<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Seahorse:
<strong>Hi Forgiver,<p>((((Forgiver))))<p>Are you sure your therapist has not confused my husband and yours?<p>Anyway, I'm sorry it has come to this. I don't know what else to say to you. I'm tired too.<p>Do you want to come dive the President Coolidge in Vanuatu with me?<p>Just a thought. <p>Hey, maybe we could get married? The only problem being we're not lesbians, so I guess it would be doomed from the beginning.<p>Oh well, I hope life works out for both of us. It can't get any worse anyway.<p>SH</strong><hr></blockquote><p>
Seahorse,<p>WELL AT LEAST U 2 COULD BE FLATMATES!!!! lol!<p>This ain't your thread but since you have such a good sense of humor I thought I'd responsd to U! Hope Forgiver won't mind!!! [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Just joking! [img]images/icons/tongue.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] <p>L.

Hey Everyone!<p> I'm doing fine. Thanks for checking in on me. I came home from work on Wednesday and my H was working in the yard. He fixed or drivway, thatched, seeded,fertelized and watered the lawn. He asked how my day was and I ask about his. He took the dogs to the beach and worked around the house. We didn't talk about anything involving the A or R. He went in the house took a shower and came out with his backpack and belongings. I was sitting reading on the lawn in the sun. He came and stood over me and said " I don't think I will ever be comfortable here ever again. I don't know what to do or say to you. If things change with me I'll give you a call. If things change with you, let me know." That was it word for word. I then said I had one last thing for him. I took out my plan B letter which was sealed inside a card. I told him, "This is the very last one (Meaning the last card ever- he was upset at all the cards I wrote to him while he was in St. Kitts). I even wrote it on the back of the envelope "This is the very last one." I told him he needed to read it. He told me he didn't want it I should keep it, he would n't even take it in his hands! I held it to his chest and told him he needed to read it. He told me "YOU open it and read it to me." CAN YOU BELIEVE THAT!!! He wanted Me to read it to him- Still trying to get someone else to do everything for him!! That flipped me out but I didn't show it. I just said "NO, You need to do something yourself for a change. This letter is for you and not for me. It is the last thing I will write to you and I feel you need to read it." So he took it and threw it in the car. He said "I guess I'll be in touch." I responded "No, you won't. I no longer wish for you to be in touch with me and that is why you must read the letter." He said "Fine, whatever it says to do I will." I took a step towards him to give him a hug and he totally avoided it and dodged in the car and closed the door. He waved to our dogs, said "By guys!" to them and drove off without looking back. 12 years and that's it. He left for St. Kitts the next morning.<p> I read his e-mail to OW and he said it was too weird being here. He said he felt like we were aquaintences. He said he was saying goodbye to the dogs today and sad he would never see them again. Her response was blah, blah, blah, blah, they have their whole future figured out already. And that's fine. Because I'm done. His problems are so vast at this point I do not think he could ever be stong enough to be with me. He has so many issues to get through. I realize now he was not meeting my needs before but I don't think he is capable of recovering himself and also being able to discover and meet my needs. I am too weary, weak and way ahead of him in what it takes to work at a relationship to try to help him anymore. I think you can put a fork in me. I'm done. It is amazing. My love bank has swished around it's last vintage deposits. I think I'm coasting on fumes at this point. I should have done plan B sooner to preserve the love. But since my love is so low (Gone?) it makes it easier to let go.<p> I am OK. I am at peace with myself. Like the plan says. I can look back and say I did everything I could to save my M. But I could not do it alone. My H does not have the character to do it. I realize this is not the end. He may (or may not) come crawling back in a few months. But I do not have it in me anymore to try to help him. I do not like who he has become and I do not think he will ever become the man I need. Looking back over the years, it is as if blinders have come off. I think of things that happened that I just couldn't believe but I brushed them aside. I now realize they were all indications that my h really lacks compassion especially towards me. And that is something I need and he does not have it in him. He has some serious personality problems that i never noticed. I thought he was perfect ot pretty close to it. He is extremely skilled at presenting a polished intelligent person however some of his comments and actions indication a lack of feelings and morals. That scares me that i never realized that.
So thanks to everyone for all your love and support I will still be posting but not as much. I'm getting back to my active lifestyle again. Meeting new people and doing new things. I will talk to a lawyer about a legal seperation in a few weeks. I am considering filing for D by the end of summer. I am OK. i hope you are too.
I'll be back!
Forgiver

