Ok,<BR>For those of you who have been kind enough to follow all my long winded posts....<BR>Guess you are up-to-date that H and OW were in touch after our "wonderful" vacation and that he volunteered to send "the letter" as in SAA(after I caught him) - Yet, for various reasons, letter had still not been sent as to date. H gave me access to his voice mail. I happened to tune in today to hear OW telling him not to worry about his call yesterday evening, that her parents and brother were there, but not a problem. Also said she had not called him to leave a message earlier since she was "sick."(the ol' sympathy ploy - poor thing has had "major" surgery - couldn't call til 9 this am because she was throwing up!!! - liar, liar) I lost it!!! Told H when he called that we had some decisions to make, that I am tired of the lies, etc. - that he needs to be with her!!! I have offered this up numerous times - said he had promised after last week's contact that he would tell me when there was further contact, but he failed to tell me he had called her yesterday. Said he had checked in order to find out when she would be at work so he could send the "end-it letter" - well, I berated him for calling her, accused him of lying, yadayada yada.... He insists he wants me, NOT her - why else would he have given me access to voicemail, yadayada...<BR>So, I pick him up for lunch and he gives me the letter to give to a courier who then delivers to OW at work... of course, she had to call him and tell him she received it<BR>(left message on his voicemail) she agrees ,<BR>time for them to "refocus on their families,<BR>etc. (excuse while I throw up!!)<BR>sorry for hurting anyone(ha!!!! yeh, right...)and she will not call anymore.... Well, as you can imagine, I am not having a good day!! All sorts of things are running through my head: do I believe him? was her message a "plant"? will they just find more devious ways to be in touch? - H says he loves me, wants me, yea, yea, yea.... WHAT do I believe? Where do I go from here?? JUST when I thought it was "safe" to go back in the water....<BR>HELP!! A<BR>PS - Very tempted to call HER and confront...

PS<BR>H said "call her if you want..."

Annc, don't call her. I know how you feel. I made the mistake of calling after my husband told me that she kept leaving him voice mail messages at work (supposedly you cannot access his voice mail from another phone). I called her and asked her to stop calling my husband and her laughter still rings through my ears.<P>Believe your husband. If she is stupid enough to help him out with his wife by planting a message like that he probably wouldn't want her.<P>Take some deep breaths. It sounds like your husband is trying to put things back together again. I think that sometimes they are just not smart and don't make good decisions. I mean if this were me I think I would know how to get someone out of my life. They just don't seem to get it. <P>Continue to work with your husband and keep praying so the devil will go away!

Annc<P>Is it the time now to sit wait for some progress to begin?<P>Try and give your H some trust in not contacting the OW. You will surely find out soon enough if he has made contact.<P>It is now time to gather your strength and to give you the chance to think of where you need to go from here.<P>Dont contact the WO you may regret that decision. Dont give them the satisfaction of the taunt, what will the conversation gain anyway.<P>Your sarcasm is noted and dont let that lead to anger. As when we are angry our thought proceses change and we say things that will lead to LB's<P>Hang in there and buckle up for the next ride in your journey. <P>all the best for you<P>T

Annc,<BR>Hang in there... you and your H still making progress... Sounds like your H is really trying to work w/you. I wish my H is willing to work that much. You know, the fog isn't completely blown away yet, I guess WS really have hard time to cut OP off, probably feeling like cutting their hand off or something like that. (Cutting us too but they don't see that)<P>Those experts on this board must be off for vacation or something, I see lot of posts left w/0 response in GQ. Sorry I don't have wise advice to give you, just let you know I'm here...<P>BTW we're leaving for Seattle and Portland tomorrow til 8/1. We're trying to move out there this fall. This vacation/preparation for moving is with kids so it's not going to be very relaxing but at least far away from the OW and our town! I'll try to enjoy, like you did on your vacation, Annc. And I'd better be careful after the vacation, huh?<P>My H is supposed to be home by now but he isn't. Just about when I start getting a hope, he does things like this. It's so tiring, isn't it. But keep the faith, I'll miss you and confused33!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Annc:<BR><B>Said he had checked in order to find out when she would be at work so he could send the "end-it letter" - </B><P>Well, he was wtrong to not tell you, but he had a plausible excuse.<P>It sounds like the no contact letter was delivered perfectly and responded to perfectly. <P>Try to put yourself in his shoes, now. Contrast and compare your reaction with the OWs. You are angry, insecure, threatening to toss him out. She is secure, cooperative, calm, ready to take him or leave him. That is attractive to men.<P>Ann, he made a mistake by calling her and not telling you. If they have continued contact, you are sure to find out. Stay cool, rejoice in the no contact letter, and get back to Plan A!<P>Mike <BR>

yeah, what Mike said.<P>It sounds to me like he's making an honest effort. Her call to him was her part of ending it. A closure thing. She couldn't let it go without saying her final piece.<BR>

