I have read all of Dr. Harley's articles and many of the posts, but have not found any answers to my problem.<P>In '97, the "other woman" entered our lives. She was someone that we both worked with indirectly. She came across as being very sweet, kind and caring and had many problems (emotional and physical). At the time, I was experiencing many of my own physical problems. She expressed care and concern to both me and my husband. My H had always been friendly and flirtatious and she seemed to thrive on his attention. I knew they talked and lunched together frequently, but since my H talked about her, I didn't think much of it.<P>In late '98, she was fired from her job and (as far as I know) contacted ceased between her and my H.<P>In spring of '99, she began calling him (on his cell phone) and paging him. He never said anything about it and I knew nothing until I received the cell phone bill. I questioned him about her calls and he said she had started a new job and had questions about her work; he was only helping her. The next month, there were more calls on the cell bill. At that time, he told me they were "just friends". He enjoyed talking with her and would occassionally have lunch with her. I wasn't nuts about the idea, but he assured me they were "just friends".<P>The end of June '99, I went out of town for a week. I talked with my H every night and he seemed happy that I was having a good time relaxing. He told me his "friend" called him and asked him to go out with her. He was appalled by her forward behavior and felt she had "crossed the line" (of friendship). I asked if he had expressed his displeasure to her, but he said he just made up a lame excuse because he didn't want to hurt her feelings. I was pleased that he was honest with me and told him I was thankful for his honesty (with me), but thought he should have been honest with her too. I thought nothing more of it.<P>When I returned home, my H treated me like a queen. He was happy to see me and made me feel very loved and secure.<P>The week after my return, I received another cell phone bill. She was now calling him on almost a daily basis, 3 to 5 times a day. Instead of waiting for him to get home, I called him and asked him what was going on with them? Why all the calls? I told him I didn't think that any other woman should have that much access to my husband... friend or no friend. He insisted there was nothing to it, that all they did was talk. She had alot of problems and he was trying to help her. But, he did not want to upset me, so he said he would ask her not to call him so much. She called him within minutes of my call to him. He told her I was upset and didn't want her calling him so much. Instead of being considerate of my feelings, she asked him if they were "still friends" (to which he said YES), then she asked if she should page him instead of calling him.<P>The next phone bill showed that she had called him twice before I was even out of town. It shocked me to see how the number of calls increased instead of decreasing. It shocked me even more to see she had called him at 1 a.m. on the day of my return. That puzzled me because his cell phone was hard-wired in his truck. What was he doing in his truck at 1 a.m.? He had a GREAT excuse. He was working on the boat and just happened to have his truck window opened and his cell phone on. When it rang, he answered it. He said she was on her way home, had a little too much to drink and decided to call him to see how he was doing. Sounded a little lame, but I did not persue it any further.<P>After 3 months of cell phone bills, I finally had enough. I demanded to know what was going on with this woman (who was now divorced). All he would say is that she was nice to him and he enjoyed talking with her. He had problems that he did not want to burden me with and he was helping her with her problems. I wanted to discuss his problems with me so that I could help him, but he insisted I had enough to deal with and did not want to burden me any further. In an instant, he became irate and stormed out of the house, cursing and throwing things.<P>I followed him and tried to talk with him, but he was very cold and extremely hostile. I asked him if he wanted a divorce...he said he didn't know. A few minutes later, he said he couldn't afford a divorce. A few minutes after that, he said he had no place else to go and didn't want to be alone. I asked him where that left me? He said he would always take care of me. He thought he was going through a mid-life crisis and needed some time to work things out. I asked him to talk with me, but got nowhere. All he would say is "I don't know".<P>He avoided me for days. He was very cold, cruel and hostile. I had no idea what was going on with him and tried to be patient and understanding. Since we were in business together, it was important for us to have atleast business communication. However, he avoided me at all costs.