I found out about my husband's affair on New Years Eve. My Husband left the country with the other woman on Friday Jan. 4, 2002. He has not called me yet but has spoken to his family to say he doen't know what to do. That school is his #1 priority right now. He wants things to work out with OW but does not know if they will. He told family members he does not want a divorce. He loves me but not in love with me. He's in love with her. I have read and printed out this whole web site. Thank GOD! Read my other post of "What Do I Say?" To find out my whole story. Today is Wednesday Jan. 9, 20002. My Husband still has not called to tell me where he or I stand. Please tell me what to say to get this roller coaster going. I am ten chapters ahead of him. I feel sorry that he does not understand what is going on in his head. After learning so much at MB I understand. I think if i tell him I feel sorry for him that I am love busting. Can I tell him he is addicted to her and I am willing to wait? Is that giving him and ok to continue the affair and making it stronger? I want to tell him I love him and I feel sorry for him and that I think our marriage is worth saving if he would give me a chance. PLEASE HELP ME SAY THE RIGHT THING!!!!! PLEASE! PLEASE!PLEASE!

Hi Forgiver,<p>As hard as it is.....say nothing. Right now no matter how much love come from you, it will not be appreciated and in the long run it will hurt you. Keep a journal, write out your feelings. Write a letter to your, you can send e-mails but for now, don't talk to him. Just for a while more. <p>When you have business or family matters to discuss do it when you are in a less shocked frame of mind. This is all quite new to you and your reactions show it. <p>Pray for a clear mind and a calm heart. Keep reading and venting here. <p>Hugz,
L.

Forgiver,
Get conseling with MB for advice, we are here to lend supports and oppinions. One comment on your freinds and families, do not interfere. Let them actually talk to your H ot not to, it is their decision. Make them understand that they are still your freinds and families no matter the outcome is. Since H is far away, your line of communication also via your freinds and families. They will help you to see changes in you in plan A.<p>On your statement of never give him up, you should be ready. Life is too short to be miserable and not all M worth saving. You give your absolute best to save this M but there is a limit and you are not mortar. Even an ocean has bottom floor. You should start with thinking you lost him already, it is easier to plan A that way. This MB will prepared you to have a fullfilling M w/ your H or with someone else. You will be wiser and bless with the know how on how to care and protect your M.<p>Right now you are betting on the past, the memory of H relations w/ you and you will help it w/ showing a different future by doing plan A. Right now you H is on the top of A, you better stay away from it.<p>What to say ?. What I am about to tell you some MB'er will call it LB'ed but you have to state it as fact and not in anger, read it as a statement and send him a copy of it. You have to tell this if you are about to do what I think you are about to do,a complete doormat. You have love so deep for your H it is ashame he didn't see it, so does my WW. I told my WW that I don't bless her A whatever excuse she has doesn't justify it. She could Dv me but not cheat on me. Since I love her, I let her go. If she is back and I am still here, we could work on M. If she is not back she is not mine to begin with, I will move on. Leave it like that then listen and listen and listen. If H starts saying something that is outragous lies you just tell H that you have a different point of view but at this point you do not want to talk about it. If H saying something that is true (something that you did, remember it takes two to screw up M), you tell H you are sorry and you will work on it. Listen and make a note on what he says, even tape it for your own research on plan A. If H say want to work on M tell him to come back home regardless, financial and everything else is secondary than M. Get him conseling w/ MB.<p>You want your H to face his own A as his choice and remove you as continuing excuse to have A. A is a fantasy, let H live it out. No one will be able to stop it but himself. Meanwhile you work on your self, making you as a save place to come back to. Try to live as if you are Dv but stop short on new relation. Go to school yourself, get advance degree. Get busy. At one point your will hit the bottom of your love, that is the time you do plan B and be ready to move on.<p>What is your chances ? There is no gurantee the only gurantee in MB is that you give your best and you are ready for rebuilding fullfiling M w/ or w/o H. It depends on how is H memories in your M or relation. It depends how much he could stand being alienated by every one but OW. It depends on OW, how much EN(s) she fullfilled and vice versa. It depends how good your plan A is to show H the glimse of new future.<p>You should learn about MB, buy or borrow from library SAA & HNHN. If you can not take the beating, go and see your doctor for ADD. Try to get conseling w/ Steve or Jennifer Harley. And most of all get busy. Schedule your day to the zilt w/o idle time. Post here to vent or to ask questions and when you feel better start helping others. Good luck and may God give all of us strength and wisdom to pass this turbulence in our life.