Thank you all for keeping me sane!!! and allowing me to vent...<BR>We went to dinner last night and had very good conversations - and, we both agreed we want to make our marriage better...so guess we are headed to recovery...<BR>God bless all of you - A

Go girl <P>lol<BR>Tim

I'm glad for you Annc....yeah, never give em the satisfaction of knowing they got you all worked up <P>Alien, things will get better, perhaps the move is the best thing for you and your family...

OK, need advice!!!!<BR>After discovering they had contact this week, just before sending the letter to OW, I made the comment to my H that I have been so tempted to call OW. He said "go ahead" if you want to. Didn't call but I emailed her that "we need to talk". She replied yesterday "No need to talk. He ended it." Debated about sending a reply to the effect of "Agree. Hope you will respect H's wishes/request to never contact him again." Yet, never sent it. Got another email from her last night - "What do we need to talk about?" Have not replied - Should I? What do y'all recommend?????? Help!<BR>A

Ann, no, no, no. Do not call her. Do not communicate with her. Do not giveher that kind of power over your relationship with your H. It's bad enough the wonderings you are having to suffer without giving her the opportunity to add more lies to what your H has already told you. Somewhere recently I responded to another question about this. Remember my horrible experience in contacting the OW. Remember how mad it made me that he would prefer this scheming manipulative sexy b**** to me. Trust me, you don't want to open that can of worms. Then, if she contacts your H like this girl did to say, "Oh, look, I got this e-mail from your wife. I really don't want to hurt her, but I just don't know what to do." (Yeah, right, but she didn't have a problem writing a small book that just turned a knife in my heart with every word about how much my H loved her instead of me.) Ooooh, so much for no contact, and for some strange reason, she comes out looking like the better person while you end up looking sad and pathetic in your H's eyes. Now, I know I have told you all this before, but obviously you need to hear it again. I have read that letter so many times, I have it burned on the insides of my eyelids. Don't do this to yourself. Honestly, let time erase the desire for this. Trust me, you don't want this kind of pain. Let it go. Don't answer her question. Let it drive her crazy that she doesn't know if you two are making it or not. Okay?

Thank You, L!!!! You are right - I just needed for you to reinforce how stupid it would be. I was going to answer her email with "I agree there is no need to talk, and I hope you respect H's wish to never contact him again." But then, I got her second email, after she has just said "no need to talk" saying "What do we need to talk about?" Had really decided I should ignore it, but you have reinforced it for me that it would be major mistake to give her the satisfaction of a reply. Better to drive her crazy, right?? Although there is a part of me that would so love to lecture or blast her!!! Thank you for your help!!!! I do hope she goes away...<BR>Take care...A (:

.<p>[This message has been edited by ohmy_marie (edited June 23, 2001).]

Good going, Annc. Now, I don't mean to say that you can't write out letters or yell at her as if she were there. I could write a book of all the things I mentally said to her. Just don't do it! If you feel the need again, just post or e-mail me. I'll be happy to remind you why you shouldn't contact her. I would send you the e-mail she sent me, but it would probably make you ill. I think she is a really disturbed person.<P>Did I ever tell you I got the "If he is meant to be yours, set him free. If he comes back to you than he is yours, if he doesn't then be happy that he has found happiness elsewhere."Now, I'm paraphrasing a bit, but you get the picture. Did that not just make me think, well maybe I should just let him run to her. Ooooh. Totally what she wants.<P>On the bright side, she talked like she felt my H and her were soulmates. I asked my H if he felt she was his soulmate. He replied that he didn't really believe in all that soulmate stuff. So, maybe he's starting to come out of the darkness. He still wants to be with her, but maybe one day he will see her for the weak person that she really is.<p>[This message has been edited by Lapeine (edited July 21, 2000).]

