Well I haven't been here for awhile.
My situation has only gotten worse.I just discovered a week ago that my H is making plans with someone else he met in his chat room.He has to go out of state to OH in June and he's made plans for her to meet him there.He's already bought her the plane ticket.I have no way of tracking money he makes or what he spends it on.He uses his bosses credit card sometimes and everything else is done with a cash card.I thought something wasn't right.For the past two weeks he's been PMing someone and vise-versa.I think he's known her for awhile.He doesn't know that I know all this.He's treating me "normal" and I'm bitting my toung.Another summer another A.I don't understand why.We get along so well.We never argue or fight.Why is he doing this again.I don't know if I should confront him with what I know or just keep my mouth shut and see what happens? If anyone can help, please I need some advice here.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by MAND:
Well I haven't been here for awhile.
My situation has only gotten worse.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Mand, I'm going to say this as kindly as I can. You're in a tough spot. You're married to a user who knows you will never stand up to him and boot his fanny to the curb. The 2nd Law of Thermodynamics applies here, as well as the definition of insanity.

The law of thermodynamics says that unless an object in motion is acted upon, it will slow down, and eventually die. All things degrade without care and attention.

The law of insanity says that doing the same things and expecting different results is nuts!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He doesn't know that I know all this.He's treating me "normal" and I'm bitting my toung.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">What would be different if he knew you know? He doesn't really care if you know. He reads you as a person who loves him so much that you will tolerate just about any kind of abuse to keep his royal highness around, even if it's just a season or two a year. You'll pay his way. You'll tolerate exposure to disease....

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I don't understand why.We get along so well.We never argue or fight.Why is he doing this again.I don't know if I should confront him with what I know or just keep my mouth shut and see what happens? If anyone can help, please I need some advice here.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Do you really get along all that well? If you do, then why are you afraid to confront? Why are you worried about protecting yourself? Why do you keep your mouth shut at such blatant disregard for your marriage???

Mand, I don't normally swing the 2x4, but I've been reading your posts for months and you still act so shocked that he doesn't give a rip about you.

He's using you. He loves the free rent. Free computer. Free sex. etc. He doesn't have to put out diddly to have his survival needs, so he's bored. A man who is a user, when he gets bored, goes looking for thrills, fun and risk. Hence the on-line relationships. He has no clue who he is really talking to until the big meeting. Big time anticipation and build-up so he does this to get his fix.

And he knows he can get away with it. Because, gee. It's just another summer affair. He'll be back.

We do actually get along so well that it is boring.Compared to a few months ago I've totally backed off.I don't ask questions,I act towards him that I don't care who he's chatting to.I've just been working on myself and what I need to do for me.I'm able to see him in a different light now.I'm still tunned into him as far as, I can always tell when he's talked to her just by the way he talks to me.When he calls me he's all stressed out and talking fast,but within 5 minutes of our conversation he calms down.That's how "keen" I've become at recognizing the "signs" of an A.I don't know if that's good or bad but it works for me.It makes me stronger in every respect.I'm not affraid of confronting my H about his plans.I'm just trying to figure out if it'll do any good,or if I'll just hear the same words I heard last summer.You know "I love you but I'm not in love with you".Those kinda lines.These past few months I've learned alot and realized alot about me.I'm a very strong person and if he were to tell me he was moving to be with her or she here I'd be fine with it.I'm at that point where I've lost the fight because I don't know who I'm fighting for.It was my mistake for trusting his words before and now I take what he says with a grain of salt even when he tells me he loves me.I've distanced myself from him,I don't call him anymore(he calls me).I've noticed that I don't even tell him I love him anymore unless he says it,then I respond.It's not something I'm doing dilibrately.I think it's just part of me letting go and not having any expectations of our relationship anymore. He made a comment the other day, that we should go camping over 4th July when he gets back from his trip. I don't even make plans to do things either.I guess before when I was trying and talking alot about what he was doing it took alot out of me.I can't be me with him.I'm loving and affectionate,like I used to bring him coffee while he was on his computer, hug him and kiss the back of his neck and walk away.I don't do that anymore(he told me he hated it).I used to rub his feet or back at night until he fell asleep.I don't do that either.It's hard I've had to change alot of things within myself.Am I protecting myself,OH YEA!It's not who I am and it's not who I want to be but it is who I am with him.I'm sorry I'm venting.He does have a job now though,well sort of.He's not on a payroll so I don't know his money situation.My gut feeling is he's putting money away for his trip and he's buying her things.That's another issue, I can't even talk to him about that, why? because I wouldn't believe him.He even lies to his boss who lives in VA.That's where he's going in June to VA and OH to deliver some equiptment to his boss.So I'm trying very hard to stay strong and take care of our children.Unfortunatly my oldest(16) knows whats going on.She heard him talking to OW one day.Well I have to go now.I can only post when I'm at work and I'm not supposed to be here today.Thank you for letting me vent.Thank you "Kay" for your support. God bless