Forgiver,<p>I am glad for you to be able to get through this storm in your life and move on. This is exactly MB delivered. It is his lost and yours too in the short term but in the long term it will his lost and your gain. You know now what to expect from a relationship and from a man ... you are fully equip w/ MB knowledge to become iresistable mate, know how to care & protect a relationship. I will envy the next person in your life. Have you listen to Alicia Key's song ?.<p>It is not that you should do plan B earlier, it was not the time. Your LB$ decrease soo much from your snooping email and get to the ineer feeling and thought of your WS. I do too, I still snoop and get more disgusted. I could not stop snooping since I need to know for my 2 D protection. She enrolled my 2 D to public school for next school year near where she live and didn't tell me about it and make me beleive that she agree to let my 2 D stay in private school at least another years. This is illegal, join legal is 50-50 .... I will use it in court. The part that make my LB$ overdraft is that she told OM that it is not only throw me off (I will have no time when my next hearing to do anything) but she said that she will have more time w/ the kids,10% more in which it will means $1k+ a month that she could pocketed. I do not want this WS no more ... snooping make it hard but I rather face the barrell of the gun and see who pull the trigger. Even you plan B earlier it won't make a diff. , your LB$ will be bankrupt anyway reading H's email and facing H's disrespect of you and himself.<p>Don't go away, I know you are hurting but MB needs you ... I consider myself only part time but the number of newbie are soo great that some of them fall through the crack. Take your time and comeback here to help others. We need you.<p>God Bless you -RH-

Forgiver, I am very sad to read your post. I know you have been to hell and back. <p>Please do not go away. When I read that, I was really sad, I do not wish to loose anymore people in my life.<p>I will keep praying.
SH

Thanks Redhat and Seahorse!<p> Seahorse! Don't worry I am not going away. I will be back and as I see it Redhat needs help helping newbies. I look forward to the opportunity to try to help through my experience. MB has made me a better person and I owe it to MB and all of you to try to help in order to repay what I have gained!<p> I am starting a class next week that will be two weeks long so I will be busy with homework and such. I also have had offers to rent my house this summer. I live in a summer hot spot. Some of you may see a special program on TV tonight about my area. I believe it is on Ch 7 around 9pm in NY. So if I rent my house I will be moving in with my parents for the summer and will not have access to my computer. But if I spend time with my brother in the city I will be able to check in from time to time. I especially want to see how you are doing Seahorse and Redhat. You two have been so instrumental in my healing and recovery.
Life is moving on and so must I. My H is with ow for 2 more years and we are in plan B. I know it will work either way. If he comes back we can try but if he does not, I am OK. I need to get out and live.<p> Speaking of which, the real estate is on their way over and I still have to vacuum. I be back later.
Forgiver

Hi Forgiver, you sound much better actually. I'm really glad. I'm sorry things worked out like they did, and who knows what the future holds?<p>Keep us up to date.
SH

