</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I'd rather end the A on my own, then start working on us.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Can't work on 'us' until you end the A. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Your H would rather you told him than find out on his own.

Imagine this, a friend of H's is out having dinner with a friend/wife/girlfriend/mother/brother, whoever, you and OM are in same dinner establishment, so now friend tells H what he saw. Can you imagine the humilation your H would be feeling at this news coming from a friend.

No matter how you tell your H, it will hurt, as you can tell by others here, they have recovered. Be honest with your H that you want to regain his trust, you love him and want to stay married to him.

The sooner the better.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Your H would rather you told him than find out on his own. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I know that...what I was saying was that I wish the A was over, then tell him...as it is, I will be telling him about an A again (for the 3rd time) that it is still going on. I fear that if I go to him and say it is still going on and that I need his help to end it, he will end it with me! "3 strikes, you're out" kind-of thing

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">No matter how you tell your H, it will hurt, as you can tell by others here, they have recovered. Be honest with your H that you want to regain his trust, you love him and want to stay married to him. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I told him all that the first time...I thought I meant it then, but I still kept the A going. Would you forgive for a 3rd time knowing that your WS was asking for help in ending it?

I do love my husband...I think I am scared of being disappointed again. You know, we've been married 17 years now. For the first 10 years he kept promising me that he would make more money (by going from part-time to full-time) so I could quit working and start a family (I didn't want to have to work and have a family.)

Well, he did go to work full-time, but we were in debt so I kept working. But then he kept saying he didn't feel comfortable with me not working yet cuz we would barely make it. So I went from making $12,000 p/year to nearly $60,000 per year. And still he wasn't comfortable. Then I started a website biz that makes more than my job (I still have the job)...and still he didn't feel that was enough. So then I start buying real estate and have 3 rental homes making money. And STILL that isn't enough.

I know he is scared, but I am sick of his broken promises, too. I sit here making a good 6 figure income, and he makes $45K (the equivalent of the taxes we have to pay to the stupid IRS).

I'm frustrated. I want him to be happy at his job, but I want what he promised me years ago. He keeps raising the bar on me.

OK...now I got mad. But it still doesn't change the fact that I am having an A. I am still wrong and I know it. ANd I do love him even though he won't keep his promise to me. Guess I didn't keep my promise, either. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Thanks for letting me vent.

Jaref could it be possible that your H's reluctance to start a family has to do with your A?

If my WS asked me for help in ending the A, and keeping NC, yes, I would give it one more try. But that is me.

Even though you admit that there was no excuse for the A, even the unhappiness you felt which contributed to your deceision about the A.

You know, you are entitled to your feelings too, such as the unkept promises, it sounds like you are making too much money now to quit, or by his standards. How much is enough money for him? Would he be comfortable with the website income and the rental income along with his income? Then you could stay home and have a family.

It sounds like you have some unmet issues here too. Even though you made the poor decision, he has to realize that you have needs to. Have you two talked about this honestly? Have you told him that you don't want to work? Have you two worked out a budget that you can live on with his income and the rental income, and website? You could maintain those from home. How much is enough. It sounds like he is trying to fulfill some needs with material gain.

He might leave, but then again, he might not. All you are doing is putting off the inevitable.

BryanP,
No...it's not about having a family. It's more about quitting work...and remember, I have been hearing his promises for 17 years.

...however, because I DO know that our relationship is not as fulfilling as he would like, I do understand why NOW he doesn't care to help me have my needs met. But honestly, if I could quit my job and just do my other biz's, it would make it a lot easier to quit the A. It's what I have always wanted.

And just so you know, I am not with the OM for money - I make about 9 times what he makes...

SWH,
I bring up the job quitting thing everyday. I think he is scared - scared of not having the stability of a wife with a JOB. Most people feel safer with a paycheck coming in every week and I udnerstand that. But I have tried to explain to my husband that if I didn't have the job, I could probably double the website income in 6-12 months becuase I would have much more time.

Oh, well...enough of that.

Sue, thanks for saying that you would give your WS another chance. It does give me hope. and one more thing that gives me hope is that one day my H and I were watching a Julia Roberts movie "The Mexican". She was frustrated with her boyfriend and she turned to her friend and asked him "When do you say enough is enough?" They looked at each other, and her friend said "Never. If you love someone, you never say enough is enough."

My husband told me he believed that...

Jaref

Its time to take the next step, time to stop the A, time to give your husband one more chance. Maybe you need to write one more letter, one that only your H will receive, telling him what you need, what you want, and what you expect. Walk away from the A, leave everything behind when you go home. Don't look back. God will give you the strength.

Again my thoughts will be with you

OK Jaref....

