I really do not know where to go or what to do. I have read everything that has been suggested, I have seen that others share a tremendous amount of suffering due to insensitive and irresponsible spouses who did not care about hurting us, did not care about their children and threw themselves into somebody else's arms. In my case, my WW was fooled by a guy who himself does not trust women since he was on the receiving end of an infidelity. He used my WW and then discarded her.
I loved her so much and she did not see it. All I did was for her and our family. I put up with verbal abuse, her anger (anger management is a problem for her), disrespect, unfair judgements, control, jealousy, etc. She does not seem to see what she is and what she has done. She had a devout husband, caring, responsible, provider, who does not have any bad habits, who comes home straight from work. She claims she does not know what happened to her. She has many childhood issues and is working with a Christian counselor. In the meantime, I feel I have to carry with her sin and stay home because of our small children and because she does not work (her choice) and does not have any training.
I avoid anything that has to do with that situation, but somehow, I feel the purity of our marriage is forever lost and I cannot get close to her because I feel there is now someone between the two of us. I cannot kiss her because I get disgusted she did that and other things with another person. Before our marriage, she had various emotional affairs, never physical, and I forgave all. To her, they were nothing of importance because there was no sex, but I still suffered and had heart aches.
How can someone be so insensitive and blind to see what she has done? How can I ever get close again. Deep inside I feel remorse that I fell in love with her and her selfishness, since she was who proposed we should marry, I feel that she may have deprived me of finding happiness with someone whou would have appreciated all that she has had. We both come from a low social class, working families in a third world country. I am the first college educated member of my family and went on to get graduate degrees. As a student, she used to put me down asking why I studied so hard when others who did not have an education had businesses and made a better salary than I did as a student. Yes, those are the type of things she used to say and I had to just ignore.

Why me?,

Listen, I assume you are a Christian. If you have ground to Dv her. However you act in self rightousness ... make sure your R with HIM is clean ... you are about to throw the first stone.

Why you ?. HE has a purpose ... HE might want you to grow and be like HIM. Be able to reconsile. He might want you to have happiness ... w/ or w/o your WW. Pray and ask HIM.

Meanwhile ... learn MB as much as you can. Also you might want to seek doctor to get AD.

-rh-

Hi Why me?

Fisrt of all, to make you laugh. Why any of us?
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />
I mean we are all going on our merry way trying to work. We try to take care of our families. We try to enjoy life.

Then Bam-ka-Boom there it is. A big crater hits us right between the eyes. The one we love turns on us and hurts us in ways that are hard to imagine.

It is life. We all have our crosses to bear. You know that suffering didn't begin with you and it won't stop with you. Many others will suffer hardships in life. But we go on.

Hey I'm not coming down on you. But I'm saying, well, Welcome to the club.

"I have read everything that has been suggested, I have seen that others share a tremendous amount of suffering due to insensitive and irresponsible spouses who did not care about hurting us, did not care about their children and threw themselves into somebody else's arms. " .

Understand that you can read everything in this site and in the books you've read but it won't mean a thing until you decide to use what you've read. I can tell by your post that you are probably recent at finding out about WS A. At this point your heart is probably aching in pain.

So allow yourself to feel the hurt. But make a decision. Do you want to save your M? If you do decide to let what you read help you understand WS and yourself. Then decide to make a course of action.

Wishig you the best. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

To Redhat, yes I am a Christian. Actually, both of us have been for over 20 years. I married her because we knew each other since childhood and both practiced celibacy before marriage. Why would she ruin all of that and put that cross on my shoulders? If I there wasn't anything holding me and if I had not made a promise at the altar, I would have walked. I do not think I can ever trust her or have the feeling that she is special.

To freetobe: I have in fact practiced much of what I have read recently before I actually read it with regards to her needs. I read Love Busters, Five Languages of Love, Men are from Mars and Women are from Venus, Surviving an Affair, etc. To me, life should not be so difficult if one lives it honestly, without hurting anyone, being considerate and respecting others. I used to think that trouble came into someone's life due to negligence, acting without thinking, etc. Then, as you put it, Bam-ka-Boom and you are left picking up the pieces.
I have lost my drive, my motivation to go on and even my lifelong dream of being what I am now, has no meaning and I find it very difficult to work since I cannot focus.
Interestingly, today we went for lunch and we were listening to a program run by a psychologist who takes calls. A woman called because she had cheated on her husband who she describes as a good man and did not know what to do. The guy used her and dumped her after he got what he wanted. My WS did not comment and was silent. I wonder, what goes through their minds?
I have tried unsuccesfully to find Biblical scriptures that would guide me. Joseph was about to leave Mary when he found she was with child and an angel adviced him. Biblically, immorality has been severely punished, but I am lost as to what I should do.
I am not bitter at her, but I am very sad and disappointed that she is not who I thought she was and now I wonder when she would do it again or how many lies and secrets she is keeping?
It is hard to live with someone who you do not trust and who has traits that are against your moral values. I wonder who in my life I did not pay attention to or ignored because I was in love with her at the time. I feel she has denied me a happy and normal life. I feel so sad for my children and how this may affect them although I have tried to protect them from knowing anything, but I cannot be the loving and affectionate husband I once was.

Here is a passage for you that Redhat was alluding too.

(Shortened Paraphrased). A woman was about to be stoned for adultery and Jesus intervened. Jesus told the crowd, let he who is without sin cast the first stone. One by one the crowd departed until only the woman and Jesus were left. Jesus then said told her that he would not condemn her either to go and sin no more.

As Redhat said, you are about to cast the first stone.

As I understand it and has been taught to me, forgiveness is one of the highest teachings of the Christian faith.

J.

Hi Why me?

I think one of the main obstacles facing you right now is dealing with how you feel. Everyone has emotions that they feel when discovering Infidelity. We all react our own way. Not "feeling yourself" and losing motivation goes with the territory. You've been hit with a whammy. Most people have a hard time in this area.

Maybe understanding how Instincts and habits work can help you sort through what you are feeling. Usually Instincts fuels by emotion can lead you down the wrong path at this time when you are vulnerable. Yet if when using wisdom with these emotions it can fuel us to make good decisions.
Now is the time to think clearly. I recommend this page: Instincts and Habits http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3250_habits.html

After looking around I gained more info on your situation. It has been a year since A. Is the A still active? You noted on another post that WS wants forgiveness. If she isn't in the A have you decided to forgive her and work on M?

I assumed that with reding the books you have that you want to save you M. However it seems you are stuck at how this makes you feel.
I understand all the feelings of betrayal that you are going through right now.

You've worked hard to make a nice life for you and your family. It proably feels now like a slap in the face for WS to show you her appreciation by having an A. But do you plan to stop at this? Or do you want to make changes in your marriage?

You've read the books so you know that affairs usually occur because a need wasn't being met in the marriage. So that may mean that you weren't meeting a need or needs. That is your part to consider in this. Also you may have noted from your reading that affairs are usually symptomatic of problems that existed prior to the A.

Take a look at your marriage before the affair. How was it? How did you feel?

WS has a part in this too. You talked about how she treated you with unfair judgements and verbal abuse. You've talked about the childhood issues of WS. Do you feel that they have contributed to her current A?

You've noted that you would leave your wife if it weren't for the children, and her not having an income. This is a choice, right? This is a choice that you've made. That being said WS has to make choices too.

If you want to make change to occur in this marriage and save it, focusing on how you've made a good life for WS and family and judging her will not magically make the marriage you want.

Yes WS did an underhanded, backstabbibng thing, but what do you do about it? If you want to save this M and also grow to be a forgiving, understanding person, you make a choice to apply what the books are telling you.

You are at a critical time where what you do is important. If I could save you the wasted time of lingering in anger and making rash, unproductive decisions that I have, hey I'd like to do it.

But it is all on you. Now there is also a part for WS to play in this. If you are willing to forgive her and work toward recovery then help her help the marriage. Tell her about what you've learned. Attend counseling with her.
How does she feel? What does she want?
Link for ending an A: http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5060_qa.html
Recovery: http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5065_qa.html

If she isn't willing to listen or if she hasn't decided to give up on the A, refer to Plan A and Plan B:
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html

You can't control her. Meaning you can't make her do what is right. you can't make her be responsible. However you can apply what you've learned with the hopes that you will show her an example of what needs to happen between you.
And I'm sure you don't have any bad habits but none of us are perfect so try to see where you can improve.

And one thing about judging her. It will probably make you more angry than anything. You don't need anger that immobilizes you. But instead anger that makes you want to take your marriage back.

So what do you want to do? Where are you at in this? Have you both discussed the effects of this on the children?

It is good that you've posted here also instead of with WS. Post, ask questions, read. State how you feel. I'm hoping things will turn out in your favor. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Dear WM:

One thing I need to tell you...I have been where you are now. 19 months ago I posted here in "Just found out" about my H's A. My first post was called similar to yours: pain is tearing me apart. I felt the pain, the despair, the unbearable grief at the loss of my old M.

There are many others here that have gone through the same like you and I.

For my H and me his A has been the wake-up call that led to enormous personal change. He has been in counselling for 19 months. I have learned so much about relationships, about personality profiles (stillwed's enneagram), I have changed as a person in a very positive sense.

I remember that in my early days here Shattered in SF posted to me and told me that he had good days with his wife again, that they were in love again and life was good. I couldn't believe it. I thought once your M is tainted like this by this horrible fact of the A, your life is ruined forever. I did not love my H anymore, I hated him, hated the betrayal he had done. I thought it was unforgiveable. I thought of leaving him.

I was so wrong...

After 17 months forgiveness reached my heart. Our life is beautiful again, we are so in love with each other, calm, peace and happiness have returned to us. Just read my latest post in the "recovery forum".

If both partners are working hard to rebuild their M, enormous personal progress is possible. There can be more closeness than before, more love.

I know you don't believe me but I have 600 posts on my record to prove it.

Read, learn, be patient and loving and put your best effort into rebuilding your M.

Keep walking on the long rocky road to recovery. We are here to help you.

Thank you for the valuable comments. I have really looked hard at different reading material here ad elsewhere. I have spent so much time in the library looking at books on relationships. I have asked myself, what did I do to allow that to happen? I am aware of the needs concept and I tried to meet them. One thing that I have come to conclude is that due to her childhood and family life experiences she is a person who needs a lot of attention. Also, communication has been difficult because I have never been able to comment on any thing that bothers me without her getting defensive and angry. She has the tendency to make mountains out of mole hills and I am not the argumentative type. She was raised in a very difficult home where conflicts were part of everyday life and I felt uncomfortable being around that during visits.
I still loved her inspite of her anger, abusive language and unfair judgements. I rationalized that her background had a lot to do with that. But when confronted with this my life was really turn upside down. I question why did I put so much effort in trying to make her happy? Why did I abandoned hobbies that I wanted to do simply because to her that was a waste of time? Why did I accept her unfounded jealousy that made me feel extremely uncomfortable? The answer to these and other questions is because I loved her and wanted to to do everything in my power to make her happy. I have really thought hard what else I could have done and it really bothers me and makes me boil when I look back and see all that she has received and did not value that. During her affair, while I was still naive, all that I did bothered her. If I gave her flowers, she was annoyed. For her birthday, I bought flowers and other gifts and she said she didn't want any of that. It was so bad that she said that to her it was a damnation to be married to someone with a doctorate. That she wished the kids were older. When I think back, it was because she wanted to be free. As I said in a previous post. She confessed that she did everything possible to make my life miserable so that I would abandon the house before I ever found out anything.
I have and am really trying to rationalize forgiveness, but I am afraid because when we were dating she cheated on me several times and everytime I forgave her. I wonder if she used that as a reference to think that because I love her so much she could do whatever she pleased regardless of how our children and I may be affected.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Why me?:

I am afraid because when we were dating she cheated on me several times and everytime I forgave her. I wonder if she used that as a reference to think that because I love her so much she could do whatever she pleased regardless of how our children and I may be affected.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You don't need to 'wonder if', because it is exactly that.

She never learned to respect you because you always tolerated and forgave her every single time. Without respect, there can be no love.

Instead of 'Why me?' ask yourself 'What issues do I have that made me tolerate her infidelities, even before we were married'?. Sadly, you are reaping what you have sown.

<small>[ January 08, 2004, 12:32 PM: Message edited by: T00MuchCoffeeMan ]</small>

Hello,

The last post by TMCM I am afraid hit the nail right on the head. You allowed her to humiliate and disrespect you without consequences. No consequences to her actions equals no motivation to change. By not setting boundaries on her behavior you gave her a clear message that you would accept all types of insulting and hurtful behavior by her. The irony of this is that the more forgiving you were of her transgressions; the more weak and unimportant you looked. The bottom line is that nobody can really respect someone who allows another person to humiliate and disrepect them. Clearly you were in denial. She cheated on you several times while you were dating and you kept forgiving her. How in the world would you expect her to admire you for this?
She probably thought you were a co-dependent person and that there was nothing she could do that would not allow you to forgive her over and over. Dating is the time what you decide whether this person has the attributes you wish to live with for the rest of your life. Why you would close your eyes to a woman who kept having emotional affairs with other men while you were dating her seems beyond reason. If you cannot respect yourself then other will not either. Please seek counseling to understand why you have had such a need to accept such humiliation in your life. I wish you luck.

The comments by TMCM and Bryanp actually touch on something that has had me going between Christian principles and forgiveness versus letting my own emotions and self-respect dictate what to do. Her past transgressions were only emotional in nature and I believe her entirely on that. Since I was going to college at the time, I could not spend as much time with her and she claimed that they happened because she felt lonesome, but she never considered that I also felt lonesome at times, but never failed her.

The Bible says to turn the other check and to forgive your brother. In Matthew 18:22 Jesus said, "I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven times." My WS IC and others say that forgiveness would cause her to have a greater love and admiration. I am so confused with everything. I am very frustrated and all of this has caused me to question my faith and principles. I always lived by high moral standards, but now I wonder.
I am truly torn, devastated and I may actually lose my job as a result because I have not been able to do what I enjoyed doing and have fallen so far behind. I have always been positive and goal-oriented, but I did not know something like this could really change me this much.

Why me? there is a difference between forgiveness and reconciliation. Forgiveness is defined as the act of pardoning somebody for a mistake or wrongdoing, while reconciliation is the act of restoration or renewal of a relationship between disputing people. It is very possible for a person to forgive another BUT never reconcile; forgive AND reconcile; and NOT forgive yet reconcile. If you are still confused, you might want to consider the case of a serial killer who was forgiven by one of his victim's father. The fact that he was forgiven does not mean that he was going to be set free to reconcile with the rest of society. So please reconsider that forgiveness is NOT the Siamese twin of reconciliation.

I am sorry that you are going through this. This site has helped me understand with my husband has been going through since my affair. I posted my story some time ago. Briefly, I met a former friend of mine and started an A with him. That in spite of having a wonderful H who has been supportive, caring and loving as well as a good privider. I would not have the lifestyle I have enjoyed, if not for him. I have regreted since because my actions distroyed him morally. He lost his job, his self-confidence and his faith because of me.
From your post, I can see some similarities. I had cheated him once early in our marriage and he forgave me because he blamed himself for being so busy trying to make a living for us. Also, he saw that I was remorseful and depressed over that incident. I guess since he forgave me once, when I felt that the second A was possible, I did not avoid it and was not afraid as I was the first time. I am not about to excuse myself, but during therapy my IC pinpointed issues from my past that contributed to my errors. I am somewhat insecure and need attention, perhaps more that most people. My father was abusive and my home life was a living hell. I am still working to become a better person and at the same time trying to rebuild my marriage, which is a very remote possiblity now. Talk to your spouse about getting help and understand that the problem is not you, but her. She needs to acknowledge this and recognize it as I have and hopefully it is not too late for both of you.

To Shame on me: I am glad that you present your perspective. I am curious about what may have led you to make those decisions that hurt your husband. Do you have children? If so, did you think about how your actions may affect them? How are you both doing now? May be you can help me understand some of the concerns I have. If your H forgave you once after going through all that pain for both, what prompted you to repeat the offense? I am struggling with this particular question, since I am thinking on whether I should continue to forgive. My Christian principels tell me I should, but my emotions keep me from making that step. I must say that I am very afraid of having to face this again.

WM:

Your wife may not be the same type of person as SOM. I discussed her post with my H and he told me that he had learned very different things from the A. Certainly NOT to do it again because I had forgiven him.

I am trying to show you that it is possible to recover from this.

What is your wife contributing to this recovery?

WM: Yes, we have two small children D10, S7. I do not know what to tell you about why I acted that way. The first time I had an A, it almost destroyed him emotionally. I felt very bad and was remorseful. The OM did not want anything to do with me and I explained this to my H. He felt bad for me as well and blamed himself for not making more time to be with me. The truth is that I know he was working hard to make a living for both of us and deep inside I knew this, but I fell into temptation. I was seduced by the devil, which is how I see that OM for the way he treated me after he got what he sought. The only explanation that I can offer you, and I must tell you that your wife's situation may be entirely different, is that I have been very insecure and when I got the attention, I was lured. It was like I blanked out and forgot what had happened before and I was not as nervous as the first time. Before that time, my H had been the only man in my life. This time I think he is not forgiving me. It has really affected him and he has told me he should have never forgiven me. I think I can change and I am doing all within my power to do it with counseling. I recognize that I have to overcome my past and move forward.
How has your wife handled her feelings? Is she in counseling? What is she doing to show remorse? I found that something I had not done the first time was to tell the whole truth. I think it is important to show that I am being very honest and I am eager to change. I will be praying for your family to stay together.

As Iceprincess suggests, it is a hard lesson in life, not only for the WS but for the BS as well.
Bryanp makes very good points in that during the dating period I should have seen the signs, but I was too naive and too in love to see them.

SOM, how are you trying to gain trust? What makes you think that there will not be yet another recurrence? I know that life has no guaranties, but I am very afraid to trust again and be hurt once more. In one of my earlier posts I mentioned that she had EA's during our dating and I forgave and buried those, but the recent affair brought all of that back with much force and now I cannot get close to her. I have not even kissed her since I found out. It is hard to describe the feeling, but it is like someone is now between the two of us and also I wonder how many more lies are there because I am aware of some, which I found on my own and she has not brought those up. One of the things that troubles me is that behind my back she was slandering me with a couple of her family members and a friend, that I know of, because they knew and I was not aware of anything. I feel betrayed by those individuals who I loved and cared for and yet covered for her instead of chastasig her and preventing the A from going as far as it went. How could she do that to excuse her actions? In my mind, the betrayal was multiprongued.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Why me?:

<strong>I feel betrayed by those individuals who I loved and cared for and yet covered for her instead of chastasig her and preventing the A from going as far as it went.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">How do you know that she didn't tell them that the OM was 'just a friend'? Most people like to give others the benefit of the doubt, and this might have been the case with them. They could just have been as easily deceived by her, just like you were initially. Even if they weren't fooled by her assurances that her relationship with the OM was a platonic one, other than totally ostracizing her, there wasn't much they could have done to end the affair. Please keep the focus of the responsibility of the affair where it solely lies, with her.

To TMCM:
Those female family members and a friend of hers knew because it came up in conversations. They were asked to swear secrecy that they should never tell me what they knew. One drove her to encounters and delivered messages, another provided her home as a haven for phone conversations, one helped her deceive other family members to allow for an encounter. If they considered it a platonic thing, why would theu hide it from other family members? So they knew. When I initially enquired before I knew anything, they played dumb and say they didn't know anything, but I could tell they were lying and I gradually extracted information from them without them realizing. I think if they had cautioned her and acted as friends and family should act, she would have thought more carefully about what she was doing. One of them actually made a comment along the lines that life was giving her another opportunity to restablish that friendship with the OM, knowing that they had something to do with one another.

Why me? you are right to be angry with the way they acted BUT be careful in not using them as scapegoats for your W's affair. They may be a sick and inmoral group of people that are more worthy of your pity than of your contempt. Besides your WW has a history of cheating that goes way back to the time you and her were courting each other, so I doubt that any attempt by her family and friends, short of ostracizing her, would have been effective in making her end her affair with the OM. But if there is anything of value from this is that now you know who is truly a friend or foe of your marriage.