Hi Forgiver, I wanted to post to you last week but I couldn't think of how to put things. I have just come back from vacation and will attempt a few lines. <p>It was painful to read the posts from you dealing with the last few weeks your H was here. It was easy to see that your LB$ was pretty empty. I was afraid for you then, and I still am. I think you may have given too much. <p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> I am OK. I am at peace with myself. Like the plan says. I can look back and say I did everything I could to save my M. But I could not do it alone <hr></blockquote><p>I can't dispute this really, but there is a lot of pain inside you - the kind that comes from expending 110% effort, and still not getting a medal. Are you dealing with that OK? That part worries me and even though we wish we could take away all your pain, we can't. So, again, are you doing OK? <p>I don't mean to doubt the part where you said that you are at peace, I just worry about you. So, tell me I'm wrong, and I will be happy. I suspect that you know that you did all you could but you hurt that it wasn't enough. That is the part I hope you feel better about soon. <p>
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> But I could not do it alone. My H does not have the character to do it. I realize this is not the end. He may (or may not) come crawling back in a few months. But I do not have it in me anymore to try to help him. I do not like who he has become and I do not think he will ever become the man I need. Looking back over the years, it is as if blinders have come off. I think of things that happened that I just couldn't believe but I brushed them aside. I now realize they were all indications that my h really lacks compassion especially towards me. And that is something I need and he does not have it in him. <hr></blockquote> <p>I wonder about anyone that does what he did. I wonder if my W did something like this if I could even try. You did do great. But - and this is a big one, remember that God can change people. If you are done, then you are done, but if you are in plan B to wait and see, then wait . . . and we'll see in time. You sounded so - well, so finished. How long are you going to give things? <p>If you are really done, please go for a D before you seek other relationships. It looks to all of us like you really did do all that you could, and you should be at peace about your efforts. Don't spoil what you have done. After doing so well and being so focused for such a long time, please don't let down your guard and spoil your perfection. <p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> . . . . .thanks to everyone for all your love and support I will still be posting but not as much. <hr></blockquote> <p>Since we really do care about you, we hope you will let us know what you are doing. I truly believe that someday you will again enjoy marital bliss. God reserves his choicest blessings for those that never give up. Keep doing as you have and I believe you will qualify. <p>I hope this comes across as I intended it, as encouragement. Never ment it any other way. <p>All the best,
SS

Thank you Seahorse and Still Seeking,<p> I want you to be assured that I am OK. Yes i hurt and the pain is there. But I can not let it fester and I am trying to find a way to let it out in a healthy way. But I feel i am OK and i do not want anyone to worry.<p> After being with my husband for that short time and knowing he has been with the OW since May 30 I have a harder time dealing and telling myself that I can forgive him and take him back. He has so much to overcome and I have grown so much. I do not see how we can meet in the middle anymore. Over the past few weeks I have had some friends ask me some pretty poigient(spelling???) questions. While going through this, I looked back on my relationship as being wonderful and in some respects it was. However I have also come to realize that although it appeared perfect it was a mask. I did not know then but I recognize now that I had needs that are very important to me that were not met. I can also see that I put him before my own needs and just wanted everything to be perfect while sacrificing myself. I overlooked so much and brushed aside incidences that I now understand were glimpses of the selfish person I married.
I do not want to be bitter. I want to put this behind me and move forward. I want to be loved and I recognize I am very vulnerable right now. But I also recognize that I do not have the strength in me to move on in my life alone for the next two - three years and wait for God to touch my H's heart. God never really was in his heart to begin with. I once said I would wait it out no problem. However I feel I will become even more bitter and angry at my H for not only shattering my dreams but for stealing away 2-3 more yeaars while I wait for him to come out of the fog.<p> I want to have children. I am 30 years old. So in some respects I have some time, while on the other hand if I wait 2-3 more years for my h and then it takes 2-3 more years for us to get through this- at that point I am looking at being a first time mom at an older age. My clock is not ticking today. But I feel if I end it soon. I will have the 2 years I would have spent waiting for my H I could seek out another equal, who will meet my most important needs. I am aching to fill someone else's needs. I am lonely and have realized my mortality. I do not want to rush into anything and I realize I need more time and understanding. But time to me is of the essence.

