A quick plea from a mother.

Before you make any irrevocable decisions, please consider what is best for your children. If you feel that divorce is the only answer, I can respect that decision. Not everyone is able to move forward after infidelity. I would advise you to wait until some of the shock and anger are processed before deciding. Please handle things in a manner that will hurt your children as little as possible. Yes, your W has participated in actions that are destructive to your happiness as a family. But you have the power to choose to react in ways that can be more or less painful for them. They only have one childhood.

I am not typing this to imply that you would hurt or neglect them. I only feel that as a parent a gentle reminder to you wouldn't hurt.

SC - Wow, so much here to process, on both sides. First, I want to tell you how sorry I am you are going through this.

You know, you remind me a lot of my FBH. He had all the info., photos, etc. He never did show them to me, but I never doubted he had them. Actually, it got to a point it didn't matter.

I have to agree with some of the others, I think you should settle down on the divorce idea some and sort things out a bit before making that final decision. I know it is hard, and I can so understand how deeply you want to have that in the situation(s) you have mentioned, but in time you may wish you'd done it a bit differently.

You really need to confront your WW on all of this. Present it to her. My FBH *asked* me about my affair. He told me that he wouldn't leave me, but he just needed ME to tell him the truth. I did, and it was WWIII in my house. He almost walked out at that moment. My mom had come to get our son so he didn't have to witness this, and it was her that convinced my DH to stay and talk with me.

I immediately ended the affair - I called the OM with my DH on the line. Hiding from myself and the destruction I was causing was easy when it wasn't placed in front of me. Having it in front of me made it all that more real, and I knew what I had to do.

See, I was one of those that thought I could end it all and noone had to know and it would be as easy as that. Well, it wasn't that easy. Nope, I couldn't end it until I was forced to face my demons. Until I was made to open my closet and look those skeletons in the face. A dark cloud loomed over me, and I failed to notice. How? Why? Fear!

My situation may be different, but for me it was a fear. It was a fear of change in my perceived road of life. I failed to see that even though there were detours in life, we were still headed to the same destination as long as we traveled that road together. My A was a fantasy (not that great a one now that I think about it) that took me away from the realities of change and decision in life. It allowed me to step away from reality.

Stepping back into reality, I saw what I was risking. I saw my family, being broken and torn by my actions. I saw my husband waiting and looking at wedding pictures will I was out with my *girl friends*. I relived the calls he made to me while I was out, and the times he asked me to stay home and not go with my *friends* - all because he wanted to be close and share life with me. I just couldn't see it then, and boy did it hit hard when I did.

You comment about your WW being the person you were supposed to be able to trust - that comment hit me hard. I remember thinking that to myself - how I was supposed to be the ONE person he could trust and believe in and who would never hurt him, yet I ended up being the one person who betrayed him in the worst way.

I made a huge turnaround, and by the grace of my husband was allowed to show him that my marriage does mean something to me. That my family does matter. The scariest part was knowing that it layed in his hands now. It was up to him and only him whether we stayed together or not. I had relinquished that right to him and only him at that point. However, I still went about each day facing my demons, answering his questions, and working to show him that my marriage, my family, and most importantly my husband are my life.

I never asked him to trust me again, I only asked him to believe, just a little. He did believe, and I he did reach a point that he trusts me again. I'm not totally sure when that happened, but I do know he mentioned it to me.

Anyhow, I didn't mean to go off on my own little story here. My point is, I guess, that my husband is a lot like you. He so wanted to get even with the OM. He wanted to destroy this man. He wanted to walk out and be done with me - I'd done the worst possible thing to him, and the worst part was I was the only one who had the power to hurt him in this way. He didn't go though. He looked into himself, found a little bit of belief, and gave me the chance to make him glad he tried.

You know, in the time I had my affair, I emotionally neglected my H, and he had every reason and right to have an affair of his own. He was the stronger of us, and he never did. Not only that, he forgave me for my mistake, and he opened his arms, his heart, and his home to me again.

