I have a 6 week old baby and a 3.5 year old son. A month ago I discovered that my husband was having an affair with a colleague for the last year. He didn't tell me the whole truth then, and told me that the had ended it. 2 weeks later I found out that he was still seeing her and that no sex had occurred, but kissing and hugging had. I was devastated. I didn't throw him out but tried, for the boys sake, to go on. A few days ago he came home and told me that he doesn't love me any more and that he wanted to leave. At first I begged him to stay, but eventually acquiesced and started talking of returning to live with my family, who live in an unstable country 10 000 miles away. My boys need a future and so do we. We talked and he asked me to stay and said that we would have a "decent" marriage - no more infidelity, plenty of kindness, etc. The next day after more talking, he said that he was worried that he might meet someone else and do it again! He is not the person I knew. He doesn't seem to know where he is or what he feels at the moment. He tells me that the affair is dead (but still hasn't officially ended it). I do believe that he is a good person who has spent the whole year thinking and talking only of the bad times and bad things about me (to her). I care about him very much and want my sons to have a secure and loving home with two parents. We are still together today, but he doesn't know if he can give me his total committment - without which I feel that there is nowhere else for us to go. I want us to work at our problems - I want to give him what he needs and I need him to give me what I need. I know that he isn't in love with me now - but I am hoping that with time and kindness on both parts, we can slowly start to rebuild what was a very special marriage. We have been together for 12 years - married for 8. He says that things have been bad for about 3 years, but I remember so many good times - plenty of bad too, but so many good ones! How can I show him that we can do this? Can I really forgive the affair and all the lies and be the person that I used to be? Can we build a safe, secure, loving and genuinely happy home for our boys?

Hi Fishwife,<p>I'm so sorry. Have you looked at all of the articles here on the MB web site? If not, I'd suggest reading all of the articles. <p>It sounds like your H does want to stay with you, but is confused... the most common term here is that he's in the "fog"...<p>Ideally, both of you should find a good marriage counselor and start getting some help. If your H doesn't want to do this, then you should at least get some counseling on your own.<p>To answer some of your questions, yes, you can build a safe, secure, loving, and happy home for your boys and for you and your H... Just realize that it's going to take a lot of hard work from both you and your H.<p>Read all of the articles here and find a good marriage counselor. I wish you and your H the best of luck on your journy.<p>Take care,
RIF90

Thank you so much for your response. It does help to talk - I sometimes feel so lonely - especially because my H finds it hard to open up and maintain "contact". I will suggest seeing a counsellor - hopefully it will clear some of his confusion and help us to move on. The worst thing is that I can feel myself wanting to push him for a decision - because it is just so hard to live like this. I'm used to giving it all or nothing (literally) and I guess that I am pushing him to give everything. I will read the site from start to finish and hopefully learn a little patience - my boys (and the man he was) are worth it.