I do not know when the right time to set things in motion is. I have only spoken to one lawyer. I understand I will have to lose my house, the one stability, the one thing that is mine. All I want is to keep my house and move on. I have even considered changing my job to begin a new chapter in my life. I know I can not make any life altering decisions at this point. But my wheels are turning. <p> Someone here once used an awesome analogy "That the door had closed and I have spent so long staring at the closed door I didn't realize a window opened behind me." I want to turn around and see what is out the window. I don't know what the right thing to do is anymore. <p> I still go day by day. I have not cried in two weeks. But it is so hard to go to work everyday and everyone thinks my H is at home. I told them he took a semester off and would return to school in September. So everyone thinks we are having our second honeymoon, they joke everyday and say what a wonderful couple we are. It kills me. I have had to get out of so many situations, Friends invite "us" out for dinner- I have to come up with an excuse. I have several job related functions where spouses attend and I have to make more excuses. Everyone thinks we are camping crazy because I "go camping" every weekend to avoid social functions. Everyone keeps asking when is my h going to come to work (he used to show up). Everyday I have to cover for him, for us. It is draining in itself. I hate telling lies- I never did before. Now because of this, because of him- I am not being truthful to my friends and co-workers. That is not who I am, so why am I letting him have this effect on me? I know it is non of their business but when this gets out I really will have a hard time. I am a teacher and thus a public figure in a very small town where stories get twisted.<p> It is all too much sometimes and thus the fantasy of renting my house and leaving to teach in a bigger city. I don't know anymore. All I do know is I want to share my life with someone. I have been alone for a year already (since last april). I now know he started with OW 2 weeks after he got there. So their relationship is over 1 year long. I have a hard time wraping my brain around that one. I am having a harder time forgiving. I just want to let go and move on. But when??<p>I'm sorry I went on so long. And now I am down when I told you I was OK. I am ok and I thank you for looking out for me. Please do not think I would take it any other way Still Seeking. I value your concern and input. It got me through today and struck me. Move on and file so I do not spoil a perfect plan. I fear I will meet someone who will meet my needs and I will be torn as what to do. I have had some interset but made it perfectly clear I was not available. It was interesting that they said they would wait and to consider them if my feelings change. I do not know how long I have to wait. I am stuck. <p> I am afraid to take the final step because I know there is no going back. But I do not want to go back. So ultimatelly it is the fear of doing something and losing my home that is keeping my planted. I have to go speak to a few more lawyers. If I could keep my home and sign papers tomorrow, I would. Oh geez, what am I gonna do? Sorry guys I just got so down again. I'm gonna go watch Craig Kilborn and hopefully get a laugh!
Speaking of laugh... I went to get gas today and there at the counter..... was a vile package with the words.............................. HORNY GOAT WEED!!! written across it. I burst out laughing, everyone thought I was crazy- but I though of you Seahorse! Thanks for my laugh today. I hope you all enjoy some laughter today.
Goodnight Everyone!
Forgiver

OK Forgiver, I can tell your really down. I recognise this same talk from after my holiday in Cairns-I felt the same way. Too scared to move ahead in case I regretted it, too scared to stay where I was in case I regretted it. When I got back from Cairns, can you remember? I was ready to take off up there, ready to live the bohemiam (spelling?) life to get away from this mess, but the problem with mum came up and I knew it was God saying, 'stay right where you are young lady, you're going to deal with this and you going to find your purpose in life'. So I stayed and I'm dealing with it. I was crying nearly all the time, I was up and down like a yoyo, but I knew everytime I faced the pain that next time it would get a little less, and it has. I've let H go now, I decided that there was no use try to control all these situations or him because I just can't, and everytime I try to, I become unhappy and frustrated.<p>Forgiver look for my post under GQII about filling the void, it was a great book I read and really helped a lot as a 'plan' of how I would deal with each time I fell back into grief and pain. Its by Dorothy Bullitt and it really is very good, plus its short, so it should be a one night job for you!! (just kidding).<p>I know the feeling of wanting to move on too, but I know for now, no other man would have much of a chance, and it wouldn't be fair to do that to someone, especially myself. Imagine another relationship breakdown in a few months Forgiver, could you handle that? (hey another great book is 'Before you Love Again' by John Hosie, it talks about this issue and lots of other stuff from a Christian perspective - I'm not Christian, but I know you are and it might help, it was a fantastic book). <p>I'm different to you Forgiver, in that I'm not that fussed about children. H & I talked about it, and I think that was part of what made him run, I thought about what it would have been like if I were a single mum, I'd hate it. If I had a dedicated H who could bring up kids 50% with me, I'd have one or two, but its not a burning issue for me.<p>In the end Forgiver, you are the only person who can decide what you are to do with the rest of your life, same for your H, same for OW, same for everyone else in this world. Its called freewill, and we all have it.<p>I wish I could give you a big hug right now. We have given so much to our H's and forgotten ourselves, but now is the time for us to reclaim our lives Forgiver, before you give yourself over to another man, sieze this opportunity for you because you really deserve it.<p>With regard to people at work, you're right, its none of their bloody business and you don't have to give them any information or tell them anything. There are 3 people at my work who know H dosen't live with me, the other's ask 'How's H?' I say "Oh fine" and move away, either changing the subject or just smiling away at them. Other's ask what I'm doing on the weekend "nothing much", "this and that", "just having a bit of fun" I'm never specific, that way I don't feel bad that I've lied (because I haven't), but I haven't given them any iformation about what is just absolutely none of their business. Set you boundaries with them Forgiver, like you did with your H, you don't have to be tough or anything, just do it with a smile one your face [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] . you don't owe anyone anything, you've done your absolute best, you are a winner no matter what the outcome of this marriage because you have the knowledge of how to make the next one awsome, whether that be with your H or some other lucky guy.<p>Hang on Forgiver, we know you can do this.<p>Hey by the way, you may all laugh at my Horny Goat Weed but its working for me [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Chow SH

