<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Jen Brown:
<strong>
Also interesting is that after our last outburst, my husband and I agreed to either be calm and decent to each other, or not to interact. I have also decided that even if he fails at that I am going to be little miss sweetness, kindness and sunshine no matter what. So, I apparently am well on the way with Plan A, and will continue with it until the cows come home. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] </strong><hr></blockquote><p>Don't get cocky because there's plenty of rough road up ahead and how you react when you pass thru it will determine how effective your plan A really is. <p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr><strong>My latest goal is to go out and enjoy life, and be the happy, confident woman he fell in love with, so that he can see or at least hear that by word of mouth. It will hopefully be a complimentary part of plan A.<p>Jen
</strong><hr></blockquote><p>This is good because it will keep your mind from obsessing about your H's A. Just be careful that you don't develop any 'friendships' with other men because if you were vulnerable once to the point of having sex with another man, you are more so now that your H is probably doing the same with another woman.

Well, there've been a couple developments in the past couple of days. My husband ended up out with a bunch of our common friends, and had a long chat with my one good friend who knew everything (I have told her). She was completely sober, he (my H) was very drunk. So she was able to relay to me all that they spoke about, and he is NOT having an affair with the woman he's staying with. He is not happy staying there either. Of course, he'd never tell me this, but then again he probably knew that by saying so to my friend it'd get back to me. She is a very good judge of character - and can pretty much see through anyone - so at this point I have faith that he's not having a physical relationship with the female friend he's staying with. Call me naive if you like, but right now I feel that he was telling the truth.<p>After spending the better part of my Saturday with many couples, and having them continually ask where my H was, I was in a very depressed state Sat. night. After surfing through some different forums, I finally went to bed, but with some new ideas in mind. The most helpful information came from some postings by "NSR" on the Plan A/B message board, and this post: Plan A - 101 (2nd ed.).<p>This morning I wrote my husband a letter, using some of the good advice different people had given in the postings on the message boards.
Some of the key phrases I used were:
"You are the most amazing person I know,
My love for you is so very strong and has not changed,with love and commitment, we can overcome so much," and "I intend to only show you kindness, love and affection; I will do anything you ask to work towards rebuilding the amazing partnership and marriage that you and I had." <p>I also enclosed a photo of us from last summer when we were holding each other tight, on one very happy day of our vacation.<p>I hope this was a wise move. My purpose was to let him know how much I still love him and want to work things out, and that I am NOT getting used to this (separation), as he keeps telling me I will.<p>Now, I just have to hope he's willing to come and pick the letter up. I told him he doesn't have to come in and see me, that he could just grab it from the mailbox.<p>I pray that he does come and pick it up.<p>Any thoughts on this?<p>Jen
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by TooMuchCoffeeMan:
<strong><p>This is good because it will keep your mind from obsessing about your H's A. Just be careful that you don't develop any 'friendships' with other men because if you were vulnerable once to the point of having sex with another man, you are more so now that your H is probably doing the same with another woman.</strong><hr></blockquote><p> [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img]

NSR's advice is some of the best you can find here at MB, so you did right in reading his posts.<p>Your letter seems to be a good idea because since both of you are separated at the moment, he probably wonders if you think of him at all and the letter you wrote to him will make him see that you are thinking of him and that you miss him very much. So kudos on the letter.<p>How's the counseling going?

Wow, TooMuchCoffeeMan, you are always so quick to post a reply. I appreciate all your feedback. <p>I only had the one initial counselling session so far, but I finally get to go to a real pschologist this Wed. So, I'll let you know how it goes. <p>One other very interesting read I found this week was the Psychology Today article "Shattered Vows." (I found it by searching on the net.) It gave me a lot of new insight too. With that info, and all the posts on this forum, I feel somewhat like I'm going into this next counselling session with some inkling as to why all of this happened and what to do next. Hopefully I can find some more answers at the session.<p>Now I'm trying to keep busy (well, I do have tonnes of work to do), while I wait to see if my H is coming over. Waiting is not fun, but I'm optimistic about my letter, especially now that you've said you think it's a good idea too. Thanks again.<p>Jen <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by TooMuchCoffeeMan:
<strong>NSR's advice is some of the best you can find here at MB, so you did right in reading his posts.<p>Your letter seems to be a good idea because since both of you are separated at the moment, he probably wonders if you think of him at all and the letter you wrote to him will make him see that you are thinking of him and that you miss him very much. So kudos on the letter.<p>How's the counseling going?</strong><hr></blockquote>

Wow, TooMuchCoffeeMan, you are always so quick to post a reply<p>MUST be the caffeine [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img]

