OK. Here's my story. My husband and I started dating in high school 15 years ago. We dated for 1 1/2 years and broke up during college. During that time I married a man whom I didn't love romantically. I knew walking down the aisle that I was still in love with my now current husband. That marriage lasted 10 months. Somehow, we are still cordial to each other. Anyway, two years later I married my current husband. We will be married 8 years the 16th of this month, but I have loved him for the past 15 years.

Our first couple of years of marriage probably set up a lot of the problems that created the environment that allowed my WH to feel so unloved and frustrated. P, you might find this interesting because I can relate to your wife. I was not interested in SF because it hurt every time and I usually got a gross UTI. So my associastions with SF were negative, despite the fact that I desperately loved my husband. He persisted to show me he loved me (I understand this NOW! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> with sexual inuendos. We'd be in line at a cafeteria with loads of elderly couples around and he'd come up behind me all aroused. I took offense and made a big issue of it. Ugh. I tried to show him in other ways I loved him, but apparently those ways weren't one his top five list. Aaah, hindsight!

Then after about two years of marriage, I gave birth to our son FOUR months early. He struggled for life his whole first year. We both have medical backgrounds, which was both a blessing and curse during this time. Sometimes too much knowledge isn't good . Anyway, I have carried the guilt for his early delivery around ever since, even though I did nothing wrong. I am letting this go now. When my son came home from the hospital 3 months after delivery, he was still not healthy and nowhere near being age-appropriate. So I resigned and dropped out of my master's program to take full care of him. For the next 5 months we did not take him anywhere out in public for fear of him getting sick. It worked! He grew and so did his poor little lungs. OK, so you get the idea of the stress I carried (some self-inflicted I'm sure). My focus on my new role did nothing for the SF in our marriage. It happened, but it wasn't good.

About a two years later my husband let a comment slip that he was so unhappy with this area (SF) that he was tempted to do something about it. I took this to mean an affair. So I fervently prayed that God would heal this area in my life. I also tried to relax about it and mentally prepare for it. For me, if I'm with him mentally and emotionally, it's good. Well, sure enough the pain went away and I enjoyed it. I thought I expressed this, but apparently it wasn't enough. I come from a pretty conservative family--to say "I love you" was a once a year thing, although we knew we were loved. So it was hard to solicit SF from my husband. I spent many nights looking at his back wanting to wake him up, but for fear of rejection or embarrassment, I never did.

Now, I'm the type of person who enjoys school and learning and have always been good at it. My husband, however, is better at "in the field" type situations. Great under pressure and knows his stuff, but panics when taking exams. This led to his inability to pass his national medical exam several times. So for the first 7 years of our marriage, he was struggling to find his career. So his minimum wage job, my part-time job, and my inheritance were our sources of income. I don't think I ever belittled him, but apparently he felt bad about it. But I always knew if he could ever get a break, he'd do an awesome job. Finally, he got accepted by a federal law enforcement agency. So two days after September 11, 2001 he left us for the academy clear across the country for 5 months. I had two little ones by now. I grieved heavily with the country and at the absence of my spouse. But I was strong in my commitment to support my husband and couldn't wait for him to come home so we could really begin our lives. We would finally be able to support our family like we had dreamed. I also fell in love with him all over again.

During our phone conversations, I could hear his confidence growing and he would occasionally mention one of the female cadets. She apparently "had a jealous husband and all the instructors were telling her to leave him." He felt really bad for her. I was jealous of this friendship and felt it could lead to trouble. I expressed this in many forms of LBs. I was dismissed. But little did I know her room was 4 doors down from my WH. Or that they were together constantly. Facts my WH left out of every conservation except maybe 3 or 4.

So when we went up there for graduation and I saw how he looked at her, I knew. And I was angry and devastated. And the biggest clue was he wasn't interested in SF at all! I was horrified. I wanted it, wanted it bad. He eventually gave in, but with no passion. No I love yous. Empty. I didn't sleep for weeks hardly at all. Weight poured off. You know.