Hi Fishwife,<p>Welcome to MB - I’m so sorry for what you are going through. [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img] <p>First, I want to commend you for the strength and maturity you are showing. You are a mother and wife and the love you have for your family comes shining through. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] You are dealing with a six week old baby and a 3 ½ year old and are having to deal with your H’s A too. Wow! You seem to be holding yourself together remarkably well! <p>I bet if you didn’t have the kids you would be thinking about ending the M. Am I right? I think that if we didn’t have our two beautiful children, my H and & I would not be together now. What my H did was completely selfish, immature and totally destructive. It ripped my world apart. My love for our children is what saved our M. I, like you, wanted a secure and loving home for my children. <p>I loved my H and still do. But what he did - well - I just don’t know if I would have forgiven him and kept at it if it wasn’t for the children. I’ve seen what divorce does to a family and children and wanted to avoid that at all costs <p>Do not blame yourself for this and do not think less of yourself! This is hard to do, I know, but it will help you in your recovery. Do not doubt yourself. You are strong and capable. You know that – do not forget that! You gave up your career, your independence and your identity for your family. This is a lot to sacrifice and yet you did it - not many people are willing to give that much. If only our H’s would give ½ of what we do, maybe this wouldn’t happen. But you know what – their lives don’t change the way ours do and it angers me when their biggest complaint is that they feel neglected. If, as new mothers, we only had to deal with that, how much easier our life would be. <p>As new mothers we are dealing with soo much and so many drastic changes. Sometimes we get help sometimes we don’t, but we preserver. And yet, our H’s feel neglected – poor babies. (If only this was our biggest problem.) It seems so often that instead of helping out and working through these difficult, tiring years, they bail. They find someone who can give them all their attention. I’ve heard it over and over and it angers me and frustrates me to no end. I go back to the generations of “boys will be boys” and I hate it. They got off the hook then – why not now? Well, time to grow up and take responsibility for their actions.<p>Do not allow your H to make you feel responsible for this. Sure there were problems in your M and you are partly responsible for that, but not for his A. (What marriage doesn’t have problems? But when you are married and make that commitment to each other, and especially when you have children, you work through the problems –you do everything you can possibly do – for the family and especially for the children. If, after doing all you can do, things can’t be fixed, you then divorce - you do not have an A.) That was his selfish choice and his alone. <p>Did he do all he can do? Did he suggest counselling? Did he tell you how he was feeling –that he was thinking of another woman? Or did he take the easy way out – for him and him getting what he wanted? It is not your fault. You were and are being a mom and wife. You were doing your part - your H wasn’t.<p>The good news is that you can get through this and have a stronger healthier M. But your H must be willing to commit and work with you. Read SAA and have your H read it too. Read all the material here and get counselling. <p>These are the steps that helped me and my H through. We still have a long way to go but have made it this far because of the knowledge and advice we received here at MB and because we are both committed to our M and making it better. <p>My H has acknowledged that what he did was terribly wrong – it was not my fault – and he is remorseful and is working at “fixing his mistake.” Without these actions, we would not be working on our M today and would not be in the recovery stage we are at. (Have your H read some of the posts by remorseful FWS's - it will be an eye opener for him.)<p>You can forgive him and the A and the lies and be the person you used to. Well, actually a better person than you used to be, and so can he. And you can build a safe, secure, loving and genuinely happy home for your boys. Your M can be like it was at the beginning, but it takes time, energy, knowledge, persistance and commitment from both of you.<p>I’m sorry if I’ve rambled. I just feel for you and I’m frustrated and angry that yet another loving, devoted mother and wife is going through this. [img]images/icons/mad.gif" border="0[/img] Stay strong and know you’re not alone – we’re here when you need us.<p>H&S

Dear H&S
I felt that my H respected me less for asking him to stay, once I had found out about the A. It took so much not to throw him out. I am so hurt - not just by the A but by all the things he has said since. I have tried to be patient and to let him make some decisions - total commitment to making this marriage better is essential. I had made plans for us, in case he decided we were not worth staying for and even though I am feeling stronger, I hoped that he would stay - my sons need him so badly. You're right, if we did not have children, there is no question that this M would be over - regardless of my feelings for him. I think he still feels "conned" into staying. <p>We agreed to put everything into trying and I think that we have a chance - provided he tries. I know that he is sorry for being caught and sorry for lying - but I sometimes feel as though he is not truly sorry for the affair. I can't describe how I feel about the OW and I hate the fact that my imagination works overtime and I do think of them together. My needs are fairly simple at present - to make me believe that he wants to be here, to try to be patient and understanding and to restore trust and to reassure me that this will never happen again.<p>Today I found something in his car. I tried not to jump to conclusions and came into the house and asked him about it. I could see by his face that he was really annoyed. He explained it, but he was not happy - and I felt guilty for asking. He does realise that it is going to take time and reassurance to trust him again - of course I want to be able to say "goodbye" as he walks out the door to work, secure in the knowledge that we are the only ones in his life - I just hope that he tries to prove it to me - over and over until I believe him again.<p>I do love him - that leaves a weakness in me which I hate to acknowledge. I want my boys to have a great father, but I also want him to love me - maybe one day ...<p>It is so good to know that you and your H have managed to patch things together. Are you happy? How did you achieve trust again? Can you love eachother as much or more than before?<p>My beautiful sons are worth this pain, but sometimes I just want to run away and hide - be done with all this. We are going to see a counsellor and we are going to try to put our M back on course - I only hope that he and the OW give us that chance.

