Ok,<BR> I've shared my story to a few folks over the past month or so. But now's time to add a new chapter. I found out Tuesday that my husband has been having a six month affair. I found out simply by being nosy and checking his voicemail. I've been trying to follow Dr. Harley's concepts and trying to use Plan A during the PA even before I knew about it. Then as most of us do, we lose it. I called the OW at 3:00 in the morning, but didn't get her. Instead she called me, Tuesday afternoon and all (excuse me) he** broke loose. <P>I feel like I've been thrown into a nightmare. I've been very supportive except for calling to OW and asking her to leave us alone. That of course made matters even worse and she's been calling threatening him. We're planning on working through this. I was suprised that he came home Tuesday at all. But he did and we talked about my affair and his affair. I'm getting from him that he was still so very angry at the OM for ruining his marriage and that because he couldn't get back at him, he took his revenge out on me by having a PA of his own. <P>The OW is upset because during the confrontation (OW, me & H all at the same place)he was more concerned about explaining things to me than her. He has a key to her house and has to give it back. (he says she put it on his key ring w/o his knowledge and I'm not so sure that I believe that) So, today he's going to go to some neutral place (if there is such a thing)to meet her and give it back. During the 1st 48 hours, I was okay. I was very strong supportive, calm, etc. Pretty much abiding by Plan A. Now my emotions are in a whirlwind and for the 1st time, I've actually cried. <P>Can someone give me a little insight here. How do you keep from losing the battle with your emotions? The OW has been the one in the rage and I've been calm about this. I just want to start the rebuilding process. I'm glad it's over, but I need help on how to keep my feelings from controling my actions.<P>Vee

Now that the affair is out in the open is when the "fun" begins.<P>Of course you are going to feel like warmed over dog doo. Go ahead & feel it & cry. Be supportive of your h and try not to LB. Let him feel safe around you.<P>He said it's over. Lots and lots of things will be said & come out in the next few weeks. Try to not react to it immediately.<P>We're here for you so come back as often as you need to.<P>------------------<BR>Prayers & God Bless!<BR>Chris<BR>For relationship info check out <A HREF="http://www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html" TARGET=_blank>Marriage & Relationship Resources</A>

Hi, Vee,<P>I remember posting to you on your earlier posts. I guess there is some good news in all of this. You now know why your H was behaving as he was when you first started posting here.<P>In someways this makes the issues cleaner to deal with, but no less painful. However, you do have some advantages. One you have been on both sides of this street. You will have some insight as to how your H feels about himself. <P>It seems that you two have decided to make a go of the marriage. At least that is what I thought I understood from you post. If that is so, then keep applying Plan A, but with the knowledge, that both of you know how the other feels. As Chris said, warmed over dog pooh.<P>It seems to me that this may break the dam that you have felt for quite awhile now. If that is so, then emotions will run hot and heavy, but now you two can go to work and build a better marriage.<P>I really don't have any advice, except to hang in there and post. We'll do our best to support you.<P>God Bless,<P>JL

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Vee:<BR><B>The OW is upset because during the confrontation (OW, me & H all at the same place)he was more concerned about explaining things to me than her. He has a key to her house and has to give it back. </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Jeez, the OW is in a rage? What does she have to be upset about? She made her bed.<P>As far as giving her key back, that is what the US Mail is for. Item one is to cut off contact. Read up on that here. No one-on-one meetings between them.<P>Funny, in 6 weeks on this forum, I have never heard of a revenge affair. Maybe it could actually be some sort of balancing of the karmic pendulum, although with terrible risk and pain involved. The two of you will be in a unique position here....you've been on the other side.<P>I hope somehow that will speed your healing and ease your pain.<P><BR>

