Nearly 19 years of marriage , 3 great children,no debt,a job he loves,great house, great social life,so after a 3 month affair that i found out about a month ago he has moved out and doesn't want to try. The ow lives 200 miles away and has only met 6 times!! The children think that he is away on exercise (military) and only 2 immediate friends know, so I have left the path open to him to try again. I found this web site quite early on so I have plan A for a month until the counsellor said there were so many negative vibes from him and he just would not talk, I found out he rang his friend last night to see how we were, he said he was very down.I suppose I'm in plan B as I told him not to ring but write to the children he's been gone 6 days and hasn't done that. We aim to meet at counselling on July 1st.Why do they not put effort into the marriage or even give it a 2nd go? Please help me think straight.I'm from the UK as we don't have anything this good over here.

Hi Uk-er,
Also from the UK and understand your problem with available help! Have had a similar problem with my H not wanting to try. Eventually I backed off (hard as it was and very painful and frustrating) and tried to let him decide whether we were "worth" trying for. Today, after much talking, he said that he thinks we are. He says that he doesn't love me, but for the kids and for what we used to have, we are going to work at it 100% and hope that the feelings come back. We are also following the basic concepts etc, and will be going for some counselling. To be honest, I was a mess until I accepted the fact that he would probably leave and started planning a life for myself and my boys. That gave me strength and resolve and I think it was reflected in the way I reacted to him. I also gave my H the address of this site and I think that reading the postings and articles gave him some insight into what I am going through. The hurt of this will never go away but, hopefully, in time, you will be able to see a future. Just take small steps and take care of yourself and your children. I know so well the pain you are feeling. It is so hard to believe that he can't see what he has in his family. Just try to keep talking and be completely honest about how you feel. Good luck - I'm thinking of you.
Fishwife

Thanks fishwife, It's nice to have some one that cares. What's your story? It's Saturday evening and all week each time a car goes by or the dog barks I think it could be him and what am I going to say....There were a few people in our village that were 40 this year ( my h being one of them) and yesterday there was a huge party for them all ...everyone kept asking where he was,(away on exercise!!!) I was half expecting him ...but alas no.

Fishwife,<p>I am glad you sat down and talked to your H.<p>UK-er, you are not alone, as you see from many posts. For me I felt relief that I am not the only one not fulfilling the needs, lacking skills and thus setting myself for all this pain.<p>I envy all of you who at least got some commitment from your partners and sympathize with those who are improving just for their own sake and hoping for the best.

Just wanted to add my note with the others to say you have found friends here! Wish we weren't... [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img]
I feel right at home with you UK'ers...I was born in the States to an English mum; have been over a few times to stay with cousins or grandparents.
I also can relate to the loneliness I hear in your posts...my H doesn't know I realized what is going on-instead of confronting him when he is so deep in the "fog" I am trying to Plan A as best I can. I hope this is the right tact to take. But meanwhile I am alone, lonely, unloved <img src="graemlins/teary.gif" border="0" alt="[Teary]" /> , ok you get the picture. He never talks to me, and in fact when he is home he sleeps in the guest bed. But I am a SAHM with two little girls and I can't take the risk that he would walk out. For myself, at this point, I could cope, but it would devastate the girls. I concur, tho, How can they be so self-centered? Somewhere on here (maybe someone else can point the way) there is an explanation of "fog"-the WS(Wayward Spouse) is so deeply infatuated with the OP(other person) that they can't see how they are behaving. It also says you might think they have had their brain taken over by an alien. For instance, my H works 2pm to 10 pm, (with a 1 hour commute)but is never home before 1am, sometimes as late as 4am.(Hmmm)Then he won't get up. When I said something about this he said if he can't get enough sleep, he may have to start sleeping at work. ????He works at a gear factory! Will he sleep on the floor? But I know he is just trying to find a way to spend more time (like all night) with "her". No normal person would think this is something reasonable to say! Sorry to ramble, just wanted to say that yes we all can relate, and it helps me to just think that the man I knew has been transformed by aliens, and that if I'm patient and lucky (?) I can have a good marriage again when he regains his senses. Others here have shown me that it can happen. Anyway, you can find support here. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

shaz87
I thought that MB said it would have to come out in the open to move forward, when are you going to confront him after 2-3 months of doing plan a secretly? Plan A is for you, Read a book on body lanuage before you confront him and you will be able to telll if he is lying.
Laying in bed for 2 hours thinking if he comes back thats the hard work and i'm lucky but if as he says the finances will always be in place, then he's the loser because i will have the 3 boys and hope to find someone that will really love me. Which one do I want at the moment?
Do you remeber the beautiful south record ( I don't know that they are that well known in the US) 'you needed time you had a little space didn't you welll i had mine' and relises that she doesn't want him any more perhaps that's what will happen to me???