Hi Fishwife,<p>Okay - I've calmed down. [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> I felt that my H respected me less for asking him to stay, once I had found out about the A. It took so much not to throw him out. <hr></blockquote><p>Yes - I felt that way too but for just a short time. I realized I was not afraid to be without H - that I could and would go on without him. A couple of nights after D-day #2 I asked H to leave, and as he was packing, I thought of the kids and how this one step would have such a drastic effect on them. It seemed premature to put them through that, when maybe there was a chance of saving our M, and the need to put them through that may not be necessary. So - he stayed. I actually didn't care if he respected me for this or not - my decision was for the kids. If he couldn't see that - so be it. (But he did see it and respects me because of it.)<p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> You're right, if we did not have children, there is no question that this M would be over - regardless of my feelings for him. I think he still feels "conned" into staying.<hr></blockquote><p>Sorry to say this - but I think your H needs to grow up. He feels "conned" into staying - well - lets talk about that. He chose to marry you and have children with you - he was not forced to. With these decisions comes responsibility - being a husband and father. No one is really prepared for these roles - we grow into them. I think in a way it's easier for us as mothers, because we know our role. We know what we have to do and do it. I don't think it's quite as clear for fathers. <p>In my H's defence, I was not a relaxed mom. I was over protective and at times completely consumed with the kids. I knew he was feeling left out. But it was easier to just deal with the kids and not our R and I reasoned that things wouldn't be this way forever - that one day we can work on us. Well, things got worse. I actually worried at times he would leave - but I never, ever, thought he would have an A. I married him, in part, because of his strong morals, integrity, family commitment etc. He's the last person I expected to do something like this. So, I turned a blind eye to our problems. Not excusing his behaviour or justifying it, just understanding it in some sense. <p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>I know that he is sorry for being caught and sorry for lying - but I sometimes feel as though he is not truly sorry for the affair. <hr></blockquote><p>It may take awhile for your H to feel sorry for the A. My H was completely in the "fog" D-day #1 and up til about one month after D-day #2. At his first counselling session, the counsellor helped him realize the extent of his actions and the need for him to acknowledge everything. <p>It sounds like your H is still in the "fog". Is there still contact? Have you sent a no-contact letter? I know this step helped me - but I think it helped my H more. I didn't want to ask him or force him to do this - didn't want to "stir up the pot"- but you know what? We have to "stir up the pot" and we have to deal with all the difficult issues. Otherwise we just sweep it under the carpet and nothing gets resolved. This is what we did after D-day # 1 - We were both in the "fog." I did not know how addictive these A's were and how hard it would be for him to end it (he told me they were just friends and I believed him.) I look back at how little we knew, and I understand why we acted the way we did. Finding this site (reading and reading and reading) and following Harley's concepts helped save our M. It's very important to work your way through everything and not ignore things or put them on the back burner.<p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> Today I found something in his car. I tried not to jump to conclusions and came into the house and asked him about it. I could see by his face that he was really annoyed. He explained it, but he was not happy - and I felt guilty for asking. <hr></blockquote><p>Do not feel guilty. You are justified in your reaction and one day your H will understand and instead of getting annoyed he will comfort you. It will happen once he's out of the "fog." But it will take time. It is important that you be "safe" for him and not attack him. Be calm and patient. (But I sense you are already doing that. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] )<p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>It is so good to know that you and your H have managed to patch things together. Are you happy? How did you achieve trust again? Can you love eachother as much or more than before?<hr></blockquote><p>We are working on our M every day. Some days I am on top of the world - others at the bottom of the barrel. The roller coaster ride continues. But I am much happier than before and there are more better days than bad now. Our future looks bright.<p>What helped us the most was completing the EN questionnaire and fulfilling those needs, following the 4 rules of marriage, POJA, spending more time together (without the kids), and communicating how we feel (always working on this one – both of us are conflict avoiders).<p>I have forgiven my H because he acknowledged what he did (the true extent of it), is remorseful and is working at making it right. Without these steps, I would not have been able to forgive him. Now… trusting him is different. I do not trust him. I trust him more now then I did at first - but I don't think I will ever completely trust him again. The blind trust is gone. The feeling of total security/protection/unconditional love is gone. But I've learned that I should not have felt this way anyways. <p>The damage this A has created is deep, but as you can see, we've learned from it, and because of this knowledge, our M is now stronger. I think my H pretty much gave up and thought it was hopeless. But by my actions and changed behaviour he saw that there was hope and from there we worked on it together.<p>I always felt that the children should come first and my H and our M second, whereas my H always thought it should be the other way around. Well, I now agree with him. If we are happy - our children our happy. Sounds so simple - but it took alot of work on my part. I had to let go and it was hard - but it's well worth it. There's more of a balance now and we're all happy. <p>I know that you’re in pain, but it does get better. Stay strong and focus on making positive changes. I think you and your H can make it through this. I believe he will be one of the remorseful ones and will work at fixing things. (He’s a fool if he doesn’t.) I can’t put my finger on it, but for some reason I truly believe it’s going to work out for you. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p>It’s great that you’re going to counselling – it will help. <p>H&S<p>[ June 24, 2002: Message edited by: Hurt & Sad ]</p>

