I started plan A about three weeks ago. It seems to have made life better so far. There is just one thing which is getting me down. You may already know from my other posts that my H works away Mon to Fri and much of our four - year marriage has been based round him only living at home at the weekends. A few weeks after D Day, but long before I found this sight and started plan A, I was getting so upset at the weekends he was here, that he started to only come home alternate weekends saying he needed some space etc. He swears that he hasn't seen the OW since March but admits that he still phones her. The problem I'm asking about is this. He used to phone every day. Even up to June this year. (D Day was 13 April). Over the last few weeks the phone calls seem to have gone down to every two or even every three days. On days he doesn't call I start to imagine all sorts of things...such as "he hasn't called because he's on a date with her"...."he hasn't called because he's in bed with her"....you get the idea don't you. When he does call, he usually apologises for not phoning and says he was just really busy at work and was eating out with colleagues until late and didn't get chance. Should I ask him to try to phone every day anyway, or will this make it look as though I'm checking up on him, and therefore become a major LB? I do try to phone him on the days he doesn't call, but he usually turns his cellphone off after about three rings without answering and lets it go onto the messaging service. This makes me feel even more upset. Should I not bother trying his phone at all to avoid the hurt when he doesn't answer or just leave a really friendly message? If I answer the phone to him after him not phoning for threedays, should I say I have missed him and wished he got chance to phone more often, or should I not say anything about the lack of phone calls at all? What is the best way to handle this so I don't blow the good work I've done on plan A so far? <P>Wounded One

By not reacting, and not expecting anything, and by accepting his somewhat lame excuses. Believe me I know how it feels. My h used to call me every day, and a little while before I found out about things, it stopped...same excuses, sorry, I'm busy at work etc.<P>If he knows you're annoyed, and thinking all those things, then he is pushing your buttons. If you've worked on Plan A, he may be testing you to see if you'll LB. (And BTW you should Plan A without expecting anything from your H). It's hard, but you must not challenge him about this.<P>So the short answer is to stop the hurting, don't expect him to call...I don't, he hasn't and I feel okay with it. Well, sort of....

Hi wounded one just wanted to say i know what you mean, my H and i are living apart fro a while to give him some space to try and sort his head out(mission impossable i think).<BR>He also works away and always used to text message 3/4 times a day but it has gradualy stopped, and since he moved into caravan im lucky if i hear from him in 3 days.<BR>Prime example last thursday he asked me out to eat i gave no LB at all didint mention OW or A at all, when we got back he stayed the night.<BR>Sat morning i took his post to him and had a coffee and chatted, then heard nothing by last night i was so angry but i sent him a text justsying love u and miss you, still nothing then mid afternoon today finaly got one, will see him later must not LB <P>------------------<BR>lizzle<BR>The hardest thing to do is watch the person you love love someone else

Hi Lizzle,<P>Yes, What you've just described with the lack of calls for up to three days with no apparent reason sounds just like us. Sometimes I try to tell myself "Maybe he hasn't got much to say or is just in a bad mood, so maybe its better if he doesn't call today" but when you leave them a message and they still don't call for three days, you start to feel as though they have forgotten who you are, or, when they do call it was just an after thought. I suppose they have started treating us more like one of their friends who they call every now and again rather than the wife they called every day because they wanted to. Last night I left him a message on his mobile phone saying "Is there a good time of day to call you when you have finished at work, but won't be out in the middle of a meal with colleagues?" He did actually return my call last night but said that there wasn't a "good time" because he finished work at different times every day and often went straight to the restaurant and then didn't get back until late. He managed to phone last night because he wasn't eating out. The annoying thing is that before the affair, he would phone from work, from the restaurant, when he got back from the restaurant, even if it was late etc. He says the reason he doesn't phone when its late anymore is because whe he's tired he always feels upset and depressed at the moment and wants to aviod losing his temper with me or offending me....Its hard isn't it?

