Wow, you yourself have been a busy bee on these boards! Yeah, lots of hours separate us. I was never an early-bird until we moved to Germany for 2 years. Now, I am a morning person. Amazing how you think you are really one way your whole life, and then realize all that can change when you totally switch time zones and continents and everything.

Just like you really think you are one way and feel one way, and then your H has an A, and you realize you don't know anything important! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Just speaking for myself, there. This entire plan has become very clear to me. Yes, I am committed to doing an AWESOME plan A, now that I have wrapped my brain around it. Unfortunately, I am limited for now because he is understandably gun-shy of my temper. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

But, I have turned that corner. I have found compassion for him. And I love that book "Torn Asunder." I have gobbled through it in just a couple of days. I love all the other books I have read, but this one really clicks with me. It seems to tie in the concepts here with MB, and our MT sessions.

So, my plan A at this point is to be upbeat and follow what he has requested specifically. Which is only business communication, only through email. He will nary hear a LB from me. In my current state of mind, I have no anger for him. I have compassion now. And that is what I have needed.

For many reasons. A big reason is that, as my IC pointed out to me yesterday, when he projects blame and anger onto me, and I don't argue with him, he has nowhere to go with that line of thinking. I won't accept the blame, but I won't engage him in an argument. When he doesn't get the argument, he has no choice but to go looking within himself for the answers that I won't give him in that way. Does that make sense? It did yesterday. I only have had 3/4 cup of coffee today so far. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Anyway, what is your thesis on? What is your area of study? What university do you go to?

I really cannot say enough about pilates and yoga. You will not realize how weak your back is until you begin both in earnest. No wonder back injuries are so prevalent. Your back supports your weight 16-18 hours a day, is used and abused, and who bothers to strengthen it? People focus on the abs in front, which is good, but muscles on opposite sides should be as equal as possible, so that injury does not occur.

And yoga helps the brain relax. When you focus on holding a pose, breathing, balancing, and how much your muscles are burning, it is hard to think about all the stuff you normally think about. When the session is over, my brain feels incredible. Very open and flexible and fresh. And I sleep so good on yoga nights.

Both these, pilates and yoga, help you do other activities better and not get injured. I use them as physical therapy, also. When I do yoga, I do not have to go to the doctor for my hip pain. It keeps my hips loose enough so that I have no pain. Cool, huh?

Anyway, thank you so much, C&S. Your posts came to me at a time that I needed hope, and you were there for me. You, along with my WW friend, have made the difference between me understanding MB intellectually, and KNOWING what I am doing and why. That makes a huge difference. I have a hard time doing things if I don't really understand why I am doing them. And I also do not do them well until I understand.

All I can say is thank you. I have turned a corner in my own personal recovery, and it is wonderful. Now, keep checking on me, because I fully expect to backslide here some day and be on here saying, "Why am I doing this again? I am so hurt and confused and mad and blah blah blah." And you all will need to talk me down again. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Love you! Amy

Hi Amy-Marie,

I was reading your posting that you made and about a comment your husband “He’s afraid that I won’t change and it won’t last”

I heard the same thing from my H. It’s too late, it won’t last, you’ll go back to the way you used to be, I can go on and on. When he saw that I was changing he was afraid to believe that it could last, I was changing the dynamics of our relationship (those were the words of my IC), I stopped being the dependent wife who could not go on without him, I started doing things for me, I started listening to him and talking with him, he started opening up, he was still having his A but I was challenging his decision with the way I was handling things, . In fact, in the height of his A, he even said to me, “You’re the only person that I trust and feel I can talk to.” Your H said the same thing to you right? This was after a month of Plan A, he was used to me being one way and I was learning how to deal and handle things a different way.

You’re on the right track, this isn’t easy but you will come out of this stronger. There will be days where you will second guess yourself, there will be days you will ask yourself “Why am I doing this?”, and there will be days of joy and happiness believe it or not. And hopefully you will be where I am three years from now and say “I love him and that’s why I hung in and refused to give up.”

He is in a fog, he is mixing fantasy with reality, he is probably second guessing himself right now as well. Be his friend, his confidante even if you don’t understand what he’s saying to you.

I’m rooting for you.

