Hello, <BR> <BR>Im male 24 and have been married just over 6 years.. I found out 6 weeks ago sunday that my wife has been cheating on me over the course of a 3 year stretch.. Kinda on for a year off for a year on for a year.. We have 2 kids ages 5 and 3.. My wife is 25, 6 months older then me. We are trying to work things out and your web site has help some but I still have issues that need to be resolved and I am hoping you kind people can help out in this department... WARNING I can be very long winded so please bare with.<BR> <BR>3 years ago my wife started going to country bars to sing and hanging around some very immoral people.. I seen it was trouble and tryed to point it out but to no good. I didnt have a problem with her going to sing but it was her friends and the drinking that sometimes came with... Well her friends found it cool I guess to sleep around and my wife like to be in the spot light.. I will add I HATE Country music and the red neck drunkin stab you in the back life style so I stayed home. (Besides I was the cheapest baby sitter ever.) <BR> <BR>Sometime in this span she ended up sleeping with her best friends husband.. He was an ongoing thing for guessing a year.. I worked evening hours and eventualy went to GraveYard shift for more money. When I came home I relaxed by playing on the computer and chatting and such. That way I would have something to do while my wife went to sing and such.. I will admit when she was home and I was on the computer I was often hard to talk to cause reading and listening at the same time was hard for me.. <BR> <BR>Anyway Many Many Many nights I would come home and my wife would be gone to the bar and there to welcome me home was an old fat fuzzy man with BO.. Not very cuddly in my opinion and Not who I wanted to come home to. Well anyway She was out alot. And I watched the kids and played on the computer.. During this time she was sleeping with her best friends husband Then in competition with her good bar friend she slept with a guy who is known to sleep with nearly anything.. My wifes tubes are tied and were then so we dont have any 'extra' kids. She also had a one night stand with a guy that basicly forced himself on her and instead of leaving the situation she gave in to him.. The funny thing is on That night she and her friend were suppose to run to the store 2 blocks away and fetch something Dont remember what... My wife made it home 7 hours later.. We had a blow up even then but she never revealed she was cheating on me.. <BR> <BR>Well after the house was paid for I quit my job due to stress at work and we mutualy decided I should stay home and raise the kids while she worked.. Remember this was a mutaul decision not me being an [censored]. I have always had more pacientce for the kids then she has and was a decent house keeper (Though after awhile I slacked off.. ALOT) Well she still had her affair with her friends husband for awhile longer then for some reason it just stopped... Not sure when or why.. She stopped cheating on me for a long while but never told me anything.. She was still going out.. I also got rid of the PC during this timeline as well. Well then she got a new job in August and I was bored sitting at home 24/7 (She was still doing the bar scene all along with few breaks) So we got a new PC around this time as well. So I was on the PC ALOT again but would get off whenever she got home Then it hit me that she wants me to jump off the PC at her whim and that was just wrong of her so in spite I would stay on when she got home at times or at very least wouldnt just jump when she came in.. I would finish what I was doing then get off. Sometimes that would take an hour... Well she then felt lonely and started a new affair with an old friend and she was gone all the time.. She came home drunk alot and on weekends especially didnt come home till 6am. (The nights she was at her lovers house) This continued till June 25 2000 when she got home from church and woke me up to tell me she had been cheating on me.. My worst nightmare come true and in my face. She told me everything and we are trying to work things out, but I have been faced with alot of questions and trials that I cant answer or find the fix to.. <BR> <BR>See my wife was a virgin when we got together and my BIGGEST boast about her is she never been with anyone but me.. Now I find its a big lie and 3 years of our marrage has been lies on top of lies. And all my efforts to keep our marriage pure and my wife inoccent has all been ruined. I dont know how to accept or deal with her lose of inoccence.. I dont know whats special about her anymore now that what I had found SOOOOO Special is now gone. Even if she can be the good girl she was that part of her she can never regain and I dont know how to deal with that. Also the events of our marriage over the last 3 years, I have a hard time telling what was real and what wasnt.. Like we had a very very special 5 year aniversery and 3 months later she was having her latest afair. <BR> <BR>Oh during this last year she also got drunk and had a one night stand as well.. On her Birthday which wasnt that long ago we were broke because she spent half our bill money every payday just about So with me having no job I couldnt get her anything nice So on her birthday she went to her lovers house and slept with him and stayed with him till morning..<BR> <BR> I wonder about every special event over the last 3 years and what it REALLY was. She doesnt have all the answers mostly due to not able to remember.. I am also having problems with my anger.. I WANT VENGANCE!!! Against her and her lovers, with 2 I have wrote letters to telling them what they have done to me (since obviously they didnt care about me at all) 2 others I wont be able to find but her friends husband burns me Soooo bad. He has had many affairs on his wife and feels little to no remorse for any of them. For some reason he tells his wife years after the affairs but then starts new affairs shortly after. I know a letter to him wont mean a thing. Him and I were also friends and it just blows me away how he could do this to me and my family.. He did aproach my wife first.. Hurting him emotionaly is near impossable and I dont really feel up to jail time so hurting him physically is out on top of it hurting his wife. Not sure how to get him.. As for vengance against my wife I have been considering returning the favor.. I have no desire to cheat on her, I dont really want too but I feel like I will have justice if I do and that if I am to screw up NOW is the time. Okay well thats my thoughts and problems and rantings.. It does go way deeper then this but I wont go any further for now..