Mosana,

No matter how you try, you will not be able to justify being the OW.

Yes, it takes both. But consider this, if the MM or MW does not find a willing OP, then the A cannot take place. It is also the responsibility of the OP to say NO. It is wrong to get involved with a Married person regardless of how the married person presents the state of their marriage.

It takes two to tangle, if one refuses, then the dance cannot take place. Do you get what I am saying. It is the responsibility of both parties to not get involved in the A. So, I hold both responsible.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by mosana:
<strong>Okay if this is a site where thoughts and different POV are not accepted then I will leave </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This is a site where different views and POV are accepted...but only if they come from people who are BUILDING MARRIAGES. You seem to be more concerned with justifying your affair, than with anything else.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>(lets drop the titles of BS WS TOW and MM) </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Why? That's what we all are. Do the titles make you uncomfortable?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>didnt your mother ever tell you "If you dont have something nice to say don't say it at all." </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Didn't your mother ever tell you to have respect for others, and for yourself?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>You cant say that he does not love me you cant say that he is in a fog and you cant say that he should stay with his wife. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Then go to the Other Woman site! You show no signs of wanting to end your affair; in fact, you seem to be deriving great pleasure from flaunting it. As long as you come to Marriage Builders acting all happy because you have a MM that loves you soooooo much...you will be judged.

Mosana -
You are very brave to come here and post as TOW. This site is indeed for everyone.

Obviously my advice will as a BS...like most others. My advice is that you have to end it, and I'll tell you why...
1.) You will only end up getting hurt yourself, all three parties get hurt. The BS, the WS and the OP. because there's no real committment.

2.) You may not know or care about the BS but put yourself in her shoes for just a minute. Imagine if you were married and some OW did this to you? It is the most hurful thing in the world and I think most BS's would rather get hit by a train (no joke)

3.) You may care about this man very much but what can of relationship are you looking for? Do you want an honest relationship and be someone's true love or do you want to be known as the OW? Hopefully you two can end it and you will find another single man who adores you. Maybe you'll get married someday? If you do, I hope you never have to experience the hell of what being a BS feels like.

4.) Get to know God. That's it.

Thanks Zany,
I like rational posts from intellegent people. I would not want to be a BS. I am sure everyone can agree on that. I as well do not want to stay a OW most of us don't there is the odd one that is happy with the type of relationship. Most of us are just deluding ourselves that things will work out the way the MM is promising. Many will leave their wifes and many wont. It is always a gamble I guess. I really do love this man and I believe him to be a decent person (also a selfish petulent child) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> I do not want to hurt his wife and I do care about her and her feelings. I in no way think that she has done anything to desearve this treatment. This I am dealing with and that is what brought me to this site. I am dealing with it by trying to get the MM to be straight with his wife and come clean. If they decide to put things back together and he tells me that, that is what he wants then I will respect that. I am not flaunting but I do not put my head in shame for loving someone either.

Mosana,

You do indeed taunt the BS's here. Sure - drop the labels. We are all haunted people. In a love triangle, everyone is in pain - some having more joy in the pain than others but we are all people with turmoil in our lives. All three sides. I've seen your sassy remarks to many. You do indeed revel in some sick joy of flaunting your adultry in the face of the truest victims. Please, tell her or don't but please.... we are all here working on marriages and you are here to steal a husband and justify yourself in it.

It has been said that you need to find your God. This is so true. As I have said before, I have no room to condemn, many years ago I was the OW. Maybe one day you will post from the other side, I hope not though, as through the years (and the husbands) I have been on the both sides.

I think you find some sort of sick satisfaction in talking to BS's here. Apparently I have some sort of sick facination with reading your posts.....but I know why. I have spoken to the OW. I went to lunch with her!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> I had to know all, and yes, the stories that we never have sex and we never do this or that was utter bu!![censored]. She was fed lies. And you are her. With all of her self-denial justifcation for sleeping with a married man and being more "in love" than we were". Honey, he married me.