When we returned home and I saw the 20 pictures he had of her, I demanded no contact. I interrogated him weekly and finally when nothing changed, I started checking the cellphone bill. He called her all the time. Sometimes 10 or 11 times a day. Always told me he wasn't allowed to call from work. He was still new. By the way, we are "just friends. She needs someone to support her during her difficult divorce." <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Someone recommended HNHN. I loved what it had to say, but cried almost completely through it because I realized what I had done so completely wrong in my marriage. And that as much as I wanted to believe him, that he was almost textbook "fog." He said he would read it, but never did. Counseling lasted about 1 1/2 months till he decided to stop.

He moved out May 1st. Living with his sister at that time. Almost every one of our conversations had some form of LB on my part. I just couldn't stop myself. It was horrible. But I was panicked. I still wanted to believe him. But finally I begged him to tell me what was really going on and he confessed. That was what I needed. Honesty. I remember complimenting him on his bravery for being able to tell me. I knew it was a hard but very important thing to do.

I had purchased SAA during this time and initially tried Plan B. I lasted a week. This was all before the confession and I was still in the "trying to convice the jury" stage.

So once I got connected to this forum, I realized I had to Plan A wholeheartedly. That's how I became so interested in P's thread. I want to learn what others did in successful/helpful Plan As. I let him initiate almost everything. I try to not ask any relationship questions. I let him ask me out to dinner. I only call him when it's important or to leave an "I love you" message from me and the kids. He knows I don't want out of this marriage and I forgive him. He originally stated he wanted a divorce. But there has been no legal motion forward with this. I write him notes once a week to let him know I love him. They are light and airy notes, but often include reference to happy memories.

He has been responding positively. His voice is softer and he calls almost evey night. This is to talk to the kids, but we always talk first. He is more attentive to me. He now even responds to my ILY with one that has emotion behind it. He used to respond with hesitation.

He also seems to think that we can divorce and still get back together. I realize that some do this, but how I feel NOW is that I am giving 100% of my effort and love into trying to recover now and if we divorce, that I will be ready to go on.

So yesterday, the conversation yielded a mention of him getting his own checking account. With the postive direction I felt we were going, my heart plummeted and it showed. When he asked about what was wrong, I tried to explain I was hurt and that I had been unwisely jumping to conclustions about our relationship. He eventually told me he was confused and unsure if he wanted divorce. He had been told by his sister ( she is like the sister I never had and my best friend) that I was learning about stuff online and was working to improve myself. And then when he sees me, well he is just confused.

I told him that I was trying to improve myself and hopefully he would be the one to benefit from this in the future. But irregardless, my kids would benefit (less anger, better cook). And if we got divorced, then someone else who wants to love me would benefit. (he also knows I have been reading SF books!!) This angered him because of the mention of someone else. I then pointed out, gently--no screaming involved, that he already had someone else. OK, crucify me. I know, I know. LB!! But he didn't take it that way, whew! He just disgustingly rolled his eyes and said, "Oh, that's nothing."

I decided that it was time for me to leave. He wanted to talk more later, but since I know his A is not over I don't think it would be fruitful for me. So I told him that right now I wasn't ready to talk about this. He needs time to think. I told him what I could: that I loved him, I didn't want divorce, and I didn't want things to go back to the ways things were. He agreed, gave me a very passionate, wet kiss and said I love you.

So, this confusion for him is good, right? Is it the beginning of the fog lifting? Did I LB badly?? Any other Plan A suggestions? Meeting his SF need right now is too emotionally painful, although I did prove to him on one occasion I was willing and very capable of change.

I'm afraid to spend too much time with him. I'm afraid I might LB and send us back to ground zero.

Our anniversary is next week. I'd love for him to remember with even a card. I am wondering how I should express my love to him. In the past we have almost always prioritized our need to save money rather than buy gifts or even go out. After reading a thread here, I realized that the thought and love in buying a gift might really be appreciated. Not too expensive--don't want to appear to be bribing him. Since he loves jewelry, I was thinking of a modest priced piece. What do you think?