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> I do not know how long I have to wait. I am stuck. <hr></blockquote><p>No, you are not stuck, you know what to do, you know there is no reason to wait. I agree that your home is the only thing keeping you. If I understand, your choices are to wait until he gets out of school and gets a job and then you could keep the house. Or, loose the house and file now. It will be easier to make house payments with a friend, helpmeet and companion than to live as you are now. You could always get a loan on the house as it is, and make payments back to the bank? It sounds as though the house is paid for? If not, this wouldn't work. Anyway, if it's possible, this would give you some stability and lessen the changes that you are forced to make. <p>I am sorry about your pain. This is the post ( from you) that I had expected earlier. I didn't really want to pull out all these feelings from you, but felt you needed to get rid of them. I feel it is time for you to move on, I must agree with you on this one. <p>Seahorse has a good system for dealing with inquires. I bet it will work for you. And she is right about you being able to make it. You will. <p>I hope you two get to meet someday, on a holiday with your Husbands. I suspect you may do it in the future. It will be good for you both. And I suspect that someday many of us will meet beyond this world and give each other the hugs and support that we longed to do here. It will be a much happier time and place. <p>In the mean time, there is a whole big world waiting out there for you. Go after it. ( but I suggest very, very slowly. Be careful, we don't want you to get hurt again. Find someone that is willing to learn HNHN so you can have a happy life - as you will be able to give to them. You know all the rules about how long, etc.<p>I would like to comment on your whole post, but you don't need it, and I don't have time. My biggest worry was not that you had the pain, we knew that you did, it was that you would not know what to do with it. I see that you are working through it properly, so I won't worry quite so much. But I reserve the right to worry a little. [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img] <p>I won't even touch the Horney Goat Weed jokes. [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] <p>See you around. <p>SS<p>[ June 07, 2002: Message edited by: still seeking ]</p>

Hi Forgiver, just wondering how you're doing?