Mike, Chris & JL,<BR> What's funny is that when we talked about how he felt, he was saying that he was trying to end the PA but he wished it would have just died like mine did. Yes, believe it or not the OW is enraged. She told him that what hurt her the most is that when she looked at bth of us, she saw that we still loved each other. He totally ignored her during the confrontation and directed his actions to me by saying that he was trying get what he missed at home. We talked about it, but I explained to him that he couldn't see that I was trying to do what he wanted and fulfill his needs. He admitted that he didn't pay any attention to that.<P>I also managed to explain to him how the PA made him feel - happy & sad type of mood swings. He just nodded to me. I tried to tell him to just mail the dang key, but he doesn't know her address. I looked it up on the net, but she just recently moved from her apartment into a house, so I don't have the actual street number. I'm not comfortable with this. He asked me to trust him on this because it's the only way to move forward. The OW is a nut I do have to admit that. She screamed at him during the confrontation as if she were his wife. I basically said nothing and stayed calm during the ordeal. But I did ask him if that was why he wouldn't read SAA with me. He just said he didn't want to read a book and what was it going to help. So is this ok? Can he go and return the key? Or should I have asked him just to ask her for her address and he'd overnite it to her. At first he said he'd drop it in her mailbox, and now he's going to meet her. I've got four hours until that time. He has football practice and is going to meet her at a fast food place and give her back the key. How can I be comfortable with that when that was the time when he was with her.<P>I know from reading SAA how important it is not to LB, etc. I've voiced this concern but he's still going to see her to return the key. Also, the OW is upset because she now knows that he didn't really care about her and that he did this out of spite. A co worker asked me today if I had lost weight. It's entirely possible since I'm barely eating. I'm sure that makes a lot of sense. A slightly underweight woman not eating Thanks for your insight guys!<BR>Vee

Vee,<P>You know somehow I think the key thing will work out OK. The OW is apparently not the love of his life and she didn't cover herself with glory, when you all had your meeting. <P>So hang in there Vee. Your H will ultimately understand the usefulness of SAA. He is just new to all of this and doesn't want to admit he may, just may, need some help.<P>One way you might introduce this information to him is to read parts to him that address your issues during your affair and how you have changed based on the information. <P>You know sort of a tactical end run. Not accusing him or making it seem as if he needs work, but you do. Hah! He will probably see through it but he can play dumb and go along and save face. <P>Alot of face saving goes on during this mess doesn't? Hang in there it seems to me you guys will make it.<P>God Bless,<P>JL

JL,<BR> I sure hope the key thing works out. I asked him what happens if he takes it to her house and she opens the door in her birthday suit? He told me that he didn't plan on going by her house in case she decided to physically harm him. So he said he'd much rather hand it over at a populated place. I just came from his football practice. I left a nice note explaining what had happened with my visit to the car dealership (I'm working out a deal on a new car). And ... I didn't even mention in my note anything about the upcoming meeting tonite. I didn't stay (and the OW's car wasn't there ...)and I don't think he even saw me. <P>I'm honestly scared to death over here! I'm not totally understanding why one minute I want to cry and the next minute I'm placing all of the blame on myself, which leaves me feeling totally ashamed. <P>Another thing I didn't mention was that my H said on Tuesday, that he finally felt at peace. I asked him if wanted to get caught and he said in some ways he wished that the OW would have called me or come by the house and confront me. But that never happened. Maybe this will all work out. He's been honest about her crazy calls and even let me listen to the messages that she left. As I'm writing this I realize that this may be all a part of some old insecurities. <P>JL - I did also start to explain to him Plan A. He listened to me, but I'm not sure if he took it all in. I don't know - men are hard to read sometimes <P>I'll let you know how this turns out!<BR>Vee

Vee,<P>It is all that poker playing we do. Don't want to tip the hand. <P>You know Plan A is difficult to grasp at first, so don't panic if he isn't really wild about the idea. You show him what Plan A is and I suspect as he comes out of this affair you will see the results you want.<P>Your comment about him being at peace, seems to me to be a telling remark. I know this hurts, but this affair is more about you two than anyone else. I know small comfort there, but being the optimist, I would offer this to consider. He didn't do this because he fell out of love with you and in love with someone else. He did it out of pain and his love for you.<P>I know sounds backwards . I am not good at explaining this, but this affair is not your fault, but is a consequence of previous events. You don't have to take the blame for it but it does mean that he has strong feels for you. <P>This is very good Vee. Hang in there, I think you all will do well, and build an even better marriage.<P>God Bless,<BR>JL