Hi also in the UK you'll find my thread over on General Questions under Is Love enough?
I have been separtated for 15 months and am still working on restoreing my marriage. I have found wonderful help on this site and on Divorce Busters. the UK contingent of DB even met up last weekend to have dinner and talk through the problems we face. If emailing a fellow Uk-er will help heres my email- I'll edit it out in 24 hours. Jante<p>
[ June 24, 2002: Message edited by: jante ]<p>[ June 24, 2002: Message edited by: jante ]</p>

hi jante,
I 've got your story on my favourites page as I just don't know how you've lasted that long, you haven't posted there for a couple of days, how are things going? I have taken your e-mail down and will contact you soon,
you sound as though you are in derbyshire? I am in somerset.
Hope everyones story has the ending they want especially yours We are off strawberry picking later I expect he's with her spending our money, just what is he missing.
His friend in the village is meeting him for a drink later this week i have the next few days to prime him with questions!!! I have printed a link off the discussion forum so he can give it to him not from me but the frined will say he found it on the internet as he is always surfing so it should ring true. The link was a in the notable section from a ws.

Well i stopped at church on the way to strawberry picking for a prayer for our family.
I made a list of statements that my h's male friend is hpoefully going to put over.I suppose as they are in fog it doesn't matter who or what they say!! I was going to say that i am coping very well is that the impression to give? help please on this matter. Thanks

I think i've worked out the time difference I 'm off to bed now so I hope you can help me on my last post. Thanks

Hi Uk-er
My story is under Trying so hard. I admire you so much for getting on with things and keeping strong for your children. I know how hard it is to get out of bed - let alone be normal, while this is going on. What happened when your neighbour saw H? Hope that you got some positive feedback. Believe in yourself, believe in your children and, for now, believe that miracles do happen! I wish you luck and happiness - always here if you need to chat.

Yes, definitely the right impression to give
Act as fi- you are happy, getting on with our life, will make with or without him. Easy to say, harder to do when you still love them but helps to stop them feeling trapped.
Jante
ps yes i am in Derbyshire in the north of the county just off junction 29 of the M1

Hi jante-I've an uncle in Belper, which I think is in your neck of the woods!
Uk-er, thanks for your reply. Having read SAA I know that I am in poor shape to confront him as my "Love Bank" is definitely overdrawn! I fear that if I confront him just now that he will say yes, and in fact I would rather be with her! My thought was to Plan A as long as I can, improve myself and allow him to have a good image of "home" in case he decides to leave, or in case I need to go to Plan B. However, this is kind of a tentative idea, since I've not seen my situation addressed here or in the books.
I've heard of beautiful south, but not the song you quoted. But I can relate; the more I focus on improving myself, receiving only coldness, the more I think, "why do I even want to fight for this marriage?" and right now my daughters are the only answer. I hope that I will feel differently; once we loved each other and I hope we will be able to recapture that.
If I could scrape up a way I would try to counsel with the Harleys. For now, I'll just seek advice and support here! [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img]

Hi Shaz87
yes Belper is about 18 miles from where I livew. I used to work in Belper.
WHERE ARE YOU?
Still trying to find a way through my H's fog.
Jante