Dear H&S
Thank you so much - you have given me hope ... We are still here - still going and still talking. I think that there have been times in the last week when we have both wondered if staying is the right thing to do. My H has his first counselling session tomorrow, and I am hopeful that it will help him sort out some things in his own mind. As for me ... well, I am struggling with my imagination still. He says that he thinks that he will be able to regain his love for me and I guess I hope that I will one day regain trust and respect for him. As for the future - I think that I look further forward than he does. I just hope that he realises how lucky he is to have a healthy, (usually) happy family. We do love him - that is the problem. I am so encouraged to see that it is possible to move on - I need that desperately - just don't know how to do it.
Thanks again - good luck and be happy

Hi again,<p>Glad you're still here! [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Sounds like things are moving along "normally" for you. It's good you're talking and your H is going to counselling. What about you?<p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> I think that there have been times in the last week when we have both wondered if staying is the right thing to do. <hr></blockquote><p>I too feel this way at times. I then look at my kids and know it's the right thing. When things get tough and I feel like throwing in the towel, I think of them and my strength and conviction returns. <p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> As for me ... well, I am struggling with my imagination still. <hr></blockquote><p>This, too, is normal. Try not to think about it too much though. It was suggested to me to pick 5 minutes out of the day, allow yourself to think about it for that time, and then put it out of your mind til the next day. Hard to do, but it is helpful. Remember - one day at a time. <p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>I am so encouraged to see that it is possible to move on - I need that desperately - just don't know how to do it.
<hr></blockquote><p>I'm glad you're encouraged. Your M really can be better than it was! [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Now as to how to move on... I can just imagine how busy you are with the kids, but you should really find the time to read SAA. (If you haven't already - and your H should too.)<p>Have you and your H completed the questionnaires? I know you must feel emotionally and physically drained, (the kids alone can do that to us!) but I found that following Harley's concepts have really helped us - it keeps us focused and on the right path.<p>Hang in there and let us know how things are going.<p>H&S

Dear H&S
Thanks again. We are going to go through everything and hopefully will keep progressing. You are right about one thing - the children are worth it. I just wish he thought the same about me.<p>Take care of yourself and your "new" marriage - and be happy!
Fishwife

Hi Fishwife,
hope you are making progress with help of counceling. I admire you for your determination and patience which I seem to run short on.
I do not know how to stay positive while he's gone. It's been a little over a week and I compulsively check email and hope for his call too.
I try to work on myself but part of me hates this independent skills, because I feel like I am betraying my hope.

FBOW

After a few very rough days (with some great moments), I am at the point where I really need help to move on. My H has advised OW that it is over and that he wants to make a go of it with me. The problem is that he told me this once before and didn't end it. I desperately want to believe him, but am so afraid to. He arrived home yesterday and I immediately began to question him, trying to see if he had told me the whole truth. He got upset and took some time out. As soon as he had gone, I thought about it and realised that my reaction wasn't exactly condusive to encouraging honest and open communication on his part. This is so difficult. I compulsively ask for details of the affair and am then devastated by them. I have waited for 2 weeks for this letter to be sent and now that it has, I am filled with anxiety about whether or not it is really over. I know that my H found it difficult and depressing to do - and that hurts and angers me. I hope that he believes that he has made the right choice, but I feel so insecure and I am afraid that this is going to destroy our chance of mending our relationship. I resent the fact that he spent time, money and emotion on this woman - when I needed him - when I do need him now. I desperately need his reassurance now - constant and specific, but he seems to be in another place right now and doesn't see how I feel about this. He thinks that I should see a counsellor and I am seriously considering this - I want us to see one together, so that someone can help us to move on from here - give us a map, maybe?! I just want my family to be happy - and I want it to just be the four of us with now outside worries. Please help me.
Fishwife

Hi Fishwife,

I'm so sorry for how you're feeling right now. I wish I knew just what to say to make you feel better!