I would like to jump in here. If I read the posts correctly, husband had an affair. What I see here is the classic pattern of pursuing and distancing, with you eing the pursuer and husband being the distancer. What you are currently doing is not working to improve your relationship. Stop phoning your husband and do not contact him unless an absolute emergency.When he calls, which he will, keep it short, and you be the one to end the conversation. You must sound happy, upbeat, and like you were in the middle of doing something fun when he called. YOu must act as if everything is fine, even if it isn't. Do not bring up OP, your relationship, or any minor problems. I know this is extremely hard to do, but you have to stop sounding needy. This pursuing behavior that I just described actually pushes them further away. When he calls, always be polite and answer any questions he has, but try to be in agreement with him as much as possible. Be cheerful on the phone, like when you first met and talked with him--right now try to be a casual friend with no pressure! When you end the phone conversation, say something like 'I'm glad you called--talk to you again soon and then hang up--don't pin him down to calling at specific times or asking him to call everyday. His turning off the cell phone is his way of trying to do some distancing!

Thanks DB713,<P>I have done a lot of thinking about this one over the last few days and was just wondering whether to try some thing along the lines you have suggested here. Now that I have read what you say about me being the persuer and his distancing strategies, it does seem to make a lot of sense. I will definitelty give your advice a go! Thanks,<P>Wounded One

Glad I could offer some assistance. This will be a new change in behavior for you and you must be consistant. It is so easy to slip into old patterns of behavior! Other people often times do not like to see any changes, and your husband may try to "bait" you trying to get you back into the old behavior and conversations--be careful and don't get caught. If you don't know what to say, don't say anything and if you start feeling like you are going to slip--get off the phone immediately. Rehearse in your mind ahead of time what you will say and if necessary keep it written by your phone as a quick aid. I used to say, I had to go because I was baking and the oven timer just went off,or I was in the middle of an exercise video-then I'd say glad you called , talk to you again soon. these are just examples that would get me off the phone quick before I could make any mistakes in behavior or be tempted to go back into the needy mold. One key is when you use an excuse, have it be something you normally wouldn't be doing. I hadn't done much baking for a long time, so for me to be making cookies was a shocker for my husband!! Just a subliminal change for him to see in me.More importantly, start doing things you've wanted to and hopefully he will interupt you actually doing something fun and for yourself! It may be several days between calls and you have got to prepare yourself for that--this is the time to utilize to your advantage. Make your plans on how to handle the next phone call,get that new acivity planned. Use this time creatively rather than moping around. As you make positive changes in your behavior, your husband has no choice but to also make changes in his response to you. As I said before, these new changes may confuse and shock him, but you've got to hang in there and be consistant.

Thanks db713,<BR>The last time he phoned was Tuesday evening which was when I asked him the question about when a good time to call would be (before you replied and told me to stop sounding so needy!). It is now 10.20pm on Thursday evening (UK time). I haven't attempted to call him today and he hasn't phoned me. He actually comes home Friday evening and will probably make a short call right when I'm in the middle of cooking for my kids to tell me what time he will be back. I won't really be able to put your suggestions re. how to behave when he calls into practise until next week when he goes back to work again. How do I stop myself sounding so "needy" over the weekend while he is at home?

Hi!<BR>The key to this weekend is no arguing! Keep all conversation light and friendly--no serious relationship talk, no begging for attention, no whining-these are all major turnoffs to those who want some distance!! Spend most of the time listening to him rather than you doing the majority of the talking. By careful listening,he just may reveal his needs that need to be met. Keep track of the clues he reveals and this is what you will work on while he is away.<BR> In one of your notes above, you mentioned he wanted space--that's one of his needs right now that you can meet. We have already talked about not calling him-that's the first step to giving him space. When he is home, make it as pleasant and comfortable as you can, but don't go overboard so it is too obvious. You want your home to be an environment where he wants to be , especially while he is away at work. You want him to miss being at home! What does he like to do when he is home? Start with the very basics--is there anything that he complained about in relationship to the house? Whatever it might be, try to get it taken care of. Try to have the house clean and tidy, have his favorite foods and drinks available. Maybe rent a video he has been wanting to see.<BR>You mentioned cooking for your children--how many and how old are they? Make meal time an enjoyable experience. Do something different---if the kids are small, why not have a quiet dinner for just the two of you after the kids are in bed?? It doesn't have to be anything elaborate-just some quiet time without the interuptions of little kids. Remember to keep all converstion light and cheerful--like in your dating days.<BR> Does he enjoy spending time with them when he is home or does he leave the childcare up to you? If he enjoys spending time with the kids--I would suggest you plan something for yourself for a couple of hours and let him babysit!!! I know it sounds strange since he is only home on the weekends, but this gives you a break from the kids ,gives you a chance to not be needy, and gives him some space! Go take a walk, go grocery shopping, go work in the yard-these are just some suggestions. If you can't really leave the house, find something so you aren't concentrating totally on him. Do you sew or do any needlework? Any type of crafts? Have something around that you can quickly start to do when you feel the "needy urge" coming on. Become a little unpredictable!<BR>Definitely continue in your Plan A mode. If you watch tv together, I wouldn't sit by him unless he asks you to. Don't pressure him for togetherness,,,be close by but not in his face all the time. How about your appearance--this is definitely the time to dress nicely, wear your makeup and keep the hair groomed! Again, think back to your dating days and how you would dress for him. Get back to that, especially if you have stopped. <BR>As you back off from the pursuing, you will start to notice a gradual change in his behavior also. The relationship will change because you have made changes. He will be testing you to see if it is just an act to get him back, so be careful. You have to remain cool and calm. Consistency is the key to your new behavior. <BR>One last thing--when he leaves to go back to his job--do not ask when he is going to call!!! Be friendly, upbeat, and don't cry! Say I love you only if he says it first!! Send him off with his favorite snack and drink.<BR>After he leaves think back over the weekend. Write down what seemed to work and what didn't work. This will help you plan for your next encounter. The goal is to keep doing what is working and change what isn't! Use this weekend as research! Don't expect everything will be perfect, because it won't be. I hope some of these suggestions will get you started . I'll be thinking of you.

Thanks db713,<BR>In reply to some of your questions above, both my H and I play musical instruments. Usually I keep all my violin practise to week days when he is away and while my toddler takes an afternoon nap! Maybe I could surprise him by going off and doing it while he is here this weekend. The thing he liked about me when we were dating was that we both played musical instruments. His previous relationship didn't work out because she hated him practising the piano and going to music rehearsals etc. Maybe if I just go off and do my own practise, it will stop me seemimg to be needy and also remind him why he married me in the first place. I have already got some of his favourite foods and snacks in for the weekend. The quiet evening meal thing might be a bit difficult. My older son is 13 and will still be around until 10pm ish! I don't think he's ready for a quiet evening meal yet anyway, any suggestions to do things "just the two of us" are being met with dissaproval at the moment. At weekends he either wants to go out for the day as a family doing family type activities or be left on his own. I'll try to take his lead this weekend and if he wants to be alone, I'll go off and do my music practise or even my exercise video! Maybe I have gradually become needy over the years. Because much of our marriage has been based round him only being here at weekends, I've deliberately made sure I haven't planned things which are "just for me" such as going out with female friends etc, over the weekend because I've wanted to spend the whole time with him. He never gets to see the person I am in the week anymore...the one who does the cleaning, the one who likes to sit alone and read. I think I do probably follow him around a bit and always sit in the same room. All he sees is the person who says, "what do you want to do this weekend then ? Shall we do this? Shall we go there?" Do you think this is the problem? When I do leave it up to him he always wants to spend money on new appliances for the house. About the time the A started, he became obseesed with moving house. We spent every weekend form last July to March, looking round houses. Once we moved house in March, (I found out about the A four weeks later), he started wanting to go to the DIY shop every weekend to buy wallpaper, new light fittings etc. I'm now a bit worried about spending money on the house in case we end up splitting up and have to sell up anyway. Should I just humour him and go along with it anyway? He even talked about taking out a secong mortgage the other weekend to pay for improvements to the house! By the way, are you speaking from experience here...have you used these strategies?

Hi wounded one sorry ive taken so long to post again had a bad couple of days, plus i keep forgrtting where i posted, started in recovery wrong place i know but post in general questions mostly now, anyway to add on to the conversation on here i had almost a week with no contact and was feeling so down yesterday i sent sms text to his mobile it was a heart with yhe words i miss you, no response all day or night i cried myself to sleep yet again.<BR>Then lunchtime today i get message on my mobile, the heart i sent H edited to say i miss you 2, made my day if only i thought he really meant it but if he did he would be here wouldent he?<P>------------------<BR>lizzle<BR>The hardest thing to do is watch the person you love love someone else