TMCM:<p>THAT'S the thing with too much coffee!!! You're ready to hit that SEND button in a femtosecond!!<p> [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Jen Brown:
<strong>"Funny, your question of why didn't he barge in or at least make so much noise that it would lead to a confrontation was a topic of much discussion between myself and OM.<p>"Even more entertaining is the fact that we too thought he may just be a pervert that was getting off listening to it all..."
</strong><hr></blockquote><p>JenBrown:<p>Where did this sexual activity take place that your H could hear you? I am puzzled?<p>Was it at your home or in at a cheap motel?<p>Clyde

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> Where did this sexual activity take place that your H could hear you? I am puzzled?<p>Was it at your home or in at a cheap motel? <hr></blockquote><p>Clyde:<p>It was in our home. I was drunk, it took the OM quite some time to persuade me to have sex, but I was foolish enough to do it. Before he came upstairs and listened at the door, my H was sleeping downstairs with the woman he is now living with. Of course, "the door to the bedroom downstairs was open", whereas the one I was in upstairs was shut.<p>I have a great deal of difficulty understanding why he didn't walk in and stop us, he was there during the "persuasion" part of things, and could have stopped us before the sex happened. I know it sounds hollow, but it hurts me that he didn't (care enough about me?) to barge in and tell us to stop. Then again, I know he was in complete and total shock. Who knows what I wouldn've done in his place. I'd like to think I would have ripped the door off its hinges and barged in, but I may very well have sat outside the door listening and weeping.<p>Jen [img]images/icons/confused.gif" border="0[/img]

Well today's a new day and it IS possible for your H to have a change of heart... Also just wait for the time when the OW starts love busting (LBing).<p>Do you have an idea of what your H's top emotional needs are? Do you have some way of filling them although you are separated?<p>My guess as to why your H didn't stop you guys is because he wanted to find out exactly how far you would go if the right temptation presented itself... I don't believe it is that he couldn't care less about you. I doubt if that is the reason... I doubt if he is a pervert either... I bet it was just curiosity. And you know how men are--they are very good at accumulating facts before they spill their beans... We (women) can't hold anything inside for too long!!! [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Hope you are feeling better today. Are you? Are you using this "opportunity" to be a better you? Are you changing what you can about yourself to make you feel better about yourself and the person you really want to be? The person you really ARE on the inside? HUGS! Keep the faith!

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Jen Brown:
<strong>"My H was sleeping downstairs with the woman he is now living with..." </strong><hr></blockquote><p>Jen Brown:<p>Unless I missed something .. why was your H "sleeping" with the woman in your house?<p>Clyde

Aaah, Clyde, you beat me to it.
Before he came upstairs and listened at the door, my H was sleeping downstairs with the woman he is now living with. [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] <p>I, too, do not understand this.<p>And am I the only one here who thinks the reason Jen's h didn't do anything was so that he could justify an a of his own?

Frankly- I have the same question for Jen. Without knowing more, I'm inclinded to agree with you. <p>I was wondering if I missed something here.

In response to the questions about what my H was doing downstairs with this other woman.. his short answer would be having a good long platonic chat, and then just plain old sleeping. If you want the whole sorted story to put this in context, here ya go, it's my dirtiest laundry...<p>
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=31&t=006992<p>Jen [img]images/icons/blush.gif" border="0[/img]

You sound a lot like me, in some ways. I just found out 8 days ago that my wife had had an affair with my friend and her best friend's husband. <p>I'm trying to channel my heartache at what she has done, the lies, the deceptions, the manipulation... into self-reflection so that regardless of what happens to our marriage, I will become a better person. Otherwise, there is only the tormet of heartache and the sadness of being alone. <p>One of my faults is that I am a workaholic. I have since day 1 of our dating, put my career before my wife. Each year my income has doubled and I now own my own business. But, in pursuing my ambition, at some point along the way, I forgot to keep bringing my wife with me. Regardless of what happens in my marriage, I will never make the mistake of prioritizing work before her. There is still going to be long days, sometimes I'll have to work on weekends and evenings, but otherwise, I'm going to come home share the events of my day, and then focus on her for a while. If I have to do other things, I'll take care of her first and get her agreement that it's okay for me to take care of my work. <p>In hindsight, I deeply regret that I didn't do this earlier. Career is part of real life. We both need to come to terms with it, but there is no reason she should ever feel second to my work.<p>Don't make your husband feel that way. There is other work, other jobs, other career paths. Have you looked? You need to stay away from your lover. You've had your entire affair to come to grips with whatever your feelings are for him. Your husband has had a fraction of that time. While you're at work, your husband is wondering if you're seeing him. <p>Quit. Leave. Even if your marriage falls apart, you'll be a better person for having broken a terrible lie and addictive cycle of behavior. It'll rebuild trust with your husband and as a bonus you might find a better job.

