I think she sounds defensive right now, she is probably very embarassed by her actions, maybe even confused herself. Keep on track with plan A, you two have been together along time and she more than likely loves you very much, she just does not know it at the time. I guess you will have to keep trying to deposit into her LB and see what comes from it. In time she will respond, my guess is very favorably. As a woman, who is the same age as her, I need to be listened to and need to know I am still loved. I feel middle age HUGE, even though I try to keep in shape, I eat right etc., try to always look nice, not like I am trying to look 'young' just nice. It seems that now, I need that more than ever, it is like all of the sudden you are no longer a 'girl' but a woman, facing middle age and it is tough to deal with. I guess it is called a mid life crisis, even though that is no excuse for her behavior at all. I understand the feelings, I remember exactly the day me and my daughter were walking through the mall, some guys were checking her out and not me!! HA HA, at first I kind of laughed, but then it sinks in, I am no longer that attractive young woman who can turn heads like I used to. I am a mom!! I am middle aged, I felt horrible. I called my other sisters and we laughed and laughed about it, because they all went through that too.

give her time. Do you realy love her? If she were ready to open up to you and tell all, would you be able to take her back in and do you have what it takes to get through this? I hope so. You seem like such a nice person, I would hate to see you suffer anymore than you have, and It just seems to me that she is suffering to, only right now she seems very defensive, she is not ready to reevaluate the situation yet. Keep going on your Plan A, and most importantly, take care of yourself!!!

GTG, my loving husband (can see feel the sarcasim) is coming in for dinner. Time to brace myself to be strong and not let on that I know what I know!! Good luck, I wil be back tomorrow afternoon - 6:00 central time or so.

Now what?

Things were going along (that's the best it gets) and on Wed I ask her to go with group to watch ball game. She say she has plans, I say with OM and she says yes. ( this means to motel) I am depressed all day and low and behold she calls at 6:30 pm says she is going to stay "home" and do laundry instead. I'm delighted thinking finally a glitter of hope. NOT SO.

Find out today as talked to her on phone that OM called off "date" because he was not feeling well. Is she being used or what.

Calls today when I'm gone and gets answering machine with new message on it saying Me and the girls can't come to phone Etc. Had replace old message with WW's voice saying family was not available. (Had undone phone for another reason and old message was deleted and had to make new one)

Comes over to get child and starts up on me about changing message on machine, eliminating her from household etc. Struck nerve. Went off on her big time. About what she was doing, devastating kids, abandoning family, most selfish person, not the real wife but clone with no feelings for family, real wife never abandon family etc.

Real LB's but you know I felt good. Like I don't give a sh**t anymore. Let's get this overwith.

Went to work and wrote a 2 page letter that I was going to E-mail to her work so she would get it first thing in the morning. But after writing it I calmed down and put it away. Now I got to re-establish my plan A if possible. I promised myself I would plan A for 2 more months. I don't think I can though. I'm almost ready for plan B.

I see where feelings of love are turning to hatred. If this doesn't take a turn for better soon, won't be any love left for her to come home to.

Hi devastated_dad

I'm sorry for what brings you here. It's been a while since I've visited or posted in JFO.

If your love is turning to hate, its probably time for plan B. I would keep on telling everyone about the A. Have you read up on Plan B. First thing is to do is write a letter. Its good to have set a time limit but sometimes its just to hard to keep.

Does the OMW know of the continued contact. If not inform her of it. Also let her know that you won't be contacting your WW until the A is over. Tell her that it means your WW will have a lot more time for her WH.

From what I've read Plan B is to protect you. Be prepared for it.

God Bless

Comes over this week-end helps out. Starting to dislike her big time. Pre planned wedding this friday to which I am taking her. Was thinking on going to plan b after that because love bank deposits are diminishing very quickly.

Anyway I take her to dinner monday cause she's losing weight and i dont want her to get sick.

Drops bomb shell - says she talked to OM today and the are going to call things off because he lives in town 50 miles away and she will never move there because to far from kids and he won't move here for same reason. so the A won't work. Says needs a few days (yeah!)and wants to come home and work things out. She was't very enthusiastic. I think he told her he wouldn't leave wife and she could have him part time only.

You'd think I would be thrilled. I don't know if I believe her or what. I think I am starting to heal somewhat and don't want to take chance of tearing heart out again.

I don't even want to work on her EN's. Just wait and see what she does next. She's not just coming home. I feel she has to NC OM, work on rebuilding our relationship and go to counselor.

Anything else for me to drop on her before I let her come back?

I've told about all her/our good friends and relatives. It's definitely out in the open. She's embarassed about it I'm sure.

Let me understand this. She is coming home because the OM lives 50 miles away and she doesn't want to move there because it would be too far from the children and he doesn't want to move closer. So she is going to do you a favor and come home to work things out. IMO I wouldn't let her back so easily until she went through therapy and counselling. Furthermore, I would have her sign a post-nuptial atreement in which she agrees to give up custody of her child and all assets if she has another affair.

yes that's the way I read it although we have not talked about when or under what circustances she is coming back.

But I think that since their A isn't working then she is going to do me the favor of trying to work on our M.

More details coming this week I would guess but considering the shrinking number of deposits in my love bank for her I would say "cold day in hell" I will let her back.

I think maybe DB 180 is the way to go now?

<small>[ October 22, 2003, 10:39 PM: Message edited by: devastated_dad ]</small>

I feel for you. At least you are alive. How am I doing? Not well at all. I am numb, scared and in pain, real pain. If you read my thread, I won't have to go through it again. It is hard to type with one hand. I wish I could help you. I just am not there right now. I am sorry, but I will read and keep you in my thoughts. I thought about you whenI was in the hospital. I agree with the other poster, make her go to councelling and you go also. Don't let her back untill it feels riht.

DD your feelings will understandably be all over the map regarding your wife's impending return. Remember your kids and the whole family that they need and deserve. Put your feelings (which are usually temporary and subject to change <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> ) aside and do the right things to save your marriage to their mom. Not saying it will all work out and be hunkydory, but is certainly worth the effort.
Recovery is a B****. No easy way to do it. My fwh and I have been in the thick of it for 10 months and we have good days and horrible days. It becomes a lesson in self-control and self-examination. You are being asked to give more of yourself than you even dreamed possible.
But you can do it.
You will draw deeply from the well inside your heart and find that you are a deeper, more complex person, capable of great love. It's a decision--to try and save something that was precious and can be again, with a lot of work.
DB 180 sounds good in your situation.
Your anger is sooo understandable, but it is destructive if you don't learn to communicate what is really the core issue without LBing. (This is my biggest personal struggle as I try to regain trust and love.) Anger released on the marriage partner creates distance and that is not what you really want. Tell her what is on your heart but think it through first and try to communicate as completely and kindly as you can.
Blessings to you in your struggle.

<small>[ October 24, 2003, 08:58 AM: Message edited by: want2shine ]</small>

Hey devasted_dad:

I am new to all of this, but have read and researched for over a year now when my h*** began. Also, I have received wonderful advice from some of the best. I don't know what your spiritual status is, but I have been a Christian all of my life, so my advice may seem a little strong from the Christian aspect. I say, it is time to let go and let GOD! First of all, I read the book "Surviving an Affair." Page 44 is the line "I Just Need Some Time Away To Think Things Through." Your wife is saying this -- I say give it to her. You are enabling her still in some ways to have her cake and eat it too. I say be nice -- don't mentin OM. But stop being there for her -- move to Plan B quickly -- she is not ending this thing. Most affairs do die a natural death -- let this die -- you are allowing it to live. I would move to Plan B quickly. It worked for me. I would write the letter, copy the lover (who cares if his spouse intercepts the mail and reads it). Then avoid all contact with her. Let her fall deep into the pit of self desctruction that she has started. Make your home happy and do fun things with kids -- let her see what she is missing. Say only positive things to the children (even about her). Then give it to God in prayer every night. Talk to God, pray for your wife. Let her see what she is missing at home -- if she doesn't see it, then she if further gone than you think. For me, when I did this, it was 2 weeks that OW broke it off with my husband. Remember an affair is an illusion, allow her to live in reality for awhile. Let her depend on him -- FOR EVERYTHING. He will fail her -- he will not be able to meet her needs. Only when she is ready to come back and commit to you would I take her back -- then, the real struggles begin. This (believe it or not is the easy part). Enjoy this separation and learn to change the things in your life and yourself that you have been wanting to change. If she calls to talk to kids -- be kind -- but, don't hold conversation with her. I would say, hello, how are you then quickly say, just a minute, I will get them. After 2 weeks, my husband (married 20 years) began to miss communication with me that he was devaste when I took that away from him. At first, he got angry and would throw temper fits. Beg for dinner engagements as a family, etc. Finally, he called me and said that we really needed to talk to see if we could get our marriage back together -- see, let her see what she is missing. Now, you are still there for her and this allows her to have her cake and eat it to. Give it all to God -- there is nothing you can do that God can't -- Seek his word and stay fast and he will fix it all.

I will pray for you.

The mental image of your wife having sex with someone else is very hard to deal with and I guess has a lot to do with how you're feeling. It's a man thing. My wife had an emotional affair and backed off before it got physical. She confessed it to me and I coped fine, better than she expected in fact. But I know that if it had got physical it would have been a monster.

But I also know that if I were to have an affair, and let me tell you I've been tempted, the love stuff would be almost as important to my wife as the sex. Possibly more. She'd more easily forgive a one night stand than a long running emotional affair. Men and women are wired up differently.

On the question of terms for her to come back how about this for a suggestion...

(1) You gave her the book HNHN and said she would read it. Tell her how much it's helped you and she needs to read it too. Stress that this is not some populist crap self-help book that just makes money but that the Harleys have a track record at actually saving marriages. Condition one is that she reads the book and makes a serious attempt at the EN Questionaire with you.

(2) Condition two is that she accepts that the objective is to save the marriage and commits to that.

(3) Condition three is a Policy of Joint Agreement - that neither of you will do anything without the others agreement. If you can't agree on a decision then you won't do anything until you do.

These conditions sound innocuous but of course if you look at them make continuation of the A impossible.

At some point in the future you are going to need to explain the man thing hang up about sex with another man. Don't do it until the conditions are right. She'll understand but not now.

<small>[ October 27, 2003, 07:56 PM: Message edited by: devastated_dad ]</small>

Thank to all for input, I read and study everything.

No comments all week on when she is going to come home. Have great time at wedding so I ask her when she is planning to come home - she says not so sure now.

Bit tongue so as not to be the main attraction at someone else's wedding reception.

Losing love at a faster pace now. Have one pre-A event left, a 3 day camping trip with friends and relatives in 2 weeks. Thought about plan B this week but decided camping trip would give me one last chance to work on her EN's (conversation and affection) Not a chance of any affection but I can do the conversation thing.

I know if there isn't some significant change by the camping trip then I will definitely be ready for the plan B letter.

I got my HNHN book back before she had a chance to read very much and won't give it to her until she wants to work on our M and not her A.

There are definitly conditions for her return (not that I have told her) if and when she ever returns. Now I am not so sure I want her back, but I am going to give it a hell of a try for the kids.

I don't think any further than just getting her back home at this time. Figure I can cross other bridges when they come up.

I am working on ME and there will definitly be a much better me for her or for someone.