I went home early today because I wanted to go spend time with my wife. I came into the house and heard her on the phone. She didn't know I was there. She proceeded to tell this person that she loves him 5 times in three minutes. I confronted her she denied. I got it out of her. I have suspected something for months. SHe is not emotionally here. SHe says she is in love with the other man and not with me. SHe wants me to let her stay here at home till she makes up her mind me or him. She wants four weeks. I had affairs a couple of years ago and been trying to be an angel to make it up to her. Now this. Should I let her stay here and have sex with me and this other guy? If we both have had affairs is it a sign we need a divorce. I have read HArleys book and have appt. in a few weeks for counseling. I will never stray again this hurts worst than everything in the world after I have tried so hard.

Hi,

Sorry you have to come here but this is a good place to get help. REading the books and then your appointment with Steve is a very good start.

Now you will have to decide whether you can tolerate her disrespect of being with the OM while at home. This means you are meeting some of her needs. She can be a cake eater.

RU willing to participate in this? Of course, plan A makes many stay with the WS then Plan B helps them let the WS move out.

You need to learn where your personal boundaries are and enforce them. However, your d/d is quite fresh so it may take some time.

The option is yours. How long has the A been going on?

L.

Fireman,

Affairs always mean that something is going wrong. Have you read about EN'S?
I'm sorry for the pain that you are going through. I can truely feel with you.

You are probably very confused at the moment and I don't think it would be a good idea to make any decisions at all at the moment.

Read about Plan A, it helps alot. Try to stay as calm as possible. I know this is difficult, mostly now that you have found out the "worse".

Try your best to make your envoirment comfortable. I am aware that this is very hard, but you both have to calm down. Then you will be able to start to talk.
As you said you have noticed that something has been wrong for the past few months. Your wife will definately be "foggy".
She has been caught in the middle of her "dream" and now she is facing reality.
This is definately a shock for all that are involved!!!

I have read some very interesting postings concerning what happens when a WS is in his dreamy world. The body goes through a chemical process. They feel truely in love. This justifies their affair because they are feeling so high.
This is what we in MB'S call in the "fog". EN'S are being met and the WS feels like never before in his life. They will say many things that don't make sence, so don't take it personally.
Do all the reading you can in MB'S. Many others have went through the same and many will give you great advice.

So welcome here and feel free to ask anything!!!

take care
BB

Fireman:

Orchid says a lot of truth.
Sorry you had to experience what you did. Perhaps your wife's resentment over what you did has festered over time, and not been dealt with totally?
However, in like fashion, you are not NOW resonsible for her actions, although you may understandably feel that way. Having been through the Plan A,Plan B thing, I have an observation: the most important thing is not to "spoil" your wife, and make things too cosy for her. This only encourages the cake-eating, and can be soul-destroying for you in the process. Try to behave as indifferebtly as you can, if your decision is that she can stay the 4 weeks. It is also much easier not to "fight" her on every issue at this stage. This will push her away. This is a fine balance, and if you cannot manage it, don't agree to her staying, even if it means that YOU leave. (unfair, I know, but not really an issue). Don't show fear of her leaving, or any kind of emotional dependancy or weakness, or neediness. Women hate wimps. She may end up despising you in this state of "fog" she is in.

Sex? tough one. I would hesitate to answer that for you, but I know you are looking for opinions. Here's mine: NO
Having said that, try to approach it as dispassionately & calmly as possible, and take the lead here. Don't discuss it before the time....it should be natural that you won't have sex....if she initiates, GE-ENTLY turn her down (be strong). Ask her THEN," ..how could you possibly sleep with both of us...?" At the very least, you should suggest alternate sleeping arrangements.
My ex reassured me that she &OM_1 had safe sex, until I found out from her best friend, that she had a pregnancy scare(!!?). By that time, we had already had sex after her A. This is scary stuff, life is short, be safe. Don't believe her, whatever she tells you about having safe sex.

People in affairs are emoyionally needy, and women feel almost obliged to be sexually adventurous, to the point of irresponsibility. Oral sex, and sex without condoms are almost perfunctory. They are mostly scared of being assertive with OM, in fear of losing them. This is of course totally unsafe sex, and the WS will NEVER admit to it. Be warned. Sorry to be so straight, but you need to hear it pal. The hurt dies after a while, though. Don't focus on it.

For the rest, ignore her, don't pester her. Vent on this board, don't push her for answers. Stay calm & confident. The other A**sH**le is confident at the moment. Outplay him. Good luck.

Muzohead

Muzzhead,

I did find out that they have been having unprotected sex the past few months never used a condom. I am getting a blood test today. My wife says that he has been with 10 other women in time. I am trying so hard to not be mad. I noticed that is pushes her away. She told me this morning that she wants me to compete for her with this other guy. So she can make her decision. She states that when I did this years ago that she competed for me and won me back. She expects the same thing.

It sounds like the issues form your A were never dealt with fully. She sounds like she resents you for what you did. It really is time for you two to get some MC.(glad you are talking to SH)

Would I compete for her affections? No. Would I treat her with courtesy and dignity? Yes. Would I treat her like a lady? Yes. Would I have sex with someone who'd been sexually careless? NO WAY!!! Would I set some boundaries? Definitely. Can she have her cake and eat it too? No.

My wife has always told me that I don't go long enough with her during intercourse. I only last 5-10 minutes. When she sits there and tells me that she has had more orgasims with this other guy in 8 weeks than in our entire 8 year relationship it errodes my confidence. She is not telling me this to me mean. I am the one that asked her. We have been saying for quite some time that our marriage would be awesome if we had a better sex life. But she never wants it with me. I get it 2-3 times a month. She has been having it a lot more than that with this other guy. She told me last week before I found this out that she is just not sexual. She has now brought a lover home and made love to him over and over in my bed while I was out of town. I wonder if I should talk to this guy and ask him to stop destroying my marriage and his.

I think you need to reread your last message.
I think that you would have to be a masochist to stay with her.
She has unprotected sex over and over again with a guy who has been with 10 others. She has sex over and over again in your home and in your marriage bed? She is psychologically and physically toxic to you. I feel very sorry for you.

fireman1,
Please take what some say here with a grain of salt. There are some that failed at saving there marraige and speak with alot of hate towards WS's. (wayward spouses)

Welcome to marraige builders. To answer your question, I would go one step farther, I would tell OM (other man) wife.
I wish I would have been informed when my wifes OM got caught by his wife. Since OM's wife didn't tell me, he was able to continue his little fantacy because he didn't have me to worry about. This allowed their A to last another year before I found out.
The bottom line is it is only fair to her that she knows whats going on and in doing so, the fantasy land will be blown to pieces and reality will look them both right in the face. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />
Good luck and welcome.
SH

<small>[ August 20, 2002, 02:25 PM: Message edited by: stillhurts ]</small>

She stayed with me when I went through a period of uncertainty. She is clearly not thinking ok. I am attempting to get her close friends and family to surround her and tell her that she is not making good choices.

Fireman1,
I just edited my last post, I hope you saw it. Remember, you can't change her, you can only change you.
I cant say much now but I will post again tonight. Hang in there.
sh

Fireman1

Have you been tested for STD's?

Your WW may beleive her OM is clean but that is not proof that he is. For all she knows he may be having sex with another woman other than your W (his own W may have an STD herself).

You might be wise to abstain from having sex with your WW until the medical results are in. Even if they do come back negative, I would urge you to use protection like a condom around her.

God forbid, but if your WW got infected with HIV and passed it on to you, your young children may be looking at a bleak future without both parents.

Fireman1,
I see you are getting great advise on the Emotional Needs board. I just want to tell you that there is hope for a full recovery. I know at times it feels like there is no hope but I assure you there is, I am living proof. I too was in your same shoes and many times felt hopeless. I am not saying that your marriage will survive but it can and with alott of hard work, there is hope. Time and patience is the key. Don't give up too soon. If in the end your marraige does not make it, you will be able to look back and have peace of mind knowing that you did do all that you could do to save your family.
A wise man once said, "That which does not kill you will only make you stronger." It's true.
Hang in there,
SH

Hello,

Well here it is a new day. I sent my wife flowers last night and told her how much I loved her. She was pleasantly suprised I guess. I told her that once she makes her decision between me and this other guy that I will be here with open arms. She stated that she could come running. This morning she states she is 60/40 torn between me and this other guy in my favor. She states that she has never had as strong feelings for me as she does for this other guy. I told her that I really want to be with her but if she decides to leave I can move on with my life if I have to. She wonders why we should work to save our marriage that is so badly damaged. We were in love once I told her and we can be again.

I just don't know what make of this. She is bringing another man home to your bed and having sex. And telling you its great.
Well she needs help and you do as well. Your relationship is very desfunctional and painful. You might want to save this marriage but at what cost to your own self worth. Think carfully about your life togeather. It's just that she seems to have no respect for you and is having her cake and eating it. Think this out.

I have to say that I can't BELIEVE in this day and age people go around having unprotected sex, and your WS knows he has been with 10 other women????????????????? I wouldn't touch your wife with a 10 foot pole until she tests negative for all STDs. I am sorry if this sounds mean but I don't think enough people are addressing this. Yes I think it's possible to get over an affair but NO ONE, not even your spouse, has a right to risk YOUR health. If she wants to risk her own that's her choice, but she can't risk yours without your consent.