I know that your relationship is different. You are in love. Please. The love is in the person that you choose to marry, you are the sex. Congrats, in my shoes you can have it, after a few years you'll find it wasn't worth destorying lives over, I'll take the respect, and the fact that I did all I could do, leave us that won't you? And so has also been stated more than once, maybe your little bird will show up on your doorstep a single man, still loving you and you can have the relationship of your dreams. Personally, I think from your arrogant attitude, you will drop him on his @ss as fast as I did my OM. A fate you both deserve. WS prospective hindsight.

Rock Tart

<small>[ October 22, 2002, 08:22 AM: Message edited by: RockTart ]</small>

mosana, have you bothered to read all the posts you're getting? if so, how can you keep posting here, in a forum for betrayed spouses knowing your causing others pain? it's clear from many of the posts that hearing you try to defend your position is pulling out flashbacks of sorts to some, you've even been told your on wrong board and still you stay. this is a site for people who want to build a marriage, not destroy one. frankly i think you should tell his wife. maybe then he'll leave her for you and you'll get exactly what you deserve. a lying, cheating, abusive man who thinks it's okay to run around on his vows and make his wife think she's crazy for suspecting. boy, your mother must be so proud of you! why don't you think more of yourself, much less a fellow human being like his wife? you say he's a decent man, would a decent man cause the mother of his children such pain? the kids can sense their mom's agony and dad's uncaring, even if they don't know. and you're helping him to do this. this woman deserves better than this, and you deserve a creature such as him. if you showed the slightest bit of remorse, it would show you still have some connection with your soul. instead you stand here in a room of burn victims holding a torch giggling at how pretty the fire is. there are other boards for women like you, try the other woman's board. there you'll find girls just like you proud of sleeping in their lovers beds with wife out of town. or realize that what you're doing the very defintion of evil (don't take my word on that either, look it up!) and take steps to find your way back into the light.

mosana-I'm sure if the OW were your (former) best friend, you'd be upset with her too. She slept with my H 6 mos after I was her matron of honor. She was sneaking around with him while pretending to be my friend and letting me walk her dog everyday, clean her house when she was out of town, etc. She let me leave cookies for her and her H, brought me gifts all the while leading him on. Yep, I would say I have something to be upset about. Maybe you really will never understand the pain and that's okay. But leave those of us who have alone.

Okay where did all the intellegent posters go? Come on if my friend was the OW now where did that come from? Do I represent every OW that any of your husbands has every had. I dont think that you are my MM's Wife so please afford the same curtasy. Now if my friend was the OW then I would also have a problem with her because she owes me a loyality. If she did that then I would know that she was no longer loyal to me....I would not blame the Husband for making my friend do that to me. Stop blaming the OW and start looking at the marriage. You guys (sterotyping) let your marriages die. When there is no sex and no passion and the only thing that they hear from you is how ****ty they are the marriage will die. That is it...you want to wake up when he finds out about the affair and then start going to the gym great...but dont ever forget why it happened and look in the mirror when you are trying to assine blame. Yes he is a coward for cheating and yes it is wrong for the OW to get into an affair but the "oh my god how could this of happened" Marriages need to be fed to grow and I cant believe that with your marriages in the mess they are in you are giving me life lessions. Your husbands for the most part fell in love with women that loved them thought they were wonderful and made them feel special. They got butterflies again instead of complaining. The person that said they marry the one they love and the other is just sex. No they married the person they thought they would love forever at a time in their life when they were supposed to get married and then later they met someone else when thier heart was open to it because of flaws in thier marriage. Some of you are working things out and that is great I believe that if the couple can fall in love again then that is better for all involved. Some of you know that your husband is only still with you because it would be highly inconvienent to not be and that is what you resent about me...You know that they are still in love with the OW and that is why you still continue to press the redial on the phone and look at the clock when they are expected home. That is why I make you uncomfortable.