Dear Orchid and Redhat,
Thank you so much for responding to me. It really helps and means so much. Since my H left in May to go to school I have been taking classes to make the time go faster. i already have my Masters and I am scheduled through Feb. to have 75 credits beyond my masters. Since Sept. I have been in classes 7 days a week. I also joined a kickboxing class. I did all this just to keep busy while he was away so time would go faster. I have taken on all financial responsibilities and the running of our house (we rent it out in the summer.) He has had total and complete freedom to pursue his dream without any responsibilities. I thought I was being a good wife and complete Giver. I found out last week about A but continued my rigerous schedule. People at work can tell I am depressed but they think it is because my husband is away. THey all invite me out and keep telling me to hang in there that he will be home soon. I was suppossed to visit him for a week in February. But now he probably does not want me to go. I was also suppossed to go down in July and stay to September. Right now I take one day at a time. I race home to check my e-mail and phone but no contact has been made. He closed all e-mail accounts so I can't e-mail and he changed his phone number. He is completely isolated in a fantasy world. they are living together on a tropical island in the West Indies going to school together. Everyone down there met me and knew H was married. When OW boyfriend came to visit their friends covered for my H telling OW's BF that my H was happily married and was not a threat. She broke up with her boyfriend this past week also. They had lived together for 6 years. I am 30 my H will be 31 in Feb and OW is 24. We have been married for 4 years but together for 12 what I thought were awesomwe years. To everyone else we were the perfect couple. I guess he wasn't so happy. I have a hard time letting go. I know you said to act as if I have lost him but I can't accept that yet. I am going to call for conseling with MB's and I will go to a conseling center nearme. I am also going to my Dr. this weekend for anti-dep. I am trying to set everythingup for as smooth a situation as is possible. I feel so helpless!! Thanks again for your support and advice any input is GREATLY appreciated.
Forgiver

Forgiver,
Fortunately, we are social animal. We need to interact w/ people, people that we know and love. Sooner or later he will need to contact you or family, let him make the first move. Meanwhile by shutting you off, actually with time it is easier for you to deal rather than on and off 'coaster ride. In some states it is also consider abandonment. Check w/ your lawyer too, to protect yourself financially and legally.<p>You could send him a plan A letter, it won't change him but it will state your position.<p>Just curious, is it Barbados ?.<p>I am happy that you get a good grip of the situation.

Thank you Redhat. You really help me. He is in St. Kitts.
He called his mother for the first time on Wednesday I spoke to her last night. I have been sharing what I have learned from MB with her. She is trying her best to contain her emotions. His mom is from Italy and has a very hot temper. She told him the whole family disowned him when they first found out. Now she is doing some back peddling because I told her that her threats and insults just draws him closer to OW. She said he kept asking how I was doing and she told him I was doing ok taking one day at a time and as far as I was concerned we have a problem that I am willing to work out. She told him that I did not tell my parents the full extent of our troubles, merely that we had a problem and we were working on it. She also told him that my parents yelled at me that I should go down ther to stay with him and that I was causing a rift in our relationship. They do not know about his A. It would break their hearts and I believe it would literally kill them (heart attack). His mom said he expressed that he felt bad that I was covering for him and taking the brunt of the situation. He asked if I had seen a lawyer- which I have not. He said he was going to call me but still has not. She said after talking to him she feels he has changed but that she thinks he will come back. She says she has a feeling. I do not want to get false hope. I also think he may just say what his mother wants to hear. She disagreed because she said if he was still insane he would not have been so concerned about me. She said he expressed sincere concern and that he did not want to hurt me anymore. He still has not called and thus I do not know where we stand. He has his first break in April for one week and he said he was not coming home. His mother said she would go to see him with his father. My H did not object. He said he planned to come home in August but was not clear if he woulfd come home to me or go to his parents. His parents said he could not step foot on their property if OW was with him. That OW will never put a toe in my shoes. I don't know how he will take that. My MIL spoke to OW on New Years and threatened to kill her. OW laughed at my MIL wich only made her madder. My MIL told my H that I had joined the gym (I am already in good shape) and that I joined what my MIL called KickButt" class. (Kickboxing). She said he said I would probably kick his A**. After getting off the phone with him. My MIL said it was the first time she felt good again and that he showed signs of remorse and confusion. He changed his phone number so no one can call him. It is up to him to call me. SO I just keep busy and surrounded by friends and family until he does. I have not spent a night alone since he left. SOmeone is always over. I have to go to class now but I will check back later. Thank you all again. I continue to pray for all of us.