We have worked hard *together* to rebuild our marriage. Things are very successful, and I think what I did almost hurts me more at times. I cry sometimes at the thought of what I did to my husband. I thank the lord daily that he loved me enough to stay and work through this.

It can be done, and it will take time, but now is not the time to make the final decision. I don't know how much this may help you. I hope that in some small way I was able to lend you some advice of value. Know this, if you do give your wife another chance - that does not make you weak in any way. No, it makes you all the stronger. I admire the strenth my husband showed in the choice he made to rebuild with me.

I hope that you can find in yourself truly the right route to take here. Hang in there, and know there are people here that want to help. I wish you all my best.

Very interesting. I do not feel bad with what will happen to the OM. He made his decisions and now will have to live with them. I feel for his wife and children.

I like your plan. It is well thought out. When this affair is fully exposed, he will try to save his marriage and will want nothing to do with your wife. Your wife will be in shock. This will bring her back to reality. She will ask to try to stay in the marriage if not right away, she will in a matter of days. This is when the two of you need to talk without yelling. You both have children to think about. Consider working on the marriage. Her actions are 100% wrong but this is a symptom of a problem in your marriage. Something is missing in your marriage for a wife to commit A. Take the time and try to find out what that something is.

S-C

I read and post mainly on Recovery, but your post brought back the visceral horror of d-day. There isn't a BS here who can't empathise with your rage, your fear and your longing for revenge. And, by the time I post this from the UK, your moment-of-truth may have been and gone.

Can I just share this experience? Looking back 15 months from that time, I recognise that I made a vital choice at the very moment of disclosure. I hadn't found NB - heck, had never even THOUGHT about adultery - but a still small voice in my head said 'TA, if he leaves tonight, if your divorce, if you remarry - YOU WON'T KNOW WHAT WENT WRONG.' I instinctively knew that, without that knowledge, I was likely to end up in the same situation with another husband. And the only person who could tell me what had failed was...my H.

At the moment, you haven't a clue what has caused this. YOU feel that you've been a perfect spouse. Perhaps you have - and even if you haven't, that doesn't justify infidelity. But something has definitely gone wrong. Perhaps your wife's personal weaknesses are to blame. But what if you divorce her, what if you remarry - and the same thing hapens again? Will you just blame the next wife?

You owe it to YOURSELF to give the marriage a chance. The divorce is still available, further down the line. But give yourself space to breathe first. Give her a chance to get over the shock and figure out who she is and what she wants to do.

You owe that to your kids.

TA

PS FYI, my H had multiple affairs and an addiction to prostitutes, over seventeen years of marriage. I found out about all of it in one searing hour. We are still together. Our marriage is a very different, and a very much better place than before.

<small>[ October 08, 2003, 04:53 PM: Message edited by: TogetherAlone ]</small>

Is this poster for real? He reminds me of OutofControl...

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

BUT, if it is for real, tonight's the night!! Talk about suspense...

<small>[ October 08, 2003, 06:10 PM: Message edited by: findingmywayback ]</small>

SC: You are right, I misread you on Plan A/B, though I am curious about why you think it is not a "valid" option. My strong suspicion is that the more someone dislikes that option, the higher the likelihood that it is EXACTLY the strategy that will do the most good both for them and for their spouse, but I have no data to back me up, so let's just ignore that. </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> j39 wrote: “If you think financial support is the only thing a woman needs, then all you will ever date or marry is whores or their slightly more refined equivalent.”

SC replied: You appear to be jumping to conclusions again. Reread my previous posting with the cliff notes of this posting. Yes, I know I exceeded the swipe quota with that last remark. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I was afraid when I wrote that you might respond by focusing on the exageration (done to shock, I admit) and ignore the point behind it. But I did something that you are doing, and you criticise me for it and do not seem to recognize it in yourself - I jumped to conclusions, based on limited information and my own point of view - which is exactly what you are doing about your wife's actions. As another poster pointed out, there are multiple possible motivations for a particular action on the part of your wife - and unless you ask her and have habitually provided a safe environment for an honest answer, and have a history of actually listening to answers given, you have no hope of knowing her actual motivation - and therefore your judgements are likely to be incorrect.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> “I do not care about my children” I assume that was intended to cause a reaction. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes and no. I have never been more serious about anything I have said in my life, yet it is true that I over-stated the case in order to get a reaction. Lets see if I can be more precise: "You do not care enough about your children to put aside your own anger and think about what is best for them, instead of the course you are planning." More later, gotta go

