Hi,l just wanted to pose the question of how do you know if it is worth fighting for your relationship or if it is better to accept it is over....from the religious angle people are taught to fight to rebuild their relationships but what if the other partner is no longer interested in continuing...isn't it better for your own sanity then to "protect" yourself and start to rebuild your own life? and how do you tell?

I guess I was somewhat lucky. My wifes A ended a natural death. She left me due to guilt in September 6th, 2004 just after she broke it off with the OM. She moved back to work on the M and then due to continued guilt she told me about the A on Christmas 2004. By that time she had come out of her fog...

When she told me about the A, I knew right away that or marriage was worth saving. Before D-Day I fell in love with her again and our marriage was great.

I know if i didn't truly beieve that she was sorry for what she did and would never do it again I would not of even tried. So I think some people just know.

<small>[ February 15, 2005, 12:16 PM: Message edited by: Hemidart ]</small>

Susan,

I am truly ashamed to admit that I have been on both sides of the fence. I was the WS in my first M. There was no hope for R there, because I didn't love my first H. That M was totally dead before the A. This time, I am the BS and my FWH does love me, very much. His A did die naturally, for him, but not for the OW. She would not let go, wouldn't let him out gracefully. It got ugly. Even though this is the hardest, most painful thing I have ever been through, I still love my FWH and want so badly for us to stay together. He wants the same thing. If he didn't, I would let him go and try to wish him well.

Susan, you don't say how long you've been married of if you have children. But to answer your question of how do you know?; you just know. What was your first reaction to H's A? When did you discover the A? You have a surprisingly detached view of this in my opinion. Almost like you could flip a coin to decide what you want to do.

Pardon me for being a bit harsh, but when you got M'd wasn't it for life? Don't you owe it to your H and yourself to make every single effort to make it work REGARDLESS of what H does? Please give us more information on how you got to this unfortunate place.

I definitely agree that you'll just know if the relationship is worth fighting for. My H had a fling in which I think I caught it early enough. He has admitted that it went so far as kissing. They started out carpooling together. He has major issues with hurting peoples feelings (except mine for some reason).

I thought my whole life was falling apart before my very eyes and really took into consideration what options I could have. I never doubted that he loved me...he has a lot of unresolved issues from the past and the present.

We have started therapy to try to rebuild a new foundation. We also attending ACOA meetings since we both come from families with quite a bit of substance abuse. I believe he's serious about changing the course of our R because for the first time he isn't lying to me about things and he even took the first steps into this whole world of therapy.

We have been together for almost eleven years and married for almost three. I got married to him because I decided that he was indeed my soul mate and was ready to be with him for life. Obstacles come in all shapes and sizes...only you can decide if you're able to climb over them.
Time will tell all! You have to trust but also watch your back and be aware of things.
Good Luck!

I totally disagree with the other posters. I don't think you "just know". I think you just make a choice to stay.
You know what, I still love my H, I have 3 beautiful children who I do not want to scar with divorce, and I did make a vow before God to stay with my H through good times and bad, but I still don't know if it is the right thing or even worth fighting for. I question everyday if I should just leave. I ask everyday is love enough and is marriage to this man worth the pain in my heart? Don't let these poeple fool you. You WILL question, which I think is normal. Like I said, it comes down to a choice. You need to choose if you WANT to fight.

Thanks for your responses......l am coming at this from the opposite angle in many ways...very happily married to my 2nd husband and true partner who l met whilst both of us were married to others,we each left our marriages and have now been together 6 yrs and married for 2.5 yrs,the reason l asked the question is an interest in human behaviour /psychology......we both left our former relationships with no great sense of guilt but also not wishing to cause our ex's more pain than necessary,we had each been in marriages we recognised as being only 50% of what they should and could be and when you realise you have 100% with someone you follow that...in out cases there was no point in mediation etc. as neither of us had any desire to try again with our ex's but whereas after an intense conversation with my ex meant he understood this and we moved on to dealing with our divorce and sons care amicably, we couldn't seem to achieve the same thing with my husbands ex which ultimately caused her more pain than was needed and a very bitter divorce with access problems etc. to his baby daughter......my belief was that l felt l like many here have stated would "just know" if my marriage was worth fighting for if l had been in that situation but l was not aware of any mixed signals we had sent out to hubbys ex. to cause her to believe their was anything left worth fighting for.......my mother spent over 30 years fighting to get my father back from his now 25yr marriage to my stepmum so l wonder if it is a male/female thing...
Sue