JL,<BR> <BR>I know! That's what I told the OW, that she was a part of my old PA. She was not thrilled to say the least. I know that it's all a throwback to what I did 2 yrs ago. He even said that much. I'm going to hang in there. <P>I think that what you said about the affair being out his pain and love is very true. When I found out, I just shook my head and said, I knew he would try to get me back one day. I even told him that. He kind of looked at me and smiled. I know that sounds odd, but to me it meant that he understood me as well as I understood him. Also that's why I haven't cried since I first heard the message from the OW on Sunday. I'm able to understand why it happened, but I would really like a few tears to fall! I told my H in an e-mail that although I look like I'm hanging in there pretty well, that there will be times when I'm not doing that well and I'll need just some reassurance that everything will be ok.<P>I'm going to hang around the boards and read a few more posts to see what other lessons I have to learn.<P>Vee

Vee,<P>Hang around and teach other people what you have learned. <P>Don't worry the tears will come, when you know it is safe. Your post to Annc was very good and very useful.<P>Take Care,<P>JL

JL - <P>I've got a new problem! My H just came home and is very upset. This big confrontation happened at his football practice site. He's been fined and has to sit out the 1st game. He said he's not mad at me and also doesn't want me to pay the fine. <P>Instead, he wants the OW to pay for it. He just left to go return the key. I tried to talk to him & tell him to just give back the key and let it go. I don't think it worked. He's thinking of being nice to her just long enough to get her to pay for the fine. <P>This is dangerous ground!!!!!!!!!! I wished I could have said something else, but I didn't know what to say except, success is always the sweetest revenge and to forget about it all. JL - I want him to have no more contact with this woman. I escpecially don't want him to use the poor woman anymore than he already has. It'll only lead to her finding out where we live and creating even more problems. <P>What do I do???? When he gets home how do I ask him to no longer see this woman? This throws areal curveball into it all!

Vee,<P>I am sure my response is too late. But maybe just laying the cards on the table would be the best. I don't understand about him being fined at football, since I don't know is roll. Is he a coach, a player, what? It really doesn't matter.<P>But the affair was his fault, so my suggestion is for him to pay the fine. He got himself into this mess. Yes, there were factors and yes you had an affair, but you didn't insist he have one. You didn't make OW come there or whatever happened. <P>He is a big boy and he has to take some responsibility for the affair. So I would have a very level headed discussion with him about this and the fact that you would really prefer he have no more contact with this woman. <P>Does this make any sense?<P>God Bless,<P>JL

JL -<P>Well, here's the latest. We did talk about it last night and I finally did get to cry a little. He told me that he was simply upset about being made the example. (He's a player). He realized that what happened should have happened someplace else and that he didn't move the location of the confrontation.<P>He also did not go & return the key! He said he felt uncomfortable meeting her and came back home 10 minutes after I posted my last message. He told me that he had to accept resposnibility for his actions and that although what I did was wrong, it was more wrong to attempt revenge. He had hoped that I would just always be sorry and guilty and he the pure one. Hey, I can understand that. You've been betrayed and your pain tells you that. I'm still reinforcing the idea of complete separation from the OW. I suggested that he simply go by her house while she's at work and leve the key in an enevlope in her mailbox. I said that way, she'lll be gone forever. He sounded like he'd think about it. So, maybe he'll do it.<P>He talked and I listened. He's always said that I don't listen well and so I did just that. I'm finding that it's getting a little easier. He wants to go hang out with one of his friends tonite and I told him that letting him do that will just be a insecurity issue that I'll have to deal with. (Of course th OW and he meet at night) He didn't react negatively to my comment! He simply said that he understood! Talk about me being happy for a minute! <P>I think that as was said earlier, the OW has made an utter fool of herself and I've been calm. I pretty much figured that if I follow Plan A, everything will be ok. And so far, it's working to that affect. <P>I'll post later on today with another progress report.<P>P.S - JL - you really need to bottle up your wisdom & sell it! <P>Thanks for your advice & prayers,<BR>Vee

Vee,<P>You are doing really well. Keep it up. <P>JL<P>PS. Thanks for the compliment.

You are doing great! You must be superhuman. <P>If I were you, I would be absolutely adamant about one thing -- NO CONTACT WITH OW. The Harley's say that the WS will always try to negotiate continued contact or one more meeting....it can't end until that stops. This key excuse is ridiculous. Have the cops return it. Fed ex it to the house. Whatever. No meeting. And no partying out at night for him for awhile either, good call there.<P>You are a pillar of strength, and I'm sure he is amazed and impressed. Keep it up. But help him by safeguarding against temptations....like meetings with the OW and nights out alone.<BR><p>[This message has been edited by Mike C2 (edited June 16, 2000).]