BH-

I don't want you to feel like you are being ignored but I got swamped starting at 7:30 this morning. I'll give your study a little more thought later.

A couple of quick thoughts though, <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> the 'sexual inuendos' thing is something that I was very guilty of. I didn't realize how much my W resented this sort of thing. I thought brushing up behind my W, a gentle brush under her breasts in the morning as I kissed her goodbye, or even slowly running my hand up her leg while we sat and watched a movie or TV would communicate how much I loved her, that I admired her body, and that I thought she was a good lover. Maybe I should have reconsidered an alternative approach long ago based on the lack of any kind of reaction from her. I think communication was the big problem here for both of you also. Now you are expressing yourself a little more and sometimes that results in Angry Outbursts or Disrespectful Judgements. Only express your feelings and don't try to hurt your H or to 'teach' him how to act or what he should do.

Like I mentioned earlier, there is no reason for him to have separate accounts if you guys are going to stay married. This implies he is trying to hide something. On a positive note, at least he mentioned the desire and didn't say that he had already done this sort of thing.

Yes, you LB'd a little. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> Learning new behaviors will take a little time. Oh, the anniversary thing...don't go overboard. Don't try to 'buy' his attention or love. How about something to remember an old time together? A souviner from a trip you took together maybe that carries with it some fond memories. Definately a card. Jewelry might be a little overboard and out of budget.

Sorry I need to run. TGIF!!! I'll look over your story some more later.

{{{{{{{{{BH}}}}}}}}}}}} Hope your kids are well.

HoFS

Hi BH,
I just wanted to bump this up for the others to see.. My DF is also in Law Enforcement. He will graduate from his academy in Sept.

I think you are doing a good job in your plan A, and it appears your H is noticing too.. keep up the good work. Make being with you something he associates with good thoughts and kindness. Make it a "safe place" for him to come. Law Enforcement is a tough job, especially since 9-11. I assume your H was in the academy in Georgia? There is a member here who is a retired cop, actually his member name is RetiredCop.. but he has given me alot of insight into the mind of an LEO. I'll try to find him to come over here..

in the meantime.. i would say for the gift, think of things he really enjoys, and go with something about that, like a hobby, ect.. I like the jewelry idea too <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

aaf <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

<small>[ July 12, 2002, 12:39 PM: Message edited by: alwaysandforever ]</small>

HoFS-

Sad thing is now I would love any sexual inuendo! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> Actually, the other day he did brush his hand over my butt and my heart raced! I just wish I had read HNHN before I got married!!!

I don't know what to do about the checking account. He can get one without my permission. I suppose if it comes up again, I will just say...??? I'm drawing a blank on a response that doesn't include a DJ or demand.

I will think about the gift some more. I only wish we had taken a trip during our marriage that was BEFORE the affair. I do have pictures...maybe a photo collage. But I think I would appreciate that more than he would. He does like DVDs. But I wanted something personal and thoughtful. I also don't want it perceived as buying his love...

S is moody more now and protective of me. But he knows we both love him very much. We are planning a joint birthday party for S and D in about 2 weeks. WH seems excited and eager to help plan. Whew!

AAF-

I would love to hear from RetiredCop. I understand that LEO often have secret lives. The profession runs in his family. 5 other members are all LEO. Are you doing OK? Do you have family support? You know, I understand the demands of the job, I just don't like feeling like I am not a priority, you know? The academy does cause them to get very self-centered. And then the bonding that occurs with other cadets and the freedom from family responsibilities-well, it became the breaking point for an already rocky marriage. Or atleast I see now it was rocky, I thought back then it was great!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Must make decision this weekend on gift...ugh.

