I wrote about it a bit before...it no better. I'm 33, American, living in Europe, married to a Danish girl, 26 for about 2.5 years.<p>We had wanted to get married - but were not quite ready when we did - when I came to Europe from the US. It helped in keeping my in Europe. So it was a private thing - and we told NO BODY. The thinking was that every body knew we were engaged - and the REAL wedding would follow later. <p>The first couple of years were hard - getting to really know each other and all. There was some lying I caught her in regarding seeing an old guy friend (who was still interested her - but her to him, only as friends), later there were a two incidents where we had had a fight, she went out to a party and ended up kissing some guy (different guys). She admitted it the next day - but still lots of pain. She suggested a divorce to me upon the first occasion - I refused. We had been having lots of disagreements thereafter and the sex life died fair part. The fights were so bad that she asked two more times for a divorce. I refused each time - wanting tob work it out. We went to a marriage counselor - it helped very little. Finally, we were living in a student apartment - VERY SMALL - she asked me to move out for two months so she could study for final exams without the arguments. I did not want to go - but I did. <p>We continued our relationship by getting together at on or the others place. Sometimes she would just be alone - and study. After her exams - she did not ask me to move back in. I was devistated!<p>I went to a summer party with my cousin living here, and met a woman. She gave me lots of attention. Told me I was a good person. Told me that I was handsome and desirable. I started to date her. However, I did not tell my wife, nor stop my relations with her - but I did see her much more infrequently. (to which she started to take up more interest in me).<p>I realized that this other woman was not a good thing. I could not stop thinking about my wife when I was with the OW. I loved my wife! I great difficulty being intimate with the OW - in fact over the four months we were intimate only three times. Even though we saw eachother every couple days. <p>I started to feel trapped in this new relationship. I started pulling back. But she started putting guilt on me to see her and her young son. I did feel guilty...so stupidly, I continued - though I had NO heart in it. Feeling weak from the situation with my wife, I was caught in this one too.<p>I went back to the US for Christmas. The OW called my wife and told her about the affair we were having. Then they both wrote an e-mail letter together identifying all the lies, fact and untrue acts - claiming I was insane - and sent it out to everbody on my mailing list (ALL my friends and family). Creative, and effective. That was more than I could stand...I lost it - 4000 miles away when I could do nothing to stop the eruption.<p>The OW told my wife lies about our affair beyond imagination. Claims of professed love and plans for kids and a house .. blah blah... I'd saw my wife hated me at that time.<p>She asked me for a divorce. I said I did not want one. She insisted, and me, wanting to please her, I signed the papers. <p>However, since that time in the beginning of January 2002, she has gotten closer to me. We speak 6 of 7 days in a weeks and see eachother (now) 3-4 time a week for dinner, a movie, or to do some shopping. We hug ALOT, kiss (the nonpassionate type), and always hold hands when we are together - almost like you would never know what had happened. We even say we love each other - and call each other to say good night nearly every night.<p>Sometimes she just pulls away - wants to shut herself up without anybody - or to go out with her girlfriends (who don't want her to see me). I hate these times - it a mental flip and I go nuts - like I'm an addict needing her drugs of attention and affection. I miss her like it were a thousand years! I miss our intimacy.<p>She says that we have no relationship and we will NEVER get this resolved. That she cannot and will not ever trust me again (because of all the usual lies over the course of the affair). She says that she is with me (spending time doing things, accepting my offers to do things and accepting gifts and flowers) only to help me - because she is worried about me and cares - but that this relationship, at best, only rise to friends. <p>She has not filed the divorce papers yet after almost two months (I pray she never will).
QUESTIONS:<p>She is thinking - I guess - but about what-and what can I do? Does she only want friends-or is this just what she is saying? What do her actions tend to suggest? <p>Am I in a good situation or a bad one? How long does this stuff like this go on for - 6, 8, 12 months? Suggestions on the "how to" of keeping or one's sanity? I'm in emotional agony.<p>I love her!<p>--nearlydead-andburned

Seems like all you can do is put the entire truth out to your wife... also put information from the Harleys out to her... maybe get a copy of Surviving an Affair and share w/ her what you have learned or are learning.<p>Then, look into counseling and/or support groups. Finally, do the best plan A or plan B that you can do.<p>I wish you the best,
Cali