Hey Seahorse and everyone else!!<p> I am doing great! i am taking my last three credits to bump me up to Masters plus 78 extra credits which puts me at the top bracket on my payscale!! Very happy!! I will get a raise in September! Been avoiding all work functions since my H is always the topic of conversation. Thanks for your advice Seahorse. i have been pretty much doing what you said. Being pleasant and changing the conversation. The only tough part is, is that some friends are retiring and are hoping to see my H before they leave. They are having a big dinner this weeekend. I told everyone we are going camping and he will hopefully be up to see everyone next week (our last week).<p> THings are going tgreat with me. I have put him behind me and am living totally for me. I do n ot wait for his calls or e-mails because I know they are not coming. I have limited my contact with his family and only give them superficial information. They still hold out hope things will turn around but at this point I am moving forward. I am doing things I've never done before like go to Manhattan alone to see friends. I 've never driven in the city alone I was always too scared. But once I did it- WOW! It's easy. A great self-esteem boost! I have been going alone to visit friends, something I've never done. I feel very independent.
The situation with my H seems like a dream. I am getting stronger each day and I feel good. People notice a difference in me and make me feel good about it. I am surviving and thriving just like you Seahorse!! At this point I am not looking forward to my H to come back. My love had run out. If I could sign papers tomorrow and have it be done with I would do it. I try not to think about him and hardly do. When he crosses my mind all I can think about is that he is with her, having sex and doing everything else. I am disgusted. As each day goes by it is easier to let go. It is surreal. I am going to see a few lawyers in July to try to get a separation and then possibly file for the big D. Each day I wish I was free and could put this behind me.<p> I have met some very interesting people both male and female and shared my story with a few. It feels good to not have to hide anything. I am not ashamed I have not done anything wrong. Unfortunately some very interseting men have become interested in me and when thery persue I am forced to lay it out. Look I'm married and can not get involved. I don 't want to hurt them or lead them on and I do not want to have an affair myself. I will not stoop to that level. That is part of the reason I want it to be over with. I know it is too soon to start anew. But I do enjoy spending time with other people and then I have to spill my guts and once again I am alone. I have patience and am a person of morals so I am well aware of the vulnerability I face right now. I am starving for affection but have to brush off advances and stand my ground. It is very frustrating. I am meeting people who are looking for someone else and I am not an option at this point. I feared dating but have been relieved that there are some really wonderful people out there. I am not bitter and am looking forward to one day being ready to fully move on and meet someone new. I am just so lonely. But I keep busy and surround myself with friends and family.<p> My parents are still in the beginning reeling stages and are haveing such a hard time with all of this. They have always seen me as there baby and they want to take the pain away and protect me. But they see how strong and independent I have become and are confused as to how well I am taking this. I tyr to help them but they need time. They want to help me but don't know how.<p> Redhat, WAT, Orchid, Still Seeking and everyone else how are you!!!!???? I think of you all every day and pray you do better than I have.
Orchid- I feed my orchids once a week with Petersons Orchid food but they have not bloomed in over a year. Can you give me any help?
Redhat - How are you holding up? I hope you and your 2 D's are doing well. I am very fond of you and hope you are happy.
Seahorse- One of my friends is planning a 2 -3 week trip to down under. He asked me to go but I can't. VERY TEMPTING!!!! I hope to one day come and see you. Any suggestions as to what he shpuld definately do? He is a triathlete and will be snowboarding (In Australia?), scuba diving, moutainbiking, rock climbing, hiking and exploring. He is very out going and going alone. I told him I would ask you for suggestions. Where do you live again?<p> Agian, I hope you are all well and I will be checking back in a few days.
Forgiver

Hi Forgiver, I'm glad you're doing well, just remember, you owe no one an explanation about where your H is. You may have to keep fending off questions, just do it as nicely as possible and they will soon get the message. <p>A counsellor explained it to me this way. there was an experiment with two pigeons. One got crumbs at irregular intervals when it pecked at something (I don't know what the something was-can't remember) sometimes when it pecked it got crumbs, sometimes it didn't, the other didn't get crumbs when it pecked. The one who got no crumbs gave up, the other stayed there forever and kept pecking. Don't give them any more crumbs Forgiver, eventually they will give up and go away.<p>I'm glad you're getting out and about by yourself. Isn't it just the most liberating thing? I know it sound weird and I must have lived a really sheltered life, but sometimes I just love that I'm am doing totally what I want at that moment. I don't even have to tell anyone where I am, or justify why I'm there!!<p>I live in Sydney Forgiver, actually about an hour out of it. Yes, we do have snow, not like in other countries, but the ski fields do get frequented and I believe its pretty good (I've only been skiing twice). Its not like New Zealand or Aspen, but its OK. If he likes the social life, well, I'm sorry, but you can't beat Aussies for that!! (Does he like to drink alcohol, especially beer???? If he does, there will be no problem).<p>If he scuba dives, depending where he's going there are lots of places. If he's coming to Sydney he's could try what I did and dive in the Manly Ocean World with the Grey Nurse Sharks, website is www.prodive.com.au - they also have lots of info re dives around Australia. The only thing is the water is cold around Sydney 17o celcius. brrr, but I still enjoyed my dive. <p>There are heaps of other sites around Sydney, or if he's heading north, there's always Cairns - the Great Barrier Reef. It would be much warmer up there too - the tropics. Where is he going? Australia's a pretty big country and you need time to get around. <p>Forgiver, I am worried for you, I know you sound well, but are you allowing yourself to grieve? I have been up and down with devastation. Your H may or may not be a lost cause and the R may or may not have been what you thought it was, but it still hurts. Let yourself grieve now, don't put it off till later, its harder to process then. There's a website I found with lots of info about grief and loss and other things its www.lifechallenges.org . It may interest you.<p>If these men are interested in you and like you enough they will wait for you. The most important person now is you, please allow yourself time. <p>But the attention does give you a lift dosen't it? [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img] <p>I too have thought about what it would be like to have to start dating again and frankly it scares me half to death! I wouldn't know what to do with a new man once I got him anyway!! For God's sake, I've been married far too long to start back at this again. I haven't thought about any of that since I was 19!<p>Try not to think about what your H has done with her. I find it hurts too much and we don't really know what its like. Don't allow your mind to do it. To get where you are in your field you must have a finely tuned mind, so, put it to work! Even though its hard, try to forgive him, it will only set you free. You don't want to be tied to him forever with these emotions.<p>If you've read my thread you'll know the last week has been hard, but I'm getting there. <p>Anyway, let me know where your friends going in Australia and I'll see what info I can dig up (websites of course). Gosh, I really wish you were coming with him, I would love to meet you. One day Forgiver, one day...<p>SH<p>PS Congrats on the Masters, and the payrise. See, being the best Forgiver you can be is the best revenge!<p>[ June 13, 2002: Message edited by: Seahorse ]<p>[ June 13, 2002: Message edited by: Seahorse ]</p>