<BR> <BR> <BR>Hello this is his wife. We felt it would be better if we told both sides of the story. I have <BR>cheated on my husband with 5 other men over the past 3 years. My reasons for this mainly<BR>were because I felt very lonely. I realize that at first it was not his fault that he had to <BR>work, but when he came home I felt like he did not have time for me. So I started to <BR>frequent bars. I go out with friends and sing this gave me attention that I so greatly <BR>craved. I felt like it began to get worse and worse with our home situation so I began to <BR>stay out more.<BR> <BR>We fought alot and when the situation arose with my friends husband he and I both were <BR>having marital problems (or so he told me). I also found out shortly after that my husband <BR>had taken nude pictures of a girl friend of mine and she had taken nude pictures of him also.<BR>Although he never slept with her I felt very betrayed and I left him. Within a week we were<BR>back together. <BR> <BR>This new information made me feel even less wanted. The fact that I am not a skinny<BR>woman and this friend of mine was made me feel even worse. So it made it easier for me <BR>to cheat. I did not do this for spite it was mostly due do the fact that I wanted to feel<BR>attractive.<BR> <BR>After a while I began to feel very bad about the relationship with my friends husband and <BR>I stopped going to their home. I could barely look at my friend. So then I found someone <BR>new to fill the void. That turned out to be a short lived thing so I still needed the attention <BR>that I felt I was not getting at home. So I had a one night stand.<BR> <BR>My husband had started spending all of his free time on the computer and I felt very unwanted.<BR>I would try to get him to come watch tv with me or something to that effect. He would always <BR>say just let me finish this up and I will be right there. He never came. This was about the <BR>same time in August when I started a new job. I had met a man through some friends who had<BR>tried on several other occasions to get me to sleep with him. I kept refusing. Then just before<BR>I started my new job we began seeing each other. <BR> <BR>This went on for about a year. When I realized this was not the way I wanted to live my life.<BR>I was neglecting my children and my home life, but mostly my husband. I know I have hurt him<BR>greatly and I really want to work our problems out. Sometimes I am not sure what to say or <BR>even how to say it. I have trouble showing emotions sometimes. I feel that I could definately<BR>use some help with this part. I have looked over all of this and realize that alot of things I <BR>simply did not want to see as they really were or the attention would have had to stopped.<BR>I should not have expected my husband to drop everything on nights that I did decide to stay<BR>home. He is truly a very wonderful man and I love him very much I forgive him for taking <BR>pictures of my friend I even forgive her. I feel what I have done is so much worse because <BR>I did more than just look or take pictures. This is my side of the story I have told everything<BR>according to the way I felt at the time of the events. I appreciate any help that you can <BR>give us to help with our problem.<BR> <BR> <BR>Husband - In closing of both our positions on the same events I do wish to add that we are working things out but its slow and relentless at times. I havent been able to sleep well in weeks nor has she. I have been telling her how I feel and trying to explain everything Im going through my own guilt and hers.. I love my wife and always have. I never imagined that my sweet inoccent wife would do anything like this, wich is the reason I allowed her so much room to explore.. I never thought she would cross the line because even when I had a nude girl infront of me I couldnt do anything with her.. I do hope you can help us in these stages of our healing and I thank you much for myself and my wife for the webpage you have.. It has helped especialy her, alot.<BR> <BR> Signed <BR> MM (husband) & JM (wife)<P>

FyreStorm,<P>I read you post this morning and have been thinking about it all day. I really don't know where to start. First, I think you will find this MB board very useful. I hope that you both spend a lot of time reading here. If you go and look further in this section you will find a greeting from NSR. Within that greating there are bookmarks to many very useful items on this board and past postings that were particularly insightful.<P>I suspect NSR will come by and post to you as well.<P>As for your, issues, there are so many, yet the story is very much the same as is posted here over and over. Please read the postings on the infidelity section and you will see many things.<P>MM, I know you are still deciding if you want this marriage to continue. I surely don't blame you. However, if you do decide to work on the marriage, please read about Plan A. It is to get the spouse back into the marriage, but it offers some strategies that may help rebuild the love of your wife for you. <P>Both of you ought to read the 4 rules for a happy marriage. It is clear you both violated those consistently. The state of the marriage before the affairs, is both of your faults. You need to assess that decide what to fix and go to work changing your behaviors.