OK. I decided against the jewelry. But I don't know what to give him. I don't want to give him clothes, cologne, or something he might use when with her. Maybe a DVD. But that isn't very personal. I was thinking of the photo collage again, but am afraid it will make him feel pressured. I was trying to find some old love letters from him...where are they??

I spoke with my SIL today and she had a talk with my WH the other day. She said he was confused. She said something like, "If you do divorce, and you know I wouldn't want you to, but if you did it would be difficult to go right into a relationship with OW." He said, "I wouldn't want to be with her. However, when I go out with the guys I DO notice other women. I guess I need to stay away from wife."

Everyone, what is going on here? It hurts me to think there might be another relationship on the horizon for him. I mean, forgiving the current transgression is difficult enough. But how can I compete with the exstacy of new relationships??

I'm feeling defeated and hopeless. I knew Plan A would be hard. I suppose I should focus on continuing to improve myself and show I care for him too. Any advice?

Hi Broken Hearted,

From what I read, you’re doing a lot of things right. It’s just going to take some time, I think. First, time for the changes you are making in yourself to actually become habits. Now I suspect a lot of things feel like forced, intentional behavior modifications. Eventually, it will become more natural. Second, it’ll take time for WH to notice the changes, and realize that they aren’t just an act. Or something that’s going to go away as soon as he comes back. And time for the fog to lift, for him.

Someone recommended HNHN. I loved what it had to say, but cried almost completely through it because I realized what I had done so completely wrong in my marriage.

Yeah, I think we’ve all felt this way. Wish someone would have handed me the FIL/SIL textbook as I was leaving the church. Right after the vows!

He moved out May 1st. Living with his sister at that time. Almost every one of our conversations had some form of LB on my part. I just couldn't stop myself. It was horrible. But I was panicked.

Yep, the same thing that I did. Probably went something like “how can you do this, you can’t be unhappy, …” Basically that her feelings, what she was saying, was all wrong. OTOH, a lot of what she was saying was history revision. But it was the wrong thing to argue with her about it, try to use guilt, etc.

I realized I had to Plan A wholeheartedly. That's how I became so interested in P's thread. I want to learn what others did in successful/helpful Plan As. I let him initiate almost everything. I try to not ask any relationship questions.

Well, there’s also some basics there. I think you hear us talk to HT about not having relationship discussions, because it basically ends with the BS feeling very frustrated, and testing abilities not to LB. And the WS is pretty fogged in anyway, so I don’t think we can expect any valid discussion. At this stage, it’s almost a no-win situation. “Don’t you love me?” Well, no. “How can you say that? What about….” Well, I’ve always felt alone, or controlled,….

OTOH, if your spouse is willing to talk, and share feelings about EN’s met, Love Busting that you did, etc., this is an incredibly valuable conversation to have. But now, before you rush over and start trying to get these answers from him, realize that he’s probably not of the mindset now of telling you these inner secrets, and setting you up for success. That was my experience. Wife was good at listing all of my LB’ers though, and that was great help.

As for Plan A, let’s start with basics. Do you know what his most important EN’s are? I guess you could start with the Harley “typical male” list, and then modify as you know. But remember that your need-meeting to-date was not sufficient to keep him from straying. So I suspect you, like the rest of us, have some work to do in identifying his most important EN’s, and meeting them.

When I was counseling with Jenn, early on, wife wouldn’t give me a clue about Enq. A lot of trial and error. Oh, she told me what she didn’t want (i.e., no Affection – even though she confessed it was her no. 1 EN), and she told me how horrible my Lbing was (another valuable thing). But I tried different things to meet what I thought were EN’s, then watch her reaction. What I found was that Affection could me met well with non-physical methods. As long as I wasn’t trying to hug or kiss her. Flowers, cards, a touch on the shoulder, frequent e-mails (yeah, then I found Conversation was high on her list too). If he won’t do it, pull out the Enq yourself, and fill it in for him, if he won’t do it.

