I found out Feb.22,2005 that my husband was having an affair. I had had my suspicions after finding the phone bill for January. He bought us all new phones for Christmas (my, my two teens, himself..) and apparently his "girlfriend". I opened the bill to check and see how our youngest was budgeting his phone hours and noticed that my husband's number wasn't listed. Got me going.....went searching and sure enough, he had a seperate bill with "their" numbers on it. Confronted him and he totally confessed. The phone calling had been going on in the Fall some, but went full-throttle once they got the phones. They started meeting in deserted alleys and making out and there was heavy fondling going on. I thank God for prompting me when he did, and while there is that small doubt that maybe there was more,,, the pieces do fit. I always thought that I would kick his a** out of the house if ever in this position, but here I am working on working it out. He wants us to work out, too, and there has been complete separation from each other. They do not love each other, they both say. And the OW wants her family to stay intact. SO here I am.....things are surely different, lots of communication going on, much better than before. Our marriage had been in a sad state for many years. He has always berated me for my body and that has been the ONE thing that I am lacking to him. I was the homecoming queen, "best figure" girl in high school. Over the years I have struggled with the extra weight, but am still a reasonable weight, but not "Perfect". I have felt that I have never measured up to his desire for me and he has admittedly agreed that he had witheld emotionally and affectionatly from me for YEARS. I have filled my days and years with much activity and volunteering, which is where I get my "strokes". We are reading His Needs/Her Needs and I have apologized for not always meeting hie need for an attractive mate, but I am just soooo scared that things will not change and that my needs will not be met. I see him trying in his feeble way, but I AM SOOO NEEDY RIGHT NOW!!!!! My world has been destroyed and I need to process through all my feelings about his affair. He thinks it is just making things worse to keep bringing up stuff. I have made it very clear to him that it is what I need for my healing. I guess I just see this going on forever and that at some point he will have had enough. Then I get resentful that I am even worrying about his (*&^% feelings when I need to take care of myself for once. I have been on a personal betterment plan since December and am about halfway to my weight loss/ fitness goals, but I am seeing that his issues are going to be much harder to implement and just start to worry that we won't make it. I am committed to do the work, but I cannot be the pursue-er in my frame of mind. I have nothing to give right now. HELP ME SOMEONNE......I know this is sooo long, but I am so desperate for some help. How long will I feel like this? How long will I feel the need to talk about "them"? I do feel like I am getting past some stuff. I read a post on here that said, "I think the reason it is so hard for us to let go in a case like this is that we believe that if we do, our spouse has gotten away with something". I really can identify with that statement. I have handled myself in a classy. Godly way for the most part. I have even talked to the OW, who was repentant. I feel like they have gotten off easy and frankly, that pisses me off. PLEASE anyone....! I need your help.....

IHSB

I am so sorry you had to find your way here. I can't tell you how long it will take you and your H to recover from this. I can tell you it is possible to not only recover but have a better marriage then before this happened.

The first thing you should do is order or go to the library and get two books. "His Needs Her Needs and Love Busters" While your waiting on those books look at the articals on this web page. Read about Plan A. Your H seems to want to work this out so plan A will be a good starting point. It will take allot of love on your part to bring this all back together.

When you have a specific question start a thread and many will reply. The General Questions II page is more active and it will get more responces. When you need to vent come here insted of letting it out on your H or kids.

Give it a little time and some of the more experianced people will be here for you. My prayers go out to you and your entire family.

RHM

IHSB,

It takes time to heal the pain and hurt that a WS causes. My w and I are in the recovery stage from her A but I still feel pain and a lack of trust on occasions.

One thing that helps is taking an anti-depressent or in my case, an herbal remedy called SAM-e. It helps stablize your mood and improves judgement, etc. If you are not doing so already, consider doing this.

They talk about the "fog" when an A is going on and for the time after it ends. It seems like your H may still have some fog. I know that when I first found out about A, I cried on the shoulder of a friend of ours and confronted OM. My w's attitude was that I had betrayed her in doing those things.

I have found plan A to be very helpful though sometimes draining. It worked for my W and I and I continue with it because the changes I have made are good for me and good for our marriage.