I am so sorry to hear of your situation. My W had (maybe still having) and EA via email (might have had a PA aswell). I agree with the advice you have been given so far. What harm could from confronting him verusus the harm done if he turns this into a PA? Maybe it won't make him stop and think. But, then again, maybe it will. I don't see how you can lose. I confronted my W four months ago. Of course she denied it all (still in denial). But, she knows that I KNOW! We have been in counseling and trying to work things out. If I were you, I would definitely tell him what you know and what yoususpect. But, you must do it calmly and rationally. This a an important time for discussion not argument. Also, read the posts here and keep posting yourself. There are some very good people here from which to draw support and strength. My best wishes for you always.

I guess I'm just getting tired of being ignored and treat like I'm impossing.He can sit there and chat for hours and hours and maybe give me 15 minutes out of his day and our children.That's what's bothering me the most.He's not involved with us anymore.I just don't know how to get my husband back or if I ever will.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by MAND:
I guess I'm just getting tired of being ignored and treat like I'm impossing.He can sit there and chat for hours and hours and maybe give me 15 minutes out of his day and our children.That's what's bothering me the most.He's not involved with us anymore.I just don't know how to get my husband back or if I ever will.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Being needy, wanting him back even though he treats you like dirt or worse is not attractive.

By the time you are the woman who would attract him back to you, you will no longer want him.

Is that why you are afraid to work on yourself and how you see yourself? Because if you really saw how precious a woman you are, you'd see him differently - and that might mean you'd need to make some changes to your lifestyle?

Are you that dependent on a loser to make you feel worthwhile?

Actually I'm not a "needy" person at all.I don't depend on my H for anything or ask anything of him.I've learned to depend on myself for alot of things.Emotionally I'm definatly stronger now than I was a few years ago.You made a good point though Kay."do I need to be with a loser to make myself feel worthwhile". I've always taken care of people and put them first,even as a child I helped care for my grandparents.It seems in my H life there's always a crisis and I automatically come to the rescue. I can see that now and I'm really working hard to change within myself.Thank you for pointing this out.It gives me strength and encouragement.I kinda worry when he's being too nice,yesturday he stopped by my job and had lunch with me unexpectedly.But it doesn't matter anymore. I'm loosing hope and realizing more and more what and who I'm living with and I don't like it.Well thank you for your inspirational words.have to get back to work now....God bless

Mand,
You have dealt with the A before. This tine though you are more experienced and your reaction s/b different.

When contact was renewed after my WS came home, it became easier and easier for me to go to plan B. He was kicked out several times.

Each time he was sent out the door, his return had higher requirements. That was stated upon his initial return.

Living with family is a privilege not a right. WS don't have the right husbands and fathers do.

Now what I did when I felt and knew I had been betrayed but I didn't want to reveal my sources, I would let the WS know that something didn't 'smell right' and I didn't feel safe. I asked if the WS knew why things didn't seem right and put them on the seat to explain.

Instead of claiming to know why and then give instructions on how to 'fix it'. I raised questions and let the WS provide answers. Fog does strange things. Most WS trip up and it becomes evident much quicker. Also it tends to remove the BS from the hot seat since the WS will realize their little pretend with the family routine isn't as smooth as they thought it was.

I put my WS in a doubtful mood just to keep him wondering what I did know. I would continue to be wondering even sniffing the air at times if I suspected contact. You can let him know you don't feel safe or maybe his cell or other known communication devices that the OW and he maybe using have been getting hang up calls or something strange. If you don't have proof, becareful but if you know they are talking on the phone, then raising doubts between their communications can cause them to LB.

In my case, the OW did call my home, cell and work #s w/hangup calls. How many times I caught vs. how many times she actually did it vs. how many times I thought she did it varied. I used that variation to put doubt into the WS to let hin know that I did not feel safe.

Find a tool that works for you.

take care,
L.

Thank you Orchid. I am dealing with things alot different now.My attitude with him has totally changed too.I'm just trying to look-out for me and my children now.He's going to do what he's going to do.I don't even want to stop him and I'm treating him as such.I don't question his chatroom anymore,I leave him alone now,I don't show him that it's a concern to me anymore who he's talking too.There's alot I'm working on within myself and I like it.I still have my ups and downs but I don't let him see the down side.I'm dealing with the reality of things and I know I have choices too. Thank you for being here
God bless........

Still hanging in there.Just keeping my distance and not asking questions.H is being extremely nice to me all of a sudden. Don't know why.He still chats but I haven't noticed any little PM windows now.So I don't know what happened.I'm not going to even discuss it with him.I'm just trying to stay focused on me and my children right now.That's all I can do. God Bless...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by MAND:
<strong> Thank you Orchid. I am dealing with things alot different now.My attitude with him has totally changed too.I'm just trying to look-out for me and my children now.He's going to do what he's going to do.I don't even want to stop him and I'm treating him as such.I don't question his chatroom anymore,I leave him alone now,I don't show him that it's a concern to me anymore who he's talking too.There's alot I'm working on within myself and I like it.I still have my ups and downs but I don't let him see the down side.I'm dealing with the reality of things and I know I have choices too. Thank you for being here
God bless........ </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">MAND,

I am sorry for the pain this man is putting you through. My W has engaged in behavior almost identical to your H for almost a year now. Swears up and down that the EA is over and that we are fine, then every so often I find the new email or IM account or telephone calls, etc. I also have done essentially the same thing as you. I JUST KEEP 'FORGIVING' and trying to move on for the sake of the 'kids'. You know what? It's BS!!! We aren't doing it for the kids...we are doing it because we are hopelessly in love with these people despite the fact that they rip our insides out as easily as blinking. Much the same sa you I am moving on once again telling her I believe her commitment is real THIS TIME but what I can't help thinking is that she will just keep getting smarter and use more devious measures to keep from getting caught. The only thing that concerns me about your posts is how you say he is going to do what he is going to do and that's it. If he is or could be taking the chatting to the PA level, I would hope you are either not engaging in SF with him or using some method to protect yourself from STDs. If you have given up on him you should make that clear to him and make sure he understands what ALL of the ramifications are (no change on his part, continued affairs means NO nookie for him). I only say this out of concern for you. Best of luck to us both <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> maybe one day these people we live with will see the light and understand just for one second how much we truly love them and stop hurting us this way.

JP

Thank you JP.I think your right on when you say they only become wiser and more devious.There's another site you may want to look up,it's "Royce's Ralationship Resource".It may help you cope with what your going through right now. It has helped me tremendously.I'm sorry that you've been put in this situation along with your children.They are very much apart of the situation also.Tipical Friday night for me is.When I get home form work,H may or maynot be there.H comes home tells me to leave him alone (as he's grabbing the Jack Daniels" out of the cuboard)because he's going to be chatting with his friends and he walks away.So from 3:30pm to 1am he's chatting with whoever.What bothers me the most is that none of his "friends" know he's married.He's become quite a "player".Please JP look-up the site I told you about I hope it helps you.Hang in there.Try not to let the pain control you and the good person you are.God bless....

Thanks MAND. I will make a point of checking out that site. You know, ever since I found this place and started posting I have wondered to myself what drew me here? I am not a religious person at all (typical Catholic who went to catholic school, made all the sacraments and then forgot all of it on his 18th birthday when mom and dad stopped forcing it) and I realize most on here are very devout. But I digress...lol.... You could not be more right about it having an impact on the childeren. Last week we had to take our five year old daughter for a rather unpleasant medical exam becuase she suddenly started eating her hair! You may wonder what would cause a five year old to do this? STRESS, of course (duhh). She senses that something is not right in the house and probably blames herself for it. My other child, a three year old boy, is pretty isolated from it due to his age. I guess the grass IS really always greener because as horrible as what your husband is doing is I wish my wife would do that many times as opposed to what she does. She tells me everything is OK and the we are working toward recovery and that she loves me and me alone. Then while she is at work, or sneaking off to a friends house she sends the OM emails telling him how sad she is without him and how there is a void in her life that noone can ever fill, including ME even though I am 'trying'. To be spoken of with such disregard when to my face she tells me I am the only one for her is just sooooo frustrating. The hardest time I have had is just getting her to admit that there even is a problem! Does your HB deny that he is back IMing OW? If he does you should get one of the tracking software programs and let it run a day or two (or however long you can hold out once you see the things he is saying) so you can show it to him and make him see the hurtful things he is saying. In my wife's case, that is what has been required in each case. Some WS just will NEVER admit what they are doing until they are confronted with cold hard evidence.
Good luck to us both in our quest for the simple truth (I never thought that would be something I would have to even give a second thought to with my wife.