<P>Finally, after a few weeks, he began to come around. He was atleast talking to me about business and would atleast sit in the same room with me. He told me he was sorry, that he loved me and did not want a divorce. He said he had no more contact with the OW and wanted to put our lives back together. (Sept. 99)<P>His entire personality changed. He was not the fun loving, friendly fellow he had always been. He would dress differently on various days during the week. He began using more after shave and breath mints. Whenever I would comment about any of the changes, he would just say he wanted a 'change' and I was trying to read something into it that wasn't there.<P>At times, he seemed more loving and considerate. He would bring me flowers and showered me with gifts at Christmas and my b-day. (Feb '00). Much of his time was unaccounted for during the day, but he would have a reasonable explanation whenever I mentioned it. Whenever I asked too many questions, he would become very defensive and the hostility would return.<P>In spring of '00, I was dealing with some serious health problems. I needed him to be there for me, but he seemed rather detached. He told me he was worried about me and that's how he dealt with his worry.<P>5/31/00, I received some very disturbing news regarding my health. The prognosis was not good at that point. I spent hours sitting alone, made peace with God and with myself. I put my life in God's hands. When my H came home, he gave me a very strange look, (one I will never forget) and told me how worried he was about me. I sat him down and we discussed all my medical problems. Basically, I was planning for my death. He sat and listened, telling me he would be there for me and asked what he could do to help. The Drs. told me to quit smoking immediately. I told my H that I needed his help to quit. He informed me that he didn't want to be anywhere near me if I was going to try to quit. I had tried before and wasn't a very nice person. We decided that if my days were numbered, I would continue to smoke since I enjoyed it. I talked for hours and he listened intently. After I had given him all the details of my "plan", he gave me a tearful hug and told me how much he loved me. We spent a very enjoyable evening together.<P>The next morning, I awoke to him gently stroking my cheek. He layed there, watching me sleep, gently stroking my cheek. At that moment, I felt so much love and caring that I was ready to burst. Instead of leaving for work as usual, he stayed and had coffee with me. We talked and laughed and seemed to enjoy each other. Before leaving, he gave me a BIG hug and kiss and again told me how much he loved me. I was on top of the world. He made me feel so loved that my serious physical problems now seemed minor. We could face anything.....together.<P>20 minutes later, my phone rang. I heard my H's voice, but it sounded distant. He was mumbling something, but I couldn't understand him. I kept saying "Hello", but he wasn't hearing me. After a couple of minutes, I heard him say "Hi Baby" and went on talking. I was dumbfounded and was still saying "hello". I finally realized he wasn't talking to me and wasn't hearing me, so I sat back and just listened. I heard him say...."oh yeah, she got her test results" and kept mentioning the 'strange conversation' we had the night before. To make a long story short, he told his "Baby" every single word I had said the previous night. I couldn't believe he could repeat it word for word, except for the part where he didn't want me to quit smoking! I listened to him call her "honey" and ended their conversation with "I love you"....in a tone that he doesn't use with me.<P>Needless to say, I was VERY upset and devasted. I acted on impulse rather than thinking rationally. I called him and asked him who he had been talking with on the cell phone? He denied talking to anyone. I called him a b.st..d and told him I had overheard everything. He refused to tell me who he had been talking with, saying he didn't want to hurt me. He said he was coming home to talk, but I told him I didn't even want to see him. He stayed away all day and did not try to call me again.<P>When he did arrive home, I asked for an explanation, but he would say nothing other than she was "a friend". He needed someone to talk with because he was having a hard time dealing with all my physical problems. Ok, I told him I might understand the need to talk with someone, but why the "Baby, Honey and I love you"? His reply was, "do you think anyone would want to talk if I just said "hey you wanna talk"? Lame excuse!! I told him I wanted a divorce. He said he didn't want a divorce. He didn't do anything wrong and couldn't understand why I was so upset. He was sorry that he hurt me, but they were "just friends".