What is your plan?

Pep <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

I don't know...

I'm scared. But I DO hear what everyone is saying: move out. Write a NC letter. Confess to my H. Rebuild M.

And I do know that it is that simple. Simple steps. Simple, but not easy. And of course, no one said it would be easy.

Do you know anyone on this board who had a longtime A that ended it on their own even though they were scared to let that part of their life go? If you do, I would LOVE to talk to that person.

Jaref,

I just have to ask this really stupid question. Why do you keep two jobs? You could quit the one you don't like and do the web job and if you can indeed increase your income what is the harm?

Further, since you really (how can I put this delicately) don't have a marriage, why not do this thing with the job, it can not be more disrespectful than what you are doing and have done to your H.

In fact, is it possible you won't take the bull by the horns and end one of the jobs because you really don't want to end the affair? It sounds like you really don't have a lot of trouble doing what you want, no matter what your H may want or say. Why not do something positive for you and perhaps eventually for your H and lose the job you don't like?

Ok, it wasn't one stupid question, it was a bunch. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Sorry.

JL

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Do you know anyone on this board who had a longtime A that ended it on their own even though they were scared to let that part of their life go? If you do, I would LOVE to talk to that person.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">That would be me! Best decision I ever made.

Susan

Hey Susan,

Long time no see. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I sure hope you can help Jaref with her situation. I suspect you can.

Jaref, you just heard from a very smart and good lady. Listen to her, she will stear you straight. She knows this stuff forwards and backwards.

JL

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Why do you keep two jobs? You could quit the one you don't like and do the web job and if you can indeed increase your income what is the harm? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The "web job" isn't a job...it's my own business and my H is scared that it will all crumble some day.

But the other reason is because the websites and rentals did so well in 2002 we had to pay a MASSIVE amount of taxes this year for 2002, plus we had to pay estimated taxes every quarter for 2003. Plus my H also has student loans. That's our only debt, but it is large and he doesn't want me to quit til it is gone.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">
Further, since you really (how can I put this delicately) don't have a marriage, why not do this thing with the job, it can not be more disrespectful than what you are doing and have done to your H. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You are correct that it would not be any more disrespectful than what I am doing, but I did promise him I would help get rid of the loans before I quit the "stable job".

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">In fact, is it possible you won't take the bull by the horns and end one of the jobs because you really don't want to end the affair? It sounds like you really don't have a lot of trouble doing what you want, no matter what your H may want or say. Why not do something positive for you and perhaps eventually for your H and lose the job you don't like?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You are very perceptive. I would have to say that you are 100% correct. If I quit the job, I would have NO CHOICE but to end the A (or my M) because I would have no excuses for not being at home anymore. I had thought about this a few times, but I thought it would be mean to my H cuz he didn't want me to (and before anyone yells at me for what I just said, you don't have to). I think part of me thinks he likes money more than me. Sort of.

Maybe that is a good idea. My H wouldn't like it if I quit, but I KNOW he wouldn't like knowing I am having an A still. We would still be able to make it, just not pay off the loans as fast.

Hmmm....interesting...

Thank you. I really am gonna give this some thought. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Hi, Susan,
Can you point me to a post where I can read your story?

If not, how long was your A?
What gave you the strength to end it even though you were scared?

More, please!

I was addicted. I was miserable. Yes, I was scared. Life could not go on like it had been. I knew that I had to get my life back. I had to have some peace. I confessed it all. It was a cry for help. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

I had two affairs. The first one was long term. I'm talking YEARS Jaref. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> It makes me sad to even think of all the years I spent involved in that tangled web.

Of course it was not easy. It was painful. I wondered if I would survive and ever be happy again.

But, I'm here to tell you today that I have a marriage today that I never dreamed possible. We did the hard work. We went to two years of IC and MC.

I would say that it takes a good two years to really be in recovery.

I'll be glad to try to help you in any way I can. Ask away.

Some links to some of my story:

Part of my story

And another part

Reader's Digest Version of my story.

Be strong! I'm here to cheer you on. YOU CAN do this! I'm living proof!

Susan

One more thing.

You have the best of the best posting to you here.

Pepper is the greatest...so much wisdom.

And also JUST LEARNING (waving hi, JL <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> ) was here to pull me along by my boot straps from the very beginning! When I wavered he was there to help me get back on track. Thanks again JL, I have never forgotten!

Susan

Susan,
I read your posts.

I know that to be able to end the A w/OM that I need to get rid of the "in love" feeling I have for him. That is very hard for me.