MAND
Do you know the address for that web site? I did a search but could not seem to find it.
Thanks.

Hi JP
This is the address of the site I told you about http://rrr.kimcm.dk/
If you have any probelms let me know.There's forums you can post in.I'm in "stop your divorce..save your marriage"in that forum my name is "eloquent".
I'm sorry to hear about your daughters condition.Stress shows it's self in strange ways.Maybe you can sit down and talk to her on her level to reasure her(if you haven't already).It's amazing how children, so inocent can see so much.I'm not a "bible thumper" either but I do have my beliefs and faith in my own way.I have three daughters,9,11 and 16.So they are very much aware of what's going on and I talk to them every now and then just to touch base and see where their heads are at.My youngest is deeply hurt but my other two want him gone.How sad.My 16yr old calls him the "player".I never thought my children would ever think of their dad that way.Hopefully your children will see your W in a different light before they start growing resentment towards her.What's your W's screen name?Maybe she's talking to my H. HA! HA! I'm sorry..Other people have asked me the same thing.
Well JP good luck finding the site.I'll try to see if theres other names,if so I'll let you know.
sincerely....Mand

Well yesturday when my H got home from work,I could tell he was in a weired mood again.Very tence.Within an hour he refered to me as "weired", and "strange".Usually when this happens he's talked to OW.He's now going to VA,OH and MD in June and he's driving from CO and as he put it he can take his time,no need to rush back but he wants to be back by July 4th so we can go camping.He leaves June 16th.So I expect him to be gone for 3-4 weeks.How sad it makes me feel.He's so excited about the whole road trip and not a care about what me and the children are going to do while he's gone.I guess that's the last thing I should expect.Of corse he's taking his laptop most hotels have internet access now so he can still chat.Well gotta go...Thanks for being here

Well another Friday.I know what H is doing tonight.Drinking and chatting.He's already told me.
Well everyone have a nice weekend....

MAND,

IMO it is IMPERATIVE that you place tracking software on that Laptop before he leaves the house. If you would like help let me know and we can talk off-line about it. Keep your head up and try to be strong.
JP

Hi JP thanks for the info.I don't think I could install the software. For one I don't have the money to buy the software I would need to do that, and he has it running but its running the chat room he hosts.I don't know his security codes to get into either of his computers,his laptop or his PC.He even has his chat room running where he's working at(but he's not on a payroll or gets a regular paycheck).I don't know how I would even install any software on his machines without him knowing somethings happening.I'd be too parinoid in case he would detect something.He's constantly formatting his machines or doing something to them.Thank you though for the thought. Things haven't changed he's getting more psyched about his trip..My concern now is he keeps buying little things for his car off of e-bay when we don't have the money.We had to pay the morgage of 1000.00 last week.200.00 of it came from him the rest was my paycheck and even then he complained because he was going to buy rims for his car with the 200.00.
He's already won the bid so he has to pay for them now.????I'm hanging in there that's all I can say

MAND,

You sound like you are unhappy with your current situation, and no surprise.

1. What is your idea of an ideal marriage?
2. Do you think you can have that M with your H and are you willing to do the work to get it?
3. What are you willing to accept in your current M (how much less than your ideal)?

If you are willing to accept your H's chat rooms and running around, then you don't really want any advice from the people here.

If you are NOT willing to accept his behavior, then you need to let him know, do a Plan A, and give him a timeframe of when you expect him to get with the program or you're leaving.

Granted, I generally hang out on GQII and so am only responding to what I've seen you say recently, but it seems to me that you're willing to say how miserable things are but not willing to do anything about it. Why are you wondering if saying something will help or not? NOT saying something is guaranteed to NOT help. Either you're willing to accept what you have or you're not. If you're not, you either work on it or you leave. It's clearcut logic.