Mike & JL<P>I don't know where I've gotten stregth, but sometimes I don't always feel that way. Ok, but here's a question, it's not like he's going to go to a club or wild party, he's supposed to go by one of his friend's house, since he just got back in town. My H would complain that I made him feel as if he was in prison. I'm sure that maybe he needs to leave home to get a little air. Now, I could totally do an LB and follow him! But, I don't want to do that. I need to feel as if I can restore some trust here. Can I impose a curfew? That would seem as if he were on parole instead of prison!<P>Truth be told, tomorrow I decided to go with one of my friends to one of those boring tupperware type shows, because I'm tired of thinking about this mess. I go to lunch, sit in the car and my mind starts going "what if ..., why didn't I ..", know what I mean?<P>Mike I do understand your point. And I am definetly still want that stupid key returned ASAP via mail or something. It seems like he's using the key to punish her. Does that sound strange? I don't know. If it's not returned by the time I get home, I'll probably starting counting backwards to regain my composure.

Vee,<P>Just remember all of this is just sorting out. His actions will not be real consistent for awhile. May even be some back sliding with contact. So you need to be cool. <P>Go do something to take your mind off of it like you said. Don't worry about his going to a friends house. No need for a curfew. He is a big boy and he has to lead his life.<P>I know there is that d--- trust issue . Well, you have been on the other end so you know how it feels to feel like you are the second class partner. <P>Finally, the "what if's..". Vee you know that what counts is the future. You cannot change the past, you can learn from the past, but not change it. In fact the only person you can change is you. Do the best you can in making you the person you want to be. Your H will have to address his issues and his behavior.<P>It just seems to me that he really does want you, rather than OW. But it will take awhile to sort out what he has done. You know he will have to deal with guilt, lose of face, and perhaps in his case the ever popular "moral high ground". <P>So don't try to fix everything at once. Do the things you want and let him do the same. I suspect you two will get ample time to address the issues and get your marriage right. So leave the key alone. He will address that when he is ready and able. <P>Have a good weekend, and smile . You are in much better shape than you realize.<P>God Bless,<P>JL

JL -<P>Thanks again. I really don't feel like dealing with the key issue. To me it's like the last little bit of the OW that is real. It's almost symbolic. Once the key is gone, that door can be locked and those items stashed away in a closet. <P>I must admit that he did ask me if I were ok with him going over to his friend's house and when I explained my reluctance but my need to deal with that insecurity, he said he understood. Also, you came into your marriage with blind faith, can't you sometimes try and use that blind faith to heal? If, I'm not comfortable with it tomorrow, I'll explain why in a non LB manner. <BR>But much like him, I need to get out of there. As a matter of fact, I may go to the movies and see 'The Skulls'. I heard it got rave reviews! I'll do my best on having a good weekend. <P>Thanks for the encouragement!<P>Vee<BR>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Vee:<BR><B>Ok, but here's a question, it's not like he's going to go to a club or wild party, he's supposed to go by one of his friend's house, since he just got back in town. </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Well, he was obviously supposed to be a lot of places in the last 6 months that he wasn't, right?<P>Take a read on this article: <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5060_qa.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5060_qa.html</A> <P>

Mike -<P>I understand your point, but I don't want him to feel like he's in prison. I think that it's healthy to do something outside of sit around with me all day and discuss this week's happenings. I've read SAA so I do understand about accounting for time your spouse spent away from you, but don't we still have a right to grieve, cry and reflect privately? <P>Also, last night he didn't go out. He stayed home and talked again about all of this week's events. I don't want my home to feel devoid of happiness when I'm here. It may get that way if we just sit and talk about it everyday. The 'key' issue is now resolved and all contact has finally ended. He said that the OW needed to feel as if she really put him through the same pain that he inflicted on her. <P>I'm pretty sure that this is all over. I've got some little personal insecurites to deal with, but we all have those. In order for me to deal with them, I have to let him do something without me. If not, I won't be able to regian my own confidence or even restore some trust.<P>Now, it's time to work on recovery. Anyone got any ideas on trying to make your home happy again?<P>Vee<p>[This message has been edited by Vee (edited June 17, 2000).]