BTW, my whole Plan A started with a sincere apology to my wife for the things I had done to harm our marriage. Recognition that I had not treated her well. A vow to work on “me” to make things better for her. And disclosure that I had seeked help, was going through a MB program with coaching. And that her only role was to provide feedback, if she could. If not, then I would understand. Anyway, I think this conversation is important.

I write him notes once a week to let him know I love him. They are light and airy notes, but often include reference to happy memories.

If he responds positively to this, then he probably has an Affection need. Not real common in guys, but it’s on my list too.

He also seems to think that we can divorce and still get back together. I realize that some do this, but how I feel NOW is that I am giving 100% of my effort and love into trying to recover now and if we divorce, that I will be ready to go on.

Yeah, my wife said the same thing. If it could just be her choice of whether we are together or not, then maybe something would happen. I know now that, at that time, it was her choice to be with OM. No, I think divorce takes enough toll, drains the LB enough, that YOU would probably not be willing to get back together. I’d stay away from that route.

Ok, I can see your disappointment about the checking account. At one point, things seem to be going better. Then this “I need independence” thing. But realize it is going to be up and down for a while. It’s been a couple of months of Plan A. If nothing else, the guy is confused. Having felt he understood exactly who and what you were (someone he wanted to divorce), then saying positive changes now. Wanting to try the marriage again, but being afraid that nothing has really changed. And knowing he felt something for OW. My wife once remarked that she knew we had never loved each other, because she felt true love for OM. That if our love was true love, then we wouldn’t have lost it. Yeah, I don’t agree with this stuff, and it flies in the face of MB, but you gotta know that she (and maybe he) had beliefs like this. And that explains a lot of what she was doing at the time.

Anyway, you handled the checking account thing well. Tell him HOW YOU FEEL about it. No DJ’s required. No AO’s. Just relay your disappointment, what you hoped the two of you were working toward.

BTW, how much do you trust his sister? If he were seeing OW, spending evenings at her home, etc., do you really think she would tell you? Or would she hold off, if for no other reason than not wanting to hurt you by telling? At some point in this, if contact is still going on, you are going to have to go to Plan B to end it. Not until you’ve laid the Plan A groundwork, to make YOUR changes, but eventually, likely.

He eventually told me he was confused and unsure if he wanted divorce. He had been told by his sister ( she is like the sister I never had and my best friend) that I was learning about stuff online and was working to improve myself. And then when he sees me, well he is just confused.

Yeah, this is good. You obviously are making the Plan A changes, and he noticed. If not, he’d probably be heading down divorce alley! Good for you.

I decided that it was time for me to leave. He wanted to talk more later, but since I know his A is not over I don't think it would be fruitful for me.

Actually, if you could understand him more by talking, that would be good. Understand from the point of finding out what EN’s she is meeting. You probably know some – like Conversation – since they talked so frequently. But if the guy is starting to think clearly, hear his thoughts, his feelings, his concerns. Validate them. And then plug them into your Plan A. Always be looking for info to optimize your Plan A. BUT, if you feel the need to LB (and listening to this “she always does this and that for me, and you never did, so therefore can’t”), then the best thing to do is excuse yourself and leave. Don’t let it get to boiling point and then Love Bust. Too much withdrawal from the Love Bank. Realize your boiling point.

So, this confusion for him is good, right? Is it the beginning of the fog lifting? Did I LB badly?? Any other Plan A suggestions? Meeting his SF need right now is too emotionally painful, although I did prove to him on one occasion I was willing and very capable of change.

Well, I think the confusion is a good thing. As for meeting other EN’s now, I guess I would go all-out and meet them all. Anything you don’t meet would be met by OW. I know SF may be difficult. But it was also the EN that he had that he was historically frustrated by you not meeting, right? Maybe some women could jump in here and give their perspective. But I would think that no EN’s would be off-limits at this stage of Plan A. In Plan B, all would be off-limits.

I'm afraid to spend too much time with him. I'm afraid I might LB and send us back to ground zero.

Well, just be aware of the LB danger. But spend as much time as you can. Part of the Plan A is to test yourself too. New habits formed, or just still deliberate “acts”. Can you comfortably meet his Affection EN, Conversation, etc. And does he see the changes. All of this takes time together – time alone with him. Remember, Harley’s 15 hours per week of time alone. Time to meet personal EN’s of Affection, Conversation, SF, Admiration especially.

Our anniversary is next week. I'd love for him to remember with even a card.

Oh, expect little, at this period in his confused life. And thank him profusely for anything beyond. My wife used to give me joke cards then, which was really hard to take. Prior to that though, I got nothing. I’m honestly not sure which was worse.

After reading a thread here, I realized that the thought and love in buying a gift might really be appreciated. Not too expensive--don't want to appear to be bribing him. Since he loves jewelry, I was thinking of a modest priced piece.

Well, we’re probably not the right ones to advise you. Jenn pushes for intimate gifts. No power tools, no cookware. When we were on the ropes, she suggested a small locket for wife, with D’s picture in it. Sort of a symbol of my heart, and the product of our the loving part of our marriage (Daughter), and a reminder. She stuck it in a drawer!

Good luck with the gift shopping. As for your Plan A, I think you got it together pretty well. I also think there’s value in a Jenn or Steve session, having done more than a few of those myself. Jenn was an especially great Plan A coach. I would have struggled without her – kept me very focused. And when an A is involved, I think this is very important.

Gotta run. Sorry it took me a while to get back to you.

P

Say BH,

So, what did you get him for birthday? What's happening? Progress? Anything? Inquiring minds want to know!

P

Sorry! Sorry! I wrote this long reply yesterday, which took me an hour as I'm trying to figure out this quote thing, and it lost my reply! It was late and I just couldn't muster up another reply.

Anyway, for our 8th anniversary tomorrow, I bought some sentimental, but not heart-breaking cards (one my son insisted I buy), put together a photo collage of myself and the kids (nicely framed) and a bouquet of 8 balloons (get the significance?) and one that said "I love you" on it. He is working 3p-1a, so I decorated his room with his mother's permission and presence. Didn't want to be accused of snooping! Jenn said she thought that was a good gift.

First counseling session went good today. Clarified to me that Plan A is for my WH to see me as an attractive alternative to OW to serve the purpose of total separation. It is not to make him fall him love with me again. It allows him to start fixing things or for the affair to die a natural death.

As far as ENs go, she said to do those things in which I also get something out of it. With the SF, she said she was afraid I might build up too much resentment, but if I did SF to protect myself from STDs/AIDS. All in all, a good conversation. She did say that more than likely a Plan B will have to be implemented as he really has no motivation to change things. Has the best of both worlds...I dread that.

His ENs...I am basing them off the typical male with some affection thrown in there. He has always enjoyed hearing I love you at the end of phone conversations or when leaving each other. So I am applying this one no matter what!! Make sure my kids say it too. After all, it is the truth.

Jenn called his confusion Cognitive Dissonance: where your beliefs and your behavior are inconsistent. For example, "my wife is an angel, but I am having an affair." I suppose this is why he once said," Why can't you just be a b-tch!"

As far as SIL, I trusted her completely prior to the A. Now I know better. But she did ask him to move to his mom's once he confessed to the A. She didn't want it going on in her home and have to face me. She said she wouldn't lie to me, but if I don't ask, she won't volunteer anything either. I don't tell her as much anymore because I don't want to put her in the middle anymore. And I'm not telling her things so she can tell WH. It is hard, though, because I consider her a friend and I sometimes just need her input as a friend and fellow BS.

Can you comfortably meet his Affection EN, Conversation, etc. And does he see the changes. All of this takes time together &#8211; time alone with him. Remember, Harley&#8217;s 15 hours per week of time alone. Time to meet personal EN&#8217;s of Affection, Conversation, SF, Admiration especially.