Vaya con dios.
GVS

RMH, thank you so much for your reply. We are reading His Needs/Her Needs right now together as we lay in bed at night. I feel optimistic at times then other times I feel like saying "screw it!!!!" I have two people in my life that know and are a support to me, as does my husband. Because we have chosen reconciliation, we felt that at least while we were working things out, the less people that know, the better. Plus, I don't want my kids to have to deal with all this right now. They do know that mom and dad are going through a difficult time and that we are working on things. I don't know if this is the right strategy or not....part of me wants EVERYONE to know what he has done.....it seems like he is not having to pay much of a price. Maybe that is my thing I will have to deal with. Anyway, I thank you and just "venting" does help sooooo much! God Bless!

IHSB

There will be many days that you will want to kick him to the curb. Then a little later you will want to hug him. This is very draining. It's also very natural. I hope you have decided to go to a MC. That is very important. A IC just for you might not be a bad idea also. I'm happy for you that your H has came around this far and I hope he continues to do so.

You might want to start a diary to write down some of your flustrations so that you don't take it out on your H. Yes you will feel he deserves it and yes he does but it won't heal the marriage and even drive a wedge into it. Not fare right? I no but that is how it is. As long as he promices to NC with the OW and sticks to it then keep plugging along to build the marriage of your dreams. Best wishes

RHM

GVS, thank you for your imput. It has been almost three weeks for me and yesterday was the first day I haven't shed any tears. Does that seem like I am in denial or anything? It seems like some days are better than others, but I wake up every morning and it is the first thing I think of. I feel like I want some manual that tells me when to expect the feelings to lighten or when I should stop bringing the "A" up to my husband. I have exhausted most of the topics about it and have asked most of the questions I want to. He seems to think it is just making things harder when I want to talk about it, but too bad. I told him I will ask what I need to ask. But I do not want to overdo it and wonder if there is a point when I am doing more harm than good when I want to talk about it. HAve any of you experienced that feeling? Boy, I sure do appreciate having this place to ask my horribly sad questions. Thank you to all and bless you.

Three weeks is really early. Recovery generally takes 18 months to two years. You are heading in the right direction. The tears will continue to flow, but less often. Keep reading here, and asking for support. One person who SHOULD know is the OW's husband. I hope you find the following quote helpful. </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> You can recover. Many people have. It isn't easy, and not everyone succeeds, but as long as you are both working on it, your chances are close to 100%. Do three things:

1.) Learn. The most important and helpful single source of information for my wife and I was "Surviving an Affair" by Willard Harley (hereinafter referred to as "SAA") available at the Bookstore, Amazon.com, and bookstores all over. SAA is THE best book on the market for helping one get to the root of "the message of the affair" (BUT YOU HAVE TO DO THE QUESTIONAIRES!). It (along with the Basic Concepts section of this site) is also helpful for giving you a vision of what a great marriage should look like. The approach of SAA to this problem is that the best defense against affairs is to have a great marriage. My wife said we had a good marriage, but she still had an affair. She was kidding herself, but it was not until we read SAA and saw what a great marriage should look like that we could clearly identify the problem areas and had the tools necessary to fix them. So that you can get started right away, while waiting for SAA to arrive in the mail, read everything in the Basic Concepts section of this site. Next, read all the Q&A's on infidelity on this site. They are found at How to Survive Infidelity

The phrase "the message of the affair" is from the book "Torn Asunder", by Carder (hereinafter referred to as "TA"). I personally think this is the best book on affair recovery we have read. In particular it deals with the two different paths the recovery of the betrayed spouse (BS) and the wayward spouse (WS) need to take, and deals w/ remorse in a way that I prefer to SAA. Read it together, if your spouse is willing. If not, go through it yourself. If you or your spouse has issues with control, you might also want to read "The State of Affairs", (SOA) by Todd Mulliken, which also treats the remorse issue similarly to TA. SOA also deals with "the vision thing" for marriage, which is neglected in SAA.

2.) See a marriage counselor. This is hard. You need help. These boards are populated by amateurs. MC?s are professionals. There is a difference. They can help deal with issues the books don't cover, and customize things to your individual situation. That said, there are lots of bad MC's in the world. Read, and take to heart, How To Find A Good Marriage Counselor. You do not want an MC that is going to teach you how to live with an awful spouse, or how to adjust to divorce. Too many of them do, as is documented here: Hazardous Counseling. Reading that link may scare you off counseling, but it should give you some good ideas to ask a potential MC before you start w/ them, so you can avoid those that give you the wrong answers. You need one that is committed to helping couples have great marriages, and knows how to do that.

You are on an emotional rollercoaster right now, and there will be times that you will think it would be best to just divorce your spouse and go on with your life. Though there are no guarantees, recovery IS possible, but it takes time and effort. You will hate yourself if you don't do everything you can to make that happen. Give yourself the time you need.

3.) I understand that you may not be a person of faith, but for me, getting my spiritual life in order was crucial. As I said, this is hard. I knew I would need all the help I could get. Repenting of the habitual sins in my life let me stop pushing God away so I could hold on for dear life. I had to humble myself and ask Him what I had done wrong, and what I could do to be the husband He wanted me to be for his child, my wife. This was not about blaming myself. It was about doing what I could to do my part in having a great marriage. My wife could participate or not, but I had to know I had done everything I could do. It also helped me to let go of thinking about what SHE needed to do, since I couldn't control her, anyway.

You might also want to read through: WAT's Quick Start Guidelines for Betrayed Spouses, but keep in mind that these are the writings of amateurs. Get the books, read the articles, and see a GOOD counselor - you need the best help you can get.

Of course, that is just my opinions and what worked for me, who experienced it once, first hand. Harley, who has helped HUNDREDS of couples through this process, lays out his program in the following link: How to Survive Infidelity You will find that I mostly followed his plan. It works. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

Wow, John, thank you for the very practical advice. That is what I am searching for. I tried buying "Surviving An Affair" at Christian bookstore the other day, but a woman I know was the cashier and I was not ready for her to be privvy to my life in that way yet. The OW husband does not know. I do have a problem with this and am not quite sure what to do about it. I have met with her and she actually told me she was relieved to have been found out and was getting counseling for herself to help her figure out why she would succumb to my husband's advances. He did pursue her. She admits she is a big girl and could have chosen not to go there. The OH is a CEO of a national company and is going through a major, major hard time right now so she feels like she just can't tell him right now, but "says" she thinks she must tell him at some point.There is a chance they will be moving out of state. That would be God's gift to me. I don't know what to do about that. I am trying to worry about my own situation right now, realizing she is part of that. I did tell her to have no doubt, that if there is any contact I WILL tell her husband. This is just hell. I am a Christian woman and I have really felt God's hand on me through this whole thing. I want to do what He wants me to do. I can forgive, but the forgetting....? I feel like they have gotten off too easy by not being exposed, but have also read and heard that if restoration is the goal, not everyone and their brother need know....at least not at first. Is this true, by your experience? Also, the MC thing is a decision we need to make. I am afraid of getting some lame counseling and making things worse. Should we be getting into couseling ASAP? We have just been letting the dust settle the last couple of weeks. When you say 18 months to 2 years, what kind of days were those? Were there good days? Somewhat normal days? Up and down days? Just getting by...I don't want to try to just get past everything too fast....but I don't want to hang on too long and end up pushing my husband away. By the way, I am having a hard time with with some of the "initials".....I have the WS, OW, OH, DDAY, PA, EA.....it stresses me out to read some of the posts because of deciphering all the lingo! But I am sure I will get the hang of it....how sad....why did he do this? I tried to be a great wife.....just a few pounds too heavy.....perfect by most men's standards. I think he has a problem, actually.....okay, now I am ranting. Bye bye for now.

Good Morning,

I am glad to see last post. I have great respect for his insights and suggestions.

I talked with friend/IC last night to fill him in on how my W and I are doing. One of the things we talked about was the the mistrust and other negative feelings I deal with on occasions. He told me it was a matter of time and he is right. By rereading notes I made early on, I can see the progress I have made.

In terms of further exposure right now, if A is over, that would be just getting revenge. If you want to save your marriage, its not worth it. Also, both your H and OW are having to face their own private hells right now and thats punishment enough, in my opinion.

Based on some of your posts, I think your H is trying to shift responsibility for his behavior from himself to you. My W did that, also. Good counseling will help here as it will make him see that he is responsible for his own behavior.