I am going to stick it out in my job for one more year at least. Sorry, but that's the decision I've made. My H said he'd kick my butt if I quit my job and ended up unemployed and he needed to support me. Also, as I 've said many times before, I do contract work, and it takes 3 yrs to get a permanent contract, etc. In about a year I can easily transfer though!! Incidentally, the OM is considering changing careers.<p>I have been putting work before my marriage for too long too. I was just finally realizing this this year. I was beginning to reduce the number of committees and extra things I was doing, but apparently should've done so a long time ago. My H has always said I work too hard, and that family should come first. <p>Jen

I've done contract software work for 3 years. Every three to six months I've changed jobs and realized a $5 to $10/hour pay increase. Now I own my own business. Quitting your job and finding a new one... woops, wrong order... focus on finding a new job and then quit. You might be surprised and if not, your husband will appreciate the effort. <p>During my wife's affair, I was very suspicious because she recieved several late night phone calls. Prior to the calls, she was tired, lethargic, and went to bed early. When the calls came in and she heard his voice, she jumped out of bed and was suddenly all perky. I eavesdropped on several. At the time I felt like scum and wondered if I should interrupt and stop them... I guess I wanted to see how far they'd take the conversation. Maybe that's the same with your husband, "How far will my wife go?" Once you started having sex, the last thing he'd want to do is barge in and see that. You can interpret it different ways... I would have barged in and then filed for divorce or killed the guy. In my case, eavesdropping actually reinforced the deception because their conversation was so lame and I tell by my wife's tone of voice that she wanted him to hang up. Sadly, those times helped me believe her when she said nothing was going on. <p>In the end, I would want my wife to come clean with me regardless of if I knew. There's a huge difference between confronting your spouse with the truth and having her cough it up on her own - a huge difference.

Quote:
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> In the end, I would want my wife to come clean with me regardless of if I knew. There's a huge difference between confronting your spouse with the truth and having her cough it up on her own - a huge difference. <hr></blockquote><p>Well, I guess I screwed up there. He had to confront me. My OM keeps putting off telling his wife. I have told him that if he tells her rather than her finding out somehow that it would be a huge step towards building trust again. But he's terrified she'll walk out, run to mommy, and never come back, so he keeps it a secret. Eventually she's going to be asking why OM is no longer spending every weekend with my H. Oh well, he deserves some pain too I guess. <p>Jen

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Lyxa:
<strong>There's a huge difference between confronting your spouse with the truth and having her cough it up on her own - a huge difference.</strong><hr></blockquote><p>Lyxa:<p>I guess you write from experience. What is this huge difference?<p>Clyde<p>[ June 27, 2002: Message edited by: ClydeA ]<p>[ June 27, 2002: Message edited by: ClydeA ]<p>[ June 27, 2002: Message edited by: ClydeA ]huge<p>[ June 27, 2002: Message edited by: ClydeA ]</p>

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Lyxa:
<strong>There's a huge difference between confronting your spouse with the truth and having her cough it up on her own - a huge difference.</strong><hr></blockquote><p>Lyxa:<p>What, in your opinion, is this <strong>huge</strong> difference?<p>Clyde

The huge difference is one of trust. <p> - IF I have to confront my WW with the truth and she finally comes clean, I will forever wonder IF I had pushed for more confrontation, if more truth would be told.
- IF I have to confront my WW with the truth, it strongly implies that the EA and PA are not truly over yet, which on top of the heartache, hurts even more.
- IF I have to confront my WW with the truth, it means I have caught her in her lies and there is no hope to rebuild at that point; only a whirlwind of pain. Really, the only options at this point, in my mind, are to fight and do things you regret, or separate and prepare for divorce. <p>
Here are the glimmers of hope:
- IF she comes clean by herself, I can take hope in the fact that she is ending the A for the right reasons. They may not be the reasons I would want, but any reason to end an A is better than reasons to continue it.
- IF she comes clean by herself, I can take hope that wants to rebuild the marriage.
- IF she comes clean by herself, I can take hope that she still loves me.
- If she comes clean by herself, I can take hope that there is Hope for us. <p>And, hope is the basis of any marriage isn't it? I'd rather rebuild after an affair on the Hope of Trust. The confrontation scenario is needed sometimes but until the WS RECOGNIZES the need to stop Plan A will never work, love will be wasted, and Plan A actually is a very merciful Plan B, from what I understand.