I am doing pretty good, ( except I worry about you and seahorse) <p>I'll let you go for another week, but seahorse is right, you need to process the pain in order for it to go away. <p>Congrats on all you have acomplished. You are one great lady. <p>I think someday you two will meet. You ought to plan it now and make it work, You would both have a ball with it, and think of the strength it would be for both of you. <p>Please continue to be careful. When you do start looking, you know enough to choose carefully and get someone that can live up to what you have become. And they have to pass our inspection. LOL. [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Both happy and sad for you. But happier it will be, we all know that. <p>SS<p>[ June 13, 2002: Message edited by: still seeking ]</p>

My dear Forgiver, <p>You sound good. It makes my heart happy to know that his dumb situation and pain are something you can put in better perspective and realize that there is more to life than waiting for a WS to make up their mind. <p>We will all eventually get to that point and it is not a logical step it is a emotional one. So even though we know we need to get there until we are emotionally ready it takes time. That is why it is important to be patient. <p>I am fine. I visit MB daily and read up on both you and Seahorse. I have fun listening to the 2 of you talk about what you are doing. Makes me wish I was younger. LOL!!! [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p>U 2 have your lives ahead of you. You have had your share of pain but instead of it holding you back, you are both showing that you have learned and moved forward. Iam quite proud of you 2 ladies!!!! [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] <p>I think it would be great for the 2 of you to meet one day. Seahorse is such an adventurous person and you 2 seem like you'd make great traveling buddies. I don't know about the swimming with sharks thingyy!!! <p>Anyway, please take care. Move forward in your life with grace and dignity. Regardless of where your H is. He will see you blossom and wonder why he is not beside you. Let him wonder. His wandering now and getting nowhere. You though are moving forward with a goal and purpose. Very different strides and paths. Maybe they will cross or not either way, you will be ok. <p>take care,
L.

Forgiver,<p>Glad that you are ready to move on. Thanks for asking, I am fine. Summer Visitation Schedule kicked in, we have alternate week. Last week I am lost w/o my 2 D [img]images/icons/blush.gif" border="0[/img] , they are the center of my universe right now. I will have them this Saturday 'till next Saturday then off we go to regional championship @Fresno. I called my mom and she came right away from my country (19 hours flight) which is closer to Seahorse than here. I am rebuilding my life. Our property is sold, she will have lots of $ to spend on OM by next week. I use mine to roll it over to buy another property (2-4 units) and plan to live in one of them. This save me $40K+ in taxes plus to have my 2 D stays in the same private school at least for another year. This time I will be a handyman & a slave for myself. I still have to attend mediation meeting for review of CC on July & Dv hearing on mid August. Oh, I will have 6 weeks sabatical starting end of July. I will be in Lincoln, Nebraska ... the state where rev lives for my 2 D national championship. Then I will be traveling or stuck fixing the fixer upper property that I saw today. I mean Californian fixer upper !!!, Orchid knows well how it is. Even your dog won't live in it.<p>Hiya, Orchid ... age is only in term of your spirit. We are the one should join in swimming with the shark ... LOL !!! we tasted enough of life and they still have plenty ahead of them. How about skydiving ?, I have never done it before, I do it if you will [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] . I think there is one in south bay. When you are passed as solo diver then you could bring your H as tandem buddy ... do you think he will trust you ? ... LOL !!!. I know my WW won't trust me.<p>-RH-