has anyone else noticed that when people agree with mosana or don't question her they're intelligent but when they don't, somehow it's always them in the wrong? man, do i wish i was that girl! to have not a care for anyone else in the world, only about yourself, must be so much easier than living with a soul! and her last post was a slap in the face to every person her who's been betrayed. she apparently gets a sick thrill at forcing herself down the throat of all who've been hurt. she doesn't listen to anyone, just keeps saying the same tired thing every other mistress from the beginning of time. "he truly loves me!" of course, it's easy to love someone who lets you do anything you want no matter who it hurts. it's only when you try to ask them to stand up and be a man that she'll find out how much that love is worth. she'll have feetprint on her back as runs away! which is why she'll never be woman enough to insist he pick a side of the fence to stay on, she knows even if he did choose her it wouldn't be long before she was the wife and he would have a vacancy for other woman. it would be sad if she didn't insist on coming to this site to gloat? would anyone care to bet that instead of respecting the many people here who have flat out told her she hurts them and to leave that she'll be back tomorrow? didn't think so, sucker bet for sure! obviously this woman has no clue what love and marriage is about. if she did, she'd realize that there's always butterflies when you meet a new person you find attractive. it's human nature. it's what you do with that feeling that defines you as a person. marriage isn't about happily ever after, it's hard work everyday. if a person feels that love is gone never to return, then as a human being they owe it to their partner to leave before taking up with someone new. in addition, any person willing to get involved with someone knowing they're married is every bit as guilty as the adulterer themselves. without a willing partner, they might actually have to work on their problems as opposed to hiding from them. somedays i wish i could be as amoral as mosana is. how much easier life must be when nobody matters but you. gosh, how i envy the soulless!

Mosana, I feel extremely sorry for you. First, let me answer your original question. Yes, the BS does want to know, not from the OW, though, but from the WS themselves. Anyone telling the BS though is better than no one telling them. If your reason for telling though is because you're hoping the BS will kick the WS out and then he is free to come to you, then go ahead and try it. I think you are afraid to because I think you know in your heart he won't leave his wife and she won't kick him out.

This is what my OW tried to do. My WS ended it with her and either for revenge, to cause him pain, or in hopes that I would tell him to leave and then he would be free to go to her, she told her husband, who then called me. Unfortunately for her, it backfired. My WS was already disgusted with himself and wracked by guilt for what he did. The last thing he wanted was for me to know, as he knew how devastating it would be for me. Prior to my finding out, the only feelings my WS had for OW was regret that he got involved with her in the first place, and disinterest. After she told you could add hate to what he felt for OW.

My WS was married when we first met. He expressed his feelings for me and I told him that if he was feeling that way toward me then something was seriously wrong in his marriage. I told him that I WOULD NOT have an affair with him, and to go fix what was wrong in his marriage. He then worked on his marriage for quite a while, without a positive outcome. There were no children involved, but WS and first wife had been together for approximately ten years, but married for three. After their marriage ended, we started our relationship. Unfortunately for me, WS had issues that were never resolved that enabled him to get involved in an affair after we were married. I am thankful he ended it on his own.

What I am trying to tell you though, is that if your MM wanted to be with you, then he would BE with you. Believe me, my WS had many reasons for not leaving his ex-wife. They were VERY good friends, never fought, had a long history, and liked each other very much, but they got married for the wrong reasons. I didn't get involved in their problems or solutions. I thought he was a very nice guy who I could be interested in, but not while he was married. He says I was everything he has ever wanted. Again, I told him I was not interested since he was married. HE was honest with his wife in that he told her he did not think he was in love with her and that there were problems in their marriage. They tried to fix their problems without the interference of anyone else. It did not work out. If your MM truly wanted to be with you, then that is who he would be with, no matter what the extenuating circumstances.

My WS and I are in counseling. We love each other very much and have made a committment to always be 100% honest with each other from this point on, as that was part of the problem. My WS sent his OW a NC letter right after she told, as she continued to try to talk to him, and my WS got a new job (they worked together). Here we are one year later, and OW is still trying her darndest to make contact through harrassing phone calls, e-mails, etc.

I am grateful my WS has recommitted to our marriage, admitted his mistakes and taken full responsibility for them, and is doing everything he can to make it up to me.

Why would you want to be with someone who is so blatantly using you and his wife? Where is your integrity? Why haven't you given him an ultimatum, her or you? I think it's because you know what the answer will be. Be prepared for heartache like you've never known before, because if he hasn't left his wife yet for you, I seriously doubt he ever will. Hopefully some of this will get through to you. If you love and respect yourself, then demand it. Tell him you will not see him again unless he is legally free. It's the right thing to do.

<small>[ October 23, 2002, 08:31 AM: Message edited by: Disneynurse ]</small>

Sorry to burst your bubble, but my H (by his own account to his friend) was having great sex at home almost every day when he had his affair. I know you want to believe the 'it's love' theory but in his case it wasn't. It was undiagnosed depression that he had for many years. He is very remorseful for what he did but she isn't. She still denies anything happened (even though she was in my bed) and will continue to deny it until her dying breath.

Mosana-some people have marriages with problems. But there is NEVER an excuse for an affair.
We had some communication problems that we fixed with counseling. We are still together after 17 years and we have a wonderful new baby.

Am I perfect? Heck no. But my needs weren't always met and I sure didn't go run off with his best friend.

SOME PEOPLE JUST ACT IN A SELFISH MANNER. PERIOD

Mosana,

You lost a lot of credibility in your last post. You ask that those of us here not view you as a representation of our WS's OP and then turn around and do that very same thing with your tirade of "you guys let your marriages die", "when there is no sex and no passion...", "look in the mirror when you are trying to assine [sic] blame."

Not only is your request hypocritical, but it is filled with ad hominem.

You want any of us to believe you are not a representative of the stereotypical OP, yet you just exhibited stereotypical OP thinking. If you want to engage in logical argument or discourse, you'll have to think and respond logically.

You want the MM and you, for some reason, think this is the place for support in that want. It isn't. It isn't a matter of censuring differing opinions, it's a matter of the purpose of the entire website.

If you want support and want to continue blaming married spouses who've been betrayed by their spouses, then I suggest you go to TOW. It's full of people who enjoy that kind of thing.

No one, that I've seen here, denies that there were problems within the marriage. No one denies that he or she made mistakes. No one denies that the WS bears more responsibility than the OP. But, you'll likely NOT get many people agreeing with you that the OP doesn't share some responsibility in the affair. You, as an OP, know that the man is married. Whether or not you respect that concept is debatable. You are an accomplice in lying and disrespect on innumerable levels. You are complicit in the harming of at least one other human being -and not an accidental harming, but a willing and active one.

It doesn't appear to bother you. Because you love him and he loves you and the rest of his family be damned. That's pretty egoistic in any situation, whether it be environmental, sociological, romantic or psychological.

If you want something real and honest, the two of you should go directly to the wife and sit and tell her the truth give her that respect. Allow her the opportunity to make her choices with all the information and not some suspicion or lie. She hasn't been given the tools with which to make an informed decision. You and the married man are keeping that from her. I'm sure the both of you have plenty of rationalisations and intellectualisations to explain WHY you can't (won't) be honest. In truth, it boils down to cowardice, selfishness, fear and total disregard for others. That's pretty damned sad, imo. Situational ethics suck.