It might help you to know that I know exactly how you're feeling. Everyone here at MB knows how you're feeling. The pain, the questions, the insecurity, the anger, the doubt, the resentment -it all just seems so overwhelming! But, it does get better. You probably don't believe that right now, but it does.

I know what you mean wanting the details of the A. I was the same way - and at the beginning I wasn't "safe" for him to open up to - and it set us back in recovery. It's hard, I know. But don't be so hard on yourself. You're still learning and you're going to make mistakes. But you've realized your mistake and this will help the next time.

It seems your H is still in a bit of "fog". It's going to take him some time to really "get" it. Counselling will help him - and I think your idea of joint counselling is really good. You should try to do that asap.

I know you want to be happy - have things be normal - but it's going to take time. Remember - one day at a time. Hang in there and I'm sure others will be here to help you out soon.

H&S

Hi,

I was over in GQII and a 'nice' poster asked that we come by and review your post. I would like to give you a belayed welcome to MB and wonder what have you been able to read from MB that has helped? You sound like you are trying to apply good principles.

MB can lend great support and help you improve even more so. The tools outlined in the basic concepts section are just the beginning of that assistance and knowledge.

If you read a few of the posts here, look for a poster by the name of Redhat. If I mention his name, he usually shows up (kind of a techy guy - LOL!!! ) Anyway, his sig line has a lot of good threads with useful information. One that may help is the 5 stages of grieving. My other computer with all my threads crashed so I am having to sponge off of Redhat's sig lines!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Understand that it is normal to want to know it all but as you may also realize, knowledge ca sometimes mean pain.

Have you read Surviving an Affair? It may help. Also the book his needs/her needs may be helpful. If your H is willing to work with you, howz about asking him to provide reassurance to you until these anxious momments of mistrust caused by the A have past and he has regained your trust.

See that puts the onis more on him than on you, it will also relieve you of some of the pressure you are currently carrying, when you are wondering who and what things he is doing.

Anxiety attacks are quite common for the BS. See your doctor if you think you need assistance. Some meds have less side effects than others. It may help you cope.

take care,
L.
ps: Hurt&Sad, you are a good poster. Thanks for the heads up!

Dear Forbetterorworse
Thanks so much for taking the time to post. Patience has never been one of my strong points and I think the truth is that, because he has made a committment to try to repair our marriage, I am tryig to do everything on my part to do the same. I do think that working on yourself gives YOU added confidence and resolve and as such, helps your WH to see you in the way that he saw you when you first met. Life changes us - marriage and children mould us into different people - everyone sees us as wives and mothers and eventually, that's all we see too. I hope your PlanA continues successfully and that you are finding strength in it.

Dear H&S
What would I do without you?! Your advice has been so great and I am tryig hard to work through all your suggestions. Am still having a really hard time at present. As my H settles, I seem to be struggling to open up. I feel so exhausted. I have spent so much time thinking of all that has been said, and it is opening up wounds that I'm not really sure how to deal with. I have my first counselling session on Sat, and hope that it will help me to verbalise some of what I feel. My life will never be the same and I will never feel the same way about myself. I can't seem to put the OW out of my mind - I feel such pain and insecurity. I hope for better days.
Fishwife

Dear Orchid
Your post was a great help and the threads you mentioned have given me plenty of food for thought. MB has helped me to believe that it is possible to save my marriage. The principles are sounds, but it is sometimes hard to put them into practise - human nature makes it difficult! I am trying.
When my H said that he was staying, I was euphoric - he chose us! But as time has moved on, I realise that he chose his boys (admirable) and he settled for me. We are working towards finding our connection again, but sometimes I think that it is so hard and I feel so lonely and small. He once told me that he felt lonely in our marriage - that makes me so sad because I always felt that he was behind me - no matter what. I long for the days when I could look into his eyes and know that he was telling me the truth. When he would touch me and I would know that I was the only one on his mind. When he would phone me and I wouldn't wonder who else he had just been speaking to! He brought me flowers today. My heart soared and for just a moment I forgot that all of this has happened. I wish I could forget for long enough to move on from this.
Fishwife