Vaya con dios,
GVS

IHSB,

So sorry that you are here. Although I am fairly new to MB, my FWH and I are in our 16th month of recovery.

I also would have thought that I would have shown my H the door, <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> no question, but surprised myself when I came to the realization that dispite some problem areas in our M, it was worth saving.

You will be on a rollercoaster for some time and you just need to understand and accept that it is normal. I thought that there was something wrong with me because I couldn't just put the past behind me and forget what had happended.

Unfortunately, it doesn't work that way. You simply never forget. BUT....as I was advised by some of wise folks here, the pain does lessen and the triggers become more and more infrequent.

Keep coming here, it really helps keep things in perspective and also provides you with insite from those who have, and are going thru the same thing.

You take care of you.

Thank you so much, Diane. It still feels surreal to me, most of the time, that I even have to think about all of this. The emotions are a tough one because I just never seem to know when something will trigger them. My H and I are going to the beach today and spending the night. We are both looking forward to it, but I am in kinda a funk right now, so not sure what to expect from myself. This is personal, but how long is it before most people can be intimate again with their WS? Because we are working very hard on reconciliation, we have been intimate already, but of course, I am not too in to it emotionally. It did help that their relationship never got past the fondling stage. But still, I don't know what to expect of myself. It helps so much to see him trying so hard to please me. He is. probably for the first time, realizing my need for affection and conversation. Dr. Harley's book says it soooo well. My H has admitted to neglecting me in those areas for yearsm which he has. So, it helps alot to see him "trying" to meet my needs.I suppose that will be the road we walk for sometime.....reconnecting the missing parts of our relationship, and honestly, we are communicating like never before. I will never again hold anything back. I HAVE gotten my voice back! That is a "silver lining" already. I can see where things will be better than ever, as most people will attest to here. But I can't ever imagine not waking up and remember "it" the minute my eyes open in the morning. Thank you everyone, for your imput and encouragement. I look forward to the day that I will have something to give back. Bless all of you!

Hey, GVS, thank you for some insight on the revenge thing. I think I am longing for some kind of restitution.....can't think of anything that would even do it. We are trying to concentrate on the 5 basic needs of each other right now, and honestly, he has a lot more work to do than I. I have always been a giving, communicative person....just carrying those 25 extra lbs....and that erases EVERYTHING to him. SO....I am finally getting that HE needs and attractive spouse.....I guess the part I struggle with on that is that, not to sound immodest, but people think of me as this golden girl, one of the "beautiful" people, but because of the way he has put me down over the years, I feel like crap. People look at us like we have it all...little do they know how horrible he has been in his comments to me. My love bank is in the deficit where he is concerned and I know he is finally getting "that" for a change. It is hard to give when you feel like you have nothing to give. I was already at the end of my rope, then I FOUND OUT about the A. We have a lot going for us, but right now I don't know why for sure I would want "us". It will be by the grace of God, with His help, and H really seeking to be a different man. It is a tall order and it worries me that he will just not do the work. Really, I have it easier, cuz all I have to do is lose 15 lbs! Geez, that never sounded easy before!! hahahah

First step, don't feel like you drove him to it. I detect hints of guilt in your post regarding your weight.

So he married the homecoming queen. You had some kids and gained weight, right? He shouldn't berate you for it. Help you, yes, if you want and need it. I mean, is he still the homecoming king (or was he ever)?

I'd feel the way you do about them getting off easy. I'd want to punish my H and the OW. I'd probably tell her H.

But at least they didn't have intercourse (it sounds like they didn't). There's another poster here who confonted the OW and her H at work. They laughed and said it was a joke. I'm pretty sure they were both lying. Would you really rather they blew it off or denied it like that? Be thankful that they're both willing to work on it.

And, the abandoned alley thing is just gross.

I doubt there was just fondling in the alley and other places. He is lying in my opinion, they had sex and alot of it and everywhere. As a connoisseur of wood, its highly unlikely a man meeting his lover all over town including alleys purchased "cute little couple cell phones that are probably blue and pink " for them to keep constant contact only fondled eachother. My wife left me for a real small guy, not much bigger then that "mini-me" man from that austin powers movie. He hardly even appears human other then he has 2 arms and 2 legs. I dont think your weight played any part in his affair.

