True-- I did the SAME thing with his mom... but his mom hates me with a passion- and she told him it was ok and that if I was a better wife he would never feel the need to go outside the marriage- CAN YOU BELIEVE????????????????????????????????????? Yes, I am so serious she said that. That is a whole issue within itself. I can't get into it now- that's another thread! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Anyhow- True- I have to agree with 2 on this one- give him a LITTLE slack... but I am still not ok with his evasiveness.(did I spell that right?) I am trying so hard to think of the best advice to give you- and I am a little lost but how about this... So if he didn't write it, how does it make you feel? And what if he did write it- how does that make you feel? Try to think of YOUR feelings- and try to think if you NEVER know-- how will you feel? And why is it in your home if he did not write it? I also think 2 has an idea- why don't you ask her? Have you ever talked with her? Do you think you could?

Sorry I seem so worthless... I will not be on here much tomorrow I have to work 7am-7pm... so I'm trying to get all my advice in now! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I sent everyone (except Rocked) and email...

HUGZ------ holley

2... the email I sent you was bounced back... I just copied and pasted it how you typed it- wonder why I can't email you... send me an email and I will save your address that way.

Hey Dog! I'm trying to figure it out. Got to go for now. Have a great night!

Good morning all! Hope your night was well. Rocked, I hope you Rocked! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Everyone else, thanks for the advice last night.

Dog, I can't believe his mom said it was ok. Sorry to hear that.

Good Morning Everyone!
I have a bad feeling today.
Don't know if it's just me, the weather, or some unknown force is coming my way.
My H is to arrive home from work in another hour and I'm afraid he's going to tell me upsetting.
After my emails and his calls to me yesterday, he was very quiet...you know, that scary quiet.
And he usually replies to an email, but yesterday he didn't.
I asked again about NC. We had a strange phone # on his cell on xmas day that he didn't want to answer because he didn't know the area code...strange...I thought...just pick it up! He didn't want to touch that phone.
Maybe he has more to tell me, but my greatest fear (silly me) is that he will tell me he doesn't want to work on us anymore (my fear everyday). Love really does "suck".
My daughter woke up this morning with a bad dream (our children, only one lives at home, don't know any of this as we have been on good, outside appearances on the most part, working with Plan A constantly.). She told me her dream was about our up and coming anniversary (30th) and that I was crying (to make this short) and that I was upset with her Dad.
Oh my.
Well, I wish you all a great Friday. Wish me luck!

Holiday,
So sorry to hear about your anxiety. I know how that is. I am constantly waiting for my H to tell me something new, or that he has still contacted her throughout, or that he is sick of listening to me not trusting him(like today). Today is his last day at his old job, where the OW is, and I am so afraid that he will talk to her. He told me yesterday that part of him wanted to contact her because she was such a good friend to him throughout most of this time. I told him earlier to think of her as a life threatening illness and run like *ell. I can't beleive he would even want to tell the person who helped destroy me goodbye, but at the same time, I am so happy that he is finally opening up to me, again.
I hope that what your H talks to you about is not what you fear, and remember if he tells you something negative, about talking to her again, he IS telling you the truth now. Just be firm, and do the Pan A thing that people talk about. For me, that contact thing was a breaking point, but I have read other people's post that are much different from me.
Be strong, and my prayers will be with you.

Rocked is in the house. Been catching up on all the posts. Dang, you ladies know how to talk when I'm away. HA.

Anyone want to know how it went when I surprised my W at the door last night? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Rocked, I've been holding my breath! Did you Rock or what?? Hope all went well, if you know what I mean <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> I know you can't give us all the details, but maybe you can give us some good advice to tell our Hs.

<small>[ January 07, 2005, 10:09 AM: Message edited by: truetoself ]</small>

Aint no telling needed. Be direct and show him a thing or 2! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Gonna hold you in suspense until I hear from some of the others. I don't want to have to type the detailed intructions out more than once. HAHAHAHAHAHA!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Detailed instructions? Wow, you must have been naughty! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> I guess I will have to wait, then.
Glad to hear your night was super.

Okay True, I can't wait for the others. They'll have to read about it when they get online.