Hi there,
I live in the UK, too, although I'm American - I've lived here 13 years and my H is English. My H has fallen in love with 2 young women in the last 18 months and I believe he is still e-mailing OW2, although I have no proof of this. He says they are "just friends" and that it is my jealousy which is the problem. LOL (is all I can say to that!) I found MB in Feb, 2 weeks after I found out about his friendship with OW2, and have been on this rollercoaster ever since - well, I have actually been on the rollercoaster since June last year, when I found out about OW1 - that's a long story - I have posted a lot, first on this forum, but mostly over on GQII.<p>We have been up and down and I consider us still not "in recovery", but we are now both in individual counselling. My H blames me for our marriage problems, but still refuses to go to marriage counselling to talk, or to tell me how he thinks I have failed him - says he has to go on his own first for awhile and is encouraging me to go on my own. I have just started and didn't feel i could go until he had had enough sessions to feel positive about the experience, and realize that he had problems that needed to be worked on, otherwise he would continue to blame me for everything.<p>I'd like to encourage you to continue here and to read everything you can - there are some very experienced people here who help people on this forum - if you keep posting and show that you really want to do everything possible to save your marriage, I'm sure you will find this a very helpful place. There are a lot of marriages that have survived even the spouse walking out and disappearing into the ether for months - moving in with the OP - sometimes, it's only then that they realize what they have done. The affair is always lived on a fantasy level - especially the ones where the have little actual contact with the OP until they finally get together, such as online affairs. It is only when they have to face the OP across the breakfast table and deal with them on a day-to-day level that they are able to compare them with what they have lost. Plan A's purpose, hard as it is, is for you, the BS - to learn that you can survive this and be a better person, to eliminate any of the behaviours you may have done which have contributed to your spouse having an affair (eliminating Love Busters) so they have no excuses and cannot blame you for their actions, and also, thereby, to leave them with the memories of you at your best. This is vital if you want them to feel able to come back to you. You don't want them to remember you punching them out the door (I punched my H after I found out about OW2), much as you might feel they deserve it.<p>I still consider myself to be somewhat of a newbie - I'm still searching for clues and ways to understand my H and what is happening to us - so I'm no expert on MB - but I think if you're looking for support, you will find it here. This place has helped me calm down and keep my hair on when it was really important that I do so. I am not always successful at not LB'ing, even now, but I am still trying.<p>There's a great thread on GQII about "Fog Statements" I'll try to find for you - it seems WS must subscribe to the same "How to talk like a WS" manual - it's good to see you are not alone. I have read posts from other WS who are now working on their Ms, who say they can't believe they said those things, so please don't lose hope.<p>My H says he loves me and that I'm the only one in his life - he is even still affectionate and wants to spend time together. But he is still very secretive, with private e-mail account and a code/lock on his cellphone, keeping money in his own bank account, and cash in his locked dresser drawer - so words, but no commitment to openness or honesty, so I still don't trust him. Until he opens up in these areas, I will assume he is just operating on the "what she doesn't know can't hurt her" principle.<p>I have found it too devastating to snoop (I did that already, copied out all their e-mails and gave them to my soliciter to keep) - so I am resolved to plan A, plan A, plan A, and get on with my own life. He has free will and his own choices to make - I cannot control him and am not going to try - I have already cried buckets and gone through feeling it would have been easier to deal with if he had died - right now, I'm just waking up to the fact that there is a lot of abuse in our marriage, so that's actually the real issue, and the OW are secondary issues.<p>Just know that there are others out here going through similar things and by supporting each other here, we can help each other to ride this rollercoaster through - just remember it's not over until the fat lady sings!<p>Good luck,
Odile

Here's 2 threads that you might find interesting -<p>The Misapplication of Plan A<p>and<p>How 'bout it WAT, Compile us a "Fog" list<p>as well as<p>WAT's Quickstart Guidelines for BS<p>I wish I knew how to make these into links, but if you use the search engine in GQII for the first 2, you'll find them there, and the 3rd is here in JFO.<p>Hope this is helpful.
Odile

odile
I managed to find the link to "fog" and recognised a few saying that the WS had been using. It'S now day10(in plan B) i think and i so want to ring him it's going to be a long 5 days until we meet in counselling on 1st July, I'll hava 2 agendas then .is he coming home or has the other women got the claws in too deep!!!
I plan to take the boys to the seaside at the weekend so I don't wait for every car that goes by thinking it could be him, Take care everyone.

Odile,<p>Just read your post and feel so much better for it! We have been trying hard over the last couple of weeks to rebuild something since I found out about H's affair. He tells me that he is not in love with her - but he also says the same about me! We have 2 beautiful sons and that is the main reason why he has stayed. Said last night that he does want to and believes that he can love me again. We have talked a lot, but sometimes what I hear hurts so badly that I worry if I will ever be able to feel the same way about him. He doesn't seem to care how much he hurts me. He is due to begin counselling tomorrow (on his own) and we will probably go for some couple counselling shortly thereafter.
I think he is beginning to realise how much this has changed me and I really hope that we can find that love again. At first I felt that he wasn't sorry for the affair - I still think that he is sad that it is over - that devastates me.
Snooping brings more heartache - it is a compulsion to know what is going on and to know the details, but every time you find something it kills a little more of you. I am trying to be good to him and not to punish him for this, but I feel that I am the one who has been punished and that she has gotten off scott-free. Even my H has gotten off lightly - we are still here! I want to be loving and consistent, but sometimes all I can do is look at him and cry.
Keep going, Odile - this site is a lifesaver - it has kept me going and I think that it has given him hope that we can do this, too.
Good luck with your H - at least he still loves you - you have a good foundation to build on. Be strong and soon he will realise that he doesn't want to lose you and that if his behaviour continues, he may! Take care.
Fishwife

If you caught my last update, h has now rung his friend in the village and is meeting him 8pm(uk time).I have primed him on a few things to say, I even told him to help him offer to pack.... I know that was wrong!!H has to back because he wants to.He may tell his friend that he made the best decision by leaving us all, but why speak to someone who h knows is giving me support>I expect i'll know ou fate in 6hrs time. Keep everything crossed.

Best of luck! Everything crossed for you! Will be watching this space ...
Fishwife