Thanks for your responses......l am coming at this from the opposite angle in many ways...very happily married to my 2nd husband and true partner who l met whilst both of us were married to others,we each left our marriages and have now been together 6 yrs and married for 2.5 yrs,the reason l asked the question is an interest in human behaviour /psychology......we both left our former relationships with no great sense of guilt but also not wishing to cause our ex's more pain than necessary,we had each been in marriages we recognised as being only 50% of what they should and could be and when you realise you have 100% with someone you follow that...in out cases there was no point in mediation etc. as neither of us had any desire to try again with our ex's but whereas after an intense conversation with my ex meant he understood this and we moved on to dealing with our divorce and sons care amicably, we couldn't seem to achieve the same thing with my husbands ex which ultimately caused her more pain than was needed and a very bitter divorce with access problems etc. to his baby daughter......my belief was that l felt l like many here have stated would "just know" if my marriage was worth fighting for if l had been in that situation but l was not aware of any mixed signals we had sent out to hubbys ex. to cause her to believe their was anything left worth fighting for.......my mother spent over 30 years fighting to get my father back from his now 25yr marriage to my stepmum so l wonder if it is a male/female thing...
Sue

So your current marriage started as an affair. That is not good for the predictive future of your marriage. Less than 3 % of marriages that start as affairs survive. That said, I believe that it is a choice to stay married. There are ups and downs, but you need to have realistic expectations that the chemical excitment is going to wear down. Is he a serial cheater? Was your affair his first? He may be looking for the chemical rush, which is unrealistic. Does he want to work on the marriage? If he does, MB is a great place. I think that if you both work at it, you have a great chance of beating the stats, but you both have to make that choice. You need to break the pattern that started this relationship, that is- he is going on to the next OW and would likely stay with her if you threw him out. IF you can work on both of your ENs, then I believe you would have a great chance of success.

<small>[ February 16, 2005, 07:59 AM: Message edited by: new jersey ]</small>

Thank you for your concern but we are more than happy now....its true that we started off as an "affair" as we were both married but we do not consider it as an "affair" as much as finding true love,neither of us had affairs or even thought of it before we met and neither of us would dream of it now so l have no qualms whatsoever that he would stray not him about me.....my concern was about how people can genuinely help themselves when it comes to the major decisions in life........if like us ttrying to repair the marriage was not even a consideration how do you get it across to an ex partner when they do not want to accept it.....Sue

There is that crazy line from the movie Moonstruck...do ya love him. That is part of it. For me, I loved my H enough to forgive, everyone makes mistakes, and this society is full of sex. Even Clinton.

I am very old school, when I married, I really meant for better or worse. I have children, I would also put their happiness before mine. Luckily I do still love their father, but even if I didn't, I would still stay married. Our culture, IMHO, has become too me oriented. Sometimes there is a greater good.

I cannot go into detail about how my life has changed since his affair, but I will say that my family is thriving. My children have excelled beyond belief and I believe it is because they have a full time dad at their side and a mom who is now 100% committed to them (I quit my job when he had his affair-we had no we time).

Life can be great even after an affair. Our marriage is better, more mature. I think you just choose to stay and make it work. We're all happy. Could we both have found other people and been happy? Sure,but together we are powerful. There was a study published that stated that men who stayed with their spouce after an affair were just as happy or happier than those who left.

I am somewhat amazed by this post. The casualness of your approach to M amazes me. Would you tell someone who lost a child that they should accept it and get over it. If your H's ex-wife is having a difficult time accepting her fate perhaps she was under the misguided illusion that marriage is for life.

For truetoself, you would suggest that Susan's husband's ex is simply choosing to be miserable? Or Susan's mother chose to be miserable for 25 years while she tried to extricate him from his affair partner? Doesn't love enter into it?

WOE

I was once told that life is better with a little more friendship and a little less passion.

Jersey, I'm with you. I also have 3 kids who are thriving and our staying together has a lot to do with that. We have had our share of bad times but I have never once considered leaving.

WOE

Susan,

I'm curious as to why you would post this question on this particular forum?

In answer to your question, though, I agree that you don't just know. It is definitely a choice. Before I found out about my H's affair, I knew there was more to what was going on than just what he was telling me. Despite that, I made the choice that I wasn't going to give up. I loved my H (I still do) and I felt strongly that despite whatever problems we may have, it wasn't worth giving up just then. I made the choice to listen to what was in my heart. There were a few times that I felt like giving up. But I made the choice to keep going. Had I done what he said he wanted, we'd be divorced, and he'd be in no relationship at all, away from his kids, and without the one person who was willing to see him through the good and the bad.

See, despite his A partner telling him she understood and wanted to be there for him through it all, she was pushy and ignored things he said he wanted in favor of her own wants. Oh, and I almost forgot, she completely forgot that he was a father when making plans for father's day. So much for understanding him. She obviuosly didn't understand what it meant to him to be a father.

For your own circumstances, I'd recommend reading His Needs, Her Needs. You said:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">...neither of us had affairs or even thought of it before we met and neither of us would dream of it now so l have no qualms whatsoever that he would stray not him about me..... </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I'd be willing to bet that both your H and your H's ex-W thought this exact same thing prior to your A. I'm not trying to be judgmental and I know it's coming off that way. So I apologise for the tone. This is why I recommend the book I mentioned. If you're right and you have a terrific relationship with your H, then this book can only make it that much better. If you are having any problems, even some you are unaware of, this book can save your M before it becomes unsaveable.