Forgiver,<p>OW is LB'ed big time on disrepectfull to MIL ... this is an italian family we are talking about, mother is big thing. Wonder how H is taking it ... Your MIL & FIL is wise parent. They draw the boundry for his behavior and state that they still love him. Kind of what plan A is about. However stay away from family business, blood is thicker than water. Just talk to get info.not to minggle w/ their business.<p>It is good that someone keep H inform about your changes. Also it seems that you have a good support system so that they could keep an eye on you for danger of depression. Live your life for now, go and see theLordofTheRing, I see "the One Ring that Rule Them All" as A. It temptates people to put it on and sucks them into their greediness. No one immune to it. Stay away from Vanilla Sky unless you have a tissue box beside you. [img]images/icons/blush.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Also change your look too (color your hair or cut it very short or something), just to say "here plan A, I am coming !!!". Meanwhile try to think what is your H's issues in M. Print out LBQ & ENQ, fill it in as your H. Those are the basis for your plan A. Also get conseling with MB if you could afford it. They could help you pin point on the detail and give you professional advice.<p>Keep us posted [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

Redhat
Thanks for those suggestions. My brother and sister are coming to stay with me for the weekend. We will go see LOTR's. <p> I had a question. On New year's Eve, before I found out about the A, I knew something was upsetting my H. I thought is was the pressure of school and being away from me. I sat down in the morning and wrote him a four page letter. I wrote to him to thank him for a wonderful 2001. i asked him to reflect on 2001 and see how far we came in the past year let alone the past 12. I wrote that I knew something was bothering him and I was not sure if we would get the chance to talk about it before he left. I reassured him of how proud i was of him and that what ever was bothering him, if I could do something to take away the pain to let me know. I wrote the whole letter assuming it was the pressure of school that was getting him down. I wrote pages and pages of how much I loved him and how happy i was that God had crossed our paths. I told him I was here for him supporting him in any way i could figure out. I encouraged him to try his best and stick to it. I knew he was an intelligent loving man and that although this was the most difficult thing we have been through(school), we would get through it. I even mentioned in the letter that I thought he might be having an affair but I told him that I didn't believe he would because I knew how much he loved me and I knew how much I loved him. I apologized for anytime i aggravated him and he didn't let me know. I aplogized for anything and everything I ever did to upset or hurt him and I reassured him that school would be over soon and we would be back together. I wrote all of this before I found out about the affair. I wrote him another two page letter of support and encouragement and told him how much I admired him and respected and loved him. I then went to the card store and bought out the entire Love section. I bought every mushy and funny card that expressed how much I loved him and how much he ment to me. i also bout some cards with I miss you theme. i bought $75.00 worth of cards. I mailed them all New Years Eve morning.<p> Mail comes in drips and drabs down there. I mailed him the same kind of cards in October and he still has not gotten them all yet. I figured I would bombard him with love and encouragement over the coming months. I kept saying "we'll get through this together. I am always by your side supporting you in anything you do etc. etc." I wrote them all with the challenge of school in mind not that he was having an affair.<p> Now he is down there and over the next few months he is going to be getting all these loving letters from me. I still mean everything they say. Now instead of school being the struggle, the A is. I have no control over the mail.<p> By him receiving those letters, will they be LB's? As I said they were mailed before the A came to light. How should I tell him about them? Or should I just say nothing. he might get them and think they were mailed after the A was discovered. I don't know what the post mark will be since the post office was closed on New Year's Eve and day.<p> What do you think?<p>Forgiver

The first thing H will check is the postage date and also if you wrote the date on your cards. It is actually a good thing, it is not LB'ed at all, those are expression of your love. You could even continue to do so if you do plan A to keep the consistancy, it is your call. The only thing is you have to tell H that you are against his behavior of having A and I guess you did already.<p>Steve encourages me to show my love for my WW. It is hard while she comes and go as she pleases and A full blast.

REDHAT Thank you!
I thought I blew it sending those cards. It was so strange that I was driven to do so before I found out about the A. My H still has not called. We do not have any children. Just me and the dogs waiting for his call. I was reading another post of how WS's with children even cut off their relationships with their children. That a WW had seen her children only 5 times in 23 days. Others explained that to do that the WS is deep in the fog. I guess my H is deep in the fog as well. The longer he does not face me the easier it is for him. I fear their relationship will get stronger.
One thing he said the OW liked to do was watch football. I watch it but I don't really like it. Since he left I havn't missed a game! I yell and scream at the TV. He would be surprised at my enthusiam. He would also be surprised that I am rooting for the other team. He is a HUGE Jets fan. GO Raiders!!!

Forgiver,
Nothing we could do or should do to interfere with A in full blast. My WW spend less than that, this week she has yet to stay over night. My WW also cut off all contact with her father and brothers. We let her, let her stare at A point blank. If the A get stronger and never dies who knows, probably my WW finds her "soulmate", I will not intefere and Dv her. I need to find my happiness too. Let WS go, if WS comes back, WS is yours and if not then WS is not yours to begin with. All we could do is try our best and move on w/ or w/o WS. This is where MB's plan A and B help BS out emotionally and mentally with whatever the outcome is.<p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr><strong>One thing he said the OW liked to do was watch football. I watch it but I don't really like it. Since he left I havn't missed a game! I yell and scream at the TV. He would be surprised at my enthusiam. He would also be surprised that I am rooting for the other team. He is a HUGE Jets fan. GO Raiders!!!</strong><hr></blockquote>
Raiders is across the bay where I live [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] . I am 49er fan ... 'till next year for them.<p>Read some books, The power of praying wife is good, Love must be tough and some other books that keep you occupied.