Marie and Lapeine,<BR>Thank you for your advice and encouragement - ok, you will probably fuss at me for this...I am ready to take my medicine. Ha! I did email her back, and just quoted her "No need to talk. He ended it." - that's it. Will not contact again - promise! <BR>Still wondering about physical intimacy issues...H seems to still be struggling in that dept. Marie, did your H go through same thing? My H keeps telling me to "relax, it will come, don't worry, etc." - I wonder if "she" is in the bedroom with us and if that is affecting his desire right now - it is hard to be patient and understand. Can't help but wonder if she was "better", etc. - did any BS's struggle with these feelings? <BR>take care - A

Oh, Annc, yes. I know I felt that way and occaisionally still do. Now, my H has never told me exactly what they did. But, I have learned a few things. I try very hard to do the things that I know that he didn't do with her. So, I do those as often as possible because I can remind myself that he didn't do that with her. I pretty much think that she was better in the things they did because H hasn't told me she wasn't therefore it must be true. I do compare myself to her a lot physically. I come out sadly lacking in my own mind. Of course, he says that one weekend isn't enough to make a comparison. Now, I just don't buy that, so she must be better. Of course, it could be that it is because he loves her so they have the intimacy between them.<P>Realistically, I don't want to be like her. I don't want to chase after a married man. I think that is a major lack or morals and integrity. Not to mention low self esteem from her recent divorce and fear of being alone (which she says she doesn't have, but her actions say otherwise).<P>Now, my H says he doesn't think about her when we are having sex. That just makes me want to have sex all the more! Recently, however, I have been having this horrible desire to kiss someone else. No one specific, I just want that first intimate romantic kiss back. I so want those feelings of being loved by another person. My got to experience it recently, why can't I? If my H would decide that he wants to love me, we could have that kiss, but who knows if that will ever happen.<P>Why doesn't my H love me? Does he really love her? Does he even know what love is? Just questions to ponder.

Hi Annc,<P>Been out of town for awhile, get back check in here and what do I see? You are up to no good again. Not really, just kidding you.<P>Don't bother with OW, Annc. She is not your problem. Your problem is to get the marriage back on track. It sounds as if it will, OW is just going to have to deal with her withdrawal alone. Sounds good doesn't it? <P>Did you ever finish reading the book I recommended? Did anything in it surprise you or was it pretty much as you suspected? Men are easy to figure out. <P>Just remember it is hard for your H not to respond to OW, but it seems from your post he really isn't attracted to her any longer. Just keep making yourself the attractive alternative and make sure that you reward honesty. This is not the same as punishing dishonesty you know. Keep telling him you can handle the honesty but not the dishonesty. A little brainwashing is required her. <P>Take care you are doing well.<P>JL

Lapeine,<P>I read your post and thought I would offer you some things to think about. Don't avoid the things that your H and OW did. Reclaim them as you own. Do the things you enjoy doing and your H will notice.<P>Lapeine, I can't speak for all men, but I am an experienced man. Men don't compare women the way you think. Yes, women can be good in bed and they can be bad in bed, but men really only classify at that level, not so much in the details. <P>What men do remember is enthusiasm. I have used that word so many times on this board when posting to women. It is the one thing that men truely really really appreciate. An enthusiastic partner really impresses men. A partner who enjoys what a man is doing to her and lets him know also turns men on.<P>If you enjoy being with your H, let him know. If you enjoy something he does to you or for you let him know. You will wipe his memory clean of the OW. <P>Don't worry about him comparing so much. I know it is natural and men surely worry about W comparing more than women do, but ultimately he has chosen you. If you want to have an enjoyable sex life, enjoy sex. It really is that easy. Don't go into worrying about the OW, just go into it to enjoy it for yourself. I know this sounds selfish, but men really do like to see their partners enjoying sex. They take it as a compliment and it is feed back for their efforts. <P>So my advice, ENJOY. Don't think. You will find the more you enjoy the experience the more your H will enjoy it as well.<P>Hope this helps.<P>God Bless,<P>JL

Thank you, JL. Coming from someone who has only really had sex with her H, this is good info. I never compare my H to former boyfriends because I never really did near as much with them as I have done with my H.<P>And, I do do the things I enjoy. I just try to do the things they didn't do more (added bonus, I really like those things). I am really trying to keep a variety up. Our sex life had gotten very stale. Things started to wake up a bit after I got off the pill, but I guess not enough for H to realize that I enjoyed it. It was just getting to be the same old thing and I really longed for some of the variety that we had first in our marriage.<P>I don't think about them together so much now. It is more like he slept with an old HS girlfriend (which he did), but I think about it as something distant. The hard thing for me is the emotional feelings that he is going through--the "I don't know what I want." I am really starting to hate the phrase "I don't know"<P>Thanks for your comment. If my H can not think about her during sex maybe I can quit thinking about her. It really has lessened and it only happens occaisionally--usually when he starts concentrating on one area for a long time and my mind starts to wonder to "I wonder if they did this. I wonder if she enjoyed this. I wonder if she looked better from that angle." So, I guess I should tell my H not to keep me on my toes, so my mond doesn't have time to wander.