Forgiver,<p>I gotta make a confession. I am not an orchid grower ( I have 2 plants also with no blooms). Orchids are just my favorite flower. My dad gave me a white orchid lei when he gave me away at our wedding. Made the a lot in the audience cry!!!! <p>So I don't how to give you good advice. I can find out since a good friend is an orchid grower and he lives just down the street. He gave 2 orchid plants that I used in our wedding ceremony over 12 years ago and even though they are up in years (80+) we used to take them to the annual orchid show in the city. <p>Redhat......skydiving? The way I feel right now I would say sure. I'll bet my H would also. I am usually not that adventurous but I would still refrain from swimming with sharks. If I was the OW in Seahorses' situation, I would fear Seahorse more than anything. If she can swim with the sharks, she can handle anyone!!! <p>Hey Seahorse..... you wanna go and take care of PBR for me? I got 2 more calls at the house today. Arrgghhh...... [img]images/icons/mad.gif" border="0[/img] I already had 1 volunteer from another MBer to go take care of her!! LOL! Just kidding. [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] <p>How are you doing Forgiver?<p>L.

Hi Forgiver, how are you? <p>Hey Orchid, I haven't been scared yet of anything in the water. I relax once I get down there its such a fascinating experience. These creatures are letting you into their homes!! The scariest part is actually submersing your head and wondering if the air tanks working. <p>I thought about skydiving, but its just the thought of willingly throwing myself out of a plane that dosen't sit well. [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img]

Hey All!<p> Just checking in! Doing very well, keeping busy! You make me laugh Seahorse! I am so glad you found shark diving! I used to go with my H. We also dove with sea turtles and rays. Watch out for those turtle beaks!!! It was alot of fun. I am considering going on some dives again. I just have to sign up with a buddy.<p> I have been talking to some friends about skydiving. Several want to go, some already have. I am on the fence on that one. LOL! I am also looking into climbing the giant sequoias in Cali. You can climb and sleep in suspended tents over night. It looks beautiful. I saw it in smithsonian magazine. I am also looking into Australia. They have Camel caravans that take two weeks to see the out back. Watch out Seahorse!! I'm coming to ya! But that trip won't be foe awhile. I have to find someone to go with.<p> Anyone have any other suggestions? I'm looking for life altering experiences to embrace it to the fullest!<p> Hope you are all OK! I'm hanging in there but doing fine. Trying to grieve as you tell me I must. Trying to get it out but I just want to live and not let this waste anymore of my life. I want to do the right thing and take time to mourn but I feel life is passing me by. I am off to therapy!
Forgiver

Hi Forgiver, you sound well. the Grief will hit you then go, it will come, you feel it, cry, yell, pray, do what you have to do then let it go. Then things will get better. Then it will hit you again. You won't do it all in one go, its not possible, you would collapse emotionally if you did it in one go. <p>Its like rolling a ball of string. You wind, wind wind, then drop the ball and it unravels a bit, you pick it up again and start winding again, but never again will you have to start from the begining. (Haven't I told you this story yet). <p>Wow, camels in the outback will really be life changing. Our desert is harse terrain, you will see some amazing things and meet amazing people. If its in a year I'll meet you there (just give me time to save up, I've still got to buy a bike helmet, and pay for a trip to Vanuatu yet!!) [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] <p>I believe Kakadu and Litchfield National Parks (In the Northern Territory also) are very beautiful, especially if you like birdlife. Lots of camping and its run by our Aborigines.<p>Then again you could go south to the Great Australian Bite, they have cages where you can dive with Great White Sharks - now THAT would set your priorities straight [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img]