<P>JM: I don't know where to begin. It seems from your post that you don't really love your H. He will have to do much work there. It also seems as if you found adultery a perfectly acceptable way to address you loneliness. However, I sense that more was going on. Your singing was an outlet and you let that coupled with the life style get to you and you liked it. I don't sense much remorse for what you have done. <P>I know you are realizing what it did to your family, but I don't think you have a clue how much damage you have done. You are not alone, most betrayers don't; just read here. You are going to have to understand why you have done this and not just say I wasn't happy. Your H is going to somehow find it in him to forgive you and then learn to trust you. This is not likely to happen unless you can provide him some reasons for your behavior and confidence that this behavior can be addressed. Otherwise, everytime you don't "like" the situation you may well head off for another affair. <P>Since there wasn't just one affair, but 5 affairs, this is going to take a lot of work on your part.<P>If you two aren't seeing a counselor I would strongly suggest you do so. So much damage has been done. Yet, I will tell you that your marriage can be revived and rebuilt, but it will be hard, long and painful. It doesn't sound very exciting does it? But I know, MM, is in the worst pain of his life right now, so it may not seem all that bad.<P>JM and MM the first thing that has to happen is that you two need to decide if you really want to work on this marriage. MM you may think you do but as this settles in believe me you are going to really resent what has been done. You can get through it, but it will be tough. JM, if you have a conscience at all and you decide to repair this marriage, you will feel guilt such as you have never felt it.<P>I haven't painted a very pretty picture, but your situation is not very good either. The tools are here for you two to rebuild your marriage. It will take <B> time and patience </B>. If you stay around here long you will hear those words over and over again.<P>So keep reading and posting, the people here will do their best to help you. Plus please consider counseling.<P>God Bless You Both,<P>JL<P>

MM - Husband<P>I do so much want our marriage to work but some of the pains and torment of her not being pure to me anymore is horrid in every way. We talk daily about the problims we face and we are slowly slowly working through alot of it. Yes we do need a counceler and are currently doing the counseler window shopping as we speak.. But I see there is some confusion in our post because it was wrote to hit the hurting points and not the WHOLE story.. I will go into further detail her...<P>This all started about 6 months after my wife had her tubes tied. We fought like all couples do about little things, Usualy money. I dont expect to have everything but I expect to pay the bills ALWAYS. SO there was the fights. Not enough money to go have fun. We were paying for the house and a car or 2 at the time if I remember right on top of a 6 month old girl, I had just transferd departments so I could get better hours where me and my wife could do things more. But Im not a social person really and after dealing with ignorant people all evening I didnt want to go out and listen to music I have hated sence childhood and see people that's presents turn my stumach on sight. I went afew times but it was usualy a real chore to get a baby sitter so usualy I would stay home and watch the kids. My wife was a good church girl up till about this time so I trusted her with all my heart, she had only been with me and I have always been very open with her about how I feel about things. I didnt mind she go out and sing Though I didnt care for what she was singing where she was singing and I didnt care for her friends. I have always been a good judge of character and new these people had very bad potential for a girl that didnt have much of a life before me as far as fun goes. Of corse I told her how I felt and what I seen but 'she new what she was doing' she would say. SHe wouldnt go to far. I also always said Dont be drinking without me. SHe always said 'I know how far to push it. I know my limits and wont cross it.' Well though I didnt like it much I aloud it. SHe needed her fun to.. Around the same time I got a PC and started chatting and playing RPGs on there which I guess kinda gave me the attention I needed when my wife was out. It was kinda my spot light while hers was Singing. I also understood that she was a shelterd child and wasnt allowed to go out and have fun like most people did. SO I let her have her fun and always prayed It wouldnt go to far, I had alot of faith in her but deep down I had some doubts cause I had never really seen this side of her before. When we first met I was the rebel without a clue looking for that perfect girl to straten me out. Now it seems the roles are reversed. ANyway I got invaled in some of the porn chat rooms and there were always requests for pictures. Well I thought my moral wife would never let me do such a thing and Man if these girls could drewl over me that would be a big ego boost for me. Very seldom in my life was I complemented for how I looked.. I was always the sweet guy they wouldnt date but would come to as a friend.. Set up many girls I liked up with other guys.. Anyway so the pictures happen and I felt like it was no big thing because I didnt sleep with the girl BUT I new that my wife would be upset. When she found out she went totaly balistic!! I new she would be mad but Geez! I had no clue she would be this mad! She left me because she didnt know what to do and thats what her great bar friends suggested.. Well about the same time she started her affair with her best friends husband I guess they only slept together once before she found out about the pictures. I dont really understand how she could go totaly balistic on me when she was doing far worse with a far worse person. Though she thought I slept with her and given the apearance I could see why. Well after her blowup, leaving then coming back after I went to get her, (SHe was only gone 1 night) I was very very very willing to let her do just about anything she wanted and didnt feel I had much room to argue given Me being in the dog house big time. Alittle after this I