I've been reading posts on this board for about a couple of months now, and I have some questions that hopefully someone can help with. Here's a brief summary of my situation: Been having problems with the marriage since April, realized I was not meeting my S's ENs, Started Plan A'ing (before I found this site and realized what it was). Started counselling with my wife in about June, bur to no avail - she wouldn't let me in. The reason being that she had started and A. Counselling was a smoke screen to her A. The A went on for 4 months, during which I became more and more suspicious, confronting her, her denials etc etc. D-Day was about 3 weeks ago, since then we have been back to counselling and she has explained that she wants to make the marriage work and that she loves me, and then in the next breath she says she is not sure what she wants. The A is over, there have been a few slip-ups like phone calls, but I have forgiven these as I have forgiven her for the A itself. I have just finished reading "His Needs, Her Needs", and have been Plan A'ing to death. We have both filled out the EN questionaire, and discussed them. The real problem is that my S doesn't want to talk about the A or our relationship, I have told her I need a great deal of affection at the moment, but she is unwilling to do that, or any other of my EN's (actually 4 out of 5 of our top 5 were the same). I'm not sure why this is. I try not to talk about it, because I know she doen't want to. Is she going through a normal pattern that other WS have been through (fog), or is she just trying to keep a civil family atmosphere (we have young children) while she decides when to end the marriage. My S has always said that if I had an A, she would divorce me, is she perhaps so sorry for the pain she is putting me through and disgusted with her own actions?<BR>Trying to find some sense or reasoning through this emotional roller-coaster<p>[ October 20, 2001: Message edited by: wpd ]

WPD,<BR>I'll spare you the regular intro since you have done all of you homework already, but welcome to heck.<P>It sounds so familiar what you have described about your S and her feelings. The only difference I see is that at least your S is going to C with you, and is willing to talk to you.<P>The first thing that I'm slowly starting to realize is that it takes time. She doesn't want to talk about the A because of the feelings it brings up for her. My W is so ridden with guilt right now that the very mention of the A puts her into a zombie like state. You can't ask her to make any promises about your future, at least not until the fog clears up a bit for her. When she is ready, you will know. As far as the affection thing - <B>MAN</B> that goes without saying - probably just like you, I want some small sign that says that all of my efforts weren't wasted...just a hug or a meaningful touch would do wonders.<P>Take it one day at a time buddy and you'll get through this thing. Don't lose patience like I do all of the time, things will work themselves out as long as you are taking the right steps. And so far, it sounds like you are doing everything just right.<P>Buckle up, keep your arms inside the cart at all times, you're in for one heck of a roller coaster ride here!<P>Pops

WPD,<BR>Are you sure you aren't married to my W? Maybe she has a twin she never told me about. You have explained the exact same situation I am in right now. W tells me that too, I love you but can't make any promises right now. That's ok, don't worry about it, you don't need to tear yourself up with these words. They are only words, look for the hidden things. The fact that you are still together, in counseling and being civil to each other holds great promise.<P>Affection, you know how much I want to hold her and give her a hug? I'm so turned on by her right now I can't stand it. But affection isn't something she is ready to give right now, and you shouldn't demand it from her either. Keep your distance. I'm sure she feels dirty and unloveable and not worthy of you right now. I remember when W was pregnant, I couldn't get close to her, no affection, no nothing, just "this is all your fault". Think of it like that, I made it through those times (many of them) so this should be a piece of cake. Look for the small signs from her, they are there, you just have to be in tune to them, it might even be some small comment she makes in passing. I've heard them from W a lot, thats why I am still hopeful. I've even felt her gently touching me at night, probably thinking I wouldn't feel it, those are the things you need to look for.<P>Forgiving her is the best thing to do. Keep your distance, do not bring up the A unless she does first. And then only listen and don't make any judgements. You can't help her right now, especially as a husband, just be her friend, that's what she is looking for. Remember that there are two sides to this. When W told me about the A she said it was all my fault and for a while I believed it. Now I will only accept the things I have done to hurt her and not the A itself.<P>W told me the same thing if I ever had an A, even accused me of it when I was in the service. I'm sure what she did goes against every moral fiber of her being. She is hurting and ridden with guilt right now and I'm sure you can see that. <P>Pops is right about patience, that's all you can do right now. I see a lot of hope in your M working out. Be sure to take care of yourself (read about the triangle), be there for W when she needs you, focus on the kids and try to get back to a normal life. Remember this web site and discussion board, read everything you can, the more you know about yourself, W and the A, the easier it will be to get through this.

Pops, thanks for the reply. Whereas the affair felt like a knife in the back, her refusal to let me in, or to respond to my actions is like turning the knife. I'm not sure which is more painfull !<P>I guess I'm looking for responses from WS's to understand what they went through or are going through, so perhaps I can see some light at the end of this long dark tunnel.

I'm a bit confused. What's this fog that everyone keeps talking about?

loveherstill, or anyone, how long does this go on for. I guess I had some slightly positive results last night. She admits that she is full of guilt, we didn't go any further beacause I knew she didn't want to talk about it.<P>Today feel no better though, feels kind of hopeless.

WPD,<BR>"How long does it go on for?" I think all of us BS's would like to know the answer to that one. Today I am feeling hopeless myself, like Pops says, it is a roller coaster. Have you read Wats Guidelines? There is some good stuff in there.<P>Not pushing the subject is one of the best things any of us can do right now. Its up to her to tell you what she wants to tell you. When I first found about the A, I tried to pry information out of W and all it did was push her away even farther. Having her tell you she is full of guilt is probably a good thing, it means that she is remorseful for what has happened. I wish W would tell me that myself, it sure would help me feel a bit better. <P>The knife example fits me as well. I feel like W has shoved a knife in my heart and is slowly twisting it by not talking to me, allowing me to move out and hiding from me. I know she is hurting as much as me right now, and to go through this apart makes it even worse. We are supposed to be there for each other, good times and bad, better or worse, right?<P>Patience, venting your pain, suffering and anger on these boards, being there for her, forgiving her (and yourself), communicating in a positive way, counseling, that's all you can do right now.<BR>I don't know if this helps you any, but writing this reply is making me feel better about myself and the M working out. I guess this kind of therapy works both ways.

Anise<P>The fog is the time that the WS is acting crazy and saying things that don't make sense. It can go on for a long time after the A ends. Keep plan Aing and stay strong. come here to vent.

Well I guess, I realise now why my W has been so distant. I found out that she'd talked to OM a couple of weeks ago, but forgave this as just a slip.
Now I find out that she's been in contact daily since D-Day (9/29), in addition after leaving our friends on Friday she went round to his place to continue their PA. I found her car there about 1:00 am. <p>I have spent the last month trying not to talk about the A, concentrating more on fixing the marriage. I have not questioned her about whether she's been in contact, but now I find this revelation, that she's been lying again, that all her remorse and committment to work things out were lies. We talked and she told me that it was over, she had ended it because she was tired of feeling like this. She has nearly lost her best friends because of all the lies and I know that she is hurting. <p>She is reading HNHN, and realises that a marriage can't start to heal while there is still contact. Should I trust her again, what can I do to help her as she doesn't want to talk about it, or should I say "enough is enough"?<p>[ October 29, 2001: Message edited by: wpd ]</p>

Whether you have had enough is totally up to you. They do say you KNOW when it is enough. Well, I have worlked out from your posts,it has been nearly five months and she is still with OM. For me that would be enough to go to Plan B.<p>Does she know you know?

Nina, thanks for the advice, yes she does know I know, we had a big arguement on Friday after I called and told her I knew where she was. I told her to move out, packed her bags and left them in the garage. On Saturday wetalked and put all her clothes back.<p>One of my main concerns is, in addition to staying married, is the effect this, or a divorce/separation could have on the children.