~

Salome,
I agree with your last paragraph and that is what I am trying to convince MM to do. I want him to be honest and tell her and not just for selfish reasons. I also want her to be able to make choices based on truths. I could force him into it by either having her find out herself or by saying I wont see him until he does. I am struggling with those choices because I dont know what my true motives are and if they could ever work out thier marriage I dont want her to have the triggers she would have if she found out again. I also dont like to give ultimatums, if I told him her or me and he chose me then I wouldnt want him to say later that he was forced to decide. Believe me I do struggle with ethical questions everyday and I try to put her feelings to the front ( you may find that ironic with the affair but believe me it is true) My last reply was me being angry at a couple of people I think I have kept my calm here with all the flaming I have gotten and if you guys are allowed to shoot venom at me then I can throw it back every once and a while. As far as getting off the site if you dont want to hear from the OW THEN DONT OPEN THE POST THAT SAYS "DOES THE BS WANT TO KNOW THE TRUTH" because that post is a dialog with me the OW okay? Now then here is my question. If I have her find out is that not
1. Mean to the MM by taking the decision of telling her out of his hands.
2. Mean to her because she will be so devestated.
3. Wont she find out in her own time anyway without me forceing it.
I was trying to think of a way to have her find out without her having to talk to me. You guys said that the last thing you want to do is have the OW tell you. And an anonomous e mail wont cut it.
4 I keep telling him that if he leaves it and she finds out she will be so angry and she will make the decision for him. He says that he wishes that he could just wake up with his kids every morning and she would only give him the every second weekend thing. He cant handle that. So for now he spends all his time with me except for when he is with his kids. He has never lied to me yet that I know off and the things he told me before I confirmed with his wife to be true. I just wish she would phone me and ask I know she has been suspicious and caught emails between him and I and she tells him to open them and show her and he wont. (that has to tell you something eh?) So in the meantime didnt mean to go off on a tangent but those couple of posts really ticked me off. Mosana

Believe me, she will be much more devastated the longer the lying and cheating go on. The betrayal is bad enough, the lies that go with it are almost too much to handle.

P.s. If he's lying to her now, what makes you think he won't lie to YOU later? It's pretty common you know.

Well, I've read it all, and now I have to jump in the fray.

Mosana, I was the OW. For 5 years, I was involved in the triangle. MM told me exactly the same things that your MM has told you; well maybe not "exactly," but you get the picture. He was in a marriage with an emotionally-unavailable wife who, because of childhood issues with abuse, would do the "push/pull" thing with him. He would sit on that proverbial fence until I was ready to scream; first wanting me--being "totally" in love with me and then wanting to save his marriage (or, in essense, save his wife from herself.) Even after their divorce, the triangle continued for another two years. He finally put me completely out of his life to try one more time to revive that dying patient he called his marriage. And the inevitible happened--it did not work. I did not contact him at any time during our NC periods. Each time, I let him go, but being the hopeless romantic I was, I waited patiently for him to return; which he did--numerous times. After all was said and done, we reunited, and we were married a year later.

There is an old saying, "The man who marries his mistress simply creates an opening for this position." I want you to honestly think about that statement. I found out three months ago, that after nearly three years of marriage, my DH was involved in another affair. In addition, I found out that he was also a sex addict and had been for years. He would have periods of lucidity when the addiction was under control, but for the past 18 months, he has been out of control and acting out with numerous women. I realize, Mosana, that this is not your situation (at least you hope he is not an addict.) I also understand that your MM may be legitimately in love with you and stuck in a bad marriage. Without knowing the three of you, no one can honestly say what he or she feels. From your posts, we here at MB obviously know how you feel.

Having been on both sides of the fence, OW and BS, let me tell you--there is no comparison between the pain I felt as the OW and the pain I feel now as BS. These people here at MB have accepted me and my posts (or ramblings as I like to call them....) As the OW, I felt the pain of not sharing a complete life with the man I loved. Of knowing that his day-to-day life was shared with another, and that our couple of days a week together, or stolen weekends, were the only semblence of a relationship that I had. I once made a list of all the things I missed doing with him as a partner--it brought tears to his eyes. When he finally ended it with me to work on the marriage, I thought I was going to die. (Dramatic, I know.) I lost 20 lbs in about a month; smoked like a chimney, slept 16 hours a day (when I wasn't up in the middle of the night smoking...) and became totally depressed. I was at the point that I knew I had to seek professional help when he came back into my life. It may have been better if he hadn't.

As the BS, the pain is ten-fold. Not only do I deal with the thought of this man that I love beyond limit sharing his body with another woman, but also sharing things with her that were precious to me and to the both of us. Things that are now ruined for me. Not only do I deal with my husband no longer being "exclusively mine," but I also deal, everyday, with the recurrence of guilt from our affair. I am right back in that guilt. Believe me, I had tons of guilt during the affair, although that is hard for some BS to believe. There were days I could not look myself in the mirror. I even wrote a letter of apology to his ex, which she thought self-serving and insincere. From the position I now find myself in, I can't blame her. I am sad that I hurt her, because I now know EXACTLY what she went through. I am sad that I cannot somehow make it up to her. Although we now share mutual children in our lives (my stepchildren, who, incredibly, have a wonderful relationship with me,) she hates me--I don't blame her. I am sad for the destroyed lives we created.

I am also sad for the marriage in which I now find myself. It can never be the same. My FWH is in recovery, and we are working through things. But this whole experience makes me sometimes, believe it or not, wish that he HAD saved his marriage. Because as much as I wish his infidelity had not occurred, and that our marriage and relationship were still the magical connection I thought they were, that is one wish that can never be granted.

I hope however things work out for you, MM and his wife, that you will learn from this experience. If the two of you will be together, I wish you the best. If he stays in his marriage, I hope they make it work.

Take care, Mosana

my move

My Move,
OMG Wow what a story that is horrible...I pictured in my head what that would be like ( I have been cheated on but it was long ago and sometimes the memories fade.) I wrestle with times of NC and he always comes back within 1 or 2 days and says he cant do it. I am not much stronger. There is also issues with his personality that drive me absolutly insane and I call his wife the Saint because she must be for putting up with him for 10 years. So I am not delutional enough to think that we are this perfect soulmate couple. It is interesting to hear your story as you have worn both hats and I can relate to your agony while you were in the relationship. So it is even worse as a BS? I think alot of the TOW think that we are the ones hurting the most.( Not that it is a contest) but the wifes have them and most dont seem to want them. We want them and dont have them. That type of thing. Before she found out she would tell him that he was a lazy s*** and blah blah blah. I used to think " okay here is someone that dosent want you, I do want you, you want me and we are not together because why? I understand wanting to be with your kids all the time so do I but I wouldnt make my x-h live a lie so I could be with them.

Mosana,

The reason you struggle with this situation is because you know that no matter what happens someone will get hurt. I understand that you don't want that person to be you. Fact of the matter is, the 'love of your life' is a MM. He is not available to you, at this point.

IMHO, while you are literally wasting time with this MM there are many wonderful, honest, caring, attractive and unattached men out there. You are depriving yourself of the opportunity to be truly happy with a man who won't create this internal struggle you are now dealing with. Be honest with yourself, someone that loved and respected you would NOT put you through this.

You want to be happy. You want a healthy, loving relationship. All of us here at MB can understand that! Here is my suggestion. I know you are going to balk at this, but read it and think seriously about it, don't react right away, think about it. End your relationship with MM, start moving on with your life, meeting new people, making new friends, trying new activities. I know this will be very hard and yes, you will mourn the loss of your relationship with MM. Now, if your MM truly loves and respects you he will end his M because he honestly couldn't make it work with his W(and not because of an OW). If he becomes single then 'go for it'! If he becomes single you will no longer face the struggle I mentioned earlier. If he stays married, well, I guess you'll have your answer on his character. BUT, that answer won't matter because you will already have moved on with your life. Either way you win, so to speak! The situation as it stands now is a no win, you know that.

Now on to a more 'touchy' subject. Every time you lash out at a BS you are doing exactly what you claimed you didn't want to do...hurting someone. Many of the reactions you have gotten have been blunt, some a little harsh but all were truthful. Isn't that what you wanted? When you lash out and say hurtful things, just to react because you are ticked off, you seriously jeopardize your credibility. If you are as smart and 'have it all together', as you claim...then ignore the flames.

You said that the BS should be told so SHE can decide what to do. Here's the impression that statement gives us. That the expectation both you and MM have is to place responsibilty for a life altering choice with a BS who will be devastated and unable to make important decisions. Is that fair? Is that hurtful? Is that dodging responsibility for one's actions? The decision to end the M should be made by both spouses...without a third party involved! Trust me, you are involved as the third party in the decision making process.

Try as you may there is no way to justify this situation. If our responses make you defensive and 'tick you off' then that should be telling you something. Maybe, you aren't as happy and secure in this relationship as you'd like us to believe. Frankly, you owe us nothing but you keep coming back, trying to have us say that what you are doing is ok. If you don't want our opinions, then don't ask for them. If you feel defensive at the replies you get then that's an indicator, by anyone's standards, that you are doing something that doesn't 'sit well' with you.

Mosana,
How is it you claim to know that most bs don't want their husbands. You claim to feel bad that you are hurting bs but yet you continue to do so everyday. You said om tried no contact but with no success and you aren't any stronger. Get that way. You can't even begin to imagine the devastation you are causing.
My wh had an ea with someone 15 years younger. We have been married 25 years and had 3 children. Last child was a real challenge - ADHD etc. He left home in January. WH started e/a in February. TOW was looking - she even told my wh that - she has a very unhappy marriage and has done this e/a thing possible p/a two other times. TOW ended the ea very quickly and I will always be grateful to her for that. But can I forgive her? I don't think so. She knew what she was doing and it didn't matter to her. It doesn't matter to her that I have gone through 9 months of hell - that my h and I are still having a really rough time. He thought she was it for him. Was our marriage perfect. Of course not - no ones is. I was just hoping that once we were on our own things would be better. No day to day dealings with ys. But lo and behold another conflict. Do I sometimes hate my wh - you bet - but the love overpowers the hate most of the time. Do I blame my wh - yes but not as much as ow since she made the I was looking comment. Not sure what my point is except the heartache you are causing is unimaginable unless you have been there. Please think carefully about what you are doing.
TTHO

I don't think it is necessarily the case that most BS don't want their WH's. In a lot of marriages, there is "mutual" taking for granted. When you hear the statement that "you don't know what you've got until you lose it..." well, sometimes that says it all. By the same token, there is the old-coat theory (this is something my brother told me when he was going through a divorce.) This theory sounds totally selfish and uncaring, so take it with a grain of salt. Sometimes a person feels like his/her spouse is an old coat--comfortable, but worn. You don't want the old coat anymore, until someone else tries it on; then, wait--that's MY coat, and you can't have it. Marriage can be like this to, but even those marriages can survive if both spouses want to work on it. I think that in the case of affairs, that theory is the exception rather than the rule. And of course, it is true that some marriages just aren't meant to be, for whatever reason. Those marriages to, in regards to an affair, are the exception rather than the rule.

Believe me, Mosana, when I tell you that the pain of the BS, IN MY OPINION, is far greater than that of the OP. This is simply based on my experience. I would not trade one for the other, but I know how I feel right now.

Take care,

my move

Everything that I say as well is a truth but it the manner that it is said that is the question and I am usually more careful of my words not to come off as mean spirited,when the posters in question tick me off it is not about thier "truths" it is about thier judgements. "What kind of person are you" "You are just used for sex" "You are nothing and we are the ones they married" those are the kind of stupid a$$ed comments that I loose my niceness over because they are not true. Any back to the previous post by MGM you dont know how much I want to be able to do that I stuggle with that everyday and I know that he will continue to fence sit until one of us kicks him off and to tell you the truth I feel weak and like I want someone else to do it. Can you understand that? If he is going to choose his wife I want it over with and I cannot find the courage to do it. Maybe I am co- dependent maybe it is the same reason that I always pick people that are not good for me. I dont know but I am trying to get the courage to do just that. I want to say look you need to decide for yourself and if your marriage can work great and if it dosent then phone me. We shall see. Maybe it will take something to happen to get me to that point that I will do something. There is a quote that I heard something like "We remain the same until the pain of remaining the same exceeds the pain of change." That couldn't be more true in my life.

<small>[ October 23, 2002, 01:17 PM: Message edited by: mosana ]</small>