Actually, I agree. I should have said before. Although he may've said they didn't have intercourse, it does seem unlikely that they got cellphones and met in alleys just to fondle.

As i am a wood connoisseur, wherever there is fire, there is always some sort of wood involved.

uM, WOODMASTER-

What does that mean?

Good Morning IHSB,

I hope you are doing well and have a good time at the beach.

What a BS wants from a WS is going to be different for each couple. My "mentor's" BS wanted the full details of the "A". My IC, who was the BS in his first marriage, wanted a divorce. I want an apology, a show of remorse, and then I want to help my W heal herself.

Like your M, my M has had several years of neglect and thoughtlessness behaviors from both of us. As part of my plan A, I have been correcting my behaviors and in the last couple of weeks, my W has been doing the same. In many ways where we are at now is more exiciting than 22 years ago when we became engaged.

Based on your last post, I think your H is making a real effort to save the marriage and to be more what you need. I know its tough but give him positive strokes as he will need the reinforcement. Let him know you need the same.

As to the importance of rather the A was an EA or a PA or both is up to you. For me, the EA part was the most important. The possibility of losing my W made me realize how much I loved her and how much she had become part of the foundation of my life. I lost sight of that for several years and that is something I will probably always regre.

Vaya con dios,
GVS

IHSB: There is never a good time. The bottom line is: you will be doing her husband a big favor by telling him. If the shoe was on the other foot, you would want him to tell you, wouldn't you? By not telling him, you are protecting her from the natural consequences of her own actions. Is that what you want to do? You are also preventing him from addressing major issues in his own marriage, because they are being kept from him. This may seem weird, but the most LOVING thing you could do for her would be to tell him.

As for what the next two years will be like - well, the hours between the bad hours get longer, and the bad hours get shorter, then it becomes days between days, then days between hours, then weeks between days. The bad times won't go away, they just become less frequent, until they are few and far between and short.

I agree with the other posters that your H is probably still lying about the physical aspect of their relationship. Recovery doesn't even start until he is honest with you, IMO. That does not mean that you need to know every detail - far from it - it simply means that he needs to be WILLLING to give you whatever details you need to have. He needs to put honesty ahead of protecting your feelings (or more properly: "protecting himself from the consequences of his actions"). Because, the reason he didin't tell you about the relationship is because he was trying to "protect you". It's time to be done with that, or you will be continuing a pattern that LED TO THE AFFAIR, and enabled it to grow. Just like keeping their secret from her husband is continuing a part of the affair.

<small>[ March 12, 2005, 11:59 AM: Message edited by: johnh39 ]</small>

Hope that your weekend at the beach was nice. Having your FWH be completely honest about the extent of his A is a touchy area....with me as well.

There was never any doubt that my FWH had sex with OW, that is what his A was primarily about. I am not saying that OW didn't meet some other EM's that I was neglecting, but that was the primary one.

Besides, since theirs was a long distance (2,500 miles)A, I kinda figured that you don't travel thousands of miles to meet someone, stay in a hotel room with them when their isn't intimacy involved.

I haven't wanted any real details of just what type of activities they engaged in, the mere thought of it still makes me a little ill. That, however was not my primary concern with the A. I feel that my H has been as honest with me as he is going to be and I will just have to accept that I will never know the whole truth.

You see, he claims that he told OW from the beginning that 1) He loved me. 2) He had no intention of leaving me. 3) Our marriage only lacked in one thing. So here's my dilema. What kind of a woman would suggest to a friend who confided personal details of his marriage to her would actually suggest that they start meeting for sex.

I will be eternally baffled at how one could meet someone they had merely been friends with and hadn't seen in a decade in a hotel room and be intimate. Am I missing something here? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Guess I got off the subject. You asked about intimacy. Well in my M, lack of it was a major LB for my H. We had reached the point where we only rarely were intimate. Because of MB and HNHN we have addressed what led us to that point and fixed the problem. Sometimes though, in the midst of intimacy, I picture him with OW and it totally derails any pleasure for me.

Even 16 months into R, I still wake up most mornings thinking about it. Only now, somedays the thought goes away more quickly. I believe that this too shall pass.

We all just have to have patience and read the posts from the experienced posters who are far beyond us in Recovery and trust that someday, we too will share their perspective of having made it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />