You are doing great Seahorse!<p> Having him out of the house gives you more time to focus your attention on you and what you want to do. Make yourself happy. that retail therapy is great! Buy clothes, get hair nails done. I'm not sure about the ring. It may be a painful reminder but then again maybe it would be good. <p> Did you go horse riding Sunday? That killed me when I read that. I have a horse. I keep him at a barn 10 minutes away. I used to see him every day for at least 3 hours. Brushing and riding. <p> Since D-day I have been to the barn only to pay my board. It is so painful to go to the barn and I don't know why. I think guilt. All the time I spent with my horse when I should have been with my husband. When my H told me he wanted to go to vet school. I totally supported him. I told him I would do anything. Sell the house, move etc. But I did ask him not to make me give up my dream, my horse. I have always wanted to own my own horse. I have had my horse for 3 years. I told him I totally support your dream but please don't ask me to give up mine. He told me it would make sense to get rid of my horse because of the money (Only 300 a month, NOT alot)but he told me I did not have to give him up. So I kept him. I love him. But since D-day I can't bring myself to go see him. <p> He is turned out on 15 acres of grass fields with another horse. He gets fed 2 times a day by the man that lives there. He watches over him for me but does not do anything. I used to brush him for 2 hours a day and keep him impeccably clean. Now his hair is long, unkempt and matted with mud. It kills me to see him like that but I feel hollow when I am at the barn. As soon as I clean him up and turn him out into the fields, he rolls in a mud puddle. The kills me too. <p> I told the guy at the barn i was having a family problem and I couldn't go to the barn for awhile. I told him I was basically retireing him and letting him just hang out and be dirty and wild. I am thinking of giving him back to his owner (she gave him to me with the understanding I could not sell him or destroy him, she has had him since he was 1 yr old). My taxes went up and thus my mortage went up 300- the cost to keep him. It's so tough.
I can't enjoy him anymore and he used to be my release and solace. Oh well. Maybe I will see him tomorrow.
Forgiver

Forgiver I understand u completely. I was like this with my garden, my home, my studies. I was so proud of it, kept it so beutiful. I have managed to keep the home up, but the garden and studies has become a bother. I did a little yesterday, just enough to get rid of the weeds and keep it alive till I come back. Frankly I don't want to live here anymore anyway. The only reason I haven't moved is my dog. Thank god for my doggy, he just looks at me, so sad. He is with my in laws while I go on holiday. So i'm here alone. I'm so alone. Its not that there isn't anyone around, its that I don't want anyone around. I just want peace, people here at MB, I don't have to explain my feelings too. Why I'm sad, why I'm so thin, everyone here knows. <p>I'm so confused about what to do. The pain in my chest, its just crushing. I'm in turmoil.<p>If I forget about the marriage, I can get over this pain, start again. maybe meet someone new. <p>If I forget about the marriage, I can stay bitter, grow old by myself and have a dog as a companion for the rest of my life, or go and donate my time to some worthy cause.<p>If I forget about the marriage I can get over this pain, and not start again, just be by myself.<p>If I choose to go on with this marriage, I can see a lot of heartache, more ddays, more lies, more pain. No one to support me because everyone's sick of hearing about it, and why do I want him anyway.<p>If I choose to go on with this marriage, he may decide to become a part of it, it may be wonderful. <p>But what are my chances of the latter? 10-15%. By his actions in the last few weeks, I don't see much hope. <p>Forgiver you are lucky, the A is dying all by itself. I can't see that happening here, not before she has weedled her way to getting pregnant so she can come to Australia. I know it sounds cynical, but its what I see happening. He will leave Thailand and be more caught up in it, until she gets another visitors visa to stay here, then it will be on again - I'm sure that's why he wants to move out, so that he can carry on this affair without my interference. I don't know if I'm strong enough to go through all this again. <p>I don't want this again, it will kill me.

Basically, he sms'd to tell me Chang Mai is awsome. I'm sad for me, but happy for him he is enjoying the trip. Great [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] <p>I'm feeling better, in Cairn's had some sun, feeling more like a human being again. Let options open by calling him, but still very much undecided. Not sure what to do re WH. Until he admits its an affair, we can't deal with it. <p>Not sure about the moving out thing, very unhappy as he's buying more time with her. <p>I'll keep thinking, keep posting. <p>Forgiver, tried to go parasailing, but foiled again, I always seem to miss out. Still, start the dive course tomorrow so can't complain.

Bye

Seahorse!
Good for you! You go Girl! Have fun! Enjoy yourself. Totally indulge! Are you alone or with some friends?<p> Parasailing sounds awesome I'd love to do that. Have you windsurfed? Try it and tell me how easy/hard it is. I've always wanted to do that.
Have fun diving!! But DON'T drink the night before you dive. Not good. Very dangerous but I forget why.<p> Keep me posted!
Forgiver

Seahorse!<p> Where are you? Having fun i hope. I bet you look awesome with a tan and the new body you have. Must be knocking out all the boys with your good looks. Hope your self-esteem is on the rise!
Keep me posted to all the fun you are having! You're always in my thoughts!
Forgiver

Things aren't real great. Got a thudding return to reality yesterday. MIL rang me and started asking me where I was, who I was keeping in contact with. Then later that evening got a sms that he wanted me to stop playing games and to leave him alone. I don't know what happened or what I've done, he would not call me back. The last 24 hours have been hell.<p>Cairns was excellent and I had so much fun. I realised there's another life waiting for me, one that I really want to do for a while. No one to answer to or tell me what to do. Life was easy, stress free, people are friendly. Yes, it was a holiday, but I'm told its always like this, an alternative lifestyle.<p>I decided that I am going to initiate a financial split and go walkabout. If H wants me back in six months or a year, then it was meant to be, if not, then there will be no regrets. I feel I have done all I can, he has been telling his friends that I am happy for him to move out for six months and live the bachelor life (ie have sex with other women) - I have never said that, he's only hearing what he wants to. He wants the cake and eat it too. I really feel like I have to break free, I want to experience life too, and I can't do it here, in this house, with this situation. I can't take the stress and the confnement. I never wanted to live here, I have wanted to take off life this for a long time, but was never allowed to (by him). <p>I still love him, and would still like him back, but I truly cannot cope with this pain. I am really starting to resent what he is doing. I'm starting to hate him. I feel like ****. I am starting to feel like I would be better off dead, I don't want to go thru that again. <p>Being up in Cairns was really fun, for a few days there was no worries, it was so good. Yes Forgiver, I spoke to all sorts of people, but I seem to attract 22 year olds guys. My dive instructor was so nice, I was terrified he would ask me out for a drink as it seemed to be heading in that direction(he didn't), but for two days I really felt like someone appreciated me. It felt good, I haven't felt like that for a while.<p>Nothing happened, nor did I want it too, but it made me think about this whole situation. I never asked for this situation, I don't think I did anything to deserve it (although I seem to be laden with guilt), I certainly don't agree with it, and its slowly torturing me to death. <p>Tomorrow I'm going to apply for 6 months or a year off work. I have notified my lawyer to start a financial split, and when he returns on Monday, my H is not going to like what I have to tell him. I am so scared of doing it, but I know, in my heart this is the only thing that will work. I know you all don't agree with this, but I do know my husband. He needs a shock right now and a big one. I risk loosing him but the other risk is loosing myself. I have to do this, it feels right.