I was feeling low yesterday and had no desire to be S (sexual). But something changed when I was reading our grp's posts. In fact, in a strange way, 2's decision to "do nothing" for her H triggered a desire in me to DO something for my W. I had shared with you all that for the past 2 days I tried to be S with my wife only to end up unable to bring closure (get it?). So...in an effort to make her feel #1 in my life and to alleviate our worry about the blanks I had been shootin', when she walked thru the front door I gave her a long bearhug and kiss, then without words took her by the hand and led her straight to the bedroom and proceeded to (that's all I say here).

Here's what I learned from that experience - I'm calling it the LAW OF OPPOSITES. My "feelings" were influencing me to remain distant, but my "mind" convinced me to do the opposite. Result=What I wanted all along. Lesson: if we follow our feelings we end up with what we DON'T want (E+P separation). If we 'choose to act' opposite of our feelings we end up with what we DO want (E+P intimacy).

The old saying is true...what we THINK determines what we DO, and what we do determines how we FEEL. You want to feel the right way about your spouse? Then DO the right thing in spite of your feelings. After all the greatest love (Agape) is not a feeling, it's a commitment.

Sorry so long.

OK, Rocked I'm here! Is that enough?

As the only man in our small grp I have a question to you who espoused yesterday as to how good you were/are in bed. How do you know you are good? H tell you? You read his body language? You guessing?

Rocked, OK first let me say, you are a great inspiration to us all who are struggling to "look forward". Second, I'm glad the Do before you FEEL adviced helped! Keep at it!
Third, and here is one of the reason for the pre-A marriage that I am trying to work on, so bear with me, Where were your kids? I wish I could just "take" my H when he gets home, but what do I do with my kids? Practical True, will you ever go away? That's one of things my H said the OW had that I don't. She was wild and spontaneous, where I am logical and down to earth.
Again, I'm glad things turned out well. In all aspects! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Did everyone's email addresses work? Just for the record mine is swansong541@yahoo.com.

OK, Rocked I'm here! Is that enough?

True thought about you a lot last night and the letter and wanted to tell you one other thing.

It doesn't really matter who wrote the letter. Let's say worst case scenerio, it was your husband. Those "feelings" he discribes in the letter are fake. Let me explain what I have learned and my husband has shared with me.

The OW was a employee and friend. Then for a variety of reason which are really irrelevant for now, started sleeping together. After about 2 months for him, but it could be 2 times for someone else, the guilt set in BIG TIME and he needed to justify what he was doing. So to put it his way " I started believing that I had feelings for her (So I could justify treating a friend like a whore...screwing her in his truck at lunch) and then start to believe that I (the spouse) wasn't doing my job. So there is the justification that allows it to happen and go on.

As my husband says, the feelings are fake, because they are based on a fantasy relationship. There is no "real" love there. He loved how she made him feel, but he realizes he didn't love her. That doesn't mean I failed either. It means that HIS esteem and happiness that needed to come from within wasn't, so he allowed a whore to meet those thinking that it would make everything better. Of course it was worse and after about 3 months of "blissful love" he started to see her in all her faults (many) and then started thinking "What the hell am I doing here". He said he spent the next 3-4 months trying to bow out graciously, but she was in too deep at that time and it wasn't easy to break it off. Remember he did end it before I found out.

Anyway, you know sometimes I feel bad for her. I talked to her on D-day and she was pretty devestated over the break up. I really do feel bad for her too. Am I strange?

2,
Thanks for what you are saying. I will bring that up with my H. He says he felt he started getting feelings for her because he now shared a bnd with her that he could not share with anyone else, especially his best friend, me. I do think he was trying to justify some of it, but remember he begged her not to end it. He thought he only had one more month before we moved, and wanted to continue to have the sex, but even after that ended they still talked. He REALLY was good friends with her. That's what hurts so bad. As for the letter, I did decided to forget it, and I am glad that I deleted it when I first found it, because now I cannot go back and read it and torture myself any further.
Rocked, as for being good in bed, I don't really think I am, but I would guess that most men like women who experiment with new things and in that repesct I am good! I know that the fact that my husband has told me so is not a good indicator. Heck, he told the OW she was good, and there are things about their A that I won't share on the board, but would make you think it wasn't that great.

2...not strange, a person with compassion!
Bless you!
Talk to you guys later today...
H is still kinda quiet. Still trying to make me not worry. Still here to work out things with me...
Right now he's downstairs making me breakfast. I wish I just didn't love him so much!! Would be easy to do all this...

Holiday,
One day at a time. Keep praying for him and yourself. Decide to act in the right way and see what happens.