Hearbroken -

Thanks for your post! I am amazed every day in our similarities here at MB. I actually thought him saying that to me yesterday about changing was interesting. I had heard FWS say that they thought the same thing. I think it is encouraging. Makes me think this A was a cry for help, not a way to exit the M.

Don't get me wrong, it is still touch and go. I would only give us a 50-50 chance right now. BUT, I have finally figured some stuff out, and I am hopeful.

My WH has not told me I am the only one he can trust and talk to. I blew that chance the weekend of the Superbowl. He was ready, I thought I was, but I was in my own fog of sorts. And I frightened him away again.

But by following his conditions, strictly, and making him feel safe in that way, I am hoping he will give me another shot. Actually, I am counting on it. He talked for the majority of our MT session yesterday. I did not interrupt. I didn't understand what he was saying or why, but it was very important to him.

I believe that he will be back soon wanting to open up to me. I just have to show him I am safe. About the changing, he doesn't realize that things can never go back to the way they were. That is the nature of the A. He definately got my attention, and my eyes are wide open now. He still sees me as the woman he left, not the person I have finally realized I am.

Does that make sense? I am not a different person, in the way that he has become as the WS, but I am made of different stuff than I thought I was. I thought something like this would kill me, but I am already so much more than I thought I could be. And in 3 more years, I intend to be even more than that.

6 months and 3 years used to seem like so much time to me. Now 6 months doesn't seem like enough time to get myself ready! Because I now realize that for all my reading, soul searching, praying, counseling, posting - the real healer and teacher is TIME. Physical time, and there is no short-cut. I looked, and it isn't there. Time marches on, and I can either be stagnant or grow. I was stangant for many years. And unhappy.

I will get through this OK. I will be better than ever. And I think it is my responsibility as my WH partner to help him out of this dark place he has gotten himself into. When he looks up out of his dark hole, I want him to see me silouetted in the light, smiling, holding my hand down to him, ready to help him in any way I can to get out. Then we will look at the path we want to go down and see if we want to go down it together. I think we will. But one step at a time.

Am I a hopeless romantic or what??? I should write a book. Or two.

Thanks for everything. I will keep everyone posted on my progress. And I do expect to fall on my face more than 100 times, and you all will have to pick me up and dust me off and give me a push to start going again. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Love, Amy

Amy,

Again, I don't want to discourage you in any way from posting advice....and it is obvious that you have learned alot in a very short time...so please keep at it.

I don't have enough time today to read this whole thread, but I will...possibly tonight and add my voice to the ones here. In the meantime, let me give you some advice for attracting some of the vets to your threads.

*put their name in the title of the thread
*don't create a post that is too long or too short, and be sure and summarize the basic information or put in a link to your original story.

*make your title express the true nature of your inquiry instead of your state of mind. For instance "lost and confused", "need help quickly" all those sorts of titles just run into each other. It should be something along the lines of "K, TMCM, please advise about the POJA" or whatever it is that you are asking.

*Sometimes a very long thread will be discouraging to folks who don't have the time to read and respond to every aspect of your concerns...so when you have a good question...make a separate thread. Cut the problems into bite-sized pieces that will help the vets get to know you in an easier format.

If you need to change the title of a thread...you can edit the title from the first post of that thread using the paper and pen icon. For instance, if you are not attracting a poster you would like to ask (say you've read some of their posts and like their advice)...just add their name to the title and most will respond.

Just in general, from the little I have read...you appear to be doing very well. You are quite right, that TIME is a huge part of the equation and not much can be done except to endure the wait in some cases. I'll read your whole story and comment as soon as I can...but I'm kinda buried today. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Star*fish -

I know I am exceptionally long-winded. And when I have a specific question in the future, I will follow your great tips. Thanks for your time, and no rush. I am doing pretty good right now. There are others out there who are really frightened, and I understand that there is only one of you and lots of us.

Amy

Okay,

I made it through...whew *wiping brow* <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Here's the thing. You have three professionals involved in the process...two ICs and a MC. It sounds like they're doing a great job of orchestrating this process and that you are taking the good advice you get to heart. It would be unethical of me to interfere with what appears to me very good treatment. The fragile state of your husband also leads me to think that it's best that you two are guided by people who are in contact with you. With that in mind...I won't give you advice that could be contrary to what they are advising. Some of the methods Dr.H uses are somewhat controversial...and they should not be combined with other treatment. For instance...you are apparently in a sort of Plan A/Plan B which appears to suit the needs of your marriage. If you were strictly following the concepts here...those would be two distinct steps...but again...I think under the circumstances it seems like the right course of action for you....and you are responding very well to it. Stick with it....and use this board mainly for support. Run any advice you get here by your MC who has their own process for you to follow.

Aside from that, as you have realized...your H is doing the WS script practically word for word...from rewritting history, to creep personality changes and the "realization" (ugh) that he never loved you. It's babble...fog babble. I hope you're right and the OW spooked and dumped him...that should help if it's true. So will your detachment, and the confidence that he will soon see that you actually CAN survive without him and even be happy without him if you must. Crying, neediness, anger are all LBs to him right now....so the new you is the best you for wading through this muck.

Now....just one little thing. The scouting. Please discuss with the MC how to handle this little detail which facilitates the affair. Get her help in explaining to your husband that it simply cannot go on. It's a boundary that needs to be enforced. That is kind of a no brainer...and I think the MC will agree that you are completely within your rights to move your child to another troop. If he refuses...you are also completely within your rights to ask for the scout master for her resignation. Scouting has taken enough beatings lately...they will take you seriously, being a den leader/committe chair myself...I know this to be true. Be clear to the MC...that you feel as though by allowing your child to continue scouting with this "friendship" in place...that you are actually helping your husband have an affair. And you are.

Good luck and blessings to you.

Good Luck to you.

Thank you, Star*fish. I understand about the Scouting. At this point, the MT thinks that it will work itself out in time. I have thrown a fit about it in the past. My boys don't want to leave, all their friends are there. That is how WH is justifying it right now. I know it cannot go on, and I think deep down WH knows, also. As it is, only one son goes to most of the stuff, and even he is having lots of conflicts with her son lately. So, . . .

I am still in a holding pattern about that. I believe I am going to ask my IC to bring up that point to his IC, and see what WH has to say about that. I know that the H I know would think it very hypocritical to be a leader in the Troop your girlfriend is in, but WH has rationalized it.

OK, now about tonight. As I posted earlier, WH lingered after yoga Tuesday night. Then he called tonight at 7:30 and stopped by to get the boys unexpectedly. And he kind-of lingered then, as well. THEN, tonight when I got home from yoga he was still here AGAIN! Hmmmmmmmm.

He just talked and talked. He fixed my computer for me, and had installed all this new stuff and he was going on and on about it all. Mostly over my head, but I just sat and smiled and let him talk and talk. Me thinks he be very lonely, with no EN being met by anyone.

Then I offered him one of my intoxicatingly good chocolate chip cookies, <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> and he ate it. Then I asked him if he wanted something to drink, and got him some milk. THEN he started talking about something funny that happened at his class the other day, and he was laughing and chatting away.

And I shared some news of a mutual friend. Then he went into great detail about how he reassured our youngest about a rough draft he was worried about at school. So, 40 minutes later, he finally left.

WOW. From someone who just wants space from me. I did so good. I did not interrupt him, I did not try and steer the conversation to what I wanted to talk about, I didn't LB at all! I was his friend. And I smiled and nodded a LOT! Baby steps. I feel like I just took some very important baby steps down my long path, that he finally opened the door a crack again, and that I came through.

I am so excited! Thank you all for your support and well wishes. I am at a place now where I feel I can truly begin our healing process. At least my healing process. And I think he is going to want to jump on board.

I'll keep you all posted. Hugs!!!

Amy

wow!!! amazing! Keep your hold AMY Keep your strenght. I know you can do it! You can show you're strong, and when you show you can BECOME! I'm glad you're doing counseling. I didn't do it, because hubby wouldn't go. And we're probably not the type for it. I might be wrong.

I'm glad he came to visit the kids yesterday. He will probably come around more often. Don't show that you re too over excited to see. Just "ACT NATURALLY" hehehe I bet he enjoyed that cookie (I WANT I WANT I WANT) yeah I'm silly like that.

ANyways, I'm doing fine today. I just need to have my brain working a little bit off the A..which is not working. It's ok, I forget sometimes about it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

amy -

Follow starfish's advice. She is the expert. But it sounds very promising. You are doing very well. Continue flying by the instruments.

Thank you all for the encouragement. I am not going to act excited, I will act normal. I really don't feel too excited until after he leaves, actually. But, I do hear what you are saying, and will keep it in the back of my brain at all times!

I dreamed about H for the first time in forever last night. When I woke up this morning, he was clearly in my mind. It was weird. He kissed me, in my dream, and it felt strange and different. He asked what was wrong, and I told him I thought it would be a while before I felt totally comfortable with that. It was exciting, but strange. I hope I'm not giving you all too much information! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Anyway, I woke up, and couldn't go back to sleep. So here I am.

Lots of love! I'm going to go check out some other people this morning. I am flying by my instruments, Believer! I am. I am truly taking my own advice. WOW!

Amy

Amy,

I have drempt (SP?) about my H since this has happened also. I just don't know what to make of it sometimes. When he was here for those six weeks he would wake up in the middle of the night and look at me and kiss me on the forehead or on the cheek for no reason. I wonder what he was thinking now that he is gone there is no way to know. He says he still loves me, but his feelings for her are strong and he doesn't think I could ever forgive him or that things would ever be right between us. So he left. I hope that everything works out for everyone on this board eventually. Everyone seems so nice and so hurt, I just want everyone to stop hurting so much in life. I pray for everyone on this board also. I wouldn't know what to do without it now.

HI

I am so glad that starfish gave you advice. I get scared that I may make suggestions that backfire or that if I say how I handled something that even though it worked for me, it may not be best in other situations, or that MB principles are not right. Looked like he felt you are handling situation well.

You are getting some encouraging signs from your husband. At least you are now getting a chance to meet some emotional needs (eg conversation). This allows you to build up his lovebank. He seems to have turned a little in the last week. There seems to be hope. If he is testing the waters you sure as hell did a great job.

I know you are excited. Yes, this is promising. However, try to be prepared for backsliding. Remember that he is still in a very confused state. (remember what you counseler told you about him changing his mind constantly). I am not saying that this will happen, just that often you read posts here where people get encouraged, only to have their Hs turn on them soon after. I think it is a syptom og the WH orWW being so unsure of what they really want.

Don't get me wrong. I think think there are great signs of hope for your marriage. I just want to prepare you so you don't get discouraged if he does this.

Dreams are amazing aren't they. Before I knew of my H's affair, I used to dream that we were together and about to make love, but something would stop us or get in the way. I dreamt this a lot. My mind was trying to tell me something. I haven't had the dream since Dday. Weird hey.

It is stinking hot here. We will probably go to the beach soon. My son is already there with some friends. My H is back. I was a little down last night as I was hopeful of a romantic eventing, but he was very tired and fell asleep in the chair. (he had been up most of the night before) He is in the Navy and is commander of all of Australia's minewarfare ships and our diving teams. He had sailed overnight with two of his ships to put them through their paces to ensure they are up to scratch before they sail for deployment on a peace keeping mission. He only had a few hours sleep as he ahd to watch what they were doing.

Next week he starts three 1/2 weeks of an exercise down the south coast. He will be back and forth between here and there, so will be away a lot. I am going down to see my oldest two children who are studying in Canberra. I also have to see my thesis supervisor. I am a neonatal intensive care nurse. The thesis is for my masters. I am doing researh into the use of humidity with preamture infants of less than 30 weeks gestaion. Basically I am trying to determine a length of time after birth that is the most advantageous to administer humidity.

Anyway good luck. Hope things continue to improve
C&S

confused

Do you think it is a good idea to try to have WH read SAA? I am just thinking that maybe the first 65 pages would be good for him to read. I mean he is everything that everyone else is describing to a T. When he came back for the six weeks he was in such terrible withdrawals for her. He couldn't stay away though, he was seeing her every night after work even though he lied and said he wasn't. He even packed condoms in his bag and lied about how they got there. I asked him what was he going to do, do her in the parking lot at work and he said yes. He will be with OW for two weeks this sun. It is not getting any easier. I am not sure how to act around him. It is so unfair, he is my H and he belongs to someone else.

C&S -

I truly am expecting backslides. And stagnation. And I am not feeling too excited today. I have a question in to Ark on the General Questions II about my newest issue regarding the Scouts.

That has occupied my mind today, and made me a bit angry that he continues to be so selfish when our children's welfare is concerned. And I realized a while ago that I forgot to take my anti-D today. I might take one of my anti-anxieties later, if I don't calm down.

I'm not out-of-control crazy, but I am getting better about monitoring my emotions before I become that way. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Wow, neonatal nurse! Those premies are sooooo small. I guess after a while you get used to it, but a 7 pound newborn is tiny. Let alone 1, 2, or 3 pound babies, with transparent skin. You are a healer. That is so wonderful.

Thank you for your time and kind words.

Hugs and love!

Amy

The roller coaster baby! I know how you feel.. I'm fed up with the roller coaster. I'm about to fall.. I either get angry or really frustrated! I get confused! Hey monday I might get my anti=D...

Anyways.. keep ya head up AMY!

Remember I have my H and I still switching.. this is a long and bumpy ride.. but you'll get to it mami. I have to be a strong woman. I am a strong woman.. I will survive.. so WILL YOU!!!!

Chins up everyone. I don't have my H and still changing my mind everyday. It is part of the process.

But we can focus on changing ourselves and that is what really helps.

I am changing myself, Believer. It is so weird, because when this first happened and people said, "Find out who AMY is, not WH's wife" I heard what they were saying, but I couldn't understand how I could discover who Amy is.

Well, it is happening. I truly feel alive for the first time in I don't know how long. Right now, WH is an annoying buzzing noise in my head on most days (I say most days, meaning the past 5! Which to me, seems like a long time - time warp).

I don't know if it's because of the meds (doc assured me they are mild), or being forced to look at myself for the first time, or what. I have been with WH since I was 16. I'm sure I married him for all the wrong reasons. I do still love him, I would like to be married to him and work through all this because I see tremendous potential with us, but to be honest I could take it or leave it at this point.

I know some day he will be back. I know in his heart of heart's, he knows I am the one for him. But he has 100% lost himself. Very much so. And I don't know if he will find himself before he D's me. I don't want to create that by believing it - he is just so far gone, I do not know how 6 months could be enough time for him.

Anyway, thanks for the posts, ladies. You are both my rocks in these turbulent waters. I love you both so much, and hope the best for you both - as I do for myself.

Love, Amy

Hi Amy. I'm pretty new and just wanted to say hello after reading your story and stuff on this thread. (My beginning post is about delicate timing or some such). I was married young, too, and have been with my husband half my life.

You mentioned on an earlier post on this thread something about God's Divine Path and it reminded me of something that happened when we were breaking down (after hubby left and went to her and then came back and then was trying to tell me that he didn't think we would stay married). He actually told me to pray about it and see what God had to say about our marriage. I did, and God told me to wait and see (and that's what I told him). I had an overwhelming feeling about it, though. I had always told my husband that I would follow him anywhere. (And I did,from the South where I was raised to the North). But I believe God was telling me that I couldn't follow him anymore or at least right now.

I asked my husband to please come home because I didn't know how long we had. He did for a little while, but then he kept looking for more excuses and I gave him one when I got into the screaming match about the calling card...

Anyway, sorry to be so long.

Wow! You got through all 7 pages! You must have a high threshold for pain. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Thank you for your time in reading my story. I'll get over there and check out your thread soon. Nice to meet you, IHH!

Love, Amy

Hi Amy
So you have been out kicking up your heels. Good for you?

Hope you are OK. I read in one of your threads that you were thinking on Divorce? Is that still how you are thinking. How is the scout situation going. A pretty delicate issure that. I don't have any ideas there.

I think it is healthy that you think of divorce. I think that if you accept that marriage may need to end, it allows a clearer perspective as you are more likely to consider yourself rather than just doing anything to appease your WH just to get him back.

That said, have you heard from him? Aren't friends great? I too spent nights out with my girlfriends dancing. It is good to do some fun things and get your mind off this sometimes.

You sound like you are pretty busy with Huradah. I hope she is OK. She sounded pretty desparate in her posts. It is just so hard when you are trying to start to trust again and you are let down.

You sound like such a wonderful caring woman. Your husband will really lose something special if he loses you. I am sure he will realise this one day.

C&S