<P>After our "talk", he left and didn't return til after midnight. I have no idea where he went and he left the next morning without saying a word to me. He never called me at all the following day and I was so mad that I didn't attempt to call him. He came home that night, gathered up a few clothes and left for the weekend, without saying a word to me. When he returned Sunday night, he totally ignored me. I approached him and asked how long he was going to continue ignoring me. He said he wasn't (ignoring me) and asked what I wanted. I told him we needed to talk. We finally talked a bit. He insisted that he did not want a divorce. I told him he had to make a choice the OM or me. He said there was no choice to be made because he only wanted me in his life. He said he had a problem and needed help. He suggested he go for counseling because he needed someone to talk to (other than me). I asked if he had broken things off with the OM; he said he had not been able to make contact with her. He had to think of a 'tactful way to end it'. <P>In the week that followed, I found out that he saw an atty. the following Monday (only 4 days after D-day). Why would he see an atty. if he didn't want a divorce? He said he needed to know where he stood in case I persued a divorce. That Friday, he informed me that he made phone contact with her and ended it. He was not seeing or talking to anyone anymore.<P>We started counseling together that week and I was hoping to get some answers to the thousands of questions I had floating around in my head and heart. He got very upset in the sessions, insisting that he was not having an affair. He had a 'friend'....that was all. He refused to discuss anything about their relationship....saying they didn't have a 'relationship'. He contributed nothing in our sessions other than denial. The therapist thought it was best that she see him alone for a few sessions. <P>He became very upset each time I would mention his 'relationship'. I asked many questions, but didn't get any answers. He finally began giving me bits of info and then would become hostile because he felt I forced him to say something.<P>2 months went by and I was still getting just bits and pieces. I wanted to believe him, but my gut feeling kept telling me to search for the truth. I started investigating and talking to other friends.<P>I was devastated to find out that everything he had told me was a lie. He was making up horrendous lies to cover up the truth.<BR> 1. "Who is she"? He gave me the name of a co-workers<BR> friend, which sent me on a wild goose chase trying<BR> to find 'her'.<BR> 2. "We only talked a couple of times a week and had <BR> lunch every other week". Through my investigations,<BR> I found that it was the same woman as last year. He<BR> never ended it last year. She bought him a cell phone<BR> so they could talk without me seeing the bills. As it<BR> turned out, they talked 20 to 30 times EVERYDAY and he<BR> had a voice mail message waiting for him every <BR> morning.<BR> 3. "I'm not seeing or talking with anyone anymore". I<BR> heard that story for 4 months, only to find that they<BR> were still talking on a daily basis.<P>From 8/99 to 10/00, they carried on behind my back, using the cell phone she had provided for him. What is really strange is, he would call her, then immediately call me, then call her again. If he didn't call her, then she called him. On the days that he refused to have any contact with me, he talked with her 10 to 20 times. <P>I had even asked him point blank if he has or has ever had another cell phone. He emphatically said NO. I couldn't figure out how I overheard his phone call to her. He told me one of his co-workers had left their cell phone in his truck and he used it. When I asked that fella about it, he was evasive, which is what led me to begin investigating.<P>Now to my present situation. My H still refuses to discuss his relationship with the OM. He feels it's over and done with and feels we should just get on with our lives. He has said that from day 1. He gave her back the cell phone in Oct. and told her he didn't want to "do this anymore"; he said he "wanted his life back". Even though I changed his cell phone number & pager number, I know that she continued to page him for 2 more months. He says he got alot of weird pages, but none from her. I find that hard to believe and phone bills don't lie.<P>He is now in couseling and taking Paxil for depression. On 2 occassions, he pulled a gun and threatened suicide because (as he says) he couldn't live with the hurt he had caused me.<P>I know this affair is over because the OM died last month. This may sound cold and cruel, but I prayed to God to get this OM out of my life.<P>My problem now is....I can't live a life based on lies. I've asked my H to be honest with me. What was he getting from her that he wasn't getting from me? All he says is he "doesn't know". From what I've read, there had to be something missing from our relationship to cause he to seek her attention. But, he insists he loves me just the way I am; he wouldn't change a thing about me. He thinks our relationship is solid even though I'm torn apart inside. I want to tell him how I truly feel, but each time I bring it up, I get a "here we go again....two steps forward and 4 backward". I need an emotional connection with my H. I share everything with him except my true feelings about my uncertainty. I feel very insecure because he has always professed his love for me even when he was telling me the horrendous lies. Is he with me for security? Is he with me because she's dead and I'm better than nothing? Is he with me because he doesn't want to lose everything we've worked for together? Is he with me out of convenience?