I am a person that FEEDS love. I mean, I say "I love you" all the time and basically only think good thoughts - I do not usually focus on bad thoughts of a person that I love. I think that is why I have always loved my husband - for even while I am having an A I love him very much and tell him that. I give him small gifts, etc.
Problem is, I do this with OM also.

The only thing I can think to do to end feelings of love for OM is to quit feeding them. Quit telling him I love him.

This A has been going on for 5+ years. He is single. He has a history of being with Married women. He was hurt in his late teens by a girl he thought was faithful to him - and after that he decided only to be with married women cuz then he knew who they were sleeping with. Problem is, he always got emotionally involved with them - that wasn't part of the plan. However, he has only been with me through all these years. (I know that most of you are going to not believe that, but I always know where he is.) Anyway, the guilt of all the years I have stolen from him eat away at my heart, as do all the years I have stolen from myself and my husband.

Anyway, we (OM and I) have been living together since 10/2002. Problem is, he thinks I am separated from my husband. AND I am still living with my H. It is sick, I know. I am a LIAR! Heck, before I know it I may be MARRIED to both of them (just kidding...I think). The only reason I say that is that I never thought I would have an A. Then I never thought it would last so long. Then I never thought I would live with two men and have two different lives. I am amazed at the lies I have told and all the things I "never thought I would do".

You know, a lot of these BSs don't think they would have ever had an affair...but you just don't know that for a fact. And they fact is that they didn't...but still, it could happen to anyone.

I remember about 3 years before my A started a friend of mine's BIL cheated on his wife and left her for the OW. I was disgusted and very judgemental. How could he do that? What an awful man he was! I was just too "in love" with my H to ever think that could happen to me. Everyone I knew...and even people I hardly knew...thought I was a "silly, goofy girl" to be so in love. My in-laws made fun of me cuz I wouldn't even go to bed without my H. If he stayed up and watched TV, so did I. I never did anything without him. (My H didn't appreciate all that back then, but nowadays he wishes it was like it was back then. He told me that. He misses the "sweet girl" he married. I miss her, too.)I was a hairdresser and even my customers knew how crazy I was about him!

Anyway, I'm babbling...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Jaref:

"You know, a lot of these BSs don't think they would have ever had an affair...but you just don't know that for a fact. And they fact is that they didn't...but still, it could happen to anyone."</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">That is very true and Dr Harley in his book 'Surviving An Affair' has this to say about it:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">"The Dangerous Illusion: It could Never Happen to Me.

When a spouse has an affair, it usually comes as a complete surprise even to him or her. That person often reports, "I had always regarded those who had affairs as selfish, misguided fools with no discipline whatsoever. I could not have imagined having an affair myself".

But infidelity is something that doesn't just happen on afternoon soaps. It happens in most marriages. [i]Most marriages, you may ask? Yes, unfortunately, most marriages.

One would think that at least the people with strong religious convictions and moral commitments would have special protection from extramarital affairs. Yet I have counseled hundreds of people. Just observing the many religious leaders who have succumbed to the temptation of infidelity proves to me that under certain conditions infidelity is irresistible.

The truth is that infidelity doesn't necessarily develop out of a bankrupt system of moral values. Instead, personal values change to accomodate the affair. What had been inconceivable prior to an affair can actually seem reasonable and even morally right after an affair. Many people who have always beleived in being faithful in marriage find that their values do not protect them when they are faced with the temptation of an affair.

It became clear to me early in my counseling experience that affairs were much more common that I had ever imagined. But now, after years of marriage counseling, I have come to realize that almost everyone, given the right conditions, would have an affair"[/i]</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">BTW I am NOT BryanP. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Hi Jaref

If you really want to end this and work on your M, I'll advice to listen to Susan, she is REALLY GOOD. She is offering that, and TAKE IT! you will not regret it.

She knows both sides, and that makes her advice very valuable. At least for me anyway. She relates on your situation really fast and she see many things that are not that easy to look at.

For me she is a living proof that you can recover from an A either way and have a better M.

So take her advice no matter what. For me it has worked so far and she has been the best support person I ever had, and for that I'm thankful to God.

Take care

Hi JareF,

I don't have anything to add to what others have posted. Except, for:

I know you can do it. I know you can do what is right.

In today's world there is not such thing as job security. It does not exist. (My opinion) I work for a company, where the joke was, it took a act of congress to get fired from this place. Well, not anymore, they have had many reorges with downsizing. When it comes to jobs, it is about 1/3 - 1/4 of your waking time, we spend more time at our jobs and with coworkers than we do with our families. So, we should be doing something we like.

I think your husband is telling you that he loves you, and will stay with you. So, tell him, walk away from OM and never look back. It is a matter of doing it, as difficult as it may be.