Hello All,
Needed to talk. We've continued to have rough days - I am feeling very low and just can't seem to get on with moving on. I have found it increasingly difficult to verbalise my emotions, because I feel that my WH is not grasping what it is that I am saying. I even tried writing it down as I thought that this would give him time to go over it and think, but he didn't even respond. I am feeling so angry with him, right now. He has been honest with me and tells me that he has thought of making contact with OW again, but has not done it. He tells me that he is resolved, but that he is sure she will contact him and he is worried that he may weaken when she does. All this after the "no contact" letter. I am desperate for him to be strong. He still feels that our marriage is worth saving, but doesn't love me. I find that so hard to hear. He has completely changed my life - my secure, happy, constant is gone. I don't know how to cope with this. I see my counsellor for my first session this afternoon and he is hoping that this is going to help me resolve all my problems. I have know about the affair for 7 weeks now. He feels that I should have accepted it and begun to move forward. My feeling is that he hasn't acknowledged what this has done to me. We did have communication issues in our relationship before this affair and I feel that not being able to talk honestly to him is compounding those issues. He gets upset, withdrawn and angry when I do tell him how I feel. He thinks that I am trying to "blame" him and make him feel bad, but I am just trying to make him see why it is so hard for me to get over this. I need his constant reassurance and his committment, and because I feel that he is not meeting some of my basic ENs, I focus my frustration and concern on the OW. I think he will give in - that is the basic truth. He did before. I so badly want to believe that it is different this time, and he is the only one who can convince me of this. Trouble is that he won't - perhaps because he wants her? He tells me that he doesn't and didn't love her. But I know that he often wrote "I love you" and other intimate things to her. I have also seen the evidence of these intimacies in things she has written. How do I get past these? My heart is broken. He doesn't seem to realise that. I want us to be happy, but I am so hurt by his actions, by his words and by his betrayal of my most special secrets to her. I don't want to snoop through his things - I don't want to be that sort of person and also, I am afraid of what I may find. How could he have done this? If he is truly sorry, how can he think of her and think of re-establishing contact? I know that these are just thoughts right now - he phones me and tries to keep busy to avoid actually doing anything, but how can I help? I have all her details and those of her husband. I have thought, many, many times of contacting her. Just saying what I think of her lies and betrayal. She is apparently worried that I will tell her husband - I think he deserves to know, but I don't want to hurt him by telling him. Also, I think that it would make my H feel responsible for her and I don't want that. I am sorry about the rambling. I just want to be out of this dark place. I look at him and think that I used to feel so much for him, but all I feel now is hurt, anger, mistrust and despair. Fear too. Fear that his committment isn't permanent or strong enough to withstand what we still have to go through in order to rebuild our marriage. I want everything from him. Remorse, affection, strength, patience, understanding, cosideration. I want him to make up for all the pain he has brought me - he didn't even celebrate our son's birth with me - but he did call her. That hurts more than I can say. I know that he loves his boys and last night he said that he does feel love for me (not in love with me, though). He is my husband. I thought that this was forever. I know that I am LBusting at a frightening rate, but I just don't know how to stop. Please, Please tell me how to move on.
Fishwife

(((((Fishwife)))))
I feel so bad that after all your determination and hard work and forgiveness and willigness to work on solving you M problems the road is not getting easier for you. I just wish and hope it will be easier with time though I am sure there will be hurdles on the way. I certainly hope MC is wiser and more experienced that I am and will give you some practical advise. I can only tell you that I admire you for strength and patience so far. And that you were able to encourage your H to visit this site. All while having little boys to worry, love and care for.
I am still in limbo, waiting for my H to come back from his loooong vacation. I miss him and work on myself in the meantime but I too have a hard time thinking about his confessed love to OW and the A which well might be going on.
I don't snoop. Partly for the same reasons - I am scared what I could find, and the more important one - my snooping in the past ruined both my self-esteem and his trust in me. I hope that now we are better in communicating our true feelings and this is my hope for rebuilding our M. I do not want to go back to our pre-A state either. And now when I start feeling better about myself occasionally I know that I deserve better than just crumbs from his happiness with the OW. And he does deserve fulfilling relationship too.
If my H will ever declare he wants to join in the efforts, I will try your approach of asking him to call/talk to me whenever he has the urge to contact OW. I realize that it's hard for me to compete with her in the communication field, but this the one area that I know for sure I failed terribly and she excelled.
I am practicing my communicating skills, listening and patience on my daughters since I have limited contact with my H now.
I still have a month to improve.
Keeping your family in my prayers,
FBOW