I'd love the opportunity to meet these needs! But we haven't been alone in months. He is still guarded around me, so I just can't push anything right now. However, when we are together I do try my best to meet these needs without putting on a false pretense. It's a constant testing of boundaries though.

Will let you know how my gift was received. I just hope he doesn't feel like he's been guilted into getting my something. I plan to be out most of the day so I don't sit around waiting for something spectacular to happen.

How do you deal with people telling you to "just drop WH" or " you'll never trust him again, " once a cheat, always a cheat."????? I am being bombarded this week with these and it is hurting my resolve to Plan A. Help!

Anniversary Day! WH worked probably didn't get home till 2:00am or so, but called me at 8am to say Happy Anniversary and thank you for the gift. He said he had a card for me. (!!!) I had to go to his sister's house this morning, so he said he'd meet me over there. I was so surprised that he also had a gift for me...from Victoria's Secret!! He has never given me lingerie before, ever!! It was very nice and sexy!! I was so giddy with joy and excitement, I thanked him several times, hugged him, and gave him a kiss. The card was simple but he wrote that he was thankful to God for me and for the love that I have given and shown to him. It was very nice. I know it didn't include any "I love yous", but I'm still happy to have received anything.

Any thoughts?

Hi BH,

Got home about 1 am this morning. Finally got a chance to read your new thread.
Sounds as if you are making excellent progress. Did you say that you have Surviving an Affair? If not, I think it would really help you add even more depth to your plan.

Women tend to not be able to stay in Plan A as long as men. For a lot of different reasons. Right now you are doing a superlative job of changing old habits and letting him know that you are willing to do what it takes for him to have the marriage he always wanted.

Be very aware of how you are feeling. When you find that you are at the place where you can't stop the LBer's it's time for Plan B. Or, when the pain is too much. If you are not sleeping well, loss of appetite or overeating, other stress related symptoms.

The very real danger is two-fold. First that you will undo all your hard work by all kinds of LBers, and secondly that you will lose your love for your H entirely and then the marriage will really be in danger. There is the added danger of the long term effects to your health. If you try to stay in Plan A too long the stress is overwhelming. There is convincing documentation that you could end up with Post Traumatic Stress Disorder types of symptoms in a year or so. Things like joint and back problems, connective tissue problems, sleep disorders, etc.....

It is a very difficult decision, especially because the time to go to Plan B is while you are still in love with your spouse.

How far did you get in P's thread?

Keep us up to date, and let us know what we can do to help. That includes techy questions to, like how to link things... etc. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I'm always the last to get it, so don' t feel bad about not figuring it out the first week. LOL

Blessings,

Cerri

Thanks for your reply, Cerri! Glad you got home safe. Did you have fun or read all your coaching manuals all the time? Or maybe I should say instead, did you let your hair down and drink margaritas?? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Joyous news! WH and I had awesome conversation today. Started with discussion of my new lingerie(OK, I guess I'm not too worried about resentment because I invited him to come over so I could model it tomorrow night). We somehow ended up discussing our future. Yes, I said OUR future. He said he wants us to have a marriage 10 or even a 100 times better than before. He also said, somewhere in the conversation, that we would be together. He volunteered all this information freely, with no probing/manipulating on my part! I'm so proud of myself.

I was able to apologize for some of my past mistakes and ask for forgiveness. He said he had already forgiven me. Yeah!

I let him know that it was OK to go slow right now. For him to take his time, that we both had things to work on to make things better. I got to explain some of the things I was working on to make me better but that would also benefit us. He said there were things he wanted to work on for himself. All in all, a 45 minute conversation with no AO or DJs. First time in months! Whew!

Anyway, I feel so good about the conversation. And then tonight, when we were talking (again!) he actually said, "I love you" FIRST!!!!!

Cerri, I hope I don't need plan B, but I know right now he has not stated he is committed to recovery or ending A. When we discuss topics like we did today, I want to bring it up because I know I can't go forward without those steps. I just don't know how to bring it up without LBing.

Techy question: how do you link things?? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />