I have been in Plan A now for about two months and have been counseling with Steve Harley for three sessions.<P>I understand that Plan A generally tells us that we try to meet certain emotional needs of the WS, avoid all LBs, and create an environment that seems safe for the WS to return to. But one question I have yet to ask Steve (and will next time) is when to phase in the "no contact" rule. Is this supposed to come at some point in Plan A or is it saved for Plan B? SAA mentions that we should negotiate with the WS to end all contact in Plan A and go to Plan B if this does not happen. But I can't imagine my wife willing to accept no contact with the OP at this point."

Always Hopeful,<P>Honesty dictates that you tell your WS that continued contact is hurting you...<P>...saying this in a non-LB manner is hard...<BR>...no doubt about it!<P>But by not saying it...<BR>...you're being an enabler.<P>Not being honest (holding back your feelings) can be as bad as overt lies (... those things you've been seeing in your WS... and disapproving of so much!)<P>Check out <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum28/HTML/002262.html" TARGET=_blank>How to say my feelings without it being a LB</A>.<P> <P>Jim

Always Hopeful,<BR>I understand your frustration, my situation is much the same, but complicated by pregnancy. I did Plan A until it was just too painful knowing that my W was still in contact with OM. I have had three sessions with Jenn and she and I agreed that it was time for Plan B. So, as of Christmas Day of all days I started Plan B. Actually I gave the letter to W the week before, but allowed her to have Christmas with us as a family, but have not had contact with her since 12/25. Make no mistake, Plan B is hard and don't enter into it half heartedly. I didn't realize it, but Jenn pointed out that when you aren't meeting your W's needs..she's not meeting yours either. I have really had a hard time not talking to my W, just because I have talked to her almost everyday for 10 years, and now I just stop cold turkey!? My situation is different, but there were too many withdrawals too often from my love bank account and I had to stop the downward spiral before I lost too much love. It was a real turning point for me when I realized how much pain my W was causing me and that I had to take control of the situation or I could see that I could quickly come to hate my W. At that point, I made an appointment with Jenn and she agreed that it was Plan B time. NSR has pointed it out to me that Plan B is to help you become acclimated to the possibility that your W may not respond and may not desire to come back to you and helps you to become more independent. It's really scary for me, but I know it's necessary for me to keep on keeping on. Someone in the Pregnancy/Child forum told me that I had to accept the fact that right now, my W loves the OM more than me. That was a hard pill to swallow, but it's true. It doesn't have to stay that way, but you can't change your W's mind, but you can change yourself and be the person your W fell in love with. The A and B Plans are designed to help you be who you need to be to your W, while protecting your love for your her in case she doesn't respond in a timely manner. I hope this helps, but just hang in there, hopefully your W will start coming out of the "fog" soon and see that you are willing to work on your marriage.<BR>God bless you.<BR>Floored

AH, I realize everyone is different but NO CONTACT is the only way - otherwise your chances for recovery are diminished.<P>For me, the no contact rule was a no-brainer. When my H confronted me on d-day, I knew that I could never have contact with MM again. I'm not sorry, either. It's the very least I can do to show my H respect and to assure him that it really is over.

I have been in plan A for about a week and initially asked W to end all contact. I think she did make a call but I feel the true conversation was that I found out so they have to be more careful. I feel this way because I have since asked if she has had any contact to which she replied no, not since the initial call. I now know she has lied to me because of the cell phone bill.<P>I have recently talked to her and let her know without LBing that continued contact is hurting me.<P>I agree with NSR about telling them how you feel without LBing. I also believe what susie says about no contact is the only way. <P>I have a difficult problem in that the OM is a former love relationship from before I met W. She has called OM several times in the past to "see how he is doing" which can never work. I am willing to go to any level to regain her love and keep my family together but it is hard. I fear this will be my biggest obstacle is cutting all ties with OM.