<small>[ October 09, 2003, 01:52 AM: Message edited by: johnh39 ]</small>

Cube, I've read your initial post, all of the replies, and yours to them, and you sound so very angry. Believe me, I can understand your anger, as I've felt the same anger about my H over the last three months. I felt he brought it on himself, he made the decisions to end a "perfect" life between us - (and I do really believe it was perfect). We never fought, we did everything together, and every day of my life we said "I love you" - and meant it. Now he blew it all up by having an A with OW at work. But the difference I have in my story is that I found this out on the same day I was told he had a brain tumor and wouldn't survive more than six months. At first I felt trapped because I was too guilty to leave a sick man. If he hadn't been ill I know I would have thrown him out in a minute. I decided to stay with him just to see him through his "treatments" and then leave him when he was on his way to better health. However, during this time, I found him to be very shamed by what he'd done...he has apologized for messing up our wonderful life and is is counseling (as am I), and now after three months he can't even believe he'd had this A (this A has lasted a year). He knows he was in a fantasy world, and his real world is with me. I never would have believe I could stay with a man who betrayed me, but here I am working on my marriage. If you really love her, let go of the anger, and see through the fog to the real issue. Do you want to continue the life you had, or are you ready to throw it all away just to show her you can? I was ready to throw it all away that easily, just because of my anger, but I don't think I can do that any more. My H has agree to total honesty now, and if he doesn't abide by that, then my decisions will change. But for the time being, after being married 24 years, I can't let go of it all. The fact that he may not be around that long has a lot to do with it, I think...but I'm not guilty any more. I'm not angry any more. I'm choosing a life with him, and I hope it'll be just as good - No, better, than it was before. Take some time for yourself before you make decisions and say things you can't take back. Take a deep breath and don't let ego take over.

I must have expressed myself poorly when using the work "whore", because you completely missed my point. Whores trade sex for money. There is a close enough relationship between sex and love that they are often confused, so someone who trades love or even just affection for money may be considered a whore as well, if you don't mind stretching the point a little. You have engineered a situation where it seems that your primary advantage over the OM, as you decribed it is that you will be financially well off, and he will not be. If your wife decides to stay with you, it may well be primarily because he cannot provide for her, financially speaking. It looks to me, based on your actions, that you are trying to buy her affection, in essence treating her like a whore. Now, you can argue all you want about how I interpret your actions and intentions, but they are perfectly logical from my point of view. If you argue that my point of view is incorrect, (which I am more than willing to admit), you are simply proving my point that there is more than one way to interpret someone's actions. BUT, if I was exceedingly judgemental, I would not listen to any alternative explanations. This may not bother you, because you have very little emotional investment in me. But how would you feel if I was someone you loved and respected deeply, and I did not listen to any explanations of your behavior, feelings and intentions that did not fit my pre-conceived notions? I probably would not stay on your list of deeply loved and respected people very long. That, or something emotionally very close to that, is what you have done to your wife, and it is one of the things that has killed her love for you. It will eventually kill your children's love for you as well, and the love of anyone else you might marry. If you don't learn to change your behavior, you will drive away those who you love the most, and who need you the most.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I’ll agree with you however on the death of love, something must have caused it or [I] have seriously misjudged her character </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Being judgemental is an EXTREMELY reliable way to cause the death of love. (It worked for me... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> ) Harley has devoted an entire chapter in his book "Love Busters" to just that subject, in fact, and it is covered fairly well in the Smalley book I referenced earlier, too. Being controlling is possibly even more reliable, and both those books are pretty good about that subject, as is the Mulliken book I mentioned.

<small>[ October 09, 2003, 01:56 AM: Message edited by: johnh39 ]</small>

johnh39 hi,

I feel you should lay off S**3 by questionning his love for his wife.

