Amy, I would love to read the posts of those who came out of the fog because you are ight, my wife is in and out. We had a decent evening last night, today she will barely get out of bed with what appears to be some depression. I tried to get her out of the house but she said no. I invited her to go out and have some dinner but we will have to see what she says.

I will type more later since I am at a B-Day party. That is better than D-Day party, Ha!

Midwest

Amy: I just found this letter of one who came out of the fog. I am printing this for my wife to read, if she will. The people on these boards have all been influenced by their own experiences and they are so happy to help others because they remember their own pain so clearly. I am amazed. Hopefully someday, I will be one to be able to help someone back.

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=37;t=026504


Midwest

Amy,

You said:

OW (who was also my "best friend" - gag) has even gone so far as to tell me after D-day that she always had my best interests at heart, that she always encouraged WH to come back to me, and the lastest was that she didn't have a hand in breaking up my marriage - I was doing a good enough job on my own. Which is why you should avoid contact with the OP at all costs. All they can possibly do is pi** you off!

If the OM doesn't like his job, maybe he will do something "honorable" - gag gag - and leave the job. But that will only happen, Murphy's Law, if you prepare yourselves for her leaving, if you know what I mean.

-------------

My wife previously told me how good of person the OM was and is. I ask her how good can he be? He is a key player and party to destroying a marriage, ruining the image my children had of their mother, party to destroying my faith and believe in my wife, and is party to over 6 months of lies and deceit. Other than these small minor issues, I guess he is a great guy. I may have been a bit on the sarcastic side when I commented back to her. I hope in time, I will be able to trust her again. Even my 19 yr old son said, if your own mother lies to you, who can you trust? Isn't that sad?

MW

THis has been a bad day. My wife spent most of the day in bed. I left for a couple of hours and she did some cleaning, etc. This evening, she wants to be left alone in the bedroom so she can be by herself to watch tv. She must be thinking of her loss of the OM this evening. She is no more connected to me tonight than the man on the moon. This must be what Star was saying earlier. Be prepared for some tough times ahead. I wish we could just go forward and not have these setbacks.

MW

midwest

I had that too for a while. He was in the room but not really in the room. He just sat around like someone cut off his right arm. Then one night he told me it wasn't fair that he just couldn't stop thinking about OW. That he was here for all the wrong reasons and that he just wanted to be with her and talk to her all the time. I was so crushed to hear that from him. He left the next day and has not been back for two weeks. I found out that in the 6 weeks WH was back here he had continued to see her at work every night before he left for home. WH would come home all worked up, but not for me for her. I was just a fill in. He is with OW now and I am very sad. He is crushing my kids and breaking my heart. I don't know if I can wait for the fog to clear. I am seriously thinking about Plan B all the way here. The only thing is we have the house and all of that stuff. I really don't think he would care if I plan B or not actually. I got to wonder sometimes what people are thinking.

We were able to start our first MC session today. We filled a cancellation slot which enables us to get started several days earlier than we expected. It was more of an introduction to our case and both WW and myself told the MC that we wanted to try and get the M back to its state prior to the A. At least the rush to the apartment to sort things out have subsided for now.

The OM is looking for a new job right now and that will allow for WW to keep her job. These are very positive events but I know that the M remains very vulnerable. Thanks for listening.

Midwest

Yes, still very vulnerable. But you are lightyears ahead of me.

WH and I have had two MT sessions, and he is convinced D is the only answer. The MT asked him why he was there, at MT, and WH said that it is in his nature to give people that one last chance. He is giving me my one last chance.

Hm. What can I say to that? At the time, it made me roll my eyes far up into the back of my head. Luckily, they came back. I don't think they have ever been that far back there before. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Anyway, I have to go be in the room with OW in less than an hour, for my boys' Court of Honor with Scouts. This is going to end soon. Check out my post to ARK on General Questions II regarding my kids. Let me know what you think. I will be telling WH on Wednesday at our 3rd (and probably final) MT appointment. This is not going to go over well. Wish me luck.

Amy

Amy:

I just went over and read your story and posts with Ark. I always thought the scouts were all about learning to tie knots. Now I find out that Scouts are now used to untie a very important knots.

I am so new to learning about infidelity and how to deal with it that I am not a good one to ask. I did take the attitude with my WW early on that I would have to be strong for my two children and to help them get through the damage of the A. Maybe that is the only thing you can do at this point. He is obviously blinded by this OW.

My MC told me today that I cannot control the actions of my WW and if I continue to harp on her or complain about the things she is doing or has done, I will likely lose her permanently anyway. She suggested I try to implement as much normalcy as I can.

Your case is different than mine. My WW is still in the fog but the fog appears to be thinning some. Your WH is still in heavy fog but it sounds like OW's patience is wearing down and the A could be ending or nearing the end allowing you a potential window of opportunity. MC told me to take things one day at a time and I am telling you this because maybe you need to do that too. I have no experience or past reference with this stuff at all. I am as desperate to save my M as you are. My threat of exposure seemed to bring my wife around. Maybe your WH needs to be humuliated and totally exposed to all the parents and scout leasers etc in hopes of stopping the A. Star was not really happy with the desperate approach of holding that over my W's head. I needed to try something quick because WW was looking for apartments with the OM and preparing her exit to "sort things out". You and I know it was to have complete and totla access to the OM.

Good luck to you Amy.

MW

Thank you, MW. There are no easy answers. No right and wrong after an A. Just the best at the time. I am trying to do as much good stuff for me and my boys as possible, minimizing our damage.

I don't know. I feel drained and sad. It sucks that I had to even go through that tonight. I hope I am feeling better by Wednesday, so I can talk the way I need to.

Chat at you later. Amy

One counseling session under our belt. WW goes in next week by herself and I go in for counseling the week after next by myself. For being in "so-called" recovery, WW remains very bitter that I threatened to expose her and the OM A at work to her boss. Today, I reminded her how important it is for the OM or her to quit their job. She said, even if he quits, it won't change anything because of my threat to ruin her job. She then said, "I will probably never trust you again". I told her I was trying to break the momentum of her A by the threat of the exposure of the A and it was not intended to get even with her. She has the A and she doesn't trust me.

She is ignoring our son who questioned why his mother would lie to him. She still shows NO sign of any remorse at all for any of the things she has done. I am beginning to think the MC sessions is nothing more than a smoke screen to justify, in the future, to her family and co-workers that she tried to save her failing marriage. Even my son is now saying, "dad, don't get your hopes up, it doesn't appear she is even interested in fixing the problems".

I think her head is still in the OM and I think she is still very much wrapped up with him at work.

I paid $80 to do a reverse cell phone search which confirmed the OM's name and address. She was truthful about that information but only because of the threat of exposure at her job.

I have no choice but to play this thing out but I remain un-optimistic. I am general a very positve person by nature.

MW

MW -

It is going to take her a while to come out of the fog. You do need to try and be her "soft place to fall."

I have not been to this stage yet. I don't know if WH and I will ever even get that chance. And recovery is supposedly harder than this fog crap I've been dealing with my WH.

Have you been reading on the Recovery boards? You might get some good information there. Maybe post some of your questions, thoughts or concerns over there since those people are closer to where you are at - all of us here at Just Found Out are still dealing with other stuff.

Also, once you realize she is in a documented process, following a script, you may find more peace with her actions and words.

Of course, Dr. Harley says that true recovery cannot begin until NC has been achieved. And since she still sees him at work, I think you might be just hovering around the cusp of recovery.

I don't know. I hope more experienced posters come here soon. What I do know is that she is foggy still. That is where you get the anger and blame.

My WH told our MT that he was giving me one last chance! Me!!! Fogese.

I hope you can find comfort that all the poeple on these boards have been through the same, more or less, and survived. Many have turned out downright decent folk! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Take care. We are all here for you. Amy

Amy:

I have hired internet investigators to help me confirm stories, names, ages, etc as a result of 6 plus months of lies. My WW is 46 and I am 52. I have the reverse cell telephone number back from the company and that is now enabling me to do some further research. I know his complete name, address, etc. I ordered court records, bankruptsy checks, marriage and divorce checks, (I know he has been married and divorced), criminal records, home ownership records, etc.

I have recieved some preliminary information back and I am finding this guy may only be 28 years old. I confronted my wife with that age tonight and she paused after my question about his age. She then said I was invading his privacy by digging up information. She then said, he has to be in his mid-thirties but then she said, "we never talked about it". I asked her how she would feel if he was 28 yrs old and she said, "at this point, it doesn't matter because I am feeling tremendous hatred towards you right now".

Previously, she acknowledged him to be 35, then 32 yrs old. I think he turns 29 this month if my preliminary information is accurate. She told the MC that I act way too old for my age. I now understand better what I am being compared with.

I am beginning to think she is not even worth fighting for at all or if trying to save this marriage is even worth it at all. I asked her again if she has been having sex with him and she says no, never. What else would they have in common???? This relationship is beginning to sound like pure lust and not some accidental EA, although, I am only guessing. It seems the more information I dig, the more I find that she is forced to confirm. I also think I have located his parents name and address. I will be calling them very soon to expose him to his parents. They are within a couple of years of me. I have a very sick feeling inside of me again. Another sleepless night ahead of me, I am sure.

Probably Soon To be Divorced,

MW

My previous post is a bit sketchy. My WW said she never had sex with the OM. I was asking in a general sense, "if there isn't sex involved what would they have in common". She never quoted that line but it reads as if she did. My late night posts are not coming across clear.

MW

Hi Midwest

My 2cents worth: Don't make desicions based on emotions. Reportedly one of Dr. Harley's statements are that your emotions will lead you in the wrong direction 99.9% of the time. From experience, I found that this is true. The age difference may be a very positive thing. My X-wife is 35 and had an affair with a guy of 50. What attracted her to him was that he was a businessman, seemed so attentive, soft and attractive. She soon discovered that he was just surviving financially: dream no. 1 down the drain. Then the age difference started to bother: he will be an old man and she still young, etc. Their relationship finally fizzled out after a year.

All these discoveries of course drove me mad due to the humiliation and disrespect. I still do from time-to-time.

From your previous posts it seems to me as if there is a chance that your M might still be rescued. The age difference suggests that your WW's A might be an infatuation that will eventually fizzle out and probably already did. Now is the time to find out what went wrong, take a hard look at your marriage vows and ask yourself how you can support your WW. If after all your efforts, your M still doesn't work out, at least you earned your way out.

Best of luck!!

Thanks Recovereddad for your post. I am absolutely disgusted right now. I have been the driving force to save the marriage and I really don't believe it is worth doing it. I slept less than an hour again last night.

Midwest

I remain in Discovery but I thought I was in Recovery. My WW continued to lie to me up until this morning. My research shows OM was only 28 Years old. He just turned 29. My WW admitted it this morning but said she only found out his age after Christmas. More lies. I said the only thing she hasn't admitted too yet is having sex with him. She still says no sex. I have become indifferent to even wanting to believe her. I called the "boys" parents this morning asking them for assistance to help break the A. They blamed my wife for allowing it to happen and I had to agree. They said they would talk to him but they said he is an adult.

My oldest child is older than her BF. Disgusted beyond belief.

Midwest

MW -

You are going through a natural stage of emotions right now. I promise. They will pass with time. Do not make any rash decisions or statements right now. Please!

I have read over and over here how people do that in their most vulnerable states, and regret it later. With emotions running so high, it is hard to take those things back.

Have you gone to the doctor to get some meds? I highly recommend that. You will be better equipped to make sensible choices that you will not regret if you are able to sleep and eat.

Also, if you want some help from the vets here, post a new thread and call them out. They have such good advice. They are wise in these matters.

I am better as a cheerleader. It's alright! It's OK! We can do this! That doesn't really rhyme, but I have never actually been a cheerleader, so I am just winging it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Lots of love and support to you. Keep posting and venting and asking and posting. It just takes TIME.

Love, Amy

Thanks again Amy. I appreciate you taking the time to post. I do need some vets to guide me through this hell. I just talked to WW at her work and she continues to justify her lies. Absolutely NO remorse for anything she has done and she still blames me for my quest to dig up information on her and her loverboy, even though the information I am digging up proves she continues to lie to me. She calls me vengeful and I am doing it to just get even with her. That is her only reponse to her A and her lies.

Lost in the Midwest

Listen to Amy, she is right. More experts will come for advice. Look for Believer.

Dear Midwest101:

I am empathizing with you right now. I am so sorry for your situation. I am facing the same thing with my wife right now. She is a Christian, who knows right from wrong. However, she feels absolutely no remorse or regret for her actions.

Respectfully, don't consider letting her come back until she decides to commit to you and your marriage.

Unless there is full-proof evidence, you can be sure WS will lie about it. When I talked to my WS Monday, she lied about her contraceptive use until I presented solid evidence; only then did she admit it.

The "fog" will make them do awful things and say awful things. Remember, they must justify their actions and their lifestyle, so they will say almost anything - true or false - to support their actions. The trick is making sure you can withstand the words long enough to realize that WS will probably regret them at some future date.

Yes, I kissed butt royally for 9.5 months before moving out of the house on July 24, 2003. You're right. It does not work. You need to implement a plan of action that shows her you want the marriage but are more than ready to move on.

You are right. None of us have the answer for your specific situation, but don't lose hope. Yes, we love the people we made commitments and vows to. They have abandoned us, but it doesn't make it any easier. I can give you at least one answer that you will hear from just about everyone. You can only change yourself. You can only work on yourself. Our wives will be forced to pay the consequences for their actions. Anything conceived in deceit and in secret will not last anyway.

God bless.

Shaken

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Midwest101:
<strong> First post

She has No remorse at all. She almost signed a lease yesterday for 6 months. She said her A may be over with by then and she would consider coming back. She blames the A on me due to her now stated 20 years of a bad marriage. She has always been a strong Christian person with strong values.

I strongly suspect she had sex with him but she says she didn’t. She has lied to me about every facet of this affair so far and I am assuming she lying about the sex too.

I just don’t know if I have a chance for she seems to remain in the withdrawal stage. Very painful times right now. I want the marriage to work but I don’t think she does. I am 52 and she is 46. The OM is 32. This fog state is so thick and I am in hopes of seeing a little light before I break. I am on anti-depressant meds and I am kissing her butt royally but that is not working. Yesterday, I searched the Internet history and I found out she was pricing apartments and new furniture preparing her move so she could think things out. The only tears she has shed sinced D-Day is when I packed her clothes in garbage bags and told her to move out. Since she half-[censored] committed to stay, she is now unpacking all of her wrinkled clothes. Being caught didn't make her cry, having me cry didn't make her cry, hurting the children didn't make her cry but the wrinkled clothes did.

I have almost no hope and I feel desperate and remain in love with her. I know you all don’t have the answer but maybe writing this will help me. Thanks for reading. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">