Esquire,<p>First, I would like to welcome you to MB. I hope this site will be as helpful and supportive to you as it has to many of us, who have, unfortunately, suffered infidelity in our Ms.<p>As a necessary introduction to this site and this forum, please read all the Basic Concepts, Articles and Q&As on the non-forum portions of the MB site. Also read Onegoing&#8217;s &#8220; General Welcome to All Builders&#8221 thread ( http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=29&t=000553 ); and the &#8220;Notables&#8221; thread ( http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=29&t=000554 ). There is a great deal of information in just the material that I have just listed, but it is very worthwhile reading and will answer many of the questions that you either have now or will have in reading responses from other MBers.<p>It sounds like you want to make some big changes in your personal life and that much damage has been done in a relatively short period of time. That said, your situation is no worse than many and actually not as horrible as some. So, take heart. There is hope for your relationship with your W.<p>Since each of you appear to be BSs and WSs, you each know something of the pain of betrayal. Given that you are the one who appears most motivated to restore the M, I would approach the situation by giving you the advice I would give to a motivated WS. Please do not take offence. It is a judgment call based on who is motivated to work on the M rather than any kind of blame allocation.<p>If you want to restore your M, you need to work on the fundamentals in the relationship with your W. That she has not filed the divorce papers is a good thing. That she sees you and talks to you is a good thing. And that she clearly has caring and loving feelings for you are also very good.<p>The first things to do are the following: become an expert on emotional needs (ENs), avoiding lovebusters (LBs), and start plan A. Read everything you can about them, find a copy of the His Needs/Her Needs book (and the Quickstart tape) and the LoveBusters book and read those, and read threads about the proper application of plan A.<p>Then go to it. Become the &#8216;king of plan A&#8217;, by figuring out what your W&#8217;s most important ENs are (if she will do the ENQ even &#8216;just for fun&#8217;, that would be of great help to you), doing the very best you can to satisfy those needs whenever you have an opportunity, also learn what LBs bother her (again the LBQ would be an ideal exercise, but lots of people never get their spouse to fill this out) and avoid those like the plague. Also, avoid relationship talks and all forms of &#8216;state of the union&#8217; discussions unless she initiates them; if she does initiate, then listen carefully to what she says and does not say, be attentive to her body language, and take your signals from her about what her issues are and don&#8217;t forget to thank her for engaging in &#8216;such an open exchange&#8217; or something of that nature. Spend as much time with her as you can, without being pushy or overly-needy, as face-to-face time is the most efficient way to meet ENs. Harley recommends a minimum of 15 hours a week, so as much time and opportunity as you can get, take it and apply plan A.<p>You will need to stick to plan A for a while. Harley recommends a minimum of 6 months. Try not to get short sighted, or impatient, or to expect too much. Just stick to a strong and consistent plan A.<p>If you read her ENs and LBs correctly and apply an effective plan A, then she will find herself wanting to be with you more and more, until you are irresistible to her. At that point, you will have created a great foundation upon which to build a better than ever M.<p>Oh, just a couple of other things. Because you had an A, in your W&#8217;s eyes, you will have to earn back her trust. In order to do this, be completely open and honest about everything, absolutely everything; do not play head games of any kind, no matter what she might do or what her friends might say to her. Reading SAA and doing that which is suggested of WSs would be a good idea, too. Although yours is not the classic A situation, there is a lot about trust building and accountability that could go a long way to helping reestablish her trust in you. If your W wants to talk about OW, or ask you questions, be honest, non-defensive and considerate with your responses; also, offer reassurance to her, when the timing is right, that you have no feelings for OW and that the relationship with her was a terrible choice on your part, that you regret ever getting involved with anyone else, and that you are sorry for the hurt you caused her. Also, mention every so often that you hope that she can forgive you at some point for the A.<p>Of course, given your W&#8217;s past conduct, you will be needing her to earn your trust and reassure you. But, since she is not the one I am addressing right now and she does not appear to be the one who is most motivated to recover the M, I&#8217;ll leave that topic for some other time.<p>I&#8217;m sure I have left things out, but others will step in where I have left off. Also, feel free to ask questions or make comments or give further information. I will check back later.<p>Good luck and welcome again to MB.<p>[ March 05, 2002: Message edited by: OneDay ]</p>

Hi Welcome to Marriage Builders,<p>OneGoing gave you a lot to read up on. Yep your M is going to need lots of work. There were things going on with your W before your A that still need to be dealt with along with how you chose to deal with it. <p>How about reading up on the basic concepts stuff and his needs/her needs? Then having a phone counseling session or 2 with Steve or Jennifer? <p>What is your W's true viewpoint on marriage? <p>The check out with your W as to if she felt she never loved you to treat you that way she did while in school and after. I mean if she never treated you well......then you may need to rethink this situation. <p>Either way, talk with a counselor and get support. You can share you viewpoint and vents here. <p>Take Care,
L.

Can We Just Forgive and Forget?<p>Read that and see if it helps. This is an unusual situation with your wife aligning with the OW???<p>Your life is not over. Your marriage was troubled from the start. Keep reading and posting. It's not the end of the world. Hopefully you and your wife can work through all the lies.<p>[ March 06, 2002: Message edited by: BINthereDUNthat ]</p>