Redhat,<p> Thanks. I have ordered all the books in the Harley Bookstore. I eagerly await their arrival.
I have printed out everything I could find on this website and have them separated into sections. I'll be putting them in a binder. It has helped my friends and family have a better understanding. Everyone comes over and reads and reads. It helps them too. I chose this website because the OW's dog's name is Harley. I took it as a sign from God that I was on the right track. I am so grateful I found this site when i did. It helped me so much. <p> I do pray. I always have. Every night I say my prayers before bed. I have always prayed for God to give my H and I strength to get through school and be apart for so long. My parents pray the rosery every night. My mom has been saying Novenas since my H left for school to keep our M strong. I have lots of prayers behind me. I went to see my priest two days after I found out about the A. He helped me alot. He told me my H has to be willing to come back to me out of love. He has to be willing to live his life like an open book. We have always lived our lives that way. Like my H said to his family, I didn't do anything wrong. He still loves me, he's just not in love with me. It was all him. He said he knows he is the bad guy. He said he can't understand why he feels this way about the OW. He doesn't know why but he is willing to give up everything to be with her. Classic. He keeps calling his family to see how I'm doing. they take that to mean he still cares. THey think he will come back. THey say he is so ashamed that he can't bear to talk to me yet. Day 14, he still has not called to tell me where we stand. When he left he said to his family it was over-not directly mind you but that was what his friends felt he ment. Now when he calls them, he says they are fighting all the time more now than ever. but he keeps asking how I am doing. They tell him I am remarkable and more of a woman than they would be in this situation. As far as he knows through them, I am taking care of myself and waiting to sort this out with him. <p> I have and appointment to speak with Jennifer at 7:00pm eastern time tonight. I can't wait to talk to her. My dad gave me the name of a marriage counseler that was recommended. But that counseler isn't available until the end of Feb. I will seek counsel with a family services center near me until then.
My parents do not know about the A. They think we are having trouble due to being separated. It would break their heart. THey adore my H and my H loves them. They call him Mr. Wonderful. When I have a better grip I may broach the subject to them with my priest.
I will be finished with my third degree this Feb. I have been taking classes since my H left to make the time go by faster and to get to the top of my salery scale. I also planned on leaving work early from now on. Especially when my H came home from school. THat was my plan. We'll see if he comes home. He still has two years down there. I also told my H last summer that I would go back to school to become a vet tech. that way I could work with him over the summers (i'm a teacher). We worked together over the summers before and loved it. MAybe I'll start that degree in Feb. Or perhaps I'll go on to get my PHd. We'll see.<p> In the mean time, hang in there. You give me strength and hope. I thank you for that. Hopefully your wife will come out of her fog soon. She does not realize how lucky she is to have a man so loving and caring. It's a shame such awful things happen to good people like us. We're too good I guess. We just have to look at this as a learning experience and welcome the lessons we learn. Until next time, my prayers are with you.
Forgiver

Forgiver,
I am really happy that you are doing well and also you have a lot of support. Yes, this MB is very usefull for relationship. It give us a chance to seek and build fullfiling M, "in love" at all time. [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] .<p>I am also glad that you will have advice from the professional, M is too valuable to be screw up with wrong steps. However when you talk to conselor in your area make sure they know about MB and practice it too. On one of other post I read that WS's conselor prohibit her to talk to Jennifer. Wonder why and whose side they are on ?.<p>You are doing a good plan A, keep it up. Post here again for update.

Redhat
i had my first session with Jennifer tonight. It really helped alot. She didn't give me too much new info. she was pleased at how much I knew and that thus far i seem to be doing plan a right. She was impressed at how much background I had on MB and thought I had a good handle on the situation. she commented that I had a lot going for me but the major thing against me was that they were down there together. it sounds as though they will LB each other. She suggested I continue with the way I am living and to call her in a month or so. she also suggested I call her if i plan to go plan B, which I don't for now. She helped me with what to say and prepared me for the worst. she said the fact my In laws expressed their displeasure and that the OW will never be welcome is in my favor. So I keep busy and maybe I'll catch his call if he decides to get up the courage. I'm here with open arms and i'll try not to kick his a**. Till tomorrow. One day at a time.
Forgiver