Seahorse,<p>I am happy you are stronger and become a better person. Yes, we all want our SO back and repent however there are price to pay. At some point the price is too steep depending on individual situation. It is a balance situation when BS reach at this point and very scary for both WS&BS.<p>Becarefull w/ your own A, it is very easy to do and we are all at a very dangerous situation emotionally. You are still married.<p>MB never promote saving M at any cost. You know what best for you & your M, there is time when BS has to stop it. We try our best to save M but if that is not working we have to try to save ourself. Just be strong and many has survive this.<p>God Bless you. -RH-

Seahorse,<p>Redhat is right. Only you can decide what is best in your M. You know the situation, we are only outsiders looking in. I am glad that you had a good vacation. You seem to be stronger and up for the challenges that face you. That is good. <p>I agree with you that sometimes the pain is to great and you have to take a step back for awhile. <p>We are all concerned for you. I have been following your posts for a long time -- yours was one of the first posts I read when I first came here.<p>Good luck. Stay strong. Let us know how things are going.<p>FHO

Tripping off is not an option right now. <p>I called my dad today to let him know I was back. He told me my mum has deteriorated. She is in a nursing home (6yrs approx) with Parkinsons and Dementia, and can no longer be fed. We are going to see a doc on monday, but basically the options are 1. Have an operation to insert a feeder - the operation may kill her, or 2. Leave her to die. My initial reaction was get the op, but now I'm thinking that I don't know. She is in pain, would we be prolonging it?<p>I can't go tripping off, my dad needs me. Maybe when its over, it will be a better time. I think this may be a sign that I need to stay and deal with all this stuff.<p>Its a real blow, I've grieved for mum already, but this will be final, she will die.<p>I have to tell H, I hope he will support me (emotionally). I still want to separate finances and just let him go. It willl be so hard to concentrate on the marriage and mum. If H really cares about me, he'll be there for me. If not, then there won't be anything to save anyway. <p>I'm so numb, I don't feel anything. No love, no pain, no frustration, just numb. Its a scary feeling.<p>I wish my H was here and with me, but it can't be. I'm so sad all this has happened. We had the best life together, we supported each other. We were best friends. I wish I could understand why, but I can't and that really hurts. If I had addressed the problems we had earlier maybe I could have prevented this. I regret that very much. I feel very guilty about that. Like I let both of us down. <p>In hindsight there is always 20/20 vision.

Felt very sad today, seem to still have feelings for my H. I don't understand how I can still care for someone who has hurt me so badly- after each turn of the knife I thought that would be it, sometimes it sure feels like it - is this normal?<p>I'm not looking forward to Monday - H returns and dad and I see the doc re mum, what a day. I don't know what H will come back as. I don't know how he will take the financial split - I think he will be very angry, and that scares me, deep down I don;t want him to hate me. I just got a credit card bill, he's spending big, he's scaring me.<p>Plus the move out, and live the single life business. He want to keep repayments going on the house so that keeps me here. I know this for sure, his friends have told me this. Apparently if he does this it justifies whatever he does - I'm to be a kept woman. <p>They say he's really confused, that he dosen't know what to do. I really need patience. Half a me has my running shoes on, the other half wants him still. I know I have to be tougher with him, otherwise he will walk all over me. It was him who said he didn't like to see people walk all over me, so maybe standing up to him will wake him up, plus I feel like I can't let him have it all his way. I won't respect myself if i don't do this. <p>One half of me dosen't respect myself any more the other says hang on. Am I normal? <p>What's scaring me is that I feel numb when i think about mum dying. Why don't I feel anything? I should feel something.

Liz - I think everyone here would certainly validate your feelings. You have a tremendous emotional load right now and you're doing remarkably well, I think. Dern right it's tough.<p>Don't expect those feelings for your H to evaporate anytime soon - if ever. If that were possible this website wouldn't exist. You are a normal, compassionate person who has been emotionally raped. But guess what - I'll bet your H is FAR more confused than you are. He just doesn't have the sense right now to recognize it. His friends telling you that he's confused is an independent vote of validation to you.<p>I've said it before, but I keep coming back to this because it helped me so much: think of your H as that alien abductee who has been experimented on. Currently, he is not your H inside. If that doesn't work, think of him as temporarily insane, or brainwashed, or sick, or ANYTHING other than the man who is your H. It is very likely that your REAL H will re-emerge - when this will occur cannot be predicted - but it is very likely. This doesn't mean that your marriage will be restored - you know that - but it does mean that you may have a go at it.<p>In the meantime, tend to your self. Focus on your parents. If it's too distracting to interface with your H, let us help you write a Plan B letter. Leave the legal and money stuff to your attorney.<p>And, one more time - are you taking those meds?<p>Dave

Hi WAT, Had a great day today, feel good, forgot all problems for the day. Indulged in a little retail therapy then went to Bondi Beach. For a city beach, its still beautiful.<p>H comes home tomorrow, I'm scared, as you said, I don't know if I get the real H or the alien abducted one - I'm expecting the later. But Mum and Dad will be my focus for a little while now.<p>I'm trying to join a dive club too, I figure the more I can distract myself with the better. That's always been a downfall of mine, I tend to 'give things up' to help others, and then I get frustrated and bored. <p>WAT, I only took two of the meds, and that was months ago. I went to a psych and he suggested not to take them, I am in counselling and have an appointment to see the psych again in a few weeks. I have the meds but don't want to take them yet.<p>I will update again tomorrow if I can

Seahorse
You are so strong and you have come such a long way! You give me inspiration and strength. Look at all you have done and how well you have done it! I am so proud of you!<p> He is confused AWESOME!! That's great! I love it when they are confused because there is HOPE! Remember redhat's words... It is still early. Give it time. Only you know how long you can stay in the game. It is up to you but you have done a fantastic job so far. I say keep going. But that may only be because I feel so close to you since I find our situations similar and if you give up maybe I should too.<p> WAT is so right and has such a wonderful way of saying exactly the right things I wish I were that knowledgable and eloquent. Listen to WAT.<p> I am so sorry about your Mum and Dad. Be there for them. Put your time and energy into them. Thisway when you look back you will not feel bad that you should have been there but couldn't because of your H. Don't let your H rob you of this precious time with your parents. make every second count.
Be your best
Forgiver
PS Love that dream post with Brad Pitt

Hi guys, H rang last night and said he was coming home today, but going straight to his new appartment [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img] I couldn't help but sound disappointed, I tried to sound supportive. I should know by now not to EXPECT ANYTHING.<p>I told him about mum, he sounded concerned, so thank god, he's not totally alien, I think it would have been a big LB (to me), if he hadn't. <p>I got the impression, by the way he was talking (very businesslike) that he had her there. Oh well, had some warm milk and went to sleep, need my beauty sleep!!<p>I'm still hanging in Forgiver, although my pride is dented by doing this. I can give it a go for a little longer even though my ego says not to. Then I read a post NSR had about plan A. Would I be a door mat for $1 million for a while - probably, so I guess if it means I get a new improved m and h I'll do it for another three months. Ughhhh.<p>Met with the doc, dad handled it very well actually. I made it clear I thought the final decision was his as its his wife, but I told him what I thought. My brothers and sister couldn't make it, but they all agree, its dad's choice. Not so easy for him.<p>He seems to be heading in the direction that we will let her die naturally. I am ok with this, her body has said "its time", so be it. The doc said it will take days, maybe weeks for her to die. <p>I feel sad. I've watched this woman deteriorate for many years. I hope this will be peace for her and for the family.

Seahorse,<p>I'm so sorry to hear about your Mother. It is a terrible situation for you. Forgiver is right -- concentrate on your family right now. Spend time with them, don't let your situation with your M rob you of this. <p>You H sounds like he is still in the fog. That's okay -- you are the stronger person. Don't give up. My H came out of the fog -- it took awhile. You might want to look at some posts from WS. They help to understand what they are going through.<p>Keep Plan Aing and keep us posted. We're all here for you.<p>FHO

H rang me and I met him at (our) home this morning, he wanted to pick up clothes. <p>He genuinely seemed pleased to see me, and me him. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p>I told him I loved him and that I wanted to work on our marriage (this goes against everything I've said the last two weeks but it seemed right at the time). He didn't say he loved me, but he does want to work on the marriage too. He is committed to the flat for six months. I told him I didn't want him to move out but I support him, and that I don't want the marriage we had, but a better one.<p>I think he's still in contact with ow, just a feeling I have.<p>We talked a bit, it was all along the lines of the above. <p>I asked if he would be seeing/meeting other people, he said we both should if it happens. He said I should go out to dinner with someone if I meet them, he did add that it does hurt him to think about it, so there's a little hope there - he still cares some. I told him that it eats me up to think of him with someone else.<p>Thing is, I don't want to go to dinner with anyone else, I want to go with him. I told him that, that he is the one, and I want to spend the rest of my life with him, it seemed to affect him.<p>Everything I said was honest. I told him I was oscillating between giving up and holding on, I told him I thought it was over, but here I am again. Scared as hell.<p>Did I say too much? Do you think I should have shut up? Do I really want to go through all this again? He seemed to care, I could see it in his eyes, in the way he held me, surely he can't fake that?<p>We started talking about selling the house and me moving into the city, he wants to be closer to work. I'm scared now that if we do that I'll loose him, but I don't want to stay where I am. I hate this its too much right now.<p>I have not been able to contact my dad today, he really has to make his decision today. I'm so sad for him.<p>H was kind to me about mum and he knows I've got a lot now. I can't really make too many life changing decisions right now. When he talks it seems real, but after I'm scared that its all lies, that he's trying to trick me. I think he's still in fog too, so how do I know what's real anymore?

{{SEAHORSE}}<p> Nothing is real right now for your H except fantasy and the fact he knows he can get you back at any moment.<p> Concentrate on you and your family right now. I like that million dollar analogy. <p> You said it your H is in the fog. It is still early- let him go. Do not give him too much information. Less is more. You have said enough and set the stage. It's his move. But don't pine for him even though I know it is so very hard. You are right, keep busy!!! I am going non-stop 7 days a week so i am not even around if my H calls.

My H asked if I met someone yet. I was elusive and did not answer him directly. It drove him up a wall. He really wanted to know. Especially when we talked about some of the interesting sexual content. He thought I was sleeping with someone and learning all these wild things. Duh, you can read about them! Does not mean you have done them. But that was immediately what my H thought. He said if I found someone that was great. I deserve to be happy. He said he was no one to judge. But by him thinking I was having my own affair made him feel less guilty, that I could stoop as low as he has. It makes the pompus [censored] feel better. He wants to feel better and by putting me down to his immature level does so. Well, I set him straight. That i absolutely would not do such a thing as he has because I am married. I told him, you know me better than anyone. I should think you know the kind of morals and values I have. And how committed I was to my marriage. I was going to say " You thought I didn't put out enough for you and yet you think I'm going to put out to a complete stranger?" But I bit my tongue and clarified that I was taking classes and reading alot. But he was missing out on some pretty crazy stuff. I did not give away all my tantilizing secrets. I just gave him a glimmer of my major change. <p> We will see. Just occupy yourself and live for YOU today. It's our H's loss. BIG TIME. The best revenge is to live well and know.... If they do not choose us they will regret it someday and from that day on will be miserable-if they are not already. <p> I mean how do you feel when you look in the mirror? I feel GREAT! Thanks Plan A! Think of our H's. Do you think they are happy at who they see in the mirror? What they have done and become? I think not. My H says he beats himself up every day and he is miserable with what she is putting him through. Yet he has not called or contacted me. AND he still has his flight booked to come home in 14 days.<p> Go look at the divorce board. Many of the threads i read (only a few) were from WS who left their BS for OW and were now miserable, trying to use the MB principles their BS used on them. But they are not happy and realize the huge mistake they made. they want thier BS back. they want their lives back. They realize OW was not what they thought. Now they realize how good they HAD it. They are kicking themselves. Now it is too late b/c thier BS ran out of love, patience etc. They are so sad. Karma. <p> You are doing wonderful Seahorse. Keep being the strong outgoing beautiful person you are! Shine where ever you go and don't let your H kill your spirit. I know it is hard, believe me! But you can do it!<p>Forgiver

Thank you Forgiver, when I look in the mirror I'm ok with what I see (physically, mentally, as a person, etc). I know I am doing the absolute best I can. I have made a few mistakes a long the way, but I can hold my head high, I've tried.<p>My H tried to infer I was having an Internet affair, he didn't realise I was on here all the time. He told me the other day that if I met someone I should go out with them, but that he would be sad. He said he knows I'm not a slut (how nice, that makes me feel so much better). I think he still wants the easy way out and someone to blame if the marriage fails, but I'm not going to let him off that easy.<p>I noticed that he has put on a bit of weight round the middle. I know he will be feeling down about himself, not just physically but mentally. He knows he's put me through hell, he even told me not to loose anymore weight (he told me before the holiday I needed to loose a couple more kilos). <p>He enquires about mum, which is nice. I could not handle it if he was nasty or didn't care. Mum was always good to him.<p>He replied to an email I sent and said he was glad to see me yesterday. I hope all this is true. I'm finding it so hard to trust anything as being real. <p>Dad told the nursing home yesterday to let mum go, it really hit me last night, when I was in bed. The house seemed empty last night, its like H was gone, mum is going and I'm lonely. I just cried and cried and prayed that mum will forgive us for not trying anymore. I was relieved to finally feel something. I'm just preparing myself and ringing dad each day to check on him. I guess I better check re funeral arrangements. This is the first person I've been close to that has died, so I don't really know how I will feel. I should count my blessings that I've not lost too many people who are close to me, but why do I have to loose two at once?<p>Anyway, no point in going down this track again. I'm trying to keep "up". I told people at work about mum, and they're supporting me. They have a laugh with me which really helps. Plus I bought myself a really short skirt today that's going to blow H away, so that put a smile on my face too, and it only cost me A$5 which is a bargain!!! [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img]

Hi Liz - I'm glad to read you have the attitude that you can only do your best and satisfy yourself that you gave it a go. This will pay off for you in the long run no matter what happens.<p>I consciously took the same approach to be able to look back, in the event we didn't reconcile, and be guilt free, knowing I did all I could. So far, it's working for me.<p>This worked when I lost my son, although there was never any doubt that we would climb mountains for him, conscious decisions or not. I am not ashamed to admit that when he passed I felt a sense of relief. I had already done most of my grieving by that point and we had done absolutely everything we could to heal him. His suffering was finally over and I was guilt free.<p>I hope you have a similar reaction for your Mum. Your love is very evident and i believe she feels it.<p>Dave

Thank you Dave, Today's a low day, feeling tired, feeling a bit of strain, feeling a bit grumpy. <p>Yesterday H was in contact with me 4 times. Today nothing. He hurt his finger and had to get stitches yesterday when he picked up our spare fridge. I emailed him this morning to see how he was, but nothing. Fog again?<p>It seems whenever I commit to my marriage I feel low, it just dosen't seem right-shouldn't I feel good about it? And what if moving out turns out to be the best thing he ever did. What if leaving me turns out to be the best thing he ever did. Then what? <p>I want to call him, but I'm hanging back. I feel he should contact me now. I suppose he will when he wants something from me.<p>I hate feeling like this. I don't even feel like going anywhere or doing anything. Just feel plain grumpy.<p>There's no further news on mum. I have a brother who we cannot find, so he dosen't know yet. I emailed all my dad's sisters overseas to try to rally support for him. They've been contacting him which is nice. He needs to know he's not alone in this.<p>Having lunch with a friend today so this may brighten me up a bit. Will try to go out tonight, somewhere, anywhere.<p>[ April 11, 2002: Message edited by: Seahorse ]</p>