Only being married for 2 1/2 years, it can be assumed that you are still in the honeymoon phase of your marriage. (Contratulations, btw, on your M.) It sounds as though you are living in a bubble, though, thinking that neither of you will ever indulge in another A again. Both of your first marriages were vulnerable to As in the first place because your respective first spouses thought that both of you would never have an A and so they didn't take the precautions necessary to protect their marrieges. Even if the precautions were merely meeting your ENs as they needed to be met.

Susan--I know I'm being harsh here. I really want your marriage to stay safe. But, you need to wake up to the fact that EVERY person can indulge in an A under the right circumstances. The first of those circumstances is to believe that your spouse will NEVER do that. Yours already did once, with you.

I cannot tell you how many times I have heard of second wives actually calling the first wife to ask them how it is their husband can ever "do this to them" when the second wife knew the husband was capable of it since that is how the second marriage got started to begin with. Did that make sense?

Okay, I'm done with the 2x4. I look forward to hearing from you.

One more thing. Just Found Out is a very fragile forum filled with the pain of people of, as the name implies, just found out about their spouses infidelity. Please consider posting any future questions in General Questions II or, if the questions are like this one, in Recovery. You will probably get less emotional responses. You will certainly get responses from people who have been at this longer and so know what really works.

Edited to Add:

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WOE,

I don't think Truetoself was suggesting anything of the sort. I think she meant that the BS, when they first find out about the A, make choices and then act on them. As for Susan's H's ex-wife, or Susan's mother. Both of them are/were dealing with men who subsequently married other women. It doesn't matter what role those women played in the end of the marriage. Once their H's remarried, the ex-W's needed to get on with their own life. To the extent that they didn't and they continued in their efforts to go after married men (even if they were married to them first), they did, in fact, choose to be miserable.

The A's in both of those relationships were wrong. But Susan's husband's ex-W's behavior in now trying to split up Susan and Susan's H is equally wrong. The ex-W certainly doesn't have to wish Susan and Susan's H, well. But she does need to get on with her life. Making the H's s life hard now, and interfering in his relationship with his daughter is really no better than the A that started it all.

<small>[ February 17, 2005, 07:40 PM: Message edited by: Floppy ]</small>

Floppy, you make some excellent points. You have made me understand that marriage is a marriage regardless of it's origin and therefore deserves the same respect that is afforded all marriages. So I agree that the ex does need to move on for their own good as well as for the new union. I take back my comments to Susan in that regard.

You also made me think about something that seems to be a little bit more consistent than I realized. And that is that woman seem to make a choice to stay whereas men just jump into survival mode and really don't make a conscious decision to stay or go. Perhaps I'm off on this but it seems to a theme around here.

WOE

Just a short comment from me,having an affair is a dealbreaker.If there are no kids ,get out.If there are, then try sort things out if you feel that there is a chance.

Me, no kids, as hard as it is, im walking away.

Elegant, you have underscored my point that this is a decision as opposed to a gut reaction. I am 3 years past d-day and can tell you I never once considered leaving. Yes, I have children but I don't think that ever consciously entered into it. I just seemed to immediately go into survival mode. At least that was my first reaction. Once it was clear that W wasn't leaving and the A was dying a natural death I suppose I was able to look at things a little more objectively. But woman seem to go into decision mode right away.

Let me ask you something. You say an A is a dealbreaker. But have you even been on either side of one?

Woe, to answer your question....Known her for 5 years,got married last year in april,found out in november that she was having an A with someone that she works with.7 months of marriage,WTF.I really do appreciate your point and maybe im just a bit cynical under my present circumstances(i.e.very recent and the wound is still open).

She is still with that guy and we havent communicated for two months.So chances are, reconciliation is not an option.Even so,if we did get back together,every time she finishes a phonecall...who was that, every time she works late.....why?.Trust is totally gone,where to from here?EW

EW, ok now we're onto something. At this point I honestly don't think you can make this decision yet. The wound is very fresh. But if you're not speaking and she's still with OM you are moving in a certain direction. Your feelings for your new wife will start to fade if you and her don't start making some positive steps.

You have certainly come to the right place. Probably you're not going to get much of a concensus to leave the marriage. After all this is Marriage Builders and I suppose you came here with some hope. I would suggest you open your own thread in the GQII forum here and put your story out there with as much detail as you are comfortable providing. You will get some excellent advice and proven methods that may help you reach the desired goal.

But you need to find a way to end the A and have her change jobs if there is any hope to heal your marriage. You made it here so please take the plunge and get into some active dialogue with the wealth of members here. Even if you're not ready to post your story at least keep reading. You will find more than one story that mirrors your own. Hang in there it does get better. If you want to just hang around this thread I'll respond but as you know there is not much traffic here like GQII.

WOE