The following was my original post. It was the last one on the board so i am copying it here so i don't have to write it over again. This is the full story:<p>
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UBBFriend: Email this page to someone! <p>Author Topic: What Do I Say?
Forgiver
Junior Member
Member # 15639
posted January 06, 2002 10:20 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Please Help!
I teased my husband on New Years Eve that I thought he was having an affair (I really didn't think he was, I was joking!) and he blurted out he was! The shock was so great I fell to my knees cying. The first thing I said to him was I love you, I forgive you, lets work this out then I asked why. I did not yell and scream. I think that was a step in the right direction. He said it wasn't my fault that it wasn't anything I did or did't do. He wants to give me the house and all we have. He also said he wasn't sure what he wanted to do. He told me school was his number one priority right now. I am number two and three.
You need a little background first.<p>He started his first year in vet school in May 2001. It is in another country. He left for school at the end of April. I joined him for July and August and we both came home at the end of August. I met the OW while I was there. They studied together. She wasn't the OW yet, just a friend. I could tell she liked him but he insisted they were friends. I am not sure when their friendship went to the next level.
In August he was looking for a new apartment with his male room mate and her. His male room mate backed out and he was just going to live with her. I told him I did not want him living with her. He said they were just friends. I told him I did not like it but I trusted him. I told him I trusted him completely but I could not stop her from falling in love with him. My mistake. I basically allowed the whole thing to happen. (I know I shouldn't blame myself)
He came back to the states with me for two weeks in August. He returned to school and her in September. When he came home for the first time this Christmas I picked him up at the airport in a stretch limosine. I thought it was weird he didn't want to have sex in the limo or as soon as we got home. We went out to eat. He started acting strange, distant yet hyper. He was nervous. I questioned if it was because of school and pressure and he said yes. Although the first few nights in the bedroom were good he couldn't perform after two days. That was an all time first. He said he was stressed and would go to the doctor. He really started to get quiet and distant.
On New years Eve I went into his history on the computer and noticed pornographic sites. I questioned him if he had something going on the side and he said yes. He told me it wasn't anything I did or didn't do. He said he does not feel 100% with me anymore he feels 100% with her. He eluded to leaving me for her when he said I could have the house and everything we have. He said he didn't understand it but she makes him feel like giving up everything for her. He knows he is wrong and that he is the bad guy. He knew his family and friends would disown him but he din't care. Then he said he was confused and he didn't know what to do. He said she reminded him of me and when I went back home to the states it hurt him. He said she says the things I"ve already said. She likes things for the same reasons I do, Etc. etc. Also, two things she does that I don't are watch football and jog.
He told me he had told his mother on Christmas Eve. He said he could not be in the house and went out with our friends for New Years. He told our friends I didn't feel well. When he went out for New Years Eve. I called his mother, she said she and his father were coming the next morning. I then broke into his e-mail and printed out 3 copies of all their letters. I also called her and calmly wished her a Happy New Year and told her to back off.
The next morning, Tuesday, New Years Day I told him I read their e-mails and I called her. Just as his mother and father showed up. He snapped. He began packing his suitcase to go to her. I hid his wallet, keys and passport. That made it worse. He was insane. He was a trapped animal being attacked by a beehive (his parents). I still was in so much shock I stayed very quiet. I did not yell and attack him, they did it for me. He threatened me and I called the police. He left with our dogs. The police brought him and the dogs back. They then took him to the train station. He rented a car and went to his sister's house. He told her he loved me but he wasn't in love with me. Classic. He is willing to give up everything to be with her and he does not know why. Classic. He spoke to his friends and family for three hours. They were all going beserk and telling him how crazy he is to give up everything. We have been together for 12 years and married for 4 years. No children. Have a beautiful home and we both have worked very hard. Up until this point I felt our life was just about perfect.
Thank God I found this website because I feel empowered. It gives me a better understanding as to what is going on and how to deal. I can now look back on our life and see we do have an excellent relationship but communication IS one of the biggest issues. I can recognize love busters. I wish I could show this website to him to help him understand his behavior. But i know he isn't in the right frame of mind yet.
He went to his family and friends to tell them everything. He knows they will tell me. He said he is not ready to talk to me yet. He needs a few days to settle down and figure out how he is going to call me and tell me if or how he wants to end it. I realize he needs to talk to me, no one else!
He went to the OW Tuesday and Wednesday. He called his sister from there.
On Thursday he went to his sister's house to meet some of his friends and family. They had what I think you call an intervention. But after finding this website I realize no matter what anyone says it just draws him to her. His family said he said he did not want to hurt me it just happened and he does not know why. He wants to prepare himself to talk to me and decide exactly what to say. Again, HE NEEDS TO TALK TO ME!!!!!!
He left with the other woman on a plane to another country on friday. They went back to school together and the semester starts on Monday. <p>He still has not called me to tell me where we stand.<p>On Saturday I found this website and stayed on it all day. After learning so much I feel better for the first time. But I am afraid I am in denial because I am so convinced we will be back together.
I now realize we set ourselves up for this when we agreed I would stay in the states and he would go to Vet school in another country. I also realize before he went to vet school I was not meeting some of his emotional needs. And being so far apart his sexual needs were not met. The OW he said is just like me. I realize she is fulfilling his emotional needs that I was unable to. He was unable to verbalize them to me. I understand he is addicted to her. They have known each other for only six months.
I have asked all family and friends not to contact them. I asked everyone to back off. I asked them that if he calls, to tell him to call me and hang up. I don't think they will. I tried to explain that him talking through them and them telling him what I have said enables the affair.
He needs to call me and tell me where he stands.
Today is Sunday and I have not spoken to him. It has been 7 days since the affair was revieled.<p>I want to know what to say when he does call to tell me he wants to be with her forever. I thought I would use some things I found on this website but I don't want to drive him away. No matter what I say It won't matter. Should I say something like: "I deserve more than this. I deserve respect and a chance to work this out. I refuse to be treated like this by the man I love. If you are upset with our relationship I want us to discuss it as adults and solve this with mutual respect. When you are ready we need to come to grips with what is missing in our marriage and work together."
But is that ok? It sounds like I am making demands which will drive him away. Should I not talk to him at all? I understand they have a good chance of burning each other out especially since they are starting one of the hardest semesters at school tomorrow.
I think the vet school is working in my favor. They both told his family that school was their priority. But after school they would go back to her part of the country and open a clinic together. He would give it all up and maybe the family would accept them back after our divorce. But every one knows I will not divorce him. I refuse to give up. <p>I know I can not reason with him in the frame of mind he is in. But what is the best thing to say to ensure his return?
I am going to therapy tomorrow because it scares me that I am so obsessed with getting him back. I am also concerned that I am not full of rage but only love for him. I know i am in shock. I have not eaten or slept and so i am in a cloud. I can not wait to get this over but I do not know how long I can wait before I collapse. I was a basket case after he left but I am so glad I found this website. <p>Please help what should I say and do to ensure his return? If it seems like I consent to their affair- won't that strengthen their bond? I think I am trying to do the plan A but would plan B work as well? What if she really is exactly like me, only better? Am I being too forgiving?
When he calls it will be the first oportunity for us to talk since he left. How should i handle him?
I probably have gone on too long. Maybe I should not have written so many intimate details. I can not think any more I have to go to bed. Please help me.<p>Forgiver<p>[ January 07, 2002: Message edited by: Forgiver ]<p>
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Posts: 11 | Registered: Jan 2002 | IP: Logged