Hope you can reply to this db713, also anyone else who feels qualified!<BR>I took on board db713s suggestions for this weekend when my H was at home. By Sunday evening he suggested going out to the pub with him for a drink! After the shock I said yes and arranged a babysitter (this is the first time since D day that he has wanted to go anywhere with just me where he knows he will have to talk to me, usually he only wants to go out to places where the kids are there too or other friends). Anyway we had a few drinks together and he seemed to want to talk mostly about how he planned to decorate the house and what we could do to make improvements to it. So I talked about this with him and avoided all talk about the A etc. all talk was about the future and was the sort of disscussion we used to have in the days before the A. It was just like old times really. We got home and I felt really happy that we'd had a good time together...a whole evening of feeling relaxed in each others company. After the babysitter had gone home he put his arms round me and gave me a hug.....bearing in mind that he has insisted on absolutely no physical contact since D Day, I was rather surprised. It ended in us making love!?! My H was at home today as well because it is a bank holiday here. Neither of us mentioned the sex, I thought it best not to make a big thing about it..but there was still a happy relaxed atmosphere between us all Monday. However, I'm now feeling a bit confused! Was it the time we spent together that reminded him of old times...did I just do a really good plan A, or was it just the alcohol? Or a mixture of all these. By Monday after noon he must have felt a bit sexy again, but instead of making advances towards me again, he looked at some internet porn (and I don't need to speel it out what he was doing whlie he lokked at this!) If he felt like this, why didn't he come to me for sex again. I do know that all the time he has not been having sex with me he has visited pornographic websites to get his thrills...does this mean that the sex with me on Sunday night was just a one off or does it mean that he just didn't feel ready to go there again with me today? Should I have refused the sex? Should I just play it cool next time he's home and see what happens? I'll carry on with the plan about phone calls...anyone got any suggestions about why this happened this weekend?

Hi!<BR>I am glad your weekend went well. You caght me by surprize with the pornographic web site stuff! You mentioned this has happened before,, so this is possibly a habit or addicition for him. Since you have known about it, have you two discussed it ? How long has this been going on and did it start before or after you felt there were marriage problems? What are your feelings about what he is doing? If you have told him how you feel, what has been his reaction? I'm not sure I can give any advice about this situation. I'm hoping someone else will jump in here with ideas.

Hi db713,<P>The porngraphic website stuff started long before there were any problems. It used to be only occasionally. It started more when I was pregnant in 1999 and while ouy baby was still small. I think he assumed I wouldn't want sex so got his thrills elsewhere. Yes, we disscussed this a few weeks ago. His answer then was that he didn't feel ready to commit to sex with me at the moment because he was still in the fog about OW and his feelings for her were still there. I didn't bring up the subject this weekend however. The problem as I see it now, (sorry for being so graphic here)is that even if he does start to get his loving feelings back for me and does initiate sex again, he won't be able to get full enjoyment from it if he's already ejaculated several times to pornographic stuff earlier in the day will he? I don't mind him viewing it occasionally, I'm quite open minded on this one, but if it stops him from wanting sex with me, then I'm not happy. It did cross my mind that his recent use of it was to stop him getting any sexual urges towards me because he would feel that he was letting OW down if he did. (thats one of my theories anyway, but haven't discussed this one) Do you think we should discuss it some more or just leave it for now?

In addition to what I've said above,<P>My H looked at pornographic stuff quite heavily back in April and May, just after D Day. At the time he had quite bad withdrawal symptoms because he hadn't seen OW for a month and was really missing her (although he was, and still is phoning her) I think he looked at this to, a) get away from me and b) to cheer himself up. He hardly went near the computer at all during June and July, but then this last weekend the pornographic stuff started all over again. He seems to have really good reactions in response to my plan A at the moment, but then suddenly, will go really depressed and withdrawn. It is usually when he gets into this state that he goes and looks at the porn. Its as though he goes off into a fantasy world away from me and the kids for a while to block out what a mess his life is in at the moment.

I really have no experience in this area, so I don't know how to offer any help with this. I would suggest that you start a new topic thread, maybe in the sexual issues area, related to this subject. I know this topic has come up before, and I think you will get the help and advice you may need from those who have had first hand experience.

Thanks,<P>I've started a new thread in GQii and have already got three replies. I'll carry on with your advice about what to do when he phones and how to deal with his lack of phone calls. I'll continue with plan A, but treat this pornographic problem as a separate issue. Therefore, if anyone has replies about the phoning situation, then please post them here, if you want to post about the porn stuff, please see my other thread in GQii. Thanks,<P>Wounded One