Transerferd again to a position that paid alot more money, but the bad part was it was graveyard shift. Well I would come home and the kids would wake shortly after. My wife would have me watch the kids till about noonish so she could sleep in. Then I went to bed and usualy tried waking about 6ish I would get up shower and get ready for work and play on the PC for awhile wich was addictive for me but some times She was already starting to get ready for her night out at the bar.. I didnt know it then but she was still sleeping with her best friends husband and also seeing afew one night stands as well.. One of wich she slept with because he was ' a smooth talker' and ' She was competing against her attention hog friend' that was after this guy as well.. Well I did my duty's at work and home and put in alot of overtime due to equipment failures and new personel all the time to be trained. I was the crue leader so I got the job of making up for anything done wrong and was usualy the last to leave. Finaly the house was paid for and I had had enough of that job and this was my first practical opritunity to leave. The equipment was fixed the personel was as trained as they were going to get and I had enough of the overtime and the managers power trips to keep me at work even longer then nessisary. So I quit the job sence we could aford it now and still have some spending money left over. Well My wife said she was bored with staying at home all the time and wanted to work. She didnt like the responsabilty of Having to work though but she picked it as the lesser of the 2 evils. SO I stayed at home and raised the kids and she went to work.. Her affairs took a break around this time for some reason. We had freinds that were down on there luck move in and we tryed helping them on there feet.. My wife still went to the bars but not as much and sometimes even not going for months at a time. I got rid of the computer about this time too.. This lasted for about a year and she went to a better paying job. Income tax just came in and she had started going to the bars on weekends alot. So I got a new PC and with the new toy I was on it alot but when my wife would come home I was off it in a flash.. Then she started staying out later so I stayed on the PC more. Later she was out the later I was on the PC. Then I started resenting that she expected me to drop my spotlight when she wanted me to so I might pay attention to her.. It wasnt she wanted to spend time with me she wanted to watch TV while I paid attention to her.. Once I reliesed this it made me mad so I stopped being so willing to jump at her beck and call.. Things got really bad for us then. I felt all she wanted me for was a house cleaner, baby sitter and that was about it. SHe felt I just wanted her to pay the bills and have sex. We hardly seen each other during that time wich lasted about mmmm 4 to 6 months I think. Even before that Bad spot she had already started up her affairs again, Occasionaly with her best friends husband at first then with her latest wich lasted the rest of the time.. She was always drunk always gone and always wanting to go out.. If I had looked harder I could have seen the signs but instead I pushed it out of my mind remembering the girl I fell inlove with, No she knows the limits she wouldnt go that far.. She continued this affair till 2 days before she told me.. I can deal with the pain and most of the depression but the anger and disapointment wont go away.. I am mad that no one not even my wife thought of me. No one told me. No one even gave me the option to denie and reject what they said. Im mad that she did this without thought or reguard for me. I understand but it doesnt help the anger when I can see other ways that could have happen but will never be tested due to her ' Im going to take the easy road' state of mind. Im dissapointed and hurt that I can no longer feel she is mine and only mine like when she was innocent and pure to only me. There is anger there too.. But thats my side of the story... <P>JM - Wife<P>first of all i would like to say that i do feel alot of remorse. there is hardly a minute goes by that i am not wishing there <BR>were some kind of time machine that I could use to go back and stop myself from doing these terrible things. The letter that was first sent told how I felt at the time not the way i feel now. I look back on this now and think how could i do this and why didnt I try harder for his attention and no one else. I realize there are no good reasons or that there really are no excuses for what I have done. I feel like I have made the biggest mistake of my life and that the person i thought was so bad is the one person i dont think i can live without. I feel selfish even saying that. I told him just the other day that i would do anything that he asked me to do even if it meant letting him go out and cheat on me i am trying not to be so selfish. I have trouble telling him how i feel now and why at the time that i did those things because i am afraid of hurting him more. I do not want him to think any of this is his fault. I am the one who made the bad choices he did the best he could with what I gave him. I feel very selfish even asking for his forgiveness now. but as I said before i do not know what i would do without him. He is the one person that has always stood up for me and been there when i needed him for anything. I feel like not only have i hurt my love but I hurt my best friend. I hope this gives you a little more insight as to how I feel i will be the first to admit that this is my fault. <BR>I will also be the first to admit that I have always taken the easy road out of my problems. but now I want to be the best wife i can be for MM I want to be someone that he can be proud to be married to. I want us to get back in church as I am confident God can help us grow stronger. I realize this may sound selfish and once again I am sorry for that but I do feel a great remorse and hurt for what I have done. <P>MM - Well Thats all from us for now but we will be looking forward to replies. We will take all the help we can get! Thanks for responding!

.<p>[This message has been edited by BamaAngst (edited August 24, 2000).]

FyreStorm,<P>Well from reading your last posting, it seems you do want to make this work. If you haven't read any books, the book that everyone swears by around here is "Surviving an Affair" By Dr. Harley. If you have found NSR's general post look under books. It will be there as well as others that people have found to be useful.<P>You two are in for a long road to recovery, but it is encouraging that you are talking and expressing your feelings to one another. One thing that is stressed here is the concept of total honesty. This is a very important thing to rebuilding the marriage as you might well imagine. But one thing that is hard to grasp is that means telling your spouse the answer to their questions even if it will hurt. <P>You see "protecting" their feelings by not telling them things, is really lying. JM your H didn't ask you if you were having an affair with men of the men that you did. But by not telling him you were being very dishonest, and he doesn't trust much of what you have said since he found out. It will take time to rebuild that trust.<P>JM, I am curious. I got the impression from your postings that you came home one day and told your MM about your affairs. What made you do that and why did you do it?<P>Do you two know how to nagvigate around this board? If not let mention a few things. You can do searchs by clicking on the search words on the upper right of the general listings of posts. You can see what people have posted in the past by clicking on the sun glasses and then on the red line in the upper left that says something like past posts. You can edit a post by clicking on the first scroll to the right of the sun glasses.<P>I must leave now but please find and read NSR's postings to you. Keep posting and keep talking to one another. There is much to work through, but you two can do it if you really want to.<P>God Bless,<P>JL<P>If you click on this book mark it will take you to NSR's information.<BR><A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/000002.html" TARGET=_blank> NSR </A><p>[This message has been edited by Just Learning (edited August 03, 2000).]

Oh the computer time for me ( MM ) Is down to the bare minumum. I dont play games or chat any more so I dont get stuck in the VR world like I once did. Matter of fact I cant even MAKE myself play as I did ever sence I found out about all this and how much my computer time allowed me to overlook things that were obvious. I guess I resent the computer some and now its seen more as a tool instead of an entertainment source. Now my entertainment time is spent souly with my wife and kids. I dont have any real hobbies besides the PC so at times its kinda boring but thats when I focus on my wife more though thats all I think of and really all I have thought about even before I found out. YThe computer was my outlet to take my mind off of my doubts and suspitions and a way to get attention too. I guess you could say I REALLY learned my lesson there.. My wife is with me all of the time now and now she listens to me alot more as well though I do tend to catch her not listening but Im quick to point it out.. SHe doesnt see me as a 'father' figure out to ruin her fun anymore. Im more of a teacher or protector wishing to help.. I always did this she just seen it as 'The old grumps paranoid and wanting to ruin my fun.' That I believe has changed and I see at times that she is really trying to grasp what I say. I can see it in her eyes and face that she not only hears me but is listening.. She remebers things I said back Then and now wishes she would have seen what I was trying to do instead of her outlook. Her old actions have stopped and I believe she means what she says ' This will never happen again.' But I have doubts. My thinking is ' Ive seen she was weak whats if she becomes weak again? What if she forgets the lessons we have learned?' I can say with all honesty that if it does ever happen again all bets are off. I wont go through this pain and torment EVER again. There will be a devorce. <P>Right now we are trying to keep the kids out of this situation as we work through our troubles.. Once we have things strate then we will have tuns of time to get our work right with the kids. Okay Okay We are helping them along too but we are currently trying to fix ourselves more so. The kids only suffer when things get harry with me and my wife and they wanna come in and fix it and make it all better. We then have to push them away so they are not exposed to the arguements. I wont call them fights. Its very rare that eather of us yell at each other. I can only think of 2 times in the last month that I have gone off and the kids were totaly out of range of hearing. <BR>Even though I have anger in me about all this I dont try to allow it to come out in negitive ways.. I explain how I feel and why most of the time. It did get the better of me 2 times that I can think of in wich I yelled and cussed and called my wife everything but flaming dog poo. <P>She is alot better then she was and every day it seems we make some progress. Though she has a hard time finding words to match her feelings. I have always been open and honest with my wife though and didnt relise how bad it was for her because she didnt know what to say or how to say it. And I do believe with all my heart that IF I can find away to deal with the lose of innocents and the anger tward her lovers and her then I will be fine and able to make this marriage work. Trust will be the last issue to face on that road. I trusted and she failed but that will take time and will come back Yet I wont be so laxed and wont be able to push away doubts when she comes home late from work or something.. I will have to check and make sure there are credable people to back her story.. ANd when I find she was truthful then the trust wil be restored alittle more.. Now if I find out she lied End of story. Before it was innocent till PROVEN Guilty. Now its reversed. but with time im sure that will change. Thank you again for your reply and your advice. It has been taken to heart by us both.