diddallas
Member
Member # 14176
posted January 07, 2002 09:39 AM
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Forgiver,
Wow! What a shock! But it seems that you have gotten a good handle on yourself...but I must say that I don't think you have any right to ask his family not to talk to him--to refer his calls to you...unless of course, he is calling them to pass messages along. Then, of course, he should be talking to you.
I might have missed it, but why exactly is he in another country and you are here? I know about the school but why aren't you there with him? Obviously, as you said, the distance is a great strain on the marriage.<p>
quote:
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"I deserve more than this. I deserve respect and a chance to work this out. I refuse to be treated like this by the man I love. If you are upset with our relationship I want us to discuss it as adults and solve this with mutual respect. When you are ready we need to come to grips with what is missing in our marriage and work together."
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I wouldn't put it so forcefully (I REFUSE to be treated like this...refuse is such a negative word)...I might say something more like "I love you and I think our marriage is worth saving. What can we do to work out our problems?"
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Posts: 333 | Registered: Nov 2001 | IP: Logged

Forgiver
Junior Member
Member # 15639
posted January 07, 2002 06:08 PM
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DIDDALLAS
Thank you so much for responding. The waiting is driving me crazy. <p>My husband was laid off the day before Christmas Eve last year. We talked about what he wanted to do. I asked him what would make him happy. What did he see himself doing 20 years from now? he said he wanted to go back to school. I told gim to go for his dream that I would do what ever he needed to get through. I fully supported him. I let him leave.
He had applied to vet school in 1993 and got in. He wasn't ready for the commitment. So last year he applied in January and started in April. It has all happened very fast.
He is going to school in another country for several reasons althought the most significant is that it is an accelerated year round program. To complete the program takes three years. This April will be the end of the firstyear. He left in April. I went down July first. I stayed there through August. I was miserable. I was not allowed to work, being an American. I was alone all the time. It is a very small third world country . All I could do was go to the beach everyday and exercise. I know everyone would like to go to the beach everyday and do nothing. But it really was like being in the Tom Hanks movie, Cast Away. I walked lonely dirt roads and admired the beauty of the land. There were goats, cows and monkies all over. There weren't any stores (but i don't like shopping anyway). I would visit the beach everyday. I was the only person on the entire beach for two months. When I went swimming or snorkling I had to watch out for sharks which were all over. It was very scary. If anything happened to me no one would ever know or find me. On one occasion he had a day off and we were alone on the beach all day. We were completely nude and made love all day. There was absolutely no one around. I am wild but not that wild so it was pushing it for me.
After being there we decided I would return home to continue working so we could have some income and start paying off the interest on his loan. I would come down once a month or for a week every other month. Him coming home this December was the first time since we came home together in August. I was going to go down for a week in February.
He said he does not want me to come down there. <p>I did not tell his family they could not talk to him I just asked that they tell him to call me. He tells them everything because he knows they will tell me. Then he does not have to call and tell me.
It is my understanding he is afraid to call me because he does not want to say something more to hurt me. He had to let his anger subside. He is going to call me to tell me he wants to end our marriage. He told his cousin that he wants to stay with the OW forever but that she probably wouldn't. He also said they are together 24/7 and thus they fight on and off. He said when I would call him (before I knew about the A), she would not talk to him for two days. When her boyfriend would call they would fight.
I am counting on the affair ending in six months, as per this websites timeline, from the discovery of the A to their burning out. That brings us to June. I am prepared to move down there in July and stay until he is finished. But she will still be there for two more years. They are in the same classes everyday. Unless one of them fails this semester (I am praying for it). When they fail one class, they have to repeat the entire semester. It is like getting left back.
He said as of right now neither he nor she is moving out. He said he needs her to get through the semester. i know she needs him because he has had straight A's and B's since the start. She was failing out and went to him for toutoring. He helped her pass.
He still hasn't called. If I condone the relationship, won't that solidify it for them? I realize it has to run it's course. I want to share what I have learned from this website with him. But it will fall on deaf ears won't it? Can I tell him he is addicted to her and no matter what anyone says to him right now, it won't work? Please help me with more to say.
Thank you so much.<p>[ January 07, 2002: Message edited by: Forgiver ]<p>
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Update<p>
Today is day ninteen. My husband e-mailed me a few days ago to tell me he loved me and missed me. He wanted to call but he didn't know what to say except he was sorry for putting me through this. He also wrote he thought about me every day.
Tonight he called his sister to say he was thinking of moving out. (he's living with OW in another country) She called me as soon as she got off the phone. She told me to sit down, she had good news. He said he still loved me and he knew I loved him but he is so ashamed of how much he hurt me he does not have the courage to call. (coward?) He said he will call me soon. He told SIL that OW's boyfriend of 6 years has been e-mailing her and that she has been in contact with him. He also said they were fighting alot. She said he sounded like he wanted another chance. He told her the OW was standing next to him while he was on the phone.
My H said if he called me he would not know where to start or what to say. He said he can't forget about our 12 years together. My SIL told him to pick up the phone and start with "Hello". She said he would be very surprised at what he would hear on the other end of the line. She told him that I harbor no anger for him. That I realize we are both responsible for getting in this situation although it was his choice to do what he did. With that he told her that I had never done anything wrong as far as he was concerned. That he was the one who pursued the relationship and that he was wrong. He never wanted to hurt me and if anyone would have ever asked him he would never have thought he would have done this. She told him he was so lucky that he had me and that I was treating him the way i was. it just shows him how much I love him and what an incredible person i am to react this way. She told him many other women would have thrown his crap out on the front lawn and lit it on fire. She told him if her husband did that, the police would never find the body.
My major concern is that even if he does move out, they are in the same classes together every day. In SAA it says TOTAL SEPERATION is necessary to save a marriage. He will not give up school and neither will she. He thinks he can handle it. He quit smoking. It's the same thing. Also this is the fog lifting for a moment right? Then he will go back into his bubble? I have to keep preparing myself for the worst. I have so much hope but what if it's false.
Can I share the total separation information with him. Can i tell him he is addicted and it will be very hard. That he might be good for a week but to see her in class every day may rekindle the affair. I should probably say nothing and let it run its course. But by him being ignorant of what the possibilities are won't that make it worse? Our own ignorance of not meeting each others needs got us where we are. When can I share what I have learned? I do not want to LB.I was hoping to move down there permently in July if he will agree. But I still have to wait for his call to tell me where I stand.<p> Any suggestions?
Anybody out there?

Forgiver,<p>Just came back from watching Beautiful Mind ... I needed tissue box. I am here but for a while only ... my WW baby sit tonite and I am out to see movie. It is LB'ed for me to be here.<p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr><strong>... She told him many other women would have thrown his crap out on the front lawn and lit it on fire. She told him if her husband did that, the police would never find the body.</strong><hr></blockquote>
She will be in the other side of marriage stats, the other 50%.

Wow, another impatient lady. Take it one day at the time, let him call you first then work out from there. I agree w/ you, either H is home or you live with him. Total separation is a must to protect your M. He is too weak to protect himself.

Thanks Redhat,

Day 20 still no phone call. Is it at all possible for WS to end A and still be in class together. I have thought about calling his professor, with whom he is very close and explaining the situation. I think my H would talk to him. He has spoken to him about other stuff. Maybe my H could move in with his Prof as someone to keep him on the path? The proff. is married but his wife is in another country. Many people are down there without their spouses. A's must be rampant, but there was no mention of them while I was there.
I get the feeling when he finally calls i should say nothing but try to be open and loving and let him know i am working on changing for me. i am taking one day at a time.<p> Should I send him a plan A letter? is ther such a thing? I don't want to LB by likening his A to an addiction and letting him know how hard breaking up will be because he loves her.

