't tell me if he loves her or not. He said that he still felt like he wanted a D and sees no reason to put it off any longer. I explained some of the things that I've learned here, told him I understood that is what he believes he wants. I told him that is not what I want, but I couldn't stop him if that is truly what he wants to do. I told him that he and the marriage and our family were very important to me and I was not ready to give up yet. Told him that if he reached a point that he wanted to really try and make it work, I would do my share and I felt like we could make it work and have a better marriage that we've ever had. Told him that I felt like we were just beginning to be able to truly communicate. He thanked me over and over for how I handled the conversation and told me that I was really making it easier for him to explain his actions and feelings (learned that here- these conversations used to be full of disrespectful judgements cuz I AM stubborn and really have to concentrate when he can't see my point of view).I also told him that I needed to sort through all this and have some understanding of what happened and why we couldn't communicate about it then and why we had so much trouble identifying unmet needs. He did agree to continue talking with me, though pointed out that he doesn't expect it to make a difference in how he feels- if it is important to me, he will do it.<BR>Communication between them has stopped, but he said that when her situation is stable, she will call him and they will try to have a normal relationship. He realizes that a lot of what he feels for her is not based on reality.<BR>Meanwhile, I have seen him for several hours every day since he left. We have had several REAL conversations about what happened in out rrelationship. He has not said anything about wanting to work it out, but he is now taking some responsibility for his part in where we were and are. He is no longer angry at me every time we talk. He has been very thoughtful and considerate and has been great with the kids.<BR>I really got the feeling that this was not the "fog". He really seems to have put a lot of thought into what's going on and what he wants. He realizes that his feelings for her are not reality based. He still wants out. The only thing that I strongly disagree with is that his relationship with her has nothing to do with our situation now. We were in a very bad place in our marriage when he started the A (by the way, I couldn't get any real dates or time frames for when anything started or was "on" or "off"). We have only in the last couple of months that we have been able to really discuss what happened and why.<BR>Anyway, is this still the fog? Or is it time to give up?

Cloudy,<P>You've made it passed D-day...<BR>...a very hard day.<P>While it is important to find out the whys and wherefores....<P>I'd say concentrate soon on Plan A...<P>Do... not just refect exclusively on the past!<P> <P>Jim

If he's willing to spend time with you and is really communicating with you, it is NOT time to give up.<P>It's good to finally get some truth...now you know you weren't crazy or paranoid. You sound pretty calm...it might not last, you might be in shock, but if you want your marriage, continuing to Plan A at this point is your best choice.<P>------------------<BR>Lor<BR>"Let love be genuine...hold fast to what is good; love one another." Rom 12:9-10

Cloudy<BR>I share your pain of your recent D-day. I too just had the revelation... I think that you should not give up, yet. My H has not even decided if he loves her or his family more. I cannot even start to redress our marriage. At least your H knows he doesn't care for the OW that way, and you can try to zero in on what emotional need is lacking between you so you can address it. Plan A is good---just be understanding, and patient and leave your options open. And make sure your H knows your open for recovery. It takes time. INpatience is a hard thing if your the wounded one-I should know. I want to rush my H right into "End the affair" mode, and I have only known for one week! Good luck!

I am feeling pretty calm. Maybe because it's been so long since I first had suspicions- I've had a long time to get accustomed to the idea. I was also releaved that H is not planning on moving in with OW any time soon- he is aware of the impact that would have on the kids and will not do it. That was a huge relief. We also managed a very civil conversation last night, without hurling insults or blame. We talked til almost 3 am and both of had to get up and go to work. Any lengthy conversation is hard for him and it meant a lot to me that he was willing to discuss it- I know it was hard for him. He had to face up to and admit stuff that I know he deeply regrets and wishes had never happened.<BR>But what do ya'll (I'm southern) think about the fog stuff? It's hard to Plan A when he says he doesn't want to work on the marriage and I'm having to guess at what his needs are. I guess for the moment, allowing access to the kids, conversation without dispectful judgements, etc? He tried to give me the key to the house back last night. I told him that I would tell him if my feelings changed, but right now I stilll think of this as his house and that he was welcome to keep the key if he wanted to. He smiled and put it back on his key chain. He's eaten dinner here every night since he left and is putting his dishes in the dishwasher (this is huge- wish I knew how to add an icon). He is telling me thank you for dinner and it was good (imagine another icon here- one of complete shock!) Other suggestions?

Oh, Cloudy... okay, you now know what's up. Your H is being civil (as he can be, anyway) and so are you. You sound more numb to me, rather than calm. But, do try to keep *calm*.<P> Plan A is your best defense right now. Apparently, OW is going to have her own little drama with her H. keep talking to your H... be his confidante, his friend... he will soon see that life with you is the way to go. OW will have a lot of baggage... she *will* LB. <P> Remember to do good things for yourself. K?<BR>I know how badly you want details of the affair. Don't dig, Cloudy. It is now water under the bridge. I am not diminishing your pain one iota... believe me, I have been there. If you want this marriage to come back to you, you are going to have to make it appealing to him (that stinks, huh?). <P> You are doing an excellent job, right now... much better than I ever could have done. Keep your chin up. You will make it through this. I just have a really good feeling about this. I must admit, yours is the first marriage on this forum that I thought had a chance, so soon after discovery.<P> Keep posting... we're here for you.<P> Sending ((((((((hugs)))))))))<BR> Mynabird

H called tonight to talk to kids about first day of school,etc. Asked if I was doing OK- I told him that it was not really something I wanted to hear, but it was a relief that the wondering and thinking I was paranoid or crazy were over. He apologized again for creating this mess and thanked me for the way I handled the conversation. Apparently, he really thought I would yell and scream and throw things- which I might have if I hadn't found this site. I thanked him too for finally being honest with me and told him that I hoped the honesty could continue. He said he felt that he could tell me anything now.<BR>I know that this has been a really long post, but would still like some opinions about whether his wanting a D is fog talking, or if it sound to others like he has really thought it out and this is what he really wants????