Dear Forbetterorworse,
I really needed that! Thank you so much for your support. After a really hard time, I saw the counsellor today (a little reluctantly, I have to admit). It was such a relief to pour out all the pain and anguish and rage, in one continuous stream. I was still pretty fired-up afterwards and did give my H a hard time when I came home. But I got to a point when I began to feel calm. I have begun to recognise what I need and I hope that I can get my H to realise the same. I wish I didn't care about him - it makes it so much harder. I have always had a problem with the green-eyed-monster and thinking of him with her tortures me. I so hope that his committment will remain. I need to believe that we are important to him. Goodness knows, he is so important to us. FBOW, stay strong. You are showing your daughters how to face the world with courage and strength - and they will always remember that. Take care of yourself, be proud of yourself - you are right about one thing - you ARE worth more than the crumbs! You deserve the whole cake and as long as you know it, he will eventually get the idea! I am thinking of you and praying for you too!
Fishwife

Dear All
Hoping that we may have turned a corner, here. We have made it through half this week already, and there have been no major dramas. We haven't really talked much about the A, altough the OW's name has come up several times (from me). I am trying to focus on our future - I can control my feelings of anger and hurt if I am not thinking about the A, most of the time. It is not easy though. We are due to begin counselling together next week and I am hopeful that we can learn how to nuture eachother's needs. My H has been frantically busy at work. I have awaited the OW's call - I know it will eventually come - my H tells me that he hasn't contacted her at all and I'm sure that some move will be made to check if this separation is permanent. Despite everything I have just said, I think about it constantly. It makes me so despondent. I know it is early days, but his feelings towards me don't seem to have changed at all - still no love. To be honest, last week was a bad week for me - LB all the time and didn't make many deposits! He is still here, though. I am looking ahead at our future - really want to try to fix what went wrong in the first place, but we seem to have drifted a little - not as much talking or touching. I tried writing to him today, but got no response. I know that he is busy - but I do need a little of his attention, too. I expected this to be hard - I just didn't expect to feel so weak, sometimes. Is he regretting his decision and just not saying? I don't know - I don't seem to be able to read him, anymore.

Hi Fishwife,
I hope your silence means that you are busy with recovery and boys.
Do you guys find it easier to communicate now?
Any practical suggestions from either of you about what questions are really unwanted and unnecessary, what reactions are hurtful, how to express feelings in an effective but considerate way?

My H should return home in one month. He called me two days ago which made my day. Told me that he has no email access while he travels. No declarations or anything this way or the other. I remain strong regarding not snooping, just can't help my imagination. I try soooo hard to focus on me, my improvement, while being warm and open to him but not overbearing at the same time.
I keep having desperate moments and sometimes days, feel too weak to face next day, some days I am really angry, I am really afraid how I will cope for two-three weeks when I will by myself, no kids, no H, just work and 2 cats.
I can't make myself to plan anything more than two days in advance. I'd love to ask my H when he's back to go away a weekend together. I've already been thru his one return after D-day, and he came back undecided, kept in contact w/ OW, so I don't even know what to expect. I wonder if in a month time I will be prepared enough to initiate calm conversation which might give me unwanted answers. Or should I just wait and go along with a flow? I am not sure if MC would help us especially since he already declined once seeking professional help. But on the other hand I am so tired of processing everything alone in my head.
I know I will not hide my feelings again behind a wall, it was not a healthy solution even though it seemed to work for me for years.
Once in a while I feel I might go away for a week alone too.

Sorry Fishwife for rambling on your thread.
Warm thoughts
FBOW