<small>[ January 31, 2005, 10:28 PM: Message edited by: hanora ]</small>

Thank you for your replies and sorry so slow for responding again but JM has come up ill and will be even slower responding then me ( MM) I spent most of the time last night and today reading everything recomended for reading and will be ordering the book Surviving an Affair.. After reading through Plan A we have found we have already done that on our own but there was a small difrence. In my wifes 'goodbye' letter she didnt make it very clear and the OTHER man ended up calling her at work. SHe then told him that she chose family over him wich kinda bugged me because it implies that she was consernd about the kids and it didnt have much to do with me really.. But at the time she was going through withdraw in away so its like she closed the door but cept the key to the door just in case. She is over that now BUT feels she doesnt want to do a New goodbye letter because she doesnt want to dredge it up again and feels it might cause more harm by making the wound fresh for the OTHER man.. This guy also lives in the same town we do less then 5 miles away wich kinda worries me. One of the men she was with in the past is now married so I find him to be less of a threat but who knows. And her best friends husband lives about 30 miles away BUT in the same town as her mother sooo. I dont think she would do that but in times of weakness who knows? <P>Anyway about the computer problim. Yes it caused trouble, we traded trouble my PC use vs her constant going out. DIFRENCE She got drunk constantly. I played games. She had affairs, I played games. SHe wasnt there for the kids, I was. Yes I didnt make the situation better but I feel I didnt make it worse eather. I was there and would have listend if aproached but when aproached I was yelled at and made to look like the bad person she wanted me to be wich justified in her mind the affairs. She sees that was wrong now and sees what she should have done but really I dont see what I could have done. I was there, I was avalible 24/7 and I was always willing to talk (Not defend myself) If she simply would have said I need you I would have roase to teh occasion and been happier for it. But instead I was told how bad I was for being on the PC when she came home and I should feel privilaged she came home to be adored by me. Now if it would have been more like I want to be with YOU I want US to be together then fine and great but when its You should drop what your doing and come adore me while I sit and watch TV, i dont think so. That just kicks in the defensive stance and the fights on. By the time I was really doing that anyway I was losing hope. We would fight about her going out all the time and she would say 'Yes I will stop and be home with you.' wich usualy lasted a week then back to the same old crap. I can remember at least 10 confruntations like this over the 3 years in wich she admited she wasnt being a very good wife or mother and would stay home. The last of these fights she went out the very next night and that made my heart drop into my stomach.. I tryed telling her what was going on but she couldnt see it, it was easier to avoid it then deal with it. Then I feel into a depression inwich the PC was my life besides the kids and let my wife do whatever she wanted to with no arguement. ALl she wanted was me to be here and care for the kids. I had basicly given up.. I finaly seen that no matter how much I fight it. No matter how much I hated it, no matter how much it hurt she would still do what she wanted and there wasnt a damned thing I could do about it. The kids love there mom to death and Im the second class person in the family because Im the inforcer that makes them mind, Momma was never home so they adored her whenever they got the chance. even now with her always home they are like that. Dads mean Momma is great.. I do understand why but it doesnt make it easier being the reject of the family. My wife rejected me for others and my kids reject me for there mom. <P>Wow I got way off topic there didnt I? Sorry.. <P>But Yes the PC was a trouble spot but it was to occupy the time my wife was out and when I was rejected that hard it became my soul sorce of attention. I DO NOT feel it is the same though. I did not degrade myself like she did. the PC was like her singing but the PC stopped there. I got my attention fix and though people wanted to meet me I would never go there. I played games like Jedi Knights and Ultima Online and I played on MUCKs at times The porn chat was very short lived and didnt really apeal to me much, I just wanted to be admired from a distance and did so the safest way possable. Yes I feel the pictures were wrong of me and did hurt us but it wasnt like I was getting net dates or anything and cybersex is just lame to me. " Oh baby Oh baby more, oh yes." What a joke hehehe. The few times I tryed it I felt totaly stupid. Most of the time I would turn it into a big joke where I would be siting back laughing at these people that were typing. Then I would do something like " I rub my hand down your thigh and *plllthhhh* Ooops sorry that was the tacos from earlier today." I couldnt get into it nor take it seriously. ANyway I will go for now. Hope this helped more.. gotta see about getting that book and we are looking into counseling.

Hi kids...<P>It's quite a story. I would suggest that in addition to the Suriving an Affair book, that you get nearly the entire Harley library (hey, I did). Lovebusters, Give and Take, and His Needs/Her Needs. These are listed in the order you're going to need them. In addition, I spent quite some time using the MarriageBuilders phone counseling with Steve Harley (888-639-1639)---it's extremely convenient, reasonably priced, and most importantly---EFFECTIVE! I'd suggest that you might want to try it.<P>MM: As the betrayed husband, I can sympathize with your pain. My wife only had one affair, but we separated (I left her and my two children), and she ended up pregnant (I now have three children). <P>But...<P>If I dared to sit and compare how her sins were so much worse than mine---I'd be divorced right now, and rightfully so.<P>MM---you seem to suffer from "lovebuster-itis". I see tons of disrespectful judgements in your posts. Being "right" in a marriage is the booby prize---you really want your wife to love you with all her heart. To do that, you must exhibit the right behaviors for her to love you:<P>1. Protection---elimination of all lovebusters (selfish demands, disrespectful judgements, angry outbursts, dishonesty)<P>2. Care---you must meet her important emotional needs, in the way that she would like them met.<P>3. Honesty---you both need to be completely honest with each other, but in a way in which you don't lovebust. It's tough right now, because a lot of your "honesty" will focus on painful stuff. You need to learn how to express it appropriately, and then take steps together to correct the behaviors that caused the problem.<P>4. Time---you must spend quality time with each other. <P>These are the "four rules" for a successful marriage. It's likely that if you can learn the skills behind them, you'll be successful as parents, in your work, and everywhere else. I'd suggest that you take the time to learn them---because you both profess a willingness to work on recovery, I'd say you have a great chance to have a terrific marriage. But I also see so many issues that I'd STRONGLY URGE professional guidance and coaching to get there. Steve Harley was terrific as my counselor, and I'd highly recommend that you start talking to him. NOW!

How are you to tell a person they are doing wrong when even they should know they are? I did what I could to point out the trouble and offerd to help fix it but instead she rebeled against me, said I was just like her step dad and all I wanted to do was ruin her fun. SHes not like that now and does listen much better and understands what I was trying to do but at the time she couldnt see past her own desiers. <BR>I see alot of places on this sight that say let go of resentment and anger, just try to forget about it and dont bring it up. How is that DEALING with the problim? SOunds like avoiding the pain and anger then really dealing with it. Ive been trying to let the pain, thoughts, anger just run there corse in my head and try to become numbed to the images.. Am I doing this wrong? <BR>Oh ALso about getting all the books and counseling and such, we are very strapped for money right now. Another hangup my wife had in her other life was to spend money if she had no cares in the world. SO now we are way behind on most every bill we have and she has managed to max out all our credit cards. Its getting better but slowly and Im not sure when exactly we will be cought up enough to afford all the books. Counseling seems to be a MUST have so we will have to find away.. Ill probably get the books one by one.. As for my Lovebusters I releise they are there and am trying to correct them with her help. Im also trying the forget about the past aproach and to my suprise it does seem to help until like bedtime when my mind starts to wonder freely.

MM,<P>Forgetting about the past is easier said than done. But understanding what happened and accepting that it did happen does help one to get over this things. It particularly helps that JM is admitting to what she did and why she did it. This will take a while to get over, but you will never truely forget. <P>However, you won't have the waves of pain, anger and sadness sweep over you as often as time goes on. Gradually, the interval between these things will become longer, and the triggers that set them off will become fewer.<P>By the quite a bit of information is available on this web site so use it.<P>God Bless,<P>JL

MM - Thank you for your replys they have really helped. The counseling number the reminder of the 4 rules of marriage and the links to the NSR pages all were very helpful I think we are on the right track now and have started a joint journal to help us remeber all these things as well.. Things are not 'fixed' yet but I do feel we are on the way there. Forgetting is the hardest part for me but I am giving it time.. Perhaps a rough guess of how long forgiving and forgetting takes would be nice so I can judge my progress perhaps? <P>JM - in answer to the question of why did i tell him: I felt that with his help i could change who i was and that he could be my stronge hold when i felt weak. I had tried to stop on my own once but in about a year it was going on again. with his help i know i can be the person i once was. I was once a very respected person that he looked up to i desperately want to be that way again. I am so tired of being trash. I guess the overall reason i told him was i felt that i needed forgiveness for what i had done so it felt to me that there was definately an end. I felt so guilty that i just couldnt hold it inside any longer especially since I knew that i was wrong and that if i did not tell him and he found out on his own that i could very well lose him. He is the one person that loved me so much and i just knew that i could not go on any longer hurting him. <BR>I would drink alot while I was out so that alot of these thoughts were easy to push out of my mind. I did think about telling him before. It was not just that i walked into the house and said hey guess what one day. <BR>I went to church one morning and really realized what I had done to myself my husband and my family. I guess you could finally say one day i just snapped and realized that i really needed a drastic change if i was ever going to be a good wife and mother. I hope that this will help you to see a little more into what I was thinking and help you better understand why i had to tell him the truth. thank you for all of your help. I greatly appreciate it. <BR>Jm<P>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>How are you to tell a person they are doing wrong when even they should know they are? I did what I could to point out the trouble and offerd to help fix it<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>You don't. Big time lovebuster! You tell them how it is affecting you. "When you go out all night, I sit home alone & worry where you are."<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>SHes not like that now and does listen much better<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Well, stop it! Don't lecture to her about how she is doing wrong. You're not going to win any bonus points doing it.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>I see alot of places on this sight that say let go of resentment and anger, just try to forget about it and dont bring it up. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>No where does it say you should just, "forget about it & not talk about it." When the spouse is in an affair & you are in Plan A, then you should not talk about it (they probably won't let you anyway). After the affair is over & you both into repairing the marriage is the time to discuss it. But you need to set limits you can both live with. For instance, don't talk about it constantly. Set aside a few hours a week or such.<P>You both have lots to deal with. This web site is free & full of great info. Read it all and ask questions. If you feel the need to scream & yell, do it here, not at each other!<P>------------------<BR>Prayers & God Bless!<BR>Chris<BR>For relationship info check out <A HREF="http://www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html" TARGET=_blank>Marriage & Relationship Resources</A>

Its hard for me to say for sure if I did that or not Chris.. If I did explain how it effected me and such it was accompanied with 'This girl your hanging with is bad news. she will get you in trouble. Why after 3 years have you desided to live a redneck lifestyle? If it was your desier all along why didnt you tell me?' I also ALWAYS asked that she not drink without me being there 'just incase' and she would always say 'I know my limits' I didnt really bash her for who she was hanging with I did do some bashing on the suprise lifestyle she switched to. See the redneck ( Note: Not country/ honest farmers and such) lifestyle I have always fought against sence childhood. The music is depressing and morbid in many ways. The people are back stabbers and the type that would mess around with your wife mother sister chicken or whatever and there redneck friends would say nothing about it because its 'cool' or at least acceptable to them. Of corse I tryed to explain my hangup to my wife back then but when your in a redneck town you get more attention being just like them, anything difrent from them they hate. So I was seen as the 'strange' intruder in these things and not accepted at all or respected. <P>I do understand what your saying though and will do that more.. Better plan then being Critical.. But I feel even then it would have done no good because my wife only was willing to see the side of the story she was on and anything else was tossed aside with her other 'moral' thoughts. <P>BTW another funny little thing is now that she does listen and understand me abit better she sees things more the way I do. NOT for my sake but her own. I have always encouraged her to be her own person but now she has found out that she wasnt being her own person she was being whatever it was needed to be in the spotlight. She was pretending to be something she wasnt so people would like her.. She heard country music only as nice sounding music and not for what the song really ment or stood for.. She sees that the rednecks and there demoralizing music go hand in hand. 'I left my wife dog and kids so I might get a beer and sleep around on my wife.' ANd when you look at the lifestyle compard to the meaning of songs they match up pretty darn well.. <P>Oh of corse I know other 'cultures' have infidelity problims but usualy not influensed by friends music and atmisphere.. My wifes need for attention and unwillingness to talk with my bad work hours and bad compter habbits could have been enough for an affair but when you also have friends, music and atmisphere cheering her on it makes things so much easier. <P>Well Ill drop this subject now sence I have explained just abit but please note, I totaly agree with you and probably should have been more sensitive back then but didnt know exactly how besides being strate forward and sometimes down right blunt.<P>