This is not about money or love. It is about betrayal and how one deals with it. We have not heard that the affair has even been exposed yet.

What led her to do this is not known. He has said nothing that gives you the right to imply that prior to his discovery of the affair he was not a loving caring partner.

If you have proof of infidelity, as S**3 has, his genes and yours and mine and everyone else's on this planet should tell you to react. He is sending WW and OM a clear message and that is entirely his right and will in fact help the process of resolution.

I was in a similar situation to you about 2 years ago. I took a slightly different course of action. Rather than get the man fired, I called him and told him what I could do. He told my WW the next time he saw her that he loved his job and he loved his wife.

He hurt my W. She began to see him in a different light. I never confronted my wife, but I did work on our M. At the time, I had not found this site. I did not know importance of NC.

I too had computer tracking software and caught W in a contact after 12 months of NC. I did confront her. By this time our marriage was strong and she was crushed. That was 4 months ago. Yes my ego and pride are still hurting, but during these 4 months you could not ask for a better wife. She has cried non-stop for hours over her mistake.

I read somewhere the best revenge for an A is to be a caring and affectionate spouse. I think there is a lot of truth in that. The actions you have planned will give you short-term satisfaction, but in the long run they will validate WW's feelings and leave you empty.

Is she worthy of your love? No. As a husband Paul directed us to love our wives as Christ loved the church. Was the church worthy of this love? No.

You demonstrate you are a powerful man that can bring man’s wrath on OM and WW. I preferred to let God handle the vengeance.

You are not posting here because you need advice on how to properly execute this plan. I believe you are here because deep under the hurt and rage you heart is telling you that there may be a flaw in this plan. The flaw is winning the battle and losing the war.

None of us married a W we thought would have an A. Most have bet 1/2 of everything they own that the person they M would never have an A. After it has happened you cannot undo it.

I am not here to judge your life and your relationship, but you owe it to yourself and this or any future relationships to create an environment where your WW can tell you why she had an A. What did she need that you were not giving? You may still decide to D her or she you, but you will have a foundation to build relationships on.

Even if my W and I D. I will be a better H to someone because of what I have learned. You can too.

O&W: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I feel you should lay off S**3 by questionning his love for his wife. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hmmm... It's interesting how people's perceptions of others actions vary. I do not think I did this, though I think SC did, quite explicitly. I did question his love for his children, however, which may have been unfair. He may not know how damaging divorce is to children - and that is something I have plenty of data on, if you, SC or anyone else is interested.

I have been following this thread too. Hope SC reports back, and things were not too disasterous. The circumstances were so terrible to begin with. Revenge is a funny thing. Sometimes you can plan something, but it backfires or goes in a different direction than you would like.
When my ex began cheating, that was over 10 years ago, I went for the jugular. Masterfully planned out and executed my revenge. Perfect lawyer, everything. Then after, I was just so empty inside. There with my kid, feeling so bad, even though he had 4 A in less than 3 years. What's more: He ran straight into last A's arms, thinking what a bad person I must be. They were married less than month after our divorce.
Since it happened, I decided no more revenge, for anything. I can speak up for myself. That's all though. I think now, that things play out in the end. If you give someone enough rope they will hang themself. What goes around comes around. It is really true. That revenge haunted me for years. Now he is paying for everything he did before, but not because of me. I actually pity him.
I had to repent to God, and it was really hard to do, because I felt wronged. Anyone follow this?

Let's talk about love....In your posts, there hasn't been any "warm fuzzies" coming through, that might suggest you're a man with a heart. I've seen more in roadkill. Do you see the A as a problem/situation to be taken care of, as in business, dogmatically? You do know, that you can't control everything; no matter what you do, you have to accept you can't make it all go away, as if it never happened.

You have made some sensible, logical steps. You now have the proof you need to present. Maybe it's time to take a break, from all the tension, and anger. Take a trip to wine country for an overnight, listen to Mozart, breath deep, go for long walks alone, be with nature; feel part of the much bigger picture. There, look within yourself for what you really want and need, tomorrow, next month, next year, 10 years from now. Are you a man that wants to love deeply, and be loved the same? Are you someone a woman can turn to to be held, and comforted (emotionally accessible). Do you know what a virtue forgiveness is; how much power it possesses to those yearning for absolution? If you love your W, and your marraige, and she loves you, (which you need to find out) can't you test the strength of your own love, put yourself above/beyond all this, and start looking for ways to mend what has been broken? Money has limitations. It doesn't mean a damn thing, in terms of what most people really need, to be happy/at peace.

There's no better way to face life, than with honesty and directness. You haven't done this. You haven't confronted your W; or the OM. To do so would put responsibility in their hands, to "fess up". It's only then, that you will know what reality is; and then know what your choices are, and so you can consider the steps necessary to get to the goal you want. It's only when you look passed your own shock, anger, sense of insult, that you will know what your heart ultimately needs, in the outcome; and how to get there.

It doesn't take game playing; or drastic measures of putting the OM's family out of house and home, by terminating employment. There are so many innocent people that will be hurt by your actions; decide wisely. This is between you and W. There could be thousands of OM that you could deal with; but, ultimately the source has to be found, that generated the result (A). That's what needs to be fixed.

If you don't think you have what it takes to try and fix what has gone wrong, continue as you have. It is easier to just throw things out when they break; and buy new. But can you feel absolutely sure, the new will prove to be any more dependable?

SC,

Please post and let us know how you are! You have been slammed by some of the posters here, but beneath all of that, we care about what happens to you and your W.

Even if you went through with your plan, and it backfired, we can help you. Or if you found enough love in you to confront your W, we are here with words of support and encouragement through this difficult time. Let yourself lean on us, just a little. It might be easier to do that because we don't know you - you're less vulnerable that way.

Hang in there and don't be afraid to seek help!

Misty

Good Evening,

During the last few days I have been reading this thread (actually the entire history of this website) and would like to express my appreciation for the responses, even those posters who seem to be off on their own tangents.

The schedule for the 8th did not completely go as I had planned. The twit (om) was terminated and he did telephone the ww’s cell that evening (multiple times actually but she only took his call once that I am aware of), however she did not leave to see him. Unfortunately this was only temporary as the next day shortly after I departed for the office she did visit him at his condo where my PI presented her the package. I would be lying if I stated that I had not reconsidered my actions many times that night and the following morning.

I decided to return home and the ww was waiting and her first words were the worst ones she could have used. She said, “I love you”. I honestly must admit those words utterly enraged me. I despise being lied to or manipulated and her conduct was such in diametric opposition to those words which at one time were so special that I am still to this moment without the words to express my emotions upon hearing them.

Sparing the gory details, she broke off the whatever you call it with the twit by phone in front of me and spent the rest of the day and night trying to get me to talk to her. I found out that the twit was an old boyfriend and that this “whatever you call it” had been going on for about 3 months.

One of the worst aspects of this situation is I cannot get a reasonable or heaven forbid a logical explanation for crippling if not destroying our family/love. When I have asked why or perhaps what did I do to cause this, her response is to break down sobbing and provide answers ranging from (I don’t know to her being selfishness and childish etc.).

I could have accepted that I am away too often (10 days a month) or perhaps this twit was the love of her life (although I thought I was). Something other than what she has provided…..jeez….what a perfectly vicious little circle.

I have spent the quite a few hours reading this site (a few others too) and had pretty much come to the conclusion that every ww was selfish, self-serving and deceptive. However Princess0413 you are causing me great pause and very honestly a large amount confusion and reflection on that conclusion.

Silent Cubed:

I agree her response is frustrating. She continued to see him after he was terminated and you had to send her the package by your PI while she was at his condo. Her first words when confronted by you is that she loves you? It sounds more like she loves her lovestyle and is very sorry that she was caught screwing her old boyfriend by you.
When you ask why she replies I don't know or I was just being selfish or immature. My concern is that she knows exactly why she was willing to cheat on you and your marriage and put your health at risk. Saying I don't know is something a child says when they are caught doing something they know they should not be doing and do not have an excuse. The second comment that she is selfish and immature is probably more accurate. My question is why is she any less immature and selfish today than she was yesterday? Is it because she had to be caught by her husband?

The situation you descibed sounds like a woman who had everything and had a husband dedicated to being a good husband and a good marriage partner. She sounds like she was too spoiled and bored and so engaged in a sexual affair behind your back.
Words are words but it is the actions that speak volumes. The old saying no consequences to her actions equals no motivation to change comes into play here. It sounds like if she says I love you then she expects all of her deceit, humiliation, disrepsect and putting your health at risk will simply vanish.
If you do decide to stay with her then of course counseling is a must. You must get her to tell you the real reason she was willing to throw this marriage away and hurt you the way she did. She is still not being honest with you and is playing on your emotions and sympathy. If you do not have honesty now then you will never get it. I wish you luck.

S**3 hi,

Thanks for the update, and my sympathy for the plight you are in.

I hope you are able to control your anger. The old saying that "hate is not the opposite of love but indifference is" may help you to find your feelings.

What next? some very humble thoughts

I believe you disclosed your intention to divorce in the package. Until you come to a decision on what to do I suggest you go ahead with this. This is a boundary you laid down and to maintain your credibility it should be respected.

To avoid spread of any STD's you should also ensure the OMW is informed rapidly and it would be interesting to see if your wife were prepared to do this.

Maybe you should agree with your wife the plan to disclose the "whatever you call it" to the rest of your family and hers and maybe friends.

Maybe you should line up your ducks so that you win any upcoming custody battle.

** Important ** STD testing for everybody

Consider DNA testing for the kids.

Good luck in all this mess.

<small>[ October 12, 2003, 02:29 AM: Message edited by: olderandwiser ]</small>

Scubed,

What I am going to suggest to going to sound like "letting her get away with it", but it is not. Trust me for this one.

I would suggest that you continue to talk with her calmly. I would suggest that you listen as her "logic" evolves. I would suggest that you treat her with GREAT kindness, and care. I would suggest that you listen very intently to what she has to say.

Why? Sounds like you are accepting what she did. Well, the answer is that you have to "accept" what she did. The only issue is once you "accept" it what are you going to do. My recommendation is to defer this decision for a period of time, perhaps a few months, ideally about 6 months. If she will see a counselor encourage it. I would encourage you to see the same MC as your W.

Gather your information, watch your W, and address the wounds inside yourself. Acting out in anger will NOT heal YOU. Now why am I saying this. Well, time and patience do wonderful things. They allow healing, they allow clarity, they allow focus of purpose, allow you to decide truely what is best for YOU, and not just your pain.

Will you get your revenge?? Oh Yes you will. If after say 6 months you decide you cannot be married to her, she loses her family and your support, although you will probably get skinned in the divorce settlement <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> , if you decide to stay then her guilt will eat at her. In fact, she may feel guilt no matter what you do.

There is no punishment so harsh as that we impose on ourself and I suspect she will punish herself. In fact, the biggest obstacle to rebuilding your marriage may well be her guilt.

So don't make any decisions based on punishment or revenge, your back is covered on that front.

Keep talking but be nice, be supporting, and empathetic, I can tell you that as much as you hurt you will learn that you WOULD NEVER WANT TO BE IN HER POSITION.

So go slow, and you will see that her "logic" is not logical, eventually she will see the same thing.

I am glad that you are considering giving this some time, it will serve YOU very well.

God Bless,

JL

SC: I, too, agree her response is frustrating, but it is pretty close to the one my wife gave. It remained frustrating for months, even as she and I got some answers to the why questions. Marriage counseling and the books "Surviving an Affair" and "Torn Asunder" were all helpful in that regard. We read the books together, did the exercises, and discussed what we read. You know, I never really got a complete answer. I think I understand about 90%, but at some point, maybe after 18 months or so, the last 10% has faded in importance. Because our relationship is so much better now, and we have both changed so much, that I am confident that understanding the 90% and fixing the major problems in our marriage is enough that it could never happen again, or if it did, I would know long before it got physical, and could intervene effectively. It bothers me that SHE does not want to understand the last 10% or so, but we continue to work on improving our marriage, and I think anything important will come out in time. Beyond that, JL is right. Just looking back makes her feel so guilty that it is almost physically painful for her. I don't want my wife doing things for me out of guilt, anyway. Our MC tried to help us separate "affair recovery" from "working on the marriage" for just that reason.

It is probably partly true that the reason they answer "I don't know" is because they don't WANT to know, but that is part of who they are at the moment. Affairs are, like other addictions, attempts to medicate something painful, instead of fix it. If they knew what was wrong and how to fix it, they would have done that, instead of taken a painkiller that has the side effect of worsening whatever it is that is causing the pain in the first place. It is going to take time for her to deal with the "Why?" question, because she needs to change to do it,a nd change takes time. It is almost a truism that if the WS really truly and deeply understood why they were having an affair, they would not be having one. You take the The Emotional Needs Questionnaire (ENQ) and the Love Busters Questionnaire (LBQ) together, and I can almost guarantee you that you will be surprised by what you learn about both of you.

I had a slightly different reaction to my wife's "I love you"'s after the affair, because, you see, she had said that to me regularly for the three years it was going on. For a while, I asked her not to say it, because it just reminded me of the affair. However, very early on I had the presence of mind to ask her "What did you mean when you said that to me during the affair?", and found out that her understanding of those words was quite different than mine, and even more than the definition was different, the emotional content was different. That was the beginning of my understanding of how poorly we had been communicating, because we had talked about those words before, and I thought I knew what she meant. I began to understand that I needed to listen for the feelings behind the words she used, and that their definitions were less important than I thought. I did not understand my wife's emotional language.

This may seem unrelated, but it is why I partly disagree with Bryanp. It is a truism in affair recovery that you must believe actions, not words. In fact, what you really need to see is words and actions that are consistent. However, you have to understand what the spouse's words mean, and most people don't - not really.

As for telling the world: Tell the OM's wife. You would want to know in her situation, wouldn't you? But, if the affair is over, please realize that telling will just make things more painful for her. If you want to punish her, do that. If you want to repair your marriage, don't tell, unless you both ENTHUSIASTICALLY agree to do so for some reason. My wife and I have disclosed her affair to numerous people as part of our ministry to couples at our church, for example, and to some of our family members for various reasons - but we agreed to do this and it was with a shared purpose.

<small>[ October 12, 2003, 11:38 PM: Message edited by: johnh39 ]</small>

First, I have been reading your postings and appreciate your perspective and advice. It seems you one of the people here who realize true implications this and do not prescribe to the save it at all cost mentality prescribed by the very vocal minority.

BryanP - quote

“I agree her response is frustrating. She continued to see him after he was terminated and you had to send her the package by your PI while she was at his condo. Her first words when confronted by you is that she loves you? It sounds more like she loves her lovestyle and is very sorry that she was caught screwing her old boyfriend by you.”

I suspect her first words were designed to calm the situation, she arrived at the house only a short time after I had which indicated she departed the unemployment statistic’s dwelling immediately upon receipt of the package (confirmed by the gumshoe). I assume she understands me well enough to know that I would not have acted without being in a position to effectively deal with whatever counter reaction legal, emotional or physical she could and can undertake. Yes, I have already informed her ill regardless of what I decide for the future her “lifestyle” is effectively over. During her apology marathon I did use very the same response that she was only sorry about being caught and the implications.

BryanP - quote

“She is still not being honest with you and is playing on your emotions and sympathy. If you do not have honesty now then you will never get it.”

I’m afraid sympathy is not an emotion I have for her at the moment nor in critical situations am I emotional. Perhaps my last posting’s intentions were poorly conveyed, as I have not altered the attorney’s instructions or the general plans. They shall proceed according to the schedule and shall only be altered if some great epiphany were to occur, perhaps .05% probability. I honestly doubt there is any response she could give to justify her actions.