<P>I feel so stupid because I believed in him, trusted him and he betrayed me. I feel humiliated and I feel angry. How do I separate fact from fiction? How do I know what to believe when he's told me so many lies? My health has suffered; my blood pressure has sky-rocketed and I have anxiety/panic attacks. My H is aware of these problems and asks if he "is the cause"? I want to scream "Yes", but bite my tongue and try to console him. Am I nuts?<P>I have tried counseling, but it hasn't seemed to help. The therapist we saw together cannot understand how I can stand to look at him after all the lies he's told me and her. Yes, he told her nothing but lies too, so all their sessions were a big waste of time and money. I have tried various therapists, but they all ask me what I want? I want honesty. They advise me that I may never have that and to prepare myself for the other choice, which is divorce.<P>In some ways, I feel my H does love me and he has been trying to be a good husband. Is he working at our marriage because he loves me or because she's dead? If he was vulnerable to her, and we don't face the issues that caused this rift between us, then won't he be vulnerable again?<P>I apologize for the length of this post, but I felt that I needed to get it all out in the open. I've tried everything and don't know where else to turn. How can I get my H to open up to me?<P>Any advice? <P><BR>

Welcome <B>betrayed&confused</B>...<P>There is a post of general welcome I wish to share with you... <P>It has a lot of quick links to many of the <B>most</B> important MB sites...<BR>Click here ==> <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/000553.html" TARGET=_blank>General Welcome for All New Builders(Newbies)</A><P><B>About your post</B>...<P>It was a long one...<BR>...and that could be a reason for no responses...<P>It could very well be that the "kind" of counseling that you and your H is getting...<BR>...isn't "result" focused enough!<BR>I would recommend that you have a couple of <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi7200_phone.html" TARGET=_blank>telephone counseling sessions</A> (~$120US a pop... but well worth it) with <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi7010_about.html" TARGET=_blank>Steven W. Harley</A> or Jennifer Harley. Check out the <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi7000_counsel.html" TARGET=_blank>Counseling Center</A>... and for some specifics... <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi7015_fee.html" TARGET=_blank>Fees for Counseling Services</A> and <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi7020_sched.html" TARGET=_blank>Scheduling an Appointment</A> (888-639-1639)!<P>The medication is a good idea though!<P>How is your health doing now?...<P>Focusing on the "causes"... while it might settle your mind somewhat... is often counter-productive to the marriage rebuilding/building process...<P>If you really follow <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3900_rules.html" TARGET=_blank>The Four Rules for a Successful Marriage</A>... and <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3500_policy.html" TARGET=_blank>The Policy of Joint Agreement(POJA)</A>...<BR>...time is what it is going to take...<BR>...patience too!<P>I'm not saying you're going to forget the wrong things that had happened...<BR>...but replacing the 'bad' with new good experiences is an important key!<P>Do start on a <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html" TARGET=_blank>Plan A</A>...<BR>Check out my post <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum30/HTML/000176.html" TARGET=_blank>Plan A - 101 (2nd ed.)</A>.<P>Plan A is the first 2 rules of <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3900_rules.html" TARGET=_blank>The Four Rules for a Successful Marriage</A>...<BR>...work on all 4!<P>You are not alone!<BR>You'll find some more help in the <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&number=31&DaysPrune=10&LastLogin=" TARGET=_blank>In recovery</A> forum...<BR>...you really are on the way!<P>BTW: OM == "other man", OW == "other woman"... check out <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/000557.html" TARGET=_blank>Acronyms, Smilies, UBB Codes</A>.<P> <P><A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/000254.html" TARGET=_blank>Jim</A> / <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/000037.html" TARGET=_blank>NSR</A><p>[This message has been edited by NSR (edited April 21, 2001).]

Thanks for reading and replying, Jim. I am deeply embarrassed about the length of my post and will refrain from posts in the future. (I seem to get carried away)!<P>Will try to follow your advice.<P>Again....Thank you!