Welcome to the
Marriage Builders® Discussion Forum

This is a community where people come in search of marriage related support, answers, or encouragement. Also, information about the Marriage Builders principles can be found in the books available for sale in the Marriage Builders® Bookstore.
If you would like to join our guidance forum, please read the Announcement Forum for instructions, rules, & guidelines.
The members of this community are peers and not professionals. Professional coaching is available by clicking on the link titled Coaching Center at the top of this page.
We trust that you will find the Marriage Builders® Discussion Forum to be a helpful resource for you. We look forward to your participation.
Once you have reviewed all the FAQ, tech support and announcement information, if you still have problems that are not addressed, please e-mail the administrators at mbrestored@gmail.com
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#441216 12/26/03 12:18 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1
B
Junior Member
Junior Member
B Offline
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1
How can I ever believe a word she says ever again?

<small>[ December 28, 2003, 05:29 PM: Message edited by: cobalt blue ]</small>

#441217 12/26/03 02:21 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 6,950
T
Member
Member
T Offline
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 6,950
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by cobalt blue:

How can I ever believe a word she says ever again?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">By how much she is committed to radical honesty, POJA[policy of joint agreement - do nothing without the enthusiastic agreement of both spouses], spending more time alone with you and mutual accountability. All three of these principles are found in The Four Rules For A Succesful Marriage.

Because she's been a serial cheater she must avoid at all costs crossing marital boundaries such as spending time alone with another man, sharing personal info with another man, sharing transportation alone with another man, exclusive friendship with another man. She must understand that just like a recovering alcoholic can never again have alcohol ever again, she cannot have other men in her life ever again.

If she is unwilling or reluctant to do the above, then you are going to be living 24/7 with the question of when history is going to repeat itself.

<small>[ December 26, 2003, 01:23 PM: Message edited by: T00MuchCoffeeMan ]</small>

#441218 12/30/03 07:58 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 15
G
Junior Member
Junior Member
G Offline
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 15
I am kind of in the same situation. It seems like every word out of his mouth is a lie. If you figure this out, let me know.

#441219 12/30/03 10:34 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,166
J
Member
Member
J Offline
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,166
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> As far as I can discern there is really only one approach to re-establishing trust, and a couple of well-established ways to get there. In both cases, the bottom line is: believe their actions, not their words, at least until you have seen a consistent pattern of their words and actions being aligned for a period of many months. That necessarily means you have to be more involved in their lives so that you have the ability to verify that their actions and words are cohesive.

The path to get there, according to Willard Harley, is to have no secrets from each other, and to use the Policy of Joint Agreement (POJA) in all your decisions. Once you see your spouse consistently use the POJA, and the two of you have learned to understand each other and communicate with each other well enough to implement it, you will trust them when they are out of sight, too. Perhaps ironically, one thing that will convince you of your spouse's honesty is if they tell you things they know will hurt, instead of lying or keeping silent to "protect" you. So this process will likely not be painless, especially since, if you are like most couples, it will require learning a new way to communicate. Change is hard.

A second path, promoted by Carder in “Torn Asunder” (and the younger Harleys, too, I think), is for the WS to really dig in to the "WHY?" of the affair, and in gaining that self-understanding, communicate to you both why it happened, and how they will change their behavior in ways that you can verify and that will prevent them from having another.

Of course, these two paths are not mutually exclusive. I view them as complementary, and think “Surviving an Affair”, by Harley is extremely helpful in figuring out important parts of the why, at least as far as the answer involves unmet Emotional Needs, and it almost always does, especially for a woman who has an affair.

The fallacy is the belief that unmet EN’s “cause” affairs. If that was the case, I would have had the affair, not my wife, because my EN’s were less well met in our marriage than hers.

Unmet EN's do not cause affairs, they cause lousy marriages. If you read Harley thoroughly and carefully, he does not say unmet EN's cause affairs, either, though it is a so common a misconception among his readers that I would say he should do some re-writing of his material. Reading SAA, it can be easy to conclude that unmet needs are the reason for affairs. Not so. Affairs are entirely the responsibility of those involved, and the reasons vary.

Our MC worked w/ Bill Harley for 8 years, and according to him, in about 40% of MEN'S affairs unmet EN's had very little to do with it. Yes, there were usually unmet EN's in their marriages, because no marriage is perfect. But, having the wife find out about and meet his most important EN's did not stop the affairs from re-kindling or stop the husband from having another. Harley is aware of this, which is why his plan for recovery is a lot more complicated than: 1.) Take the EN questionnaire. 2.) Meet your spouse’s EN's. Our MC said that in his opinion, for that 40%, if the wife had been meeting the husband's top 5 EN's PERFECTLY, the husband still would have had the affair. If you want to learn more, read "The State of Affairs", by Todd Mulliken particularly the chapter on "The Double Life Man". Though the percentage of women who have this type of affair is small, it is not zero.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">


Moderated by  Fordude 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Forum Search
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 1,092 guests, and 89 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Zion9038xe, renki, Gocroswell, Allen Inverson, Logan bauer
72,026 Registered Users
Latest Posts
Help: I Don't Like Being Around My Wife
by rossini - 07/20/25 10:36 AM
How important is it to get the whole story?
by leemc - 07/18/25 10:58 AM
Following Ex-Wifes Nursing Schedule?
by Roger Beach - 07/16/25 04:21 AM
My wife wants a separation
by Roger Beach - 07/16/25 04:20 AM
Spying husband arrested
by coooper - 06/24/25 09:19 AM
Forum Statistics
Forums67
Topics133,624
Posts2,323,520
Members72,026
Most Online6,102
Jul 3rd, 2025
Building Marriages That Last A Lifetime
Copyright © 2025, Marriage Builders, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Site Navigation
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 8.0.0