Forgiver:<p>Here is WAT's Plan A letter, modify as you need it. It was borrowed from plan B letter.<p>Yes, you need to snoop/sleuth since you are not there to see it. Make sure you could get someone dependable and in secret. However make sure you know how to handel the info. It is not to "fry" or confront H but use it to access how deep is H into the fog and your progress of plan A. If the A is sitll going and fullsteam, H will lie & cheat. Be ready for the worst.<p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr><strong>I get the feeling when he finally calls i should say nothing but try to be open and loving and let him know i am working on changing for me. i am taking one day at a time.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Do not give him a lot of room, hold it a bit and do not emphesize on "your part". You do not need to apologize for your part until he brought it up. Just states that you love him and disaprove/hate what he has done, and willing to work on M if he agree to seek M conseling w/ MB. Go from there and judge it your self how to open up your part and plan the seed for plan A.<p>
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr><strong>... I don't want to LB by likening his A to an addiction and letting him know how hard breaking up will be because he loves her.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yes, it is an LB, you try to educate your H. Let him figure that one out and this where you have your $ of conseling pay off. It has come from third party and let him learn.

Thanks Redhat<p> I copied and modified WAT's plan letter. However I then read his W's reaction and it seemed to backfire. I think I will hold off since he still has not called. He called one of his friends at work during a meeting so the friend could not talk. I later called friend just to keep in touch. (No one calls me because they feel awkward so I give calls from time to time to let them know I'm OK). His friend told me he had his number. I told friend I did not want it. Friend said he would not give it to me because that would put him in an awkward situation. I told friend that I did't want any one else to feel uncomfortable and I wouldn't do that to him. (I knew it would be a MAJOR LB to call). Friend said he would call my H and call me back, he never did.<p> I can see his friends have found that my H is in love w/ someone else and they are shocked but they accept him. They have told his family to just let him be and move on. They can't turn their back on him. I understand so I will no longer keep in touch so they don't feel wierd.<p> My H won't come home, school is his #1 priority. He said I was #2 and #3. I take everything w/ a grain of salt now-could be lies. If I go to him-when and if he asks, he will still be in class with her every day. I will risk my own job and future to go there and still have them continue the affair? It is a very small island. Everyone eats at the same place etc. I am looking at A going on at least another year b/c they have one more year on the island before they come back to the States. In their third year they each go to one of the Vet schools in the country. They can not choose where they go. If they both are selected to go to the same school. I am looking at another year for them to solidify their relationship. Maybe by then I will fall out of love with him? I am a very patient person but he is more patient than I am. <p> I know with us being apart none of his needs were met b/c he did not have time for me. I would call but he would only talk briefly. The only thing I could do was send him cards of how much I loved him and how proud I was of him. So maybe his need for admiration was met. It was impossible for me to fufill his sexual need. To do that would phone sex be an option? I don't know how, but I have friends that do it. Maybe they could teach me? Or is that degrading myself. I have never been willing to do it before. But I am willing to do anything to meet his needs and save or marriage. Am I grasping at straws?<p> I tried to prepare myself today that he might never call me. And although he told his sister he was thinking of moving out, maybe he was just saying what she wanted to hear? OW was standing next to him while he spoke to his sister. He told his sister he wanted his family back in his life. They said he could not do that with OW. He told his sister that "when he goes back to me it has to be 100%". He told me on d-day he does not feel 100% with me, he feels 100% with her. (How could he when he has not seen me for three months and he has been with her 24/7 for three months). <p> I take everything one day at a time. Everything he says to his family I have two interpretations. Could be the fog lifting and it's true or it could be lies to tell what is wanted to hear.
If I go to plan B someday (not ready yet). It won't really work. H has already completly cut me off and he has loans for the next two years to live off of. His rent, food, flights, everything is paid for by loans. She has the same loans. They will be in major debt when they are done. But two vets working together would make quite a bit after a few years. I have a good job and now after taking all these classes I will be making a great salery. We also rent our house out for the summer. Paying off his debts with me won't be so bad. Between my salery, his and renting our house he would be in good shape. I wish he could see that. But I know he can't right now.

Friends of ours are vets. They have another friend who went to the same school. He said when he was there, affairs and divorce were rampent. He said there were lots of married people without their spouses (MLC) and there were alot of young 20 something students. It was a bad mix. Older married folks had affairs and chose young new lovers. The new lovers saw older figures who were meal tickets with their combined incomes. Greed and selfishness really takes over. After going through this I would love to go there and set up a MB workshop to save all the marriages that are threatened down there. If the death of our marriage saves another it still would not be worth it but it would make me feel some good came out of